Thoughts on the passage of the health care bill?

[briansd1]

[quote=air_ogi]Rushed into passage? It took more than a year to get the bill passed. How much time do you need?[/quote]

Yes, well said.

How much more debate should we have?

[briansd1]

The government will spend money no matter what.

I would rather the money be spent on health care.

We already blew $1 trillion on a useless war in Iraq. That money would have been better spend on providing health care to all Americans.

I never hear the right bitch about the cost of war. But even as one extra penny hasn’t even been spent on health care yet, the right is calling the end of America.

I think the solution is to allocate the money we have more appropriately and humanely.

[briansd1]

The government will spend money no matter what.

I would rather the money be spent on health care.

We already blew $1 trillion on a useless war in Iraq. That money would have been better spend on providing health care to all Americans.

I never hear the right bitch about the cost of war. But even as one extra penny hasn’t even been spent on health care yet, the right is calling the end of America.

I think the solution is to allocate the money we have more appropriately and humanely.

[briansd1]

The government will spend money no matter what.

I would rather the money be spent on health care.

We already blew $1 trillion on a useless war in Iraq. That money would have been better spend on providing health care to all Americans.

I never hear the right bitch about the cost of war. But even as one extra penny hasn’t even been spent on health care yet, the right is calling the end of America.

I think the solution is to allocate the money we have more appropriately and humanely.

[briansd1]

The government will spend money no matter what.

I would rather the money be spent on health care.

We already blew $1 trillion on a useless war in Iraq. That money would have been better spend on providing health care to all Americans.

I never hear the right bitch about the cost of war. But even as one extra penny hasn’t even been spent on health care yet, the right is calling the end of America.

I think the solution is to allocate the money we have more appropriately and humanely.

[briansd1]

The government will spend money no matter what.

I would rather the money be spent on health care.

We already blew $1 trillion on a useless war in Iraq. That money would have been better spend on providing health care to all Americans.

I never hear the right bitch about the cost of war. But even as one extra penny hasn’t even been spent on health care yet, the right is calling the end of America.

I think the solution is to allocate the money we have more appropriately and humanely.

[partypup]

People, wake up: this bill has absolutely nothing to do with the care of our health.

This is a stealth tax increase to pay for the trillions in bailout dollars that have been heaped upon the backs of Americans for the past 24 months.

This is precisely why Obama was been focused with laser beam precision on health care ever since he stepped into office instead of focusing on the problem that every American is obsessed with: jobs. His one and only concern has been how to avert the effects of his spending in the short term in order to (a) keep his party in office through 2010 and (b) with lots of luck and a few miracles, get him re-elected in 2012. Sadly for these jokers, I suspect they will fail on both counts.

This is also precisely whey the costs of this bill are being front-loaded for 4 years. Would you pre-pay co-pays to your doctor for 4 years? No. By the time 2014 rolls around, our debt will be so severe that there’s no way in hell there will be any money left in the health care *lockbox*. Peter will be robbed to pay Paul, and we’re Peter.

Another clue as to the real intent of this *health care* bill is the entity that is enforcing coverage payments: the I.R.S. How many more people do we want flying their planes, buses and cars into the sides of I.R.S. buildings because they can’t handle the tax increases or are simply too strapped to afford compulsory coverage? Whenever you get the I.R.S. involved in ANYTHING it spells misery and disaster.

If Obama and the Dems were to come clean and admit what is really going on, it would sound something like this: “My fellow Americans, it is true that we have screwed the pooch. My predecessor did it, and I am presently taking it to new levels. The only alternative at this point to a complete implosion of our economy by 2010 mid-terms is to institute an across-the-board tax hike. Now, I realize that you people weren’t consulted when we decided to throw money into TARP and the $800 billion *stimulus* bill. I know that most of you vehemently opposed both of these bills. But what can I say? My masters wanted *change*, and I gave it to them: the change in your pocket, that is. But rest assured, you will get something for your sacrifice: rather than 50% of you receiving decent health care, ALL of you will now receive mediocre health care.”

Obama and the Dems have now officially sold their souls to the darkest of the dark side. They, alone, will have to live with this unprecedented betrayal. I only hope that the spot in hell reserved for all of them lacks any ventilation whatsoever.

