Ignore Ron Paul are the new marching orders?

[Navydoc]

[quote=AN]My questions to Navydoc is, how many tomb stones can you point to of mothers that died because they didn’t have an abortion vs how many tomb stones you can point to of babies who were aborted who would have grown up to be healthy adults?

I always find it funny that those who are pro choice tend to be anti death penalty and those who are pro life tend to be pro death penalty.[/quote]

I think you missed the point of my response. I was reacting to the Ron Paul statement that he never saw an abortion that was necessary to save the mother’s life. They absolutely do happen. You may not know this, but I’m a high risk pregnancy subspecialist, and maintaining healthy pregnancies in women with medical conditions is actually my job. Unfortunately there are times when aborting a healthy fetus IS necessary to protect the mother’s life. Don’t misunderstand me, I detest the concept of abortion, and some of the procedures I’ve performed have left me personally scarred, but the procedure MUST remain legal. I have no interest in placing my professional future at the whim of a court because I perfomed an illegal procedure. What you said about Planned Parenthood is absolutely correct, and the pre-procedure counseling those patients receive can be extremely suspect, especially considering it’s fee for service care.

And there are some people out there who are pro-choice and pro-death penalty. I consider the two concepts completely unrelated.

[jpinpb]

[quote=AN]Maybe you should read the reason why he’s anti-abortion: http://www.ronpaul.com/on-the-issues/abortion/.

Let me start off by saying, before I have kids, I was 100% pro choice and can’t understand why anyone would be pro life. What opened my eyes was going to the very first ultrasound and hearing the heart beat after 8 weeks. I now understand why many people are pro life. Although I’m still pro choice when it come to situation where the mother’s life is in danger, I’m now leaning toward pro life for your average abortion. The reason people are pro life is because they want to be the voice for those babies who are being killed.

Do you know Planned Parenthood don’t let the mother see the ultrasound screen and they turn off the volume? I know a NP who works there and she said if they let them see the screen and hear the heart beat, many would probably back out. I know I did when I saw the first ultrasound and hear the 1st heart beat. I still support Roe v Wade, but only for cases where it would kill the mother if the abortion wasn’t done. Ron Paul’s point is, Life > Liberty, which is why he’s against Roe v Wade.

My questions to Navydoc is, how many tomb stones can you point to of mothers that died because they didn’t have an abortion vs how many tomb stones you can point to of babies who were aborted who would have grown up to be healthy adults?

I always find it funny that those who are pro choice tend to be anti death penalty and those who are pro life tend to be pro death penalty.[/quote]

I am not saying that abortion is a good thing. I am saying abortion should be a decision made between doctors and patients b/c there are circumstances where it is required and the government should not have to intervene.

If you had a tumor, would have like to have it removed or go to the SC to ask for permission? I am not saying a fetus is a tumor, but just trying to make a comparison that some life or death situations should not have to involve the government.

The reason you no longer see tombstones you can point to of mothers that died because they didn’t have an abortion is b/c we are a developed society that allows it. Before doctors were allowed to perform abortions, there were many women who died while pregnant, and many more while attempting to deliver.

Having an abortion has to be the most traumatic thing a woman would ever have to experience. But at least there is still that option when required.

The government really has enough on its plate and personal health decisions should be done by individuals.

[quote=Navydoc]
And there are some people out there who are pro-choice and pro-death penalty. I consider the two concepts completely unrelated.[/quote]

Agreed. Two entirely different issues.

[quote=CA renter]
The decision to get an abortion is never made lightly. It’s an extremely important and personal decision, and the government/politicians (and every other stranger) have absolutely no business trying to force their beliefs on people whose entire lives will be affected by these decisions.

I’m grateful that I was never in a position to have to make this decision, and I’ve felt the awe and pure love as I sobbed my way through those miraculous ultrasounds, so I understand the powerful, emotional reasons behind the Right to Life movement. Still my beliefs are mine, and I do not have the right to force my beliefs on people I do not know, and who will have to suffer the consequences that I will not have to suffer if my will is imposed upon them.[/quote]

Thank you for better stating it.

Our own personal choice and what we would personally do should not be forced upon someone else, particularly on those w/medical issues that require terminating a pregnancy.

Back to the media ignoring RP. They did give him more media coverage the first time around.

[jpinpb]

[quote=AN]Maybe you should read the reason why he’s anti-abortion: http://www.ronpaul.com/on-the-issues/abortion/.

Let me start off by saying, before I have kids, I was 100% pro choice and can’t understand why anyone would be pro life. What opened my eyes was going to the very first ultrasound and hearing the heart beat after 8 weeks. I now understand why many people are pro life. Although I’m still pro choice when it come to situation where the mother’s life is in danger, I’m now leaning toward pro life for your average abortion. The reason people are pro life is because they want to be the voice for those babies who are being killed.

