The Pigs are Famous… OK act cool everybody, there a flood of new members on the horizon?

[CA renter]

[quote=Doooh]What school district. I had a friend who worked at a private school. Those guys were on a true free market system and got paid pennies as teacher… The way it should be. There’s always somebody else who would love to have that job.
3 months off for summer and another month off between Christmas, presidents week, and spring break. 2 weeks in sick time and paid vacation days, and he’ll a teacher is approaching the half a year mark of time off. This is considered part time work were I come from.

$80k and health benefits for 7 months of work is a JOKE! Teachers should not be sacred cows, they the majority of the problem. What’s the % of the budget we spend on education here in CA?

I left my spelling and grammar errors in place so our local Piggington teachers would have some sort of leg to stand on when they try to argue their value.[/quote]

There’s always somebody else willing to do **anybody’s** job for less these days.

The private sector workers are buoyed by those “evil” public sector unions as well. Private sector employees can easily migrate to public sector work if the disparity in compensation gets too large, and this sets a floor for wages in the private sector.

Until very recently, there were PLENTY of jobs in the public sector. If the private sector workers were so underpaid, why didn’t they migrate to those “overpaid” govt jobs?

I would love to hear a well-reasoned, detailed response that outlines how private sector workers would benefit from the decimation of unions. Do you really think your taxes would go down enough to compensate for the lower wages/benefits you’d get as a result of a fully non-unionized workforce? The only people who will benefit from the demise of the unions are the financial and corporate theives who have driven this country — and the world — to the brink of economic destruction.

If the public unions are broken, the private sector workers will fall with them.

Be careful what you wish for…

[jeeman]

CA Renter,

No, I am not saying that they should be paid less, like $18k/year. But I don’t see the reason for them to be marching on an almost yearly basis complaining about being underpaid.

Let’s say that they are making $60k/year for 9 months of work. Then you take their future pension of $50k/year and assume they live to 70. 20 years of $50k/year is a $1 million retirement package. The average 50 year old has only $100k in retirement.

So take that $1M and divide it by the 25 years of work that they actually did, that’s an additional $40k/year over the years that they did work. This is a fair comparison, because they aren’t saving money into their pensions…the rest of us are saving into theirs and our own.

These are very rough numbers, but I’m just trying to show that teachers are making six figures for 9 months of work for 25 years worth of service.

Why exactly are they complaining again?

BTW…I never understood the idea that teaching is an elevated profession. It is the one profession that is elevated, but they don’t risk their lives. To me, it is just like any other profession, except for losers and failures can hide behind the protection of tenure and the unions.

[jeeman]

CA Renter,

No, I am not saying that they should be paid less, like $18k/year. But I don’t see the reason for them to be marching on an almost yearly basis complaining about being underpaid.

Let’s say that they are making $60k/year for 9 months of work. Then you take their future pension of $50k/year and assume they live to 70. 20 years of $50k/year is a $1 million retirement package. The average 50 year old has only $100k in retirement.

So take that $1M and divide it by the 25 years of work that they actually did, that’s an additional $40k/year over the years that they did work. This is a fair comparison, because they aren’t saving money into their pensions…the rest of us are saving into theirs and our own.

These are very rough numbers, but I’m just trying to show that teachers are making six figures for 9 months of work for 25 years worth of service.

Why exactly are they complaining again?

BTW…I never understood the idea that teaching is an elevated profession. It is the one profession that is elevated, but they don’t risk their lives. To me, it is just like any other profession, except for losers and failures can hide behind the protection of tenure and the unions.

[jeeman]

CA Renter,

No, I am not saying that they should be paid less, like $18k/year. But I don’t see the reason for them to be marching on an almost yearly basis complaining about being underpaid.

Let’s say that they are making $60k/year for 9 months of work. Then you take their future pension of $50k/year and assume they live to 70. 20 years of $50k/year is a $1 million retirement package. The average 50 year old has only $100k in retirement.

So take that $1M and divide it by the 25 years of work that they actually did, that’s an additional $40k/year over the years that they did work. This is a fair comparison, because they aren’t saving money into their pensions…the rest of us are saving into theirs and our own.

These are very rough numbers, but I’m just trying to show that teachers are making six figures for 9 months of work for 25 years worth of service.

Why exactly are they complaining again?

BTW…I never understood the idea that teaching is an elevated profession. It is the one profession that is elevated, but they don’t risk their lives. To me, it is just like any other profession, except for losers and failures can hide behind the protection of tenure and the unions.

[jeeman]

CA Renter,

No, I am not saying that they should be paid less, like $18k/year. But I don’t see the reason for them to be marching on an almost yearly basis complaining about being underpaid.

Let’s say that they are making $60k/year for 9 months of work. Then you take their future pension of $50k/year and assume they live to 70. 20 years of $50k/year is a $1 million retirement package. The average 50 year old has only $100k in retirement.

So take that $1M and divide it by the 25 years of work that they actually did, that’s an additional $40k/year over the years that they did work. This is a fair comparison, because they aren’t saving money into their pensions…the rest of us are saving into theirs and our own.