People, it is officially time to pick up your torches and pitchforks. War has been declared against you.

[partypup]

People, wake up: this bill has absolutely nothing to do with the care of our health.

This is a stealth tax increase to pay for the trillions in bailout dollars that have been heaped upon the backs of Americans for the past 24 months.

This is precisely why Obama was been focused with laser beam precision on health care ever since he stepped into office instead of focusing on the problem that every American is obsessed with: jobs. His one and only concern has been how to avert the effects of his spending in the short term in order to (a) keep his party in office through 2010 and (b) with lots of luck and a few miracles, get him re-elected in 2012. Sadly for these jokers, I suspect they will fail on both counts.

This is also precisely whey the costs of this bill are being front-loaded for 4 years. Would you pre-pay co-pays to your doctor for 4 years? No. By the time 2014 rolls around, our debt will be so severe that there’s no way in hell there will be any money left in the health care *lockbox*. Peter will be robbed to pay Paul, and we’re Peter.

Another clue as to the real intent of this *health care* bill is the entity that is enforcing coverage payments: the I.R.S. How many more people do we want flying their planes, buses and cars into the sides of I.R.S. buildings because they can’t handle the tax increases or are simply too strapped to afford compulsory coverage? Whenever you get the I.R.S. involved in ANYTHING it spells misery and disaster.

If Obama and the Dems were to come clean and admit what is really going on, it would sound something like this: “My fellow Americans, it is true that we have screwed the pooch. My predecessor did it, and I am presently taking it to new levels. The only alternative at this point to a complete implosion of our economy by 2010 mid-terms is to institute an across-the-board tax hike. Now, I realize that you people weren’t consulted when we decided to throw money into TARP and the $800 billion *stimulus* bill. I know that most of you vehemently opposed both of these bills. But what can I say? My masters wanted *change*, and I gave it to them: the change in your pocket, that is. But rest assured, you will get something for your sacrifice: rather than 50% of you receiving decent health care, ALL of you will now receive mediocre health care.”

Obama and the Dems have now officially sold their souls to the darkest of the dark side. They, alone, will have to live with this unprecedented betrayal. I only hope that the spot in hell reserved for all of them lacks any ventilation whatsoever.

People, it is officially time to pick up your torches and pitchforks. War has been declared against you.

[partypup]

People, wake up: this bill has absolutely nothing to do with the care of our health.

This is a stealth tax increase to pay for the trillions in bailout dollars that have been heaped upon the backs of Americans for the past 24 months.

This is precisely why Obama was been focused with laser beam precision on health care ever since he stepped into office instead of focusing on the problem that every American is obsessed with: jobs. His one and only concern has been how to avert the effects of his spending in the short term in order to (a) keep his party in office through 2010 and (b) with lots of luck and a few miracles, get him re-elected in 2012. Sadly for these jokers, I suspect they will fail on both counts.

This is also precisely whey the costs of this bill are being front-loaded for 4 years. Would you pre-pay co-pays to your doctor for 4 years? No. By the time 2014 rolls around, our debt will be so severe that there’s no way in hell there will be any money left in the health care *lockbox*. Peter will be robbed to pay Paul, and we’re Peter.

Another clue as to the real intent of this *health care* bill is the entity that is enforcing coverage payments: the I.R.S. How many more people do we want flying their planes, buses and cars into the sides of I.R.S. buildings because they can’t handle the tax increases or are simply too strapped to afford compulsory coverage? Whenever you get the I.R.S. involved in ANYTHING it spells misery and disaster.

If Obama and the Dems were to come clean and admit what is really going on, it would sound something like this: “My fellow Americans, it is true that we have screwed the pooch. My predecessor did it, and I am presently taking it to new levels. The only alternative at this point to a complete implosion of our economy by 2010 mid-terms is to institute an across-the-board tax hike. Now, I realize that you people weren’t consulted when we decided to throw money into TARP and the $800 billion *stimulus* bill. I know that most of you vehemently opposed both of these bills. But what can I say? My masters wanted *change*, and I gave it to them: the change in your pocket, that is. But rest assured, you will get something for your sacrifice: rather than 50% of you receiving decent health care, ALL of you will now receive mediocre health care.”

