50 years of pension for 20 years of work

[pertinazzio]

If we can pay public safety people less and still attract qualified applicants we should do so. However much F & P personnel are worth, it seems we just can’t afford them at current benefit levels. As it is they and public service employees in general have evolved into a privileged section of the working class. I suspect that very few public employees would leave service if given a take it or leave it salary and benefit reduction. And even if they did, that would present an opportunity to test the hypothesis that only cadilliac compensation packages can attract qualified applicants to public service. Speaking of which whatever happened to the idea of public service? My hunch is that qualified applicants can be found at much lower wage levels for many public service jobs. Just as families need to be thrifty to prosper so do municipalities and other levels of government. Being thrifty means not paying more than you have to! As it is I believe we are getting royally screwed blued and tattooed by the public service unions.

One participant wrote:

“While those other jobs are important, they are not a matter of life-and-death, nor do they provide society with the same overall benefits that public safety personnel do.”

While agreeing that manicurists are probably not as important as cops and firemen there are many professions and economic sectors equally important to our way of life. Consider the U.S. with no professional educators or truckdrivers or miners or store employees. Economically things would be such a shambles that we would indeed be forced to revert to voluntary public security. Are cops more important than the workers involved in maintaining telecommunication and electrical systems? More important than folks who work in meat packing plants? By the way thats pretty damn dangerous work too.

Just as we are considering universal health insurance I believe it is time to begin consider having some sort of universal retirement program beyond the peanuts provided by SS. Many countries do that are at our wealth level. Under such a system most participants could make out a little better and the public sector employees would probably make out a little worse.

To conclude, this will continue to grow as a political issue and yes there are resentments brewing among the working stiffs who pay the taxes when they learn how much these folks (Cops and Fire) are getting.

Just one guy’s opinion.

[blahblahblah]

While agreeing that manicurists are probably not as important as cops and firemen there are many professions and economic sectors equally important to our way of life. Consider the U.S. with no professional educators or truckdrivers or miners or store employees. Economically things would be such a shambles that we would indeed be forced to revert to voluntary public security. Are cops more important than the workers involved in maintaining telecommunication and electrical systems? More important than folks who work in meat packing plants? By the way thats pretty damn dangerous work too.

Imagine life without sanitation workers or wastewater treatment engineers. Cholera, anyone?

[blahblahblah]

While agreeing that manicurists are probably not as important as cops and firemen there are many professions and economic sectors equally important to our way of life. Consider the U.S. with no professional educators or truckdrivers or miners or store employees. Economically things would be such a shambles that we would indeed be forced to revert to voluntary public security. Are cops more important than the workers involved in maintaining telecommunication and electrical systems? More important than folks who work in meat packing plants? By the way thats pretty damn dangerous work too.

Imagine life without sanitation workers or wastewater treatment engineers. Cholera, anyone?

[blahblahblah]

While agreeing that manicurists are probably not as important as cops and firemen there are many professions and economic sectors equally important to our way of life. Consider the U.S. with no professional educators or truckdrivers or miners or store employees. Economically things would be such a shambles that we would indeed be forced to revert to voluntary public security. Are cops more important than the workers involved in maintaining telecommunication and electrical systems? More important than folks who work in meat packing plants? By the way thats pretty damn dangerous work too.

Imagine life without sanitation workers or wastewater treatment engineers. Cholera, anyone?

[blahblahblah]

While agreeing that manicurists are probably not as important as cops and firemen there are many professions and economic sectors equally important to our way of life. Consider the U.S. with no professional educators or truckdrivers or miners or store employees. Economically things would be such a shambles that we would indeed be forced to revert to voluntary public security. Are cops more important than the workers involved in maintaining telecommunication and electrical systems? More important than folks who work in meat packing plants? By the way thats pretty damn dangerous work too.

Imagine life without sanitation workers or wastewater treatment engineers. Cholera, anyone?

