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Allan from Fallbrook.
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August 17, 2008 at 11:14 PM #258420August 17, 2008 at 11:14 PM #258464
Allan from Fallbrook
Participantpedrocon: Absolutely! Because as Hitler showed us, it is so much better to appease power hungry ultranationalists bent on regional domination than to confront them.
I hear the ghost of Neville Chamberlain calling out “Peace in our time!”.
Actually Santayana put it better when he opined that those that don’t learn from the lessons of history are doomed to repeat them.
August 17, 2008 at 11:55 PM #258182Veritas
ParticipantAllan,
The warriors are all dead. Nothing left but a bunch of limp wristed girly men. It is pragmatic to stay out of this, but eventually we will have to fight.
“O Lord, deliver me from the man of excellent intention and impure heart for the heart is deceitful above all things, and desperately wicked.”
T. S. Elliot
August 17, 2008 at 11:55 PM #258371ParticipantAllan,
The warriors are all dead. Nothing left but a bunch of limp wristed girly men. It is pragmatic to stay out of this, but eventually we will have to fight.
“O Lord, deliver me from the man of excellent intention and impure heart for the heart is deceitful above all things, and desperately wicked.”
T. S. Elliot
August 17, 2008 at 11:55 PM #258383ParticipantAllan,
The warriors are all dead. Nothing left but a bunch of limp wristed girly men. It is pragmatic to stay out of this, but eventually we will have to fight.
“O Lord, deliver me from the man of excellent intention and impure heart for the heart is deceitful above all things, and desperately wicked.”
T. S. Elliot
August 17, 2008 at 11:55 PM #258431ParticipantAllan,
The warriors are all dead. Nothing left but a bunch of limp wristed girly men. It is pragmatic to stay out of this, but eventually we will have to fight.
“O Lord, deliver me from the man of excellent intention and impure heart for the heart is deceitful above all things, and desperately wicked.”
T. S. Elliot
August 17, 2008 at 11:55 PM #258474ParticipantAllan,
The warriors are all dead. Nothing left but a bunch of limp wristed girly men. It is pragmatic to stay out of this, but eventually we will have to fight.
“O Lord, deliver me from the man of excellent intention and impure heart for the heart is deceitful above all things, and desperately wicked.”
T. S. Elliot
August 18, 2008 at 10:08 AM #258282Anonymous
GuestAbsolutely! Because as Hitler showed us, it is so much better to appease power hungry ultranationalists bent on regional domination than to confront them.
The problem is that we’re bogged down in Iraq and Afghanistan so we don’t have an army to deploy to the region. Even if we pull out, the readiness state of our army is currently very low. The reason why Russia feels like they can get away with it, is because we’ve lost a lot of our military power. They feel our threats are mostly meaningless at this point. The wars have made out country less secure, than more secure.
August 18, 2008 at 10:08 AM #258471GuestAbsolutely! Because as Hitler showed us, it is so much better to appease power hungry ultranationalists bent on regional domination than to confront them.
The problem is that we’re bogged down in Iraq and Afghanistan so we don’t have an army to deploy to the region. Even if we pull out, the readiness state of our army is currently very low. The reason why Russia feels like they can get away with it, is because we’ve lost a lot of our military power. They feel our threats are mostly meaningless at this point. The wars have made out country less secure, than more secure.
August 18, 2008 at 10:08 AM #258483GuestAbsolutely! Because as Hitler showed us, it is so much better to appease power hungry ultranationalists bent on regional domination than to confront them.
The problem is that we’re bogged down in Iraq and Afghanistan so we don’t have an army to deploy to the region. Even if we pull out, the readiness state of our army is currently very low. The reason why Russia feels like they can get away with it, is because we’ve lost a lot of our military power. They feel our threats are mostly meaningless at this point. The wars have made out country less secure, than more secure.
August 18, 2008 at 10:08 AM #258530GuestAbsolutely! Because as Hitler showed us, it is so much better to appease power hungry ultranationalists bent on regional domination than to confront them.