Obama and the Dems have now officially sold their souls to the darkest of the dark side. They, alone, will have to live with this unprecedented betrayal. I only hope that the spot in hell reserved for all of them lacks any ventilation whatsoever.

People, it is officially time to pick up your torches and pitchforks. War has been declared against you.

[partypup]

People, wake up: this bill has absolutely nothing to do with the care of our health.

This is a stealth tax increase to pay for the trillions in bailout dollars that have been heaped upon the backs of Americans for the past 24 months.

This is precisely why Obama was been focused with laser beam precision on health care ever since he stepped into office instead of focusing on the problem that every American is obsessed with: jobs. His one and only concern has been how to avert the effects of his spending in the short term in order to (a) keep his party in office through 2010 and (b) with lots of luck and a few miracles, get him re-elected in 2012. Sadly for these jokers, I suspect they will fail on both counts.

This is also precisely whey the costs of this bill are being front-loaded for 4 years. Would you pre-pay co-pays to your doctor for 4 years? No. By the time 2014 rolls around, our debt will be so severe that there’s no way in hell there will be any money left in the health care *lockbox*. Peter will be robbed to pay Paul, and we’re Peter.

Another clue as to the real intent of this *health care* bill is the entity that is enforcing coverage payments: the I.R.S. How many more people do we want flying their planes, buses and cars into the sides of I.R.S. buildings because they can’t handle the tax increases or are simply too strapped to afford compulsory coverage? Whenever you get the I.R.S. involved in ANYTHING it spells misery and disaster.

If Obama and the Dems were to come clean and admit what is really going on, it would sound something like this: “My fellow Americans, it is true that we have screwed the pooch. My predecessor did it, and I am presently taking it to new levels. The only alternative at this point to a complete implosion of our economy by 2010 mid-terms is to institute an across-the-board tax hike. Now, I realize that you people weren’t consulted when we decided to throw money into TARP and the $800 billion *stimulus* bill. I know that most of you vehemently opposed both of these bills. But what can I say? My masters wanted *change*, and I gave it to them: the change in your pocket, that is. But rest assured, you will get something for your sacrifice: rather than 50% of you receiving decent health care, ALL of you will now receive mediocre health care.”

Obama and the Dems have now officially sold their souls to the darkest of the dark side. They, alone, will have to live with this unprecedented betrayal. I only hope that the spot in hell reserved for all of them lacks any ventilation whatsoever.

People, it is officially time to pick up your torches and pitchforks. War has been declared against you.

[partypup]

People, wake up: this bill has absolutely nothing to do with the care of our health.

This is a stealth tax increase to pay for the trillions in bailout dollars that have been heaped upon the backs of Americans for the past 24 months.

This is precisely why Obama was been focused with laser beam precision on health care ever since he stepped into office instead of focusing on the problem that every American is obsessed with: jobs. His one and only concern has been how to avert the effects of his spending in the short term in order to (a) keep his party in office through 2010 and (b) with lots of luck and a few miracles, get him re-elected in 2012. Sadly for these jokers, I suspect they will fail on both counts.

This is also precisely whey the costs of this bill are being front-loaded for 4 years. Would you pre-pay co-pays to your doctor for 4 years? No. By the time 2014 rolls around, our debt will be so severe that there’s no way in hell there will be any money left in the health care *lockbox*. Peter will be robbed to pay Paul, and we’re Peter.

Another clue as to the real intent of this *health care* bill is the entity that is enforcing coverage payments: the I.R.S. How many more people do we want flying their planes, buses and cars into the sides of I.R.S. buildings because they can’t handle the tax increases or are simply too strapped to afford compulsory coverage? Whenever you get the I.R.S. involved in ANYTHING it spells misery and disaster.

If Obama and the Dems were to come clean and admit what is really going on, it would sound something like this: “My fellow Americans, it is true that we have screwed the pooch. My predecessor did it, and I am presently taking it to new levels. The only alternative at this point to a complete implosion of our economy by 2010 mid-terms is to institute an across-the-board tax hike. Now, I realize that you people weren’t consulted when we decided to throw money into TARP and the $800 billion *stimulus* bill. I know that most of you vehemently opposed both of these bills. But what can I say? My masters wanted *change*, and I gave it to them: the change in your pocket, that is. But rest assured, you will get something for your sacrifice: rather than 50% of you receiving decent health care, ALL of you will now receive mediocre health care.”