[blahblahblah]

While agreeing that manicurists are probably not as important as cops and firemen there are many professions and economic sectors equally important to our way of life. Consider the U.S. with no professional educators or truckdrivers or miners or store employees. Economically things would be such a shambles that we would indeed be forced to revert to voluntary public security. Are cops more important than the workers involved in maintaining telecommunication and electrical systems? More important than folks who work in meat packing plants? By the way thats pretty damn dangerous work too.

Imagine life without sanitation workers or wastewater treatment engineers. Cholera, anyone?

[paramount]

Once upon a time cops and firefighters and teachers could point to good benefits and retirements, but salaries were a bit low – because you were a public servant. There was an element of sacrifice.

Now it’s the other way around – the servants are now the masters and now cops and firefighters and teachers get Great benefits, a Golden parachute for retirement and Great pay.

This has also had an effect on many younger people who just want a gov’t job – I for one never wanted a gov’t job (military excluded) because I wanted to make a definite positive contribution to the country and not just suck off the gov’t tit.

And it concerns me that so many young people I speak to just want that cushy gov’t job – when what we really need is young people to innovate, work hard and out compete our competitors in a global economy.

And in between all of that if they still want to work for the gov’t and serve the community they should volunteer in some way.

[paramount]

Once upon a time cops and firefighters and teachers could point to good benefits and retirements, but salaries were a bit low – because you were a public servant. There was an element of sacrifice.

Now it’s the other way around – the servants are now the masters and now cops and firefighters and teachers get Great benefits, a Golden parachute for retirement and Great pay.

This has also had an effect on many younger people who just want a gov’t job – I for one never wanted a gov’t job (military excluded) because I wanted to make a definite positive contribution to the country and not just suck off the gov’t tit.

And it concerns me that so many young people I speak to just want that cushy gov’t job – when what we really need is young people to innovate, work hard and out compete our competitors in a global economy.

And in between all of that if they still want to work for the gov’t and serve the community they should volunteer in some way.

[paramount]

Once upon a time cops and firefighters and teachers could point to good benefits and retirements, but salaries were a bit low – because you were a public servant. There was an element of sacrifice.

Now it’s the other way around – the servants are now the masters and now cops and firefighters and teachers get Great benefits, a Golden parachute for retirement and Great pay.

This has also had an effect on many younger people who just want a gov’t job – I for one never wanted a gov’t job (military excluded) because I wanted to make a definite positive contribution to the country and not just suck off the gov’t tit.

And it concerns me that so many young people I speak to just want that cushy gov’t job – when what we really need is young people to innovate, work hard and out compete our competitors in a global economy.

And in between all of that if they still want to work for the gov’t and serve the community they should volunteer in some way.

[paramount]

Once upon a time cops and firefighters and teachers could point to good benefits and retirements, but salaries were a bit low – because you were a public servant. There was an element of sacrifice.

Now it’s the other way around – the servants are now the masters and now cops and firefighters and teachers get Great benefits, a Golden parachute for retirement and Great pay.

This has also had an effect on many younger people who just want a gov’t job – I for one never wanted a gov’t job (military excluded) because I wanted to make a definite positive contribution to the country and not just suck off the gov’t tit.

And it concerns me that so many young people I speak to just want that cushy gov’t job – when what we really need is young people to innovate, work hard and out compete our competitors in a global economy.

And in between all of that if they still want to work for the gov’t and serve the community they should volunteer in some way.

[paramount]

Once upon a time cops and firefighters and teachers could point to good benefits and retirements, but salaries were a bit low – because you were a public servant. There was an element of sacrifice.

Now it’s the other way around – the servants are now the masters and now cops and firefighters and teachers get Great benefits, a Golden parachute for retirement and Great pay.

This has also had an effect on many younger people who just want a gov’t job – I for one never wanted a gov’t job (military excluded) because I wanted to make a definite positive contribution to the country and not just suck off the gov’t tit.

