[one_muggle]

hipmatt,

Obviously you worship satan.
Just kidding–you’re obsolutely correct, I second your statement.

-one muggle

[one_muggle]

PD,

Sorry–nerd humor. I stole it from the T-shirt
Five out of Three People Can’t Do Fractions

http://www.cafepress.com/buy/math/-/pv_design_prod/pg_10/p_storeid.17903841/pNo_17903841/id_6452410/opt_/fpt_/c_360/

Well… I find it funny.

-one muggle

[one_muggle]

PD,

Sorry–nerd humor. I stole it from the T-shirt
Five out of Three People Can’t Do Fractions

http://www.cafepress.com/buy/math/-/pv_design_prod/pg_10/p_storeid.17903841/pNo_17903841/id_6452410/opt_/fpt_/c_360/

Well… I find it funny.

-one muggle

[one_muggle]

jg said: lniles, why do you think the laid off engineers and techies will be able to find work quickly here in San Diego? Were you speaking tongue-in-cheek?

I don’t know why that is tongue-in-cheek, it is really hard to find qualified engineers in SoCal right now. One can get a similar salary in other, much cheaper, parts of the country so it is hard to get new grads to come here and I don’t know any currently-employed, competent engineers that are currently in danger of a lay-off. Things may be different for IT or software people, but degreed engineers are in high demand.
Things might change (and fast), but right now it is hard to get work done with all the head-hunters calling. We have way more work (and funding) than people right now.

-one muggle

[one_muggle]

jg said: lniles, why do you think the laid off engineers and techies will be able to find work quickly here in San Diego? Were you speaking tongue-in-cheek?

I don’t know why that is tongue-in-cheek, it is really hard to find qualified engineers in SoCal right now. One can get a similar salary in other, much cheaper, parts of the country so it is hard to get new grads to come here and I don’t know any currently-employed, competent engineers that are currently in danger of a lay-off. Things may be different for IT or software people, but degreed engineers are in high demand.
Things might change (and fast), but right now it is hard to get work done with all the head-hunters calling. We have way more work (and funding) than people right now.

-one muggle

[one_muggle]

Funny!

His appendage might be noodly, but his balls are huge.

-one muggle

[one_muggle]

Funny!

His appendage might be noodly, but his balls are huge.

-one muggle

[one_muggle]

PC,
People should think long and hard before they have kids, rather than pop them out after a marital fight.

So true!

You almost sound conservative. Has someone stolen your handle??!! ;^)

-one muggle

[one_muggle]

PC,
People should think long and hard before they have kids, rather than pop them out after a marital fight.

So true!

You almost sound conservative. Has someone stolen your handle??!! ;^)

-one muggle

[one_muggle]

Perry:the new paradigm is to “increase standards of living by giving people what they need now.” So long as you can make the monthly payments, you can have what you want, now. Computer models allow the credit industry to “grow the pie.”

I agree that this is the intention, along with cheap baubles (sp?) from China to confuse the dum-masses into thinking things are great. I am sure the use of computers and models have streamlined business, but I don’t think that changes fundamentals.
Rustico:Sounds like debt slavery to me, not a better standard of living at all.I can see the younger guys feeling helpless if that truly is the new paradigm.

Again, I agree with you that people feel that this is a new paradigm, but I doubt it. Housing and credit have the heady/queezy fell of tech stocks around 1998-early1999. My bro-in-law was a bond trader back then and all these concepts were being thrown around–he would have none of it.
At the time Wallstreet was paying former aerospace workers to model the market, the internet was bringing a new paradigm, and there was nowhere to go but up. But even before the downturn, the bond traders were already pulling their own gains out of stocks. The ones I know bought vacation homes in resort locations–most have since sold then.
On these fancy models, they only work if you have control or visibility into the variables–and there are way more variables not modeled–AND models must have some second order or higher order terms to ever hope to catch quick changes in the market…etc. It is nearly as complicated as weather modeling, but with the added complications of human factors. Fundamentals will rule the day, long term, but the really smart money knows how to make money in the meantime. I think that time is well past.
Personally, I have little doubt the standard of living is droppping, but I think recent events, such as RE increases and even college tuition have far outpaced this trend. We see the RE trend turning around, and now we even see Politicians getting into the college costs act–great.

