OT – Whitman Hired Illegal Worker

[sdduuuude]

This thread is one massive troll buffet line. All you can eat.

[ucodegen]

[quote BigGovernmentIsGood]
To me, issues like clean water, clean air, food safety and security, and enviornmental protections are way more important than the amount of taxes that I pay.
[/quote]
Where is it written that to have these, you have to have high taxes? You can have poor food safety with high taxes.. or low taxes. The real question is how effectively is our tax money being spent. Money is a type of resource. Wasting it in one area precludes using it for something else.

Elements within the government often chime that taxes are going up because there are now more people in the country. This ignores the obvious fact that with a larger population, there is also a larger taxpayer base. A 20% greater population also means 20% more taxes with all else held constant. What is also ignored is that with greater size, comes greater efficiency (of scale). The problem comes from the fact that to survive, a company has to be efficient else it ceases to exist – with the exception of a company that is a monopoly. Governments on the other hand, end up creating bureaucracies that have their survival based upon how many individuals are below the ‘head man’. Their survival is structured to be completely in-efficient due to how they handle the accounting. The bureaucracies are not rewarded for being efficient – they are penalized for it. NOTE: I am not stating that all government services need to be farmed out – that would be a straw-man argument. There is a balance. The one thing that does irritate me is when people take a look at another country and want to change this one to be like the country ‘over there’.. particularly when they could just simply move there if this country was such a problem. As you have a right to live as you wish.. so do I.

[quote BigGovernmentIsGood]
Can there really be more than one person out there who thinks about something other than taxes? Answer: Yes.
[/quote]
You are attributing a position to me that I do not take nor have I stated – and then after you painted that position as mine, you proceed to skewer.. I think it is called a straw-man argument in the arena of flawed logic.

[quote BigGovernmentIsGood]
There appears to be a large subgroup on this board who feels that taxes is the most pressing issue in the world. When someone makes a post about some issue of actual importance, the cognitive dissonance in the ‘taxes is everything’ subgroup causes them to either (a) accuse the poster of being on government assistance (b) ask for them to be banned for posting about something other than taxes or (c) to think that all of the handles posting about something other than taxes must be the same person.
[/quote]
Another straw-man, also presenting points not supported by facts in evidence or present at hand.

[ucodegen]

[quote BigGovernmentIsGood]
To me, issues like clean water, clean air, food safety and security, and enviornmental protections are way more important than the amount of taxes that I pay.
[/quote]
Where is it written that to have these, you have to have high taxes? You can have poor food safety with high taxes.. or low taxes. The real question is how effectively is our tax money being spent. Money is a type of resource. Wasting it in one area precludes using it for something else.

Elements within the government often chime that taxes are going up because there are now more people in the country. This ignores the obvious fact that with a larger population, there is also a larger taxpayer base. A 20% greater population also means 20% more taxes with all else held constant. What is also ignored is that with greater size, comes greater efficiency (of scale). The problem comes from the fact that to survive, a company has to be efficient else it ceases to exist – with the exception of a company that is a monopoly. Governments on the other hand, end up creating bureaucracies that have their survival based upon how many individuals are below the ‘head man’. Their survival is structured to be completely in-efficient due to how they handle the accounting. The bureaucracies are not rewarded for being efficient – they are penalized for it. NOTE: I am not stating that all government services need to be farmed out – that would be a straw-man argument. There is a balance. The one thing that does irritate me is when people take a look at another country and want to change this one to be like the country ‘over there’.. particularly when they could just simply move there if this country was such a problem. As you have a right to live as you wish.. so do I.

[quote BigGovernmentIsGood]
Can there really be more than one person out there who thinks about something other than taxes? Answer: Yes.
[/quote]
You are attributing a position to me that I do not take nor have I stated – and then after you painted that position as mine, you proceed to skewer.. I think it is called a straw-man argument in the arena of flawed logic.

[quote BigGovernmentIsGood]
There appears to be a large subgroup on this board who feels that taxes is the most pressing issue in the world. When someone makes a post about some issue of actual importance, the cognitive dissonance in the ‘taxes is everything’ subgroup causes them to either (a) accuse the poster of being on government assistance (b) ask for them to be banned for posting about something other than taxes or (c) to think that all of the handles posting about something other than taxes must be the same person.
[/quote]
Another straw-man, also presenting points not supported by facts in evidence or present at hand.

[ucodegen]

[quote BigGovernmentIsGood]
To me, issues like clean water, clean air, food safety and security, and enviornmental protections are way more important than the amount of taxes that I pay.
[/quote]
Where is it written that to have these, you have to have high taxes? You can have poor food safety with high taxes.. or low taxes. The real question is how effectively is our tax money being spent. Money is a type of resource. Wasting it in one area precludes using it for something else.