And it concerns me that so many young people I speak to just want that cushy gov’t job – when what we really need is young people to innovate, work hard and out compete our competitors in a global economy.

And in between all of that if they still want to work for the gov’t and serve the community they should volunteer in some way.

[temeculaguy]

[quote=equalizer]TG,

You are so wrong. You are the better man, and you need to deal with it.

See, you are helping me and others be less bitter and nicer to others.

“I am a great man but I am less of a man…”[/quote]

Thank you brother, I am pleased that my wine soaked poetry has had a positive influence on you, reading the last couple of posts, it apparently only affected you. I think it’s normal to be a little egocentric, it just gets a little out of hand when people are less happy. Athletes, politicians, bankers, ceo’s, cops, firemen, teachers, did I miss anyone? How about anyone that is not us gets more than they deserve and we get less than we deserve, oh, and nobody appreciates us enough.

I had it all wrong, I knew the recession was coming and I thought it would be good for us as a society. I thought shaking off a little bit of the built up greed and envy that had become omnipresent would be a good thing, I guess for some it gets worse as the times get worse. Maybe it has always been this way, perhaps threads like these are just modern day versions of the angry villagers with pitchforks and torches.

I refuse to end on a down note, this one is for you equalizer. School is starting soon, many of us have kids and may find ourselves interacting with teachers in the coming weeks. Most of them just took a pay cut, they feel as neglected as ever. Instead of making a comment about their benefits or pensions, tell them that you know they are going to do more with less and for less this year, even if it hurts you to say it, even if you just lost your own job or you you hate unions and you hate taxes even if you hate yourself, I promise you it will feel liberating. I’m gonna do it, so do it for me, do it for you, do it for them and do it for your karma. It qualifies as an unsolicited act of kindness to a stranger, so you will get something back, likely 20 fold, so there’s something in it for you. Plus if you make some insulting and morale destroying comment and karma doesn’t punish you, I’m gonna have to and then that will screw up my karma. Scratch that, I’ve been watching too many Dexter episodes, that show makes you feel all justified about dispensing justice. I retract my threat, just be nice, it will feel good. I promise.

[temeculaguy]

[quote=equalizer]TG,

You are so wrong. You are the better man, and you need to deal with it.

See, you are helping me and others be less bitter and nicer to others.

“I am a great man but I am less of a man…”[/quote]

Thank you brother, I am pleased that my wine soaked poetry has had a positive influence on you, reading the last couple of posts, it apparently only affected you. I think it’s normal to be a little egocentric, it just gets a little out of hand when people are less happy. Athletes, politicians, bankers, ceo’s, cops, firemen, teachers, did I miss anyone? How about anyone that is not us gets more than they deserve and we get less than we deserve, oh, and nobody appreciates us enough.

I had it all wrong, I knew the recession was coming and I thought it would be good for us as a society. I thought shaking off a little bit of the built up greed and envy that had become omnipresent would be a good thing, I guess for some it gets worse as the times get worse. Maybe it has always been this way, perhaps threads like these are just modern day versions of the angry villagers with pitchforks and torches.

I refuse to end on a down note, this one is for you equalizer. School is starting soon, many of us have kids and may find ourselves interacting with teachers in the coming weeks. Most of them just took a pay cut, they feel as neglected as ever. Instead of making a comment about their benefits or pensions, tell them that you know they are going to do more with less and for less this year, even if it hurts you to say it, even if you just lost your own job or you you hate unions and you hate taxes even if you hate yourself, I promise you it will feel liberating. I’m gonna do it, so do it for me, do it for you, do it for them and do it for your karma. It qualifies as an unsolicited act of kindness to a stranger, so you will get something back, likely 20 fold, so there’s something in it for you. Plus if you make some insulting and morale destroying comment and karma doesn’t punish you, I’m gonna have to and then that will screw up my karma. Scratch that, I’ve been watching too many Dexter episodes, that show makes you feel all justified about dispensing justice. I retract my threat, just be nice, it will feel good. I promise.

