OT: Justice for Alexian Lien: victim of mob beating…

[an]

[quote=zk][quote=AN]
FYI, you yourself, just lump EVERYONE who are not a liberal into a nut job camp. [/quote]
You’ll have to show me where I did that. I’m quite sure you won’t be able to.[/quote]
Here you go:
[quote=zk]SK, you wouldn’t know what flu is talking about unless you, too had been brainwashed by the right-wing noise machine.[/quote]
Only brainwashed by right-wing noise machine would understand him. I’m not brainwashed by the right wing noise machine. But I’m probably not as liberal as you. So, since you don’t know what flu is talking about and I do, I must be brainwashed by the right wing noise machine. Brainwashed by the right wing noise machine, IIRC is synonymous to nut job in your book.

[zk]

[quote=AN][quote=zk][quote=AN]
FYI, you yourself, just lump EVERYONE who are not a liberal into a nut job camp. [/quote]
You’ll have to show me where I did that. I’m quite sure you won’t be able to.[/quote]
Here you go:
[quote=zk]SK, you wouldn’t know what flu is talking about unless you, too had been brainwashed by the right-wing noise machine.[/quote]
Only brainwashed by right-wing noise machine would understand him. I’m not brainwashed by the right wing noise machine. But I’m probably not as liberal as you. So, since you don’t know what flu is talking about and I do, I must be brainwashed by the right wing noise machine. Brainwashed by the right wing noise machine, IIRC is synonymous to nut job in your book.[/quote]
Error number 1: You left off half my quote. I said, “SK, you wouldn’t know what flu is talking about unless you, too had been brainwashed by the right-wing noise machine. Or at least were familiar with their tactics.”
I knew exactly what flu was talking about, because I’m familiar with the right-wing noise machine’s tactics. Lump run-of-the-mill liberals in with gloria allred and her ilk. Anybody who is a pansy or a crybaby or who plays the “victim” card must be a liberal. Etcetera.

Error number 2: You seem to have come to the conclusion that I think that everybody who isn’t a liberal has been brainwashed by the right-wing noise machine. I never said that. I never implied that. I never believed that. I know lots of perfectly reasonable conservatives and middle-of-the-road types who can think for themselves and aren’t brainwashed by the machine.

[an]

[quote=zk][quote=AN][quote=zk][quote=AN]
FYI, you yourself, just lump EVERYONE who are not a liberal into a nut job camp. [/quote]
You’ll have to show me where I did that. I’m quite sure you won’t be able to.[/quote]
Here you go:
[quote=zk]SK, you wouldn’t know what flu is talking about unless you, too had been brainwashed by the right-wing noise machine.[/quote]
Only brainwashed by right-wing noise machine would understand him. I’m not brainwashed by the right wing noise machine. But I’m probably not as liberal as you. So, since you don’t know what flu is talking about and I do, I must be brainwashed by the right wing noise machine. Brainwashed by the right wing noise machine, IIRC is synonymous to nut job in your book.[/quote]
Error number 1: You left off half my quote. I said, “SK, you wouldn’t know what flu is talking about unless you, too had been brainwashed by the right-wing noise machine. Or at least were familiar with their tactics.”
I knew exactly what flu was talking about, because I’m familiar with the right-wing noise machine’s tactics. Lump run-of-the-mill liberals in with gloria allred and her ilk. Anybody who is a pansy or a crybaby or who plays the “victim” card must be a liberal. Etcetera.

Error number 2: You seem to have come to the conclusion that I think that everybody who isn’t a liberal has been brainwashed by the right-wing noise machine. I never said that. I never implied that. I never believed that. I know lots of perfectly reasonable conservatives and middle-of-the-road types who can think for themselves and aren’t brainwashed by the machine.[/quote]That’s what you said and that was how you came across. It’s fine that you didn’t meant what you said, but that’s how I interpret what you said. So, it’s not an error in how I interpret what you said. It’s your error in how you say it.

[FlyerInHi]

AN, you can say that Fox is part of the mainstream if that makes you happy. It you are of their persuasion, then you have no reason to feel the mainstream media is liberal.

I’m talking about the news industry taken as a whole.

Hollywood is not liberal either. Most of their scripts actually lag social norms a little. That’s simply so they can assure they don’t offend, have a market for their films, and generate profits for their investors.

[KIBU]

This turned into a political discussion about the unfortunate incident. Instead of figuring out about the reality of this intimidating driving, bullying phenomenon, people again state their political ideas.

It is not a race issue either. I am an Asian American but I do not care if Liam was an Asian or not. It is equally bad if an African American, White, Red, or who the heck was in that SUV. The bikers were doing all they could to intimidate the car driver with implications of threat to the life of the car’s occupants. I am not sure most of us would not turn panic in that situation and decided to defend ourselves by running away. Unfortunately, even to run away from this crowd was in itself blocked intentionally by many bikers closely surrounding the car.