Elements within the government often chime that taxes are going up because there are now more people in the country. This ignores the obvious fact that with a larger population, there is also a larger taxpayer base. A 20% greater population also means 20% more taxes with all else held constant. What is also ignored is that with greater size, comes greater efficiency (of scale). The problem comes from the fact that to survive, a company has to be efficient else it ceases to exist – with the exception of a company that is a monopoly. Governments on the other hand, end up creating bureaucracies that have their survival based upon how many individuals are below the ‘head man’. Their survival is structured to be completely in-efficient due to how they handle the accounting. The bureaucracies are not rewarded for being efficient – they are penalized for it. NOTE: I am not stating that all government services need to be farmed out – that would be a straw-man argument. There is a balance. The one thing that does irritate me is when people take a look at another country and want to change this one to be like the country ‘over there’.. particularly when they could just simply move there if this country was such a problem. As you have a right to live as you wish.. so do I.

[quote BigGovernmentIsGood]
Can there really be more than one person out there who thinks about something other than taxes? Answer: Yes.
[/quote]
You are attributing a position to me that I do not take nor have I stated – and then after you painted that position as mine, you proceed to skewer.. I think it is called a straw-man argument in the arena of flawed logic.

[quote BigGovernmentIsGood]
There appears to be a large subgroup on this board who feels that taxes is the most pressing issue in the world. When someone makes a post about some issue of actual importance, the cognitive dissonance in the ‘taxes is everything’ subgroup causes them to either (a) accuse the poster of being on government assistance (b) ask for them to be banned for posting about something other than taxes or (c) to think that all of the handles posting about something other than taxes must be the same person.
[/quote]
Another straw-man, also presenting points not supported by facts in evidence or present at hand.

[ucodegen]

[quote BigGovernmentIsGood]
To me, issues like clean water, clean air, food safety and security, and enviornmental protections are way more important than the amount of taxes that I pay.
[/quote]
Where is it written that to have these, you have to have high taxes? You can have poor food safety with high taxes.. or low taxes. The real question is how effectively is our tax money being spent. Money is a type of resource. Wasting it in one area precludes using it for something else.

Elements within the government often chime that taxes are going up because there are now more people in the country. This ignores the obvious fact that with a larger population, there is also a larger taxpayer base. A 20% greater population also means 20% more taxes with all else held constant. What is also ignored is that with greater size, comes greater efficiency (of scale). The problem comes from the fact that to survive, a company has to be efficient else it ceases to exist – with the exception of a company that is a monopoly. Governments on the other hand, end up creating bureaucracies that have their survival based upon how many individuals are below the ‘head man’. Their survival is structured to be completely in-efficient due to how they handle the accounting. The bureaucracies are not rewarded for being efficient – they are penalized for it. NOTE: I am not stating that all government services need to be farmed out – that would be a straw-man argument. There is a balance. The one thing that does irritate me is when people take a look at another country and want to change this one to be like the country ‘over there’.. particularly when they could just simply move there if this country was such a problem. As you have a right to live as you wish.. so do I.

[quote BigGovernmentIsGood]
Can there really be more than one person out there who thinks about something other than taxes? Answer: Yes.
[/quote]
You are attributing a position to me that I do not take nor have I stated – and then after you painted that position as mine, you proceed to skewer.. I think it is called a straw-man argument in the arena of flawed logic.

[quote BigGovernmentIsGood]
There appears to be a large subgroup on this board who feels that taxes is the most pressing issue in the world. When someone makes a post about some issue of actual importance, the cognitive dissonance in the ‘taxes is everything’ subgroup causes them to either (a) accuse the poster of being on government assistance (b) ask for them to be banned for posting about something other than taxes or (c) to think that all of the handles posting about something other than taxes must be the same person.
[/quote]
Another straw-man, also presenting points not supported by facts in evidence or present at hand.

[ucodegen]

[quote BigGovernmentIsGood]
To me, issues like clean water, clean air, food safety and security, and enviornmental protections are way more important than the amount of taxes that I pay.
[/quote]
Where is it written that to have these, you have to have high taxes? You can have poor food safety with high taxes.. or low taxes. The real question is how effectively is our tax money being spent. Money is a type of resource. Wasting it in one area precludes using it for something else.

Elements within the government often chime that taxes are going up because there are now more people in the country. This ignores the obvious fact that with a larger population, there is also a larger taxpayer base. A 20% greater population also means 20% more taxes with all else held constant. What is also ignored is that with greater size, comes greater efficiency (of scale). The problem comes from the fact that to survive, a company has to be efficient else it ceases to exist – with the exception of a company that is a monopoly. Governments on the other hand, end up creating bureaucracies that have their survival based upon how many individuals are below the ‘head man’. Their survival is structured to be completely in-efficient due to how they handle the accounting. The bureaucracies are not rewarded for being efficient – they are penalized for it. NOTE: I am not stating that all government services need to be farmed out – that would be a straw-man argument. There is a balance. The one thing that does irritate me is when people take a look at another country and want to change this one to be like the country ‘over there’.. particularly when they could just simply move there if this country was such a problem. As you have a right to live as you wish.. so do I.

[quote BigGovernmentIsGood]
Can there really be more than one person out there who thinks about something other than taxes? Answer: Yes.
[/quote]
You are attributing a position to me that I do not take nor have I stated – and then after you painted that position as mine, you proceed to skewer.. I think it is called a straw-man argument in the arena of flawed logic.