Obama and the Dems have now officially sold their souls to the darkest of the dark side. They, alone, will have to live with this unprecedented betrayal. I only hope that the spot in hell reserved for all of them lacks any ventilation whatsoever.

People, it is officially time to pick up your torches and pitchforks. War has been declared against you.

[UCGal]

I just hope the house reconciliation stuff passes in the senate. The Senate version does not eliminate the anti-trust exemptions. The House reconciliation bill puts that in.

On some of the points mentioned previously… California already has medical malpractice tort reform. If a doctor amputates the wrong leg you are limited to $200k or so. The limit has not gone up since it passed in the 1975.

Here in CA we have very inexpensive health insurance compared to back east. My health insurance (same employer) was cut in half when I moved from Philly to San Diego. I assume this is because of the tort reform.

The largest health insurer in San Diego is Kaiser Permanente, a non-profit. I’ve got them. I am VERY pleased with my family’s doctors. My parents oncologists were REALLY good. Yes, I had to pay out of pocket when I wanted the genetic cancer test – I’m fine with that. (Was one dead relative short of meeting their criteria.) That’s the ONLY thing that Kaiser has denied me coverage for. But it’s no frills. No private rooms if you’re hospitalized. They don’t cover removal of skin-tags – expect you to pay for that yourself. But if you’re sick, or doing preventative care – they’re good.

This bill has some important fixes.

It eliminates the lifetime cap. As a person who has seen 2 family members fight and beat cancer… only to have a separate, unrelated cancer occur 20-30 years later – I am VERY afraid of lifetime caps. (and a 3rd member fight a long battle with her first and only cancer) It doesn’t take much before costs start accruing.

It addresses rescission. Where insurance companies take your money for years, then dump you if you get sick.

The rhetoric on the floor of the house last night, during the debate, was pretty over the top. One of the GOP congressmen conflated “Totalitarian Communist China” with the health care bill. I can see calling it socialist – but not communist. The shout of “Baby Killer” to Stupak… former darling of the GOP until he decided to vote for the bill. The exchange between Rep. Slaughter and Rep. Drier was completely rude (both parties involved.)

All in all, it’s far from a perfect bill – but it does address some of the problems. I hope, over time, more can be done to correct and fix the problems that still exist.

[UCGal]

I just hope the house reconciliation stuff passes in the senate. The Senate version does not eliminate the anti-trust exemptions. The House reconciliation bill puts that in.

On some of the points mentioned previously… California already has medical malpractice tort reform. If a doctor amputates the wrong leg you are limited to $200k or so. The limit has not gone up since it passed in the 1975.

Here in CA we have very inexpensive health insurance compared to back east. My health insurance (same employer) was cut in half when I moved from Philly to San Diego. I assume this is because of the tort reform.

The largest health insurer in San Diego is Kaiser Permanente, a non-profit. I’ve got them. I am VERY pleased with my family’s doctors. My parents oncologists were REALLY good. Yes, I had to pay out of pocket when I wanted the genetic cancer test – I’m fine with that. (Was one dead relative short of meeting their criteria.) That’s the ONLY thing that Kaiser has denied me coverage for. But it’s no frills. No private rooms if you’re hospitalized. They don’t cover removal of skin-tags – expect you to pay for that yourself. But if you’re sick, or doing preventative care – they’re good.

This bill has some important fixes.

It eliminates the lifetime cap. As a person who has seen 2 family members fight and beat cancer… only to have a separate, unrelated cancer occur 20-30 years later – I am VERY afraid of lifetime caps. (and a 3rd member fight a long battle with her first and only cancer) It doesn’t take much before costs start accruing.

It addresses rescission. Where insurance companies take your money for years, then dump you if you get sick.

The rhetoric on the floor of the house last night, during the debate, was pretty over the top. One of the GOP congressmen conflated “Totalitarian Communist China” with the health care bill. I can see calling it socialist – but not communist. The shout of “Baby Killer” to Stupak… former darling of the GOP until he decided to vote for the bill. The exchange between Rep. Slaughter and Rep. Drier was completely rude (both parties involved.)