Reading up to here, we still have not said about where the hell were the police on that long and lawless drive??? Their 911 response should be a big concern to address.

[CA renter]

Flyer,

You’re waaaay out of line on this issue. Like another poster said, you desperately need to research this incident before spouting off here. Mr. Lien was 100% in the right. He DID stop when that asshat brake-checked him. He only fled (and ran over the other rider) when the bikers started beating on his car, and he was totally justified in his actions.

————

Flu,

Please stop. As you know, I’m about as liberal as they come, but I would NEVER in a million years try to justify what these bikers did. This is not a “liberal vs. conservative” issue. Like zk, I’m liberal but also very anti-crime…and happen to be very pro-Second Amendment, as well. Don’t try to shove us all in one box.

[ocrenter]

I heard about this incidence earlier this week, just went through the various videos and news articles as well as the posts on this thread.

1. The initial contact was intentional on the part of the now arrested biker Christopher Cruz. Video evidence is solid here. He break checked the SUV hard, forcing contact. Rest of the biker gang then started to crowd around the SUV to intimidate. The tire slashing occurred here as well.

2. Actual intent of the break check to draw contact is not known. Two possibilities, one is simply they were annoyed he did not move to the side of the road and allow the “Hollywood Stuntz” crew to own the entire highway, the other possibility was they targeted him for a shake down fee because of the luxury SUV.

3. There was zero evidence that Lien actively provoked the bikers. Also zero evidence that Lien previously drove around provoking cyclists.

4. Plenty of video evidence of past behaviors of intimidating drivers as well as reckless stunts and shutting down the public roadway for their own pleasure on the part of the same Hollywood Stuntz crew.

5. Public opinion is OVERWHELMINGLY in favor of Lien and his family. The comments on the facebook page “justice for jay meezee” are about 95% pro-Lien.

6. The police so far are completely on the side of Lien as the victim. They fully understand he was in FEAR and had every right to do what he did. They are continuing to search for more arrests involving the biker gang.

7. The bystanders were the true heros. While Lien was being pulled out of the SUV, his wife and child were in the process of getting pulled out by the bikers. The bystanders saved them and ultimately saved Lien. New Yorkers do come to each other’s aid afterall.

8. The low lifes will bully and intimidate when they can, but when they are down they will play victims. That’s just how low lifes work. Here, elsewhere, past and present. That’s not going to change.

9. There will always be attorneys willing to represent low lifes. That Gloria Allred stepped up to the plate should suprise no one.

10. Race, politics, Faux News, liberals vs conservatives play zero role in this story.

[Jazzman]

[quote=all][quote=FlyerInHi][quote=spdrun]

That was my first reaction, but from all I hear, the bikers really were that bad, while not 100% blameless, Lein was the innocent party here.[/quote]

You’re presuming that these bikers are troublemakers like the other bike gangs you saw on tv. There are lots of presumptions and few facts only analysis.

Assume you’re a young guy riding peacefully with your buddies. An SUV comes along and swipes a rider and keeps on driving. Would all the other guys not want to stop the SUV?[/quote]

Watch the video:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5ukdkgLYYbw%5B/quote%5D

The SUV looks to be too close to a motorcycle in front. The biker in the white shirt seems to be remonstrating with him about it and then stupidly pulls on his brakes too hard probably not giving enough space and time for the SUV to avoid a collision. The SUV wasn’t the only car on the road so it wasn’t his mere presence. A white van pulls passed just after the altercation. I am a biker and there has always been tension between bikes and cars. 90% of bike accidents are caused by cars (according to the DMV). Attitudes towards bikes is tainted and this incident won’t help. From the video it looks like the biker in the white “T” shirt let his animosity and bravado get the better of him. On the other hand, panicking and running over a motorcycle does not look good and will require some explaining. Did he not see the motorcycle or were there threats that made him panic blindly? The question is: as the media circus and litigation hucksters twist and distort will the truth ever emerge?

[Coronita]

[quote=KIBU]This turned into a political discussion about the unfortunate incident. Instead of figuring out about the reality of this intimidating driving, bullying phenomenon, people again state their political ideas.
[/quote]

[quote]
It is not a race issue either. I am an Asian American but I do not care if Liam was an Asian or not. It is equally bad if an African American, White, Red, or who the heck was in that SUV. The bikers were doing all they could to intimidate the car driver with implications of threat to the life of the car’s occupants. I am not sure most of us would not turn panic in that situation and decided to defend ourselves by running away. Unfortunately, even to run away from this crowd was in itself blocked intentionally by many bikers closely surrounding the car.

Reading up to here, we still have not said about where the hell were the police on that long and lawless drive??? Their 911 response should be a big concern to address.[/quote]

Or about the undercover cop(s) that were part of the ride all lawyered up.

[flyer]

Since CAR mentioned “Flyer,” I just wanted to clarify, FlyerInHI and I have completely different opinions on this topic, as I’ve commented throughout this thread.