Do you know Planned Parenthood don’t let the mother see the ultrasound screen and they turn off the volume? I know a NP who works there and she said if they let them see the screen and hear the heart beat, many would probably back out. I know I did when I saw the first ultrasound and hear the 1st heart beat. I still support Roe v Wade, but only for cases where it would kill the mother if the abortion wasn’t done. Ron Paul’s point is, Life > Liberty, which is why he’s against Roe v Wade.

My questions to Navydoc is, how many tomb stones can you point to of mothers that died because they didn’t have an abortion vs how many tomb stones you can point to of babies who were aborted who would have grown up to be healthy adults?

I always find it funny that those who are pro choice tend to be anti death penalty and those who are pro life tend to be pro death penalty.[/quote]

I am not saying that abortion is a good thing. I am saying abortion should be a decision made between doctors and patients b/c there are circumstances where it is required and the government should not have to intervene.

If you had a tumor, would have like to have it removed or go to the SC to ask for permission? I am not saying a fetus is a tumor, but just trying to make a comparison that some life or death situations should not have to involve the government.

The reason you no longer see tombstones you can point to of mothers that died because they didn’t have an abortion is b/c we are a developed society that allows it. Before doctors were allowed to perform abortions, there were many women who died while pregnant, and many more while attempting to deliver.

Having an abortion has to be the most traumatic thing a woman would ever have to experience. But at least there is still that option when required.

The government really has enough on its plate and personal health decisions should be done by individuals.

[quote=Navydoc]
And there are some people out there who are pro-choice and pro-death penalty. I consider the two concepts completely unrelated.[/quote]

Agreed. Two entirely different issues.

[quote=CA renter]
The decision to get an abortion is never made lightly. It’s an extremely important and personal decision, and the government/politicians (and every other stranger) have absolutely no business trying to force their beliefs on people whose entire lives will be affected by these decisions.

I’m grateful that I was never in a position to have to make this decision, and I’ve felt the awe and pure love as I sobbed my way through those miraculous ultrasounds, so I understand the powerful, emotional reasons behind the Right to Life movement. Still my beliefs are mine, and I do not have the right to force my beliefs on people I do not know, and who will have to suffer the consequences that I will not have to suffer if my will is imposed upon them.[/quote]

Thank you for better stating it.

Our own personal choice and what we would personally do should not be forced upon someone else, particularly on those w/medical issues that require terminating a pregnancy.

Back to the media ignoring RP. They did give him more media coverage the first time around.

[jpinpb]

[quote=AN]Maybe you should read the reason why he’s anti-abortion: http://www.ronpaul.com/on-the-issues/abortion/.

Let me start off by saying, before I have kids, I was 100% pro choice and can’t understand why anyone would be pro life. What opened my eyes was going to the very first ultrasound and hearing the heart beat after 8 weeks. I now understand why many people are pro life. Although I’m still pro choice when it come to situation where the mother’s life is in danger, I’m now leaning toward pro life for your average abortion. The reason people are pro life is because they want to be the voice for those babies who are being killed.

Do you know Planned Parenthood don’t let the mother see the ultrasound screen and they turn off the volume? I know a NP who works there and she said if they let them see the screen and hear the heart beat, many would probably back out. I know I did when I saw the first ultrasound and hear the 1st heart beat. I still support Roe v Wade, but only for cases where it would kill the mother if the abortion wasn’t done. Ron Paul’s point is, Life > Liberty, which is why he’s against Roe v Wade.

My questions to Navydoc is, how many tomb stones can you point to of mothers that died because they didn’t have an abortion vs how many tomb stones you can point to of babies who were aborted who would have grown up to be healthy adults?

I always find it funny that those who are pro choice tend to be anti death penalty and those who are pro life tend to be pro death penalty.[/quote]

I am not saying that abortion is a good thing. I am saying abortion should be a decision made between doctors and patients b/c there are circumstances where it is required and the government should not have to intervene.

If you had a tumor, would have like to have it removed or go to the SC to ask for permission? I am not saying a fetus is a tumor, but just trying to make a comparison that some life or death situations should not have to involve the government.

The reason you no longer see tombstones you can point to of mothers that died because they didn’t have an abortion is b/c we are a developed society that allows it. Before doctors were allowed to perform abortions, there were many women who died while pregnant, and many more while attempting to deliver.

Having an abortion has to be the most traumatic thing a woman would ever have to experience. But at least there is still that option when required.

The government really has enough on its plate and personal health decisions should be done by individuals.

[quote=Navydoc]
And there are some people out there who are pro-choice and pro-death penalty. I consider the two concepts completely unrelated.[/quote]

Agreed. Two entirely different issues.