[quote BigGovernmentIsGood]
There appears to be a large subgroup on this board who feels that taxes is the most pressing issue in the world. When someone makes a post about some issue of actual importance, the cognitive dissonance in the ‘taxes is everything’ subgroup causes them to either (a) accuse the poster of being on government assistance (b) ask for them to be banned for posting about something other than taxes or (c) to think that all of the handles posting about something other than taxes must be the same person.
[/quote]
Another straw-man, also presenting points not supported by facts in evidence or present at hand.

[briansd1]

[quote=pjwal]

Thank you for making my point. You’ve just admitted your real impetus for your political leanings are anti-Christian/Catholic. Jesus loves you either way brian.[/quote]

How is my point anti-Christian?

How is waving the flag and the cross contributing to the policy debate?

You talk about arguing policy but you aren’t contributing. Claiming patriotism and religiosity does not solve our real world problems.

[briansd1]

[quote=pjwal]

Thank you for making my point. You’ve just admitted your real impetus for your political leanings are anti-Christian/Catholic. Jesus loves you either way brian.[/quote]

How is my point anti-Christian?

How is waving the flag and the cross contributing to the policy debate?

You talk about arguing policy but you aren’t contributing. Claiming patriotism and religiosity does not solve our real world problems.

[briansd1]

[quote=pjwal]

Thank you for making my point. You’ve just admitted your real impetus for your political leanings are anti-Christian/Catholic. Jesus loves you either way brian.[/quote]

How is my point anti-Christian?

How is waving the flag and the cross contributing to the policy debate?

You talk about arguing policy but you aren’t contributing. Claiming patriotism and religiosity does not solve our real world problems.

[briansd1]

[quote=pjwal]

Thank you for making my point. You’ve just admitted your real impetus for your political leanings are anti-Christian/Catholic. Jesus loves you either way brian.[/quote]

How is my point anti-Christian?

How is waving the flag and the cross contributing to the policy debate?

You talk about arguing policy but you aren’t contributing. Claiming patriotism and religiosity does not solve our real world problems.

[briansd1]

[quote=pjwal]

Thank you for making my point. You’ve just admitted your real impetus for your political leanings are anti-Christian/Catholic. Jesus loves you either way brian.[/quote]

How is my point anti-Christian?

How is waving the flag and the cross contributing to the policy debate?

You talk about arguing policy but you aren’t contributing. Claiming patriotism and religiosity does not solve our real world problems.

[briansd1]

[quote=investor]
No conservatives I know are maligning immigrants, they just want our laws followed. [/quote]

How is passing unconstitutional laws such as Prop 187 and SB 1070 not maligning immigrants?

And who is enforcing our existing laws?

Deportation of illegal immigrants increases under Obama administration

The Immigration and Customs Enforcement agency expects to deport about 400,000 people this fiscal year, nearly 10 percent above the Bush administration’s 2008 total and 25 percent more than were deported in 2007. The pace of company audits has roughly quadrupled since President George W. Bush’s final year in office.

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2010/07/25/AR2010072501790.html

http://answers.yahoo.com/question/index?qid=20100823112413AA0CwUB

[briansd1]

[quote=investor]
No conservatives I know are maligning immigrants, they just want our laws followed. [/quote]

How is passing unconstitutional laws such as Prop 187 and SB 1070 not maligning immigrants?

And who is enforcing our existing laws?

Deportation of illegal immigrants increases under Obama administration

The Immigration and Customs Enforcement agency expects to deport about 400,000 people this fiscal year, nearly 10 percent above the Bush administration’s 2008 total and 25 percent more than were deported in 2007. The pace of company audits has roughly quadrupled since President George W. Bush’s final year in office.

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2010/07/25/AR2010072501790.html

http://answers.yahoo.com/question/index?qid=20100823112413AA0CwUB

[briansd1]

[quote=investor]
No conservatives I know are maligning immigrants, they just want our laws followed. [/quote]

How is passing unconstitutional laws such as Prop 187 and SB 1070 not maligning immigrants?

And who is enforcing our existing laws?

Deportation of illegal immigrants increases under Obama administration

The Immigration and Customs Enforcement agency expects to deport about 400,000 people this fiscal year, nearly 10 percent above the Bush administration’s 2008 total and 25 percent more than were deported in 2007. The pace of company audits has roughly quadrupled since President George W. Bush’s final year in office.

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2010/07/25/AR2010072501790.html

http://answers.yahoo.com/question/index?qid=20100823112413AA0CwUB

[briansd1]

[quote=investor]
No conservatives I know are maligning immigrants, they just want our laws followed. [/quote]

How is passing unconstitutional laws such as Prop 187 and SB 1070 not maligning immigrants?

And who is enforcing our existing laws?

Deportation of illegal immigrants increases under Obama administration

The Immigration and Customs Enforcement agency expects to deport about 400,000 people this fiscal year, nearly 10 percent above the Bush administration’s 2008 total and 25 percent more than were deported in 2007. The pace of company audits has roughly quadrupled since President George W. Bush’s final year in office.

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2010/07/25/AR2010072501790.html

http://answers.yahoo.com/question/index?qid=20100823112413AA0CwUB

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