These are very rough numbers, but I’m just trying to show that teachers are making six figures for 9 months of work for 25 years worth of service.

Why exactly are they complaining again?

BTW…I never understood the idea that teaching is an elevated profession. It is the one profession that is elevated, but they don’t risk their lives. To me, it is just like any other profession, except for losers and failures can hide behind the protection of tenure and the unions.

[jeeman]

CA Renter,

No, I am not saying that they should be paid less, like $18k/year. But I don’t see the reason for them to be marching on an almost yearly basis complaining about being underpaid.

Let’s say that they are making $60k/year for 9 months of work. Then you take their future pension of $50k/year and assume they live to 70. 20 years of $50k/year is a $1 million retirement package. The average 50 year old has only $100k in retirement.

So take that $1M and divide it by the 25 years of work that they actually did, that’s an additional $40k/year over the years that they did work. This is a fair comparison, because they aren’t saving money into their pensions…the rest of us are saving into theirs and our own.

These are very rough numbers, but I’m just trying to show that teachers are making six figures for 9 months of work for 25 years worth of service.

Why exactly are they complaining again?

BTW…I never understood the idea that teaching is an elevated profession. It is the one profession that is elevated, but they don’t risk their lives. To me, it is just like any other profession, except for losers and failures can hide behind the protection of tenure and the unions.

[CA renter]

I don’t hear many of them marching every year because they think they are underpaid. The majority of teachers I know think they are fairly compensated.

Teachers are “elevated” because of the work they do — particularly in a society that claims to value children and education. It’s an unbelievably difficult and exhausting job, with a tremendous amount of responsibility and liability.

Teachers are “always on” during the workday, and you’ll see very few people who perform in front of an audience/interact with people on a constant basis work the daily hours that teachers do. When I was teaching, we had a half-hour break for lunch, and a 15-20 minute break for recess (which was usually spent with students or preparing for another lesson, etc.). That was it. It’s difficult to convey how draining it can be when you are talking/interacting **non-stop** throughout the day.

Teachers also have to carefully balance the needs of three different groups of people who, all too often, have opposing goals and desires — the administrators, the parents, and the students. Some parents think you give too much homework, while others think you give too little; some think you’re too strict, while others think you’re too lenient; some want more art, others want more academic instruction…on and on it goes.

I won’t even get into the severe discipline problems teachers have to deal with (especially public school teachers — private schools get rid of these kids, if they were ever accepted to begin with). The reason private schools **appear** to do better is because they don’t have severe discipline problems, and many private schools require a minimum I.Q./test score to get in. Public schools have to deal with all the kids nobody else is willing to deal with, and that makes a HUGE difference.

As for bad teachers being protected by the unions; yes, it does happen, but I’ve personally seen teachers being disciplined and even fired if they didn’t perform. It’s not that uncommon, as a matter of fact.

[CA renter]

I don’t hear many of them marching every year because they think they are underpaid. The majority of teachers I know think they are fairly compensated.

Teachers are “elevated” because of the work they do — particularly in a society that claims to value children and education. It’s an unbelievably difficult and exhausting job, with a tremendous amount of responsibility and liability.

Teachers are “always on” during the workday, and you’ll see very few people who perform in front of an audience/interact with people on a constant basis work the daily hours that teachers do. When I was teaching, we had a half-hour break for lunch, and a 15-20 minute break for recess (which was usually spent with students or preparing for another lesson, etc.). That was it. It’s difficult to convey how draining it can be when you are talking/interacting **non-stop** throughout the day.

Teachers also have to carefully balance the needs of three different groups of people who, all too often, have opposing goals and desires — the administrators, the parents, and the students. Some parents think you give too much homework, while others think you give too little; some think you’re too strict, while others think you’re too lenient; some want more art, others want more academic instruction…on and on it goes.

I won’t even get into the severe discipline problems teachers have to deal with (especially public school teachers — private schools get rid of these kids, if they were ever accepted to begin with). The reason private schools **appear** to do better is because they don’t have severe discipline problems, and many private schools require a minimum I.Q./test score to get in. Public schools have to deal with all the kids nobody else is willing to deal with, and that makes a HUGE difference.

As for bad teachers being protected by the unions; yes, it does happen, but I’ve personally seen teachers being disciplined and even fired if they didn’t perform. It’s not that uncommon, as a matter of fact.

[CA renter]

I don’t hear many of them marching every year because they think they are underpaid. The majority of teachers I know think they are fairly compensated.

Teachers are “elevated” because of the work they do — particularly in a society that claims to value children and education. It’s an unbelievably difficult and exhausting job, with a tremendous amount of responsibility and liability.

Teachers are “always on” during the workday, and you’ll see very few people who perform in front of an audience/interact with people on a constant basis work the daily hours that teachers do. When I was teaching, we had a half-hour break for lunch, and a 15-20 minute break for recess (which was usually spent with students or preparing for another lesson, etc.). That was it. It’s difficult to convey how draining it can be when you are talking/interacting **non-stop** throughout the day.

