MMoore movie SiCKO

[Coronita]

fat_lazy_union, I have to agree with the assesment, but I might wait for it to show up on the documentary channel. IMO Michael Moore is one reason the rest of world generally despises the ugly American. He's a fat, wealthy, spoiled American, claiming how terrible America is. He ought to spend a year as a native does in Sudan, China, or India, then see what he thinks about America.

 

The irony to MM is that he probably shoved enough of the those Big Macs down his fat throat for it to be an issue moving forward. Both him and Rush are just tubs of lard, and probably contributing to the increased cost of our health system.

[Coronita]

Lastly, everday MM does less for this country and the world than do Bill Gates, Steve Jobs, or Michael Dell. -one muggle

 

I couldn't agree any more with this statement. I hate folks that capitalism on people's negativity for personal gain. I don't buy the "to inform the average american" crap. But hey, if folks are willing to pay $7-9 bucks a two hours of their time, well that's a personal choice. 

[Coronita]

Lastly, everday MM does less for this country and the world than do Bill Gates, Steve Jobs, or Michael Dell. -one muggle

 

I couldn't agree any more with this statement. I hate folks that capitalism on people's negativity for personal gain. I don't buy the "to inform the average american" crap. But hey, if folks are willing to pay $7-9 bucks a two hours of their time, well that's a personal choice. 

[rankandfile]

Michael Moore is nothing more than a hypocritical gravytrainer. He plays the role of Robin Hood while he is getting richer and fatter on the backs of the very people he is supposed to be fighting for. Sounds an awful lot like socialism to me.

Here’s a question you won’t hear a lot, certainly not from politicians. Where does it say that I should be FORCED (taxed) to pay for the health of you and your family? If I am smarter, more talented, run faster, jump higher, work harder, or generally make more money than you, why should I be FORCED to pay more to cover you and your family’s problems? Don’t you think that me and my family have enough problems as it is? I certainly don’t want to see people suffer from the pitfalls of life, but at the same time I don’t want to be FORCED to provide for their misfortunes.

There is such a thing as altruism and generosity and it can produce phenomenal results instead. Nay Sayers to this philosophy will cry, “But we shouldn’t have to depend on people’s choices…they may not be as generous as we give them credit for and many will continue to suffer as a result.”

A primary counter to the aforementioned outcry from the left is that humans, in general, tend to live on the path of least resistance. Sure, there are those that will try to excel at all costs. However, for the majority of the population, if there is an easier way to make it through life without having to work hard, study more, run extra sprints, etc., they will not only do it, they will seek it out. Universal healthcare, and socialism in general, is just the ticket for these types – in fact it actually encourages these types of people. Why accelerate when you can just hit cruise control? You’re gonna be taken care of either way. Heck, you actually have a DISINCENTIVE to try harder and excel – the better you do, the more you get penalized in the form of higher taxes and fees. Oh, and another thing, are you so naïve to think that illegal immigrants don’t know about the loopholes in our healthcare system? Think again. Just ask anyone who works in the maternity wards of any San Diego hospital and they’ll tell you that they get a ton, A TON, of non-english speaking patrons who just so happen to stroll across the border prior to giving birth. The resultant anchor baby is brought into this world with high-level medical services provided courtesy of all of us who gripe about our astronomical health insurance premiums every month. Don’t be a racist! They’re only here to find a better life, right?

Personally, I feel that important things like healthcare and education should have a minimal level of service that is provided by our society to all LEGAL immigrants. Basic exams, shots, surgeries, procedures, etc. should be provided at no or minimal cost to all American citizens. All other non-standard services would be paid for by the beneficiary of those services. If they cannot pay for these services themselves, they either find some donors or they do not receive these services. We should not, as a society, be FORCED to cover the cost of these services. Same thing goes for education. Each LEGAL citizen, in my opinion, should have the right to a 12 year education that covers the standard topics in preparation for post-secondary education (college) or entrance into the workforce. Any services provided beyond this (private schooling, tutoring, etc.) should be paid for by the beneficiary of those services.