-one muggle

[one_muggle]

Perry:the new paradigm is to “increase standards of living by giving people what they need now.” So long as you can make the monthly payments, you can have what you want, now. Computer models allow the credit industry to “grow the pie.”

I agree that this is the intention, along with cheap baubles (sp?) from China to confuse the dum-masses into thinking things are great. I am sure the use of computers and models have streamlined business, but I don’t think that changes fundamentals.
Rustico:Sounds like debt slavery to me, not a better standard of living at all.I can see the younger guys feeling helpless if that truly is the new paradigm.

Again, I agree with you that people feel that this is a new paradigm, but I doubt it. Housing and credit have the heady/queezy fell of tech stocks around 1998-early1999. My bro-in-law was a bond trader back then and all these concepts were being thrown around–he would have none of it.
At the time Wallstreet was paying former aerospace workers to model the market, the internet was bringing a new paradigm, and there was nowhere to go but up. But even before the downturn, the bond traders were already pulling their own gains out of stocks. The ones I know bought vacation homes in resort locations–most have since sold then.
On these fancy models, they only work if you have control or visibility into the variables–and there are way more variables not modeled–AND models must have some second order or higher order terms to ever hope to catch quick changes in the market…etc. It is nearly as complicated as weather modeling, but with the added complications of human factors. Fundamentals will rule the day, long term, but the really smart money knows how to make money in the meantime. I think that time is well past.
Personally, I have little doubt the standard of living is droppping, but I think recent events, such as RE increases and even college tuition have far outpaced this trend. We see the RE trend turning around, and now we even see Politicians getting into the college costs act–great.

-one muggle

[one_muggle]

beanmaestro,

You already killed your dream of retiring young when you got a PhD in engineering… ;^)
Trust me, I know… 8^{

Seriously, an article in Money states that guys earn less than their Dads (Happy Father’s Day), adjusted for inflation: http://money.cnn.com/2007/05/25/pf/mobility_study/index.htm

I believe it. My parents raised 6 kids on Long Island, NY with a civil servant job–no degree (Dad) and an adminstrative job (Mom). They owned their 5 bedroom home, a few miles from the beach, and had money for modest vacations.
Now, gainfully employeed with a PhD in engineering and a wife in medicine, affording a three bedroom house in the LA area is painful. Sure I contribute fully to retirement and have some other investments etc., which my father never did. But, then again, he didn’t really need to do his own retirement since his pension is around 70% his old income, and adjusts for inflation!
I think you really need about $400-500k per year, family income even to live the expected, but non-rich “LA” lifestyle.
Maybe it is more. Friends of ours, whose income is well into the 7 figures, said that they didn’t like going to a certain vacation spot because of all the rich people. dude, that hurts.

-one muggle

[one_muggle]

beanmaestro,

You already killed your dream of retiring young when you got a PhD in engineering… ;^)
Trust me, I know… 8^{

Seriously, an article in Money states that guys earn less than their Dads (Happy Father’s Day), adjusted for inflation: http://money.cnn.com/2007/05/25/pf/mobility_study/index.htm

I believe it. My parents raised 6 kids on Long Island, NY with a civil servant job–no degree (Dad) and an adminstrative job (Mom). They owned their 5 bedroom home, a few miles from the beach, and had money for modest vacations.
Now, gainfully employeed with a PhD in engineering and a wife in medicine, affording a three bedroom house in the LA area is painful. Sure I contribute fully to retirement and have some other investments etc., which my father never did. But, then again, he didn’t really need to do his own retirement since his pension is around 70% his old income, and adjusts for inflation!
I think you really need about $400-500k per year, family income even to live the expected, but non-rich “LA” lifestyle.
Maybe it is more. Friends of ours, whose income is well into the 7 figures, said that they didn’t like going to a certain vacation spot because of all the rich people. dude, that hurts.

-one muggle

[one_muggle]

bob,

you’re assuming the dollar is valuable…?!

-one muggle

[one_muggle]

bob,

you’re assuming the dollar is valuable…?!

-one muggle

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