All in all, it’s far from a perfect bill – but it does address some of the problems. I hope, over time, more can be done to correct and fix the problems that still exist.

[UCGal]

I just hope the house reconciliation stuff passes in the senate. The Senate version does not eliminate the anti-trust exemptions. The House reconciliation bill puts that in.

On some of the points mentioned previously… California already has medical malpractice tort reform. If a doctor amputates the wrong leg you are limited to $200k or so. The limit has not gone up since it passed in the 1975.

Here in CA we have very inexpensive health insurance compared to back east. My health insurance (same employer) was cut in half when I moved from Philly to San Diego. I assume this is because of the tort reform.

The largest health insurer in San Diego is Kaiser Permanente, a non-profit. I’ve got them. I am VERY pleased with my family’s doctors. My parents oncologists were REALLY good. Yes, I had to pay out of pocket when I wanted the genetic cancer test – I’m fine with that. (Was one dead relative short of meeting their criteria.) That’s the ONLY thing that Kaiser has denied me coverage for. But it’s no frills. No private rooms if you’re hospitalized. They don’t cover removal of skin-tags – expect you to pay for that yourself. But if you’re sick, or doing preventative care – they’re good.

This bill has some important fixes.

It eliminates the lifetime cap. As a person who has seen 2 family members fight and beat cancer… only to have a separate, unrelated cancer occur 20-30 years later – I am VERY afraid of lifetime caps. (and a 3rd member fight a long battle with her first and only cancer) It doesn’t take much before costs start accruing.

It addresses rescission. Where insurance companies take your money for years, then dump you if you get sick.

The rhetoric on the floor of the house last night, during the debate, was pretty over the top. One of the GOP congressmen conflated “Totalitarian Communist China” with the health care bill. I can see calling it socialist – but not communist. The shout of “Baby Killer” to Stupak… former darling of the GOP until he decided to vote for the bill. The exchange between Rep. Slaughter and Rep. Drier was completely rude (both parties involved.)

All in all, it’s far from a perfect bill – but it does address some of the problems. I hope, over time, more can be done to correct and fix the problems that still exist.

[UCGal]

I just hope the house reconciliation stuff passes in the senate. The Senate version does not eliminate the anti-trust exemptions. The House reconciliation bill puts that in.

On some of the points mentioned previously… California already has medical malpractice tort reform. If a doctor amputates the wrong leg you are limited to $200k or so. The limit has not gone up since it passed in the 1975.

Here in CA we have very inexpensive health insurance compared to back east. My health insurance (same employer) was cut in half when I moved from Philly to San Diego. I assume this is because of the tort reform.

The largest health insurer in San Diego is Kaiser Permanente, a non-profit. I’ve got them. I am VERY pleased with my family’s doctors. My parents oncologists were REALLY good. Yes, I had to pay out of pocket when I wanted the genetic cancer test – I’m fine with that. (Was one dead relative short of meeting their criteria.) That’s the ONLY thing that Kaiser has denied me coverage for. But it’s no frills. No private rooms if you’re hospitalized. They don’t cover removal of skin-tags – expect you to pay for that yourself. But if you’re sick, or doing preventative care – they’re good.

This bill has some important fixes.

It eliminates the lifetime cap. As a person who has seen 2 family members fight and beat cancer… only to have a separate, unrelated cancer occur 20-30 years later – I am VERY afraid of lifetime caps. (and a 3rd member fight a long battle with her first and only cancer) It doesn’t take much before costs start accruing.

It addresses rescission. Where insurance companies take your money for years, then dump you if you get sick.

The rhetoric on the floor of the house last night, during the debate, was pretty over the top. One of the GOP congressmen conflated “Totalitarian Communist China” with the health care bill. I can see calling it socialist – but not communist. The shout of “Baby Killer” to Stupak… former darling of the GOP until he decided to vote for the bill. The exchange between Rep. Slaughter and Rep. Drier was completely rude (both parties involved.)

All in all, it’s far from a perfect bill – but it does address some of the problems. I hope, over time, more can be done to correct and fix the problems that still exist.

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