Additional leeway can and should be granted for those born with physical or mental abnormalities. However, I don’t feel that leeway should be granted for those who are lazy, have made poor decisions in their lives, or use things like race or socio-economic status as an excuse for not getting where they want to be in life.

[rankandfile]

Michael Moore is nothing more than a hypocritical gravytrainer. He plays the role of Robin Hood while he is getting richer and fatter on the backs of the very people he is supposed to be fighting for. Sounds an awful lot like socialism to me.

Here’s a question you won’t hear a lot, certainly not from politicians. Where does it say that I should be FORCED (taxed) to pay for the health of you and your family? If I am smarter, more talented, run faster, jump higher, work harder, or generally make more money than you, why should I be FORCED to pay more to cover you and your family’s problems? Don’t you think that me and my family have enough problems as it is? I certainly don’t want to see people suffer from the pitfalls of life, but at the same time I don’t want to be FORCED to provide for their misfortunes.

There is such a thing as altruism and generosity and it can produce phenomenal results instead. Nay Sayers to this philosophy will cry, “But we shouldn’t have to depend on people’s choices…they may not be as generous as we give them credit for and many will continue to suffer as a result.”

A primary counter to the aforementioned outcry from the left is that humans, in general, tend to live on the path of least resistance. Sure, there are those that will try to excel at all costs. However, for the majority of the population, if there is an easier way to make it through life without having to work hard, study more, run extra sprints, etc., they will not only do it, they will seek it out. Universal healthcare, and socialism in general, is just the ticket for these types – in fact it actually encourages these types of people. Why accelerate when you can just hit cruise control? You’re gonna be taken care of either way. Heck, you actually have a DISINCENTIVE to try harder and excel – the better you do, the more you get penalized in the form of higher taxes and fees. Oh, and another thing, are you so naïve to think that illegal immigrants don’t know about the loopholes in our healthcare system? Think again. Just ask anyone who works in the maternity wards of any San Diego hospital and they’ll tell you that they get a ton, A TON, of non-english speaking patrons who just so happen to stroll across the border prior to giving birth. The resultant anchor baby is brought into this world with high-level medical services provided courtesy of all of us who gripe about our astronomical health insurance premiums every month. Don’t be a racist! They’re only here to find a better life, right?

Personally, I feel that important things like healthcare and education should have a minimal level of service that is provided by our society to all LEGAL immigrants. Basic exams, shots, surgeries, procedures, etc. should be provided at no or minimal cost to all American citizens. All other non-standard services would be paid for by the beneficiary of those services. If they cannot pay for these services themselves, they either find some donors or they do not receive these services. We should not, as a society, be FORCED to cover the cost of these services. Same thing goes for education. Each LEGAL citizen, in my opinion, should have the right to a 12 year education that covers the standard topics in preparation for post-secondary education (college) or entrance into the workforce. Any services provided beyond this (private schooling, tutoring, etc.) should be paid for by the beneficiary of those services.

Additional leeway can and should be granted for those born with physical or mental abnormalities. However, I don’t feel that leeway should be granted for those who are lazy, have made poor decisions in their lives, or use things like race or socio-economic status as an excuse for not getting where they want to be in life.

[MANmom]

How about this? We start treating health insurance like car insurance – you pay for your oil changes and basic maintanance, and if you get into an accident or something major happens, you are covered. Health insurance should be for the catastrophic diseases…you pay for the coverage for the big ones…cancer, accidents, etc. You would get one check-up per year. Any colds, fevers, small injuries you pay for, and when the big one happens, you pay a deductable, say $10,000, then all is covered. There would be an incentive for you to stay in good shape, less money out of your pocket.

Second we take medical students who want to pay off their student loans and match their payment to the loan company if they spend so many hours working in not-for-profit public health clinics one or two days a month. That would provide health care for the indigent at low or no cost and help med students pay off loans faster. What say you to this?