Teachers also have to carefully balance the needs of three different groups of people who, all too often, have opposing goals and desires — the administrators, the parents, and the students. Some parents think you give too much homework, while others think you give too little; some think you’re too strict, while others think you’re too lenient; some want more art, others want more academic instruction…on and on it goes.

I won’t even get into the severe discipline problems teachers have to deal with (especially public school teachers — private schools get rid of these kids, if they were ever accepted to begin with). The reason private schools **appear** to do better is because they don’t have severe discipline problems, and many private schools require a minimum I.Q./test score to get in. Public schools have to deal with all the kids nobody else is willing to deal with, and that makes a HUGE difference.

As for bad teachers being protected by the unions; yes, it does happen, but I’ve personally seen teachers being disciplined and even fired if they didn’t perform. It’s not that uncommon, as a matter of fact.

[CA renter]

I don’t hear many of them marching every year because they think they are underpaid. The majority of teachers I know think they are fairly compensated.

Teachers are “elevated” because of the work they do — particularly in a society that claims to value children and education. It’s an unbelievably difficult and exhausting job, with a tremendous amount of responsibility and liability.

Teachers are “always on” during the workday, and you’ll see very few people who perform in front of an audience/interact with people on a constant basis work the daily hours that teachers do. When I was teaching, we had a half-hour break for lunch, and a 15-20 minute break for recess (which was usually spent with students or preparing for another lesson, etc.). That was it. It’s difficult to convey how draining it can be when you are talking/interacting **non-stop** throughout the day.

Teachers also have to carefully balance the needs of three different groups of people who, all too often, have opposing goals and desires — the administrators, the parents, and the students. Some parents think you give too much homework, while others think you give too little; some think you’re too strict, while others think you’re too lenient; some want more art, others want more academic instruction…on and on it goes.

I won’t even get into the severe discipline problems teachers have to deal with (especially public school teachers — private schools get rid of these kids, if they were ever accepted to begin with). The reason private schools **appear** to do better is because they don’t have severe discipline problems, and many private schools require a minimum I.Q./test score to get in. Public schools have to deal with all the kids nobody else is willing to deal with, and that makes a HUGE difference.

As for bad teachers being protected by the unions; yes, it does happen, but I’ve personally seen teachers being disciplined and even fired if they didn’t perform. It’s not that uncommon, as a matter of fact.

[CA renter]

I don’t hear many of them marching every year because they think they are underpaid. The majority of teachers I know think they are fairly compensated.

Teachers are “elevated” because of the work they do — particularly in a society that claims to value children and education. It’s an unbelievably difficult and exhausting job, with a tremendous amount of responsibility and liability.

Teachers are “always on” during the workday, and you’ll see very few people who perform in front of an audience/interact with people on a constant basis work the daily hours that teachers do. When I was teaching, we had a half-hour break for lunch, and a 15-20 minute break for recess (which was usually spent with students or preparing for another lesson, etc.). That was it. It’s difficult to convey how draining it can be when you are talking/interacting **non-stop** throughout the day.

Teachers also have to carefully balance the needs of three different groups of people who, all too often, have opposing goals and desires — the administrators, the parents, and the students. Some parents think you give too much homework, while others think you give too little; some think you’re too strict, while others think you’re too lenient; some want more art, others want more academic instruction…on and on it goes.

I won’t even get into the severe discipline problems teachers have to deal with (especially public school teachers — private schools get rid of these kids, if they were ever accepted to begin with). The reason private schools **appear** to do better is because they don’t have severe discipline problems, and many private schools require a minimum I.Q./test score to get in. Public schools have to deal with all the kids nobody else is willing to deal with, and that makes a HUGE difference.

As for bad teachers being protected by the unions; yes, it does happen, but I’ve personally seen teachers being disciplined and even fired if they didn’t perform. It’s not that uncommon, as a matter of fact.

[paramount]

The argument above is just a preview of what you will be seeing more of in the next few months as public employee unions try to get the June $55 billion tax increase passed. They will also try to attach ’emotional’ type issues to the tax increase – probably something to do with children or parks or public safety.

I guarantee you the public employee unions have a think tank of con artists trying to figure out a scheme right at this very moment.

[paramount]

The argument above is just a preview of what you will be seeing more of in the next few months as public employee unions try to get the June $55 billion tax increase passed. They will also try to attach ’emotional’ type issues to the tax increase – probably something to do with children or parks or public safety.

I guarantee you the public employee unions have a think tank of con artists trying to figure out a scheme right at this very moment.

[paramount]

The argument above is just a preview of what you will be seeing more of in the next few months as public employee unions try to get the June $55 billion tax increase passed. They will also try to attach ’emotional’ type issues to the tax increase – probably something to do with children or parks or public safety.

I guarantee you the public employee unions have a think tank of con artists trying to figure out a scheme right at this very moment.

[paramount]

The argument above is just a preview of what you will be seeing more of in the next few months as public employee unions try to get the June $55 billion tax increase passed. They will also try to attach ’emotional’ type issues to the tax increase – probably something to do with children or parks or public safety.

I guarantee you the public employee unions have a think tank of con artists trying to figure out a scheme right at this very moment.

[Author]

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