[quote=CA renter]
The decision to get an abortion is never made lightly. It’s an extremely important and personal decision, and the government/politicians (and every other stranger) have absolutely no business trying to force their beliefs on people whose entire lives will be affected by these decisions.

I’m grateful that I was never in a position to have to make this decision, and I’ve felt the awe and pure love as I sobbed my way through those miraculous ultrasounds, so I understand the powerful, emotional reasons behind the Right to Life movement. Still my beliefs are mine, and I do not have the right to force my beliefs on people I do not know, and who will have to suffer the consequences that I will not have to suffer if my will is imposed upon them.[/quote]

Thank you for better stating it.

Our own personal choice and what we would personally do should not be forced upon someone else, particularly on those w/medical issues that require terminating a pregnancy.

Back to the media ignoring RP. They did give him more media coverage the first time around.

[jpinpb]

[quote=AN]Maybe you should read the reason why he’s anti-abortion: http://www.ronpaul.com/on-the-issues/abortion/.

Let me start off by saying, before I have kids, I was 100% pro choice and can’t understand why anyone would be pro life. What opened my eyes was going to the very first ultrasound and hearing the heart beat after 8 weeks. I now understand why many people are pro life. Although I’m still pro choice when it come to situation where the mother’s life is in danger, I’m now leaning toward pro life for your average abortion. The reason people are pro life is because they want to be the voice for those babies who are being killed.

Do you know Planned Parenthood don’t let the mother see the ultrasound screen and they turn off the volume? I know a NP who works there and she said if they let them see the screen and hear the heart beat, many would probably back out. I know I did when I saw the first ultrasound and hear the 1st heart beat. I still support Roe v Wade, but only for cases where it would kill the mother if the abortion wasn’t done. Ron Paul’s point is, Life > Liberty, which is why he’s against Roe v Wade.

My questions to Navydoc is, how many tomb stones can you point to of mothers that died because they didn’t have an abortion vs how many tomb stones you can point to of babies who were aborted who would have grown up to be healthy adults?

I always find it funny that those who are pro choice tend to be anti death penalty and those who are pro life tend to be pro death penalty.[/quote]

I am not saying that abortion is a good thing. I am saying abortion should be a decision made between doctors and patients b/c there are circumstances where it is required and the government should not have to intervene.

If you had a tumor, would have like to have it removed or go to the SC to ask for permission? I am not saying a fetus is a tumor, but just trying to make a comparison that some life or death situations should not have to involve the government.

The reason you no longer see tombstones you can point to of mothers that died because they didn’t have an abortion is b/c we are a developed society that allows it. Before doctors were allowed to perform abortions, there were many women who died while pregnant, and many more while attempting to deliver.

Having an abortion has to be the most traumatic thing a woman would ever have to experience. But at least there is still that option when required.

The government really has enough on its plate and personal health decisions should be done by individuals.

[quote=Navydoc]
And there are some people out there who are pro-choice and pro-death penalty. I consider the two concepts completely unrelated.[/quote]

Agreed. Two entirely different issues.

[quote=CA renter]
The decision to get an abortion is never made lightly. It’s an extremely important and personal decision, and the government/politicians (and every other stranger) have absolutely no business trying to force their beliefs on people whose entire lives will be affected by these decisions.

I’m grateful that I was never in a position to have to make this decision, and I’ve felt the awe and pure love as I sobbed my way through those miraculous ultrasounds, so I understand the powerful, emotional reasons behind the Right to Life movement. Still my beliefs are mine, and I do not have the right to force my beliefs on people I do not know, and who will have to suffer the consequences that I will not have to suffer if my will is imposed upon them.[/quote]

Thank you for better stating it.

Our own personal choice and what we would personally do should not be forced upon someone else, particularly on those w/medical issues that require terminating a pregnancy.

Back to the media ignoring RP. They did give him more media coverage the first time around.

[jpinpb]

[quote=AN]Maybe you should read the reason why he’s anti-abortion: http://www.ronpaul.com/on-the-issues/abortion/.

Let me start off by saying, before I have kids, I was 100% pro choice and can’t understand why anyone would be pro life. What opened my eyes was going to the very first ultrasound and hearing the heart beat after 8 weeks. I now understand why many people are pro life. Although I’m still pro choice when it come to situation where the mother’s life is in danger, I’m now leaning toward pro life for your average abortion. The reason people are pro life is because they want to be the voice for those babies who are being killed.

Do you know Planned Parenthood don’t let the mother see the ultrasound screen and they turn off the volume? I know a NP who works there and she said if they let them see the screen and hear the heart beat, many would probably back out. I know I did when I saw the first ultrasound and hear the 1st heart beat. I still support Roe v Wade, but only for cases where it would kill the mother if the abortion wasn’t done. Ron Paul’s point is, Life > Liberty, which is why he’s against Roe v Wade.