MANmom

[MANmom]

How about this? We start treating health insurance like car insurance – you pay for your oil changes and basic maintanance, and if you get into an accident or something major happens, you are covered. Health insurance should be for the catastrophic diseases…you pay for the coverage for the big ones…cancer, accidents, etc. You would get one check-up per year. Any colds, fevers, small injuries you pay for, and when the big one happens, you pay a deductable, say $10,000, then all is covered. There would be an incentive for you to stay in good shape, less money out of your pocket.

Second we take medical students who want to pay off their student loans and match their payment to the loan company if they spend so many hours working in not-for-profit public health clinics one or two days a month. That would provide health care for the indigent at low or no cost and help med students pay off loans faster. What say you to this?

MANmom

[34f3f3f]

What is the film really about?
It was an emotional appeal to a nation so used to the preferred medium of sensationalism to make a point …and what a point, but what a sad way to make it. This moving but one-sided documentary failed, in my view, to tackle the real issue of why health care is so expensive, or what the best way to tackle it would be? Making obvious comparisons with Europe is engaging, but when poignant counter-arguments are dismissed with a nonchalance usually associated with French waiters, the viewer is left asking what is the truth? On balance, I’d put my money on half truths, as opposed to outright lies, so he gets my vote. But it remains a sorry plight of a people that one man sees his mission to correct a system gone awry, using highly emotive techniques to do it. So folks, not enough balance here.

What does the film achieve?
It has a greater chance of fueling the divisive bipolarity that is becoming more apparent in the US, to which many posts here will testify, than bucking the system. Did Hilary decline to be interviewed for her input? Was she asked? Was anyone asked? Are Americans going to go out on the streets and protest? …I don’t think so. Has is heightened awareness of the issues? Yes, but mainly in the liberal camp who are more savvy when it comes to these issues anyway. Michale Moore is a wonder man, and you have to take your hat off to him, but this was a hard hitting indictment of a way of life, as much as a health care system and isn’t going to endear everyone to his cause, even if they are paying extortionate premiums.

What can be done?
Maybe the problem should be tackled and solved at the State level? Perhaps a two tier-system (public/private) based on ability to pay could be introduced? Whatever happened to Mutuals, whose duty was first to policy holders, because there were no shareholders? A highly litigious climate, high tax deductibles in pharmaceuticals, shareholders vs policy holders, morality vs profit, health education and the media’s role, all need to be thrown into the debate, if you want to mobilize a nation to partake in shaping the future.

[34f3f3f]

What is the film really about?
It was an emotional appeal to a nation so used to the preferred medium of sensationalism to make a point …and what a point, but what a sad way to make it. This moving but one-sided documentary failed, in my view, to tackle the real issue of why health care is so expensive, or what the best way to tackle it would be? Making obvious comparisons with Europe is engaging, but when poignant counter-arguments are dismissed with a nonchalance usually associated with French waiters, the viewer is left asking what is the truth? On balance, I’d put my money on half truths, as opposed to outright lies, so he gets my vote. But it remains a sorry plight of a people that one man sees his mission to correct a system gone awry, using highly emotive techniques to do it. So folks, not enough balance here.

What does the film achieve?
It has a greater chance of fueling the divisive bipolarity that is becoming more apparent in the US, to which many posts here will testify, than bucking the system. Did Hilary decline to be interviewed for her input? Was she asked? Was anyone asked? Are Americans going to go out on the streets and protest? …I don’t think so. Has is heightened awareness of the issues? Yes, but mainly in the liberal camp who are more savvy when it comes to these issues anyway. Michale Moore is a wonder man, and you have to take your hat off to him, but this was a hard hitting indictment of a way of life, as much as a health care system and isn’t going to endear everyone to his cause, even if they are paying extortionate premiums.

What can be done?
Maybe the problem should be tackled and solved at the State level? Perhaps a two tier-system (public/private) based on ability to pay could be introduced? Whatever happened to Mutuals, whose duty was first to policy holders, because there were no shareholders? A highly litigious climate, high tax deductibles in pharmaceuticals, shareholders vs policy holders, morality vs profit, health education and the media’s role, all need to be thrown into the debate, if you want to mobilize a nation to partake in shaping the future.