[temeculaguy]

[quote=equalizer]TG,

You are so wrong. You are the better man, and you need to deal with it.

See, you are helping me and others be less bitter and nicer to others.

“I am a great man but I am less of a man…”[/quote]

Thank you brother, I am pleased that my wine soaked poetry has had a positive influence on you, reading the last couple of posts, it apparently only affected you. I think it’s normal to be a little egocentric, it just gets a little out of hand when people are less happy. Athletes, politicians, bankers, ceo’s, cops, firemen, teachers, did I miss anyone? How about anyone that is not us gets more than they deserve and we get less than we deserve, oh, and nobody appreciates us enough.

I had it all wrong, I knew the recession was coming and I thought it would be good for us as a society. I thought shaking off a little bit of the built up greed and envy that had become omnipresent would be a good thing, I guess for some it gets worse as the times get worse. Maybe it has always been this way, perhaps threads like these are just modern day versions of the angry villagers with pitchforks and torches.

I refuse to end on a down note, this one is for you equalizer. School is starting soon, many of us have kids and may find ourselves interacting with teachers in the coming weeks. Most of them just took a pay cut, they feel as neglected as ever. Instead of making a comment about their benefits or pensions, tell them that you know they are going to do more with less and for less this year, even if it hurts you to say it, even if you just lost your own job or you you hate unions and you hate taxes even if you hate yourself, I promise you it will feel liberating. I’m gonna do it, so do it for me, do it for you, do it for them and do it for your karma. It qualifies as an unsolicited act of kindness to a stranger, so you will get something back, likely 20 fold, so there’s something in it for you. Plus if you make some insulting and morale destroying comment and karma doesn’t punish you, I’m gonna have to and then that will screw up my karma. Scratch that, I’ve been watching too many Dexter episodes, that show makes you feel all justified about dispensing justice. I retract my threat, just be nice, it will feel good. I promise.

[temeculaguy]

[quote=equalizer]TG,

You are so wrong. You are the better man, and you need to deal with it.

See, you are helping me and others be less bitter and nicer to others.

“I am a great man but I am less of a man…”[/quote]

Thank you brother, I am pleased that my wine soaked poetry has had a positive influence on you, reading the last couple of posts, it apparently only affected you. I think it’s normal to be a little egocentric, it just gets a little out of hand when people are less happy. Athletes, politicians, bankers, ceo’s, cops, firemen, teachers, did I miss anyone? How about anyone that is not us gets more than they deserve and we get less than we deserve, oh, and nobody appreciates us enough.

I had it all wrong, I knew the recession was coming and I thought it would be good for us as a society. I thought shaking off a little bit of the built up greed and envy that had become omnipresent would be a good thing, I guess for some it gets worse as the times get worse. Maybe it has always been this way, perhaps threads like these are just modern day versions of the angry villagers with pitchforks and torches.

I refuse to end on a down note, this one is for you equalizer. School is starting soon, many of us have kids and may find ourselves interacting with teachers in the coming weeks. Most of them just took a pay cut, they feel as neglected as ever. Instead of making a comment about their benefits or pensions, tell them that you know they are going to do more with less and for less this year, even if it hurts you to say it, even if you just lost your own job or you you hate unions and you hate taxes even if you hate yourself, I promise you it will feel liberating. I’m gonna do it, so do it for me, do it for you, do it for them and do it for your karma. It qualifies as an unsolicited act of kindness to a stranger, so you will get something back, likely 20 fold, so there’s something in it for you. Plus if you make some insulting and morale destroying comment and karma doesn’t punish you, I’m gonna have to and then that will screw up my karma. Scratch that, I’ve been watching too many Dexter episodes, that show makes you feel all justified about dispensing justice. I retract my threat, just be nice, it will feel good. I promise.

[Author]

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