In a nutshell, this entire event makes you both sad that things like this happen, and grateful for your own life. That’s probably one reason I enjoy investing in films–especially those about superheroes.

As my kids always used to say, “They always come to the rescue when you need them most.” Even though superheroes may not be based in reality, the big box office numbers they do worldwide, makes you realize humanity will always be searching for hope, and after something like this, you can see why that would be true.

[Coronita]

[quote=KIBU]This turned into a political discussion about the unfortunate incident. Instead of figuring out about the reality of this intimidating driving, bullying phenomenon, people again state their political ideas.
[/quote]

Agreed. My bad..

[quote]
It is not a race issue either. I am an Asian American but I do not care if Liam was an Asian or not. It is equally bad if an African American, White, Red, or who the heck was in that SUV. The bikers were doing all they could to intimidate the car driver with implications of threat to the life of the car’s occupants. I am not sure most of us would not turn panic in that situation and decided to defend ourselves by running away. Unfortunately, even to run away from this crowd was in itself blocked intentionally by many bikers closely surrounding the car.
[/quote]

This is where I respectfully disagree here…I would be just as horrified that this happened to anyone as well as you..

But my beef is the way the media circus *cough*
CNN *cough* earlier was trying to spin things (until they actually removed it after dozens or so of us complained about it)..One of which was “Biker attack video: Who is the real victim? – CNN.com”…Ways that were completely unimaginable. Reading it sounded nothing like journalism but instead the National Enquirer. There was even a nice gem of a quote from a “witness” ” the SUV was driven by a Chinese madman”…Ok..So excuse the asian driving jokes aside here. And excuse the person who said it. CNN editors don’t have an issue with running quote like that? Really? Wait, CNN constantly run articles about ethnic diversity and racial sensitivity..And here is same organisation that doesn’t know any better at a time of a horrific event? This isn’t the National Enquirer. It’s suppose to be CNN. And it happened a few times. Not just once.

Funny thing is if you try to go to the link now, it goes to suddenly a “cleaned” up version that now actually just points to real factual news reporting after several of us bitched about it to the editors…finally…

Anyway, whatever… Folks are right. My bad for calling this issue up in this context of this event…It seems to come up during these events, and, who am I to think a little sensitivity of supposedly respectable news organizations would be the appreciated by the folks who were victims in this crime, you know, just in case they were meandering in the news during their recovery.

[quote]
Reading up to here, we still have not said about where the hell were the police on that long and lawless drive??? Their 911 response should be a big concern to address.[/quote]

I’m more interested in the undercover cop(s) that were part of the ride that are all lawyered up.

[Coronita]

oh btw:

Though, not a concern probably in SD, watch your back….

>>>>Michael C Lee
Fellow Asian, please be careful now and it seems hate crime towards Asians are inevitable. My cousin which is also a biker was jumped walking home by a couple of Hispanic guys. He got a few shots in, they just lucky he wasn’t carrying his gun since he’s licensed to carry

[spdrun]

*Two* cops were possibly with the group. Looks like they’re been suspended after it came out that they didn’t lift a pinky to help Mr. Lien, and good riddance.

[ocrenter]

[quote=flu]
But my beef is the way the media circus *cough*
CNN *cough* earlier was trying to spin things (until they actually removed it after dozens or so of us complained about it)..One of which was “Biker attack video: Who is the real victim? – CNN.com”…Ways that were completely unimaginable. Reading it sounded nothing like journalism but instead the National Enquirer. There was even a nice gem of a quote from a “witness” ” the SUV was driven by a Chinese madman”…Ok..So excuse the asian driving jokes aside here. And excuse the person who said it. CNN editors don’t have an issue with running quote like that? Really? Wait, CNN constantly run articles about ethnic diversity and racial sensitivity..And here is same organisation that doesn’t know any better at a time of a horrific event? This isn’t the National Enquirer. It’s suppose to be CNN. And it happened a few times. Not just once.

Funny thing is if you try to go to the link now, it goes to suddenly a “cleaned” up version that now actually just points to real factual news reporting after several of us bitched about it to the editors…finally…

[/quote]

Did not know about CNN’s racist comments.

And what’s up with assuming his Chinese. I don’t see the media jumping the gun and saying a Mexican man was spotted driving erratically or there goes a Norwegian on a bike. How they managed to figure out he is Chinese when all I was able to conclude by video footage was he’s Asian is beyond me.

Perhaps CNN is a victim of the political polarization. As they were trying to stay in the center, they ended up losing most of the audience to Faux or MSNBC. But then they got desperate and started pendering to sensationalism, the result is now they have no one watching except captive airport passengers.

[FlyerInHi]

I hope no one gets offended since some of you say to call it what it is.

Did it occur to you that Alexian sounds like a black, made up, frenchified name?
Maybe his daughter is named Alexiana.

It doesn’t sound like a transliterated Chinese name to me.

[Author]

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