[drunkle]

nonsense arguments like “the government will screw it up” or “they’ll tax us to death”…

i pay 100 dollars a month out of my paycheck for insurance. gee, if, instead of paying it to a dozen middle men, salesmen, ad agents and insurance underwriters, i got taxed the same amount and got real doctors instead of drug dealers, i’d be far fucking better off, eh?

private industry fucks up more often and worse than government. the government does a crappy, but acceptable job in all areas: who the fuck invented computers? the internet? space travel? TANKS, for all you douchebags that so love wars and fighting rather than TAKING CARE OF YOUR ELDERLY MOTHERS.

shut up with the stupid, red herring, nonsense arguments. the health care industry should do what they’re paid for: making people better. not parsing words, not calculating cost/benefit.

[drunkle]

nonsense arguments like “the government will screw it up” or “they’ll tax us to death”…

i pay 100 dollars a month out of my paycheck for insurance. gee, if, instead of paying it to a dozen middle men, salesmen, ad agents and insurance underwriters, i got taxed the same amount and got real doctors instead of drug dealers, i’d be far fucking better off, eh?

private industry fucks up more often and worse than government. the government does a crappy, but acceptable job in all areas: who the fuck invented computers? the internet? space travel? TANKS, for all you douchebags that so love wars and fighting rather than TAKING CARE OF YOUR ELDERLY MOTHERS.

shut up with the stupid, red herring, nonsense arguments. the health care industry should do what they’re paid for: making people better. not parsing words, not calculating cost/benefit.

[what_a_disasta]

jg, for such a ‘newshound’, you sure get it wrong a lot. Your ‘point’ about fighting them over there was so laced with irony and fallicious logic I just don’t know where to begin.

[what_a_disasta]

jg, for such a ‘newshound’, you sure get it wrong a lot. Your ‘point’ about fighting them over there was so laced with irony and fallicious logic I just don’t know where to begin.

[luchabee]

Like most of the things in this world, the rest of the world gets a free ride because of the contributions of the US economy and corporations. Specifically, much of the great research and innovation in medical research comes from the US. These advances can only be funded with a true market economy. Canada, Cuba, and Mexico are not going to be on the cutting edge of medical research because there is no market incentive for such progress.

In many ways, it is like Europe and Canada’s free ride on military spending. They can devote a larger chunck of their tax receipts to ridiculous socialist programs because they don’t have to defends themselves. They know the US will do it for them. The same is true for healthcare. If we decided to transfer from a market orientated system to a single payer, it would mean significantly much less inovation and R&D, which would literally means millions of people across the world would die sooner because they did not receive the latest treatments.

Besides, it is amazing what percentage of the uninsured are very young, illegal aliens, or those that are too lazy to fill out the paperwork for Medicare. Do we really want to funadamentally transform the US economy (and curtailing inovation) for this segment of the population?

[luchabee]

Like most of the things in this world, the rest of the world gets a free ride because of the contributions of the US economy and corporations. Specifically, much of the great research and innovation in medical research comes from the US. These advances can only be funded with a true market economy. Canada, Cuba, and Mexico are not going to be on the cutting edge of medical research because there is no market incentive for such progress.

In many ways, it is like Europe and Canada’s free ride on military spending. They can devote a larger chunck of their tax receipts to ridiculous socialist programs because they don’t have to defends themselves. They know the US will do it for them. The same is true for healthcare. If we decided to transfer from a market orientated system to a single payer, it would mean significantly much less inovation and R&D, which would literally means millions of people across the world would die sooner because they did not receive the latest treatments.

Besides, it is amazing what percentage of the uninsured are very young, illegal aliens, or those that are too lazy to fill out the paperwork for Medicare. Do we really want to funadamentally transform the US economy (and curtailing inovation) for this segment of the population?

[Author]

Posts