The problem is that we’re bogged down in Iraq and Afghanistan so we don’t have an army to deploy to the region. Even if we pull out, the readiness state of our army is currently very low. The reason why Russia feels like they can get away with it, is because we’ve lost a lot of our military power. They feel our threats are mostly meaningless at this point. The wars have made out country less secure, than more secure.
August 18, 2008 at 10:08 AM #258574GuestAbsolutely! Because as Hitler showed us, it is so much better to appease power hungry ultranationalists bent on regional domination than to confront them.
The problem is that we’re bogged down in Iraq and Afghanistan so we don’t have an army to deploy to the region. Even if we pull out, the readiness state of our army is currently very low. The reason why Russia feels like they can get away with it, is because we’ve lost a lot of our military power. They feel our threats are mostly meaningless at this point. The wars have made out country less secure, than more secure.
August 18, 2008 at 10:24 AM #258302ParticipantJordanT: I wasn’t talking about the US Army. This is, first and foremost, a European problem. Between NATO and CSCE, there are sufficient grounds for action. And, yes, I’m aware that Georgia is not a member of NATO, but Russia’s saber rattling has wider implications for Europe as a whole. You’ll notice the deafening silence emanating from Germany and Italy at present as well.
We’re “bogged down” in Iraq and Afghanistan? Really? According to whom? The combat phase of Iraq is essentially over and the problems in Afghanistan are largely a function of the hand over to NATO and UN forces, most of which don’t like to venture off of their bases and actually engage the Taliban and al-Qaeda.
As to the readiness state of our military, even if we were at a maximum state of readiness, we lack sufficent offensive power to conduct a war of maneuver in Europe, and that is thanks to Dubya’s daddy and Clinton and the massive reductions in force of our first line armored, mechanized and infantry divisions. The best we could do at this point is send in the 82d Airborne and hope Putin doesn’t call our bluff.
August 18, 2008 at 10:24 AM #258490ParticipantJordanT: I wasn’t talking about the US Army. This is, first and foremost, a European problem. Between NATO and CSCE, there are sufficient grounds for action. And, yes, I’m aware that Georgia is not a member of NATO, but Russia’s saber rattling has wider implications for Europe as a whole. You’ll notice the deafening silence emanating from Germany and Italy at present as well.
We’re “bogged down” in Iraq and Afghanistan? Really? According to whom? The combat phase of Iraq is essentially over and the problems in Afghanistan are largely a function of the hand over to NATO and UN forces, most of which don’t like to venture off of their bases and actually engage the Taliban and al-Qaeda.
As to the readiness state of our military, even if we were at a maximum state of readiness, we lack sufficent offensive power to conduct a war of maneuver in Europe, and that is thanks to Dubya’s daddy and Clinton and the massive reductions in force of our first line armored, mechanized and infantry divisions. The best we could do at this point is send in the 82d Airborne and hope Putin doesn’t call our bluff.
August 18, 2008 at 10:24 AM #258503ParticipantJordanT: I wasn’t talking about the US Army. This is, first and foremost, a European problem. Between NATO and CSCE, there are sufficient grounds for action. And, yes, I’m aware that Georgia is not a member of NATO, but Russia’s saber rattling has wider implications for Europe as a whole. You’ll notice the deafening silence emanating from Germany and Italy at present as well.
We’re “bogged down” in Iraq and Afghanistan? Really? According to whom? The combat phase of Iraq is essentially over and the problems in Afghanistan are largely a function of the hand over to NATO and UN forces, most of which don’t like to venture off of their bases and actually engage the Taliban and al-Qaeda.
As to the readiness state of our military, even if we were at a maximum state of readiness, we lack sufficent offensive power to conduct a war of maneuver in Europe, and that is thanks to Dubya’s daddy and Clinton and the massive reductions in force of our first line armored, mechanized and infantry divisions. The best we could do at this point is send in the 82d Airborne and hope Putin doesn’t call our bluff.
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