My questions to Navydoc is, how many tomb stones can you point to of mothers that died because they didn’t have an abortion vs how many tomb stones you can point to of babies who were aborted who would have grown up to be healthy adults?

I always find it funny that those who are pro choice tend to be anti death penalty and those who are pro life tend to be pro death penalty.[/quote]

I am not saying that abortion is a good thing. I am saying abortion should be a decision made between doctors and patients b/c there are circumstances where it is required and the government should not have to intervene.

If you had a tumor, would have like to have it removed or go to the SC to ask for permission? I am not saying a fetus is a tumor, but just trying to make a comparison that some life or death situations should not have to involve the government.

The reason you no longer see tombstones you can point to of mothers that died because they didn’t have an abortion is b/c we are a developed society that allows it. Before doctors were allowed to perform abortions, there were many women who died while pregnant, and many more while attempting to deliver.

Having an abortion has to be the most traumatic thing a woman would ever have to experience. But at least there is still that option when required.

The government really has enough on its plate and personal health decisions should be done by individuals.

[quote=Navydoc]
And there are some people out there who are pro-choice and pro-death penalty. I consider the two concepts completely unrelated.[/quote]

Agreed. Two entirely different issues.

[quote=CA renter]
The decision to get an abortion is never made lightly. It’s an extremely important and personal decision, and the government/politicians (and every other stranger) have absolutely no business trying to force their beliefs on people whose entire lives will be affected by these decisions.

I’m grateful that I was never in a position to have to make this decision, and I’ve felt the awe and pure love as I sobbed my way through those miraculous ultrasounds, so I understand the powerful, emotional reasons behind the Right to Life movement. Still my beliefs are mine, and I do not have the right to force my beliefs on people I do not know, and who will have to suffer the consequences that I will not have to suffer if my will is imposed upon them.[/quote]

Thank you for better stating it.

Our own personal choice and what we would personally do should not be forced upon someone else, particularly on those w/medical issues that require terminating a pregnancy.

Back to the media ignoring RP. They did give him more media coverage the first time around.

[DomoArigato]

[quote=AN]
I always find it funny that those who are pro choice tend to be anti death penalty and those who are pro life tend to be pro death penalty.[/quote]

I always find it funny how people who are supposedly ‘pro life’ couldn’t give two shits about the 20+% of kids in the U.S. who are living in poverty. How many kids have you adopted?

The GOP uses ‘pro life’ as way to get clueless Evangelicals to vote for them. Their main goal is tax cuts and subsidiaries for the top 0.1%.

[DomoArigato]

[quote=AN]
I always find it funny that those who are pro choice tend to be anti death penalty and those who are pro life tend to be pro death penalty.[/quote]

I always find it funny how people who are supposedly ‘pro life’ couldn’t give two shits about the 20+% of kids in the U.S. who are living in poverty. How many kids have you adopted?

The GOP uses ‘pro life’ as way to get clueless Evangelicals to vote for them. Their main goal is tax cuts and subsidiaries for the top 0.1%.

[DomoArigato]

[quote=AN]
I always find it funny that those who are pro choice tend to be anti death penalty and those who are pro life tend to be pro death penalty.[/quote]

I always find it funny how people who are supposedly ‘pro life’ couldn’t give two shits about the 20+% of kids in the U.S. who are living in poverty. How many kids have you adopted?

The GOP uses ‘pro life’ as way to get clueless Evangelicals to vote for them. Their main goal is tax cuts and subsidiaries for the top 0.1%.

[DomoArigato]

[quote=AN]
I always find it funny that those who are pro choice tend to be anti death penalty and those who are pro life tend to be pro death penalty.[/quote]

I always find it funny how people who are supposedly ‘pro life’ couldn’t give two shits about the 20+% of kids in the U.S. who are living in poverty. How many kids have you adopted?

The GOP uses ‘pro life’ as way to get clueless Evangelicals to vote for them. Their main goal is tax cuts and subsidiaries for the top 0.1%.

[DomoArigato]

[quote=AN]
I always find it funny that those who are pro choice tend to be anti death penalty and those who are pro life tend to be pro death penalty.[/quote]

I always find it funny how people who are supposedly ‘pro life’ couldn’t give two shits about the 20+% of kids in the U.S. who are living in poverty. How many kids have you adopted?

The GOP uses ‘pro life’ as way to get clueless Evangelicals to vote for them. Their main goal is tax cuts and subsidiaries for the top 0.1%.

[Navydoc]

Jp I love how you keep trying to steer this discussion back on topic from the abortion threadjack.

[Navydoc]

Jp I love how you keep trying to steer this discussion back on topic from the abortion threadjack.

[Navydoc]

Jp I love how you keep trying to steer this discussion back on topic from the abortion threadjack.

[Navydoc]

Jp I love how you keep trying to steer this discussion back on topic from the abortion threadjack.

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