OT: And you thought public employee unions were out of hand

[spdrun]

More a matter of questionable management and a year-long shutdown in 2009(?) due to construction in the building that they were using. It never really recovered from either one.

[CDMA ENG]

[quote=tc]This was meant to be a reply to the comment about the New York Opera going out of business.[/quote]

Not aimed at you TC.

CE

[bearishgurl]

[quote=CDMA ENG][quote=bearishgurl][quote=tc]I am a union stagehand. And I find that to be unacceptable.
I can also assure everyone that reads this that the stagehands in the San Diego theaters make enough to take care of their families and pay for a mortgage on a small house and no more. And many of us work 60+ hours a week.
Also the average non-union stagehand earns $14 an hour with no retirement or healthcare. So when they end up in the ER guess who ends up paying the bill.
And on a final note next time you go to a concert and look up to the 140,000 pounds of equipment over your head. Who do you want hanging it? A person making just enough to share an apartment with a bunch of other drug attics or a guy who has a family and a home to take care of.[/quote]

I’d want YOU to install it over my head, tc, with all of the professionalism you have always demonstrated.

You’re probably aware that SD isn’t NY and the salaries here are a far cry from those in NYC, yet the cost of living here is the same or close to NYC.

Some of these jobs which are “unionized” no doubt look like a walk in the park to a lot of these Piggs who likely couldn’t possibly perform them themselves. Nor would they live in the “small (modest?) house” you bought with your “lavish” union wages.

Case in point: your $14 hr non-union counterpart whose family may be regularly utilizing SD’s emergency rooms who may or may not be doing the exact same job as you and likely doesn’t stay past a year on the job.

Thanks for posting, tc.[/quote]

I have done this exact job as a non-union memember (sic) in Las Vegas and I can tell you the Union Guys werent (sic) that good. In fact many times my team was called in to do the job when the unions guy (sic) weren’t getting it done fast enough cause “this guy can only do this and that guy can only do that bullshit”.

So don’t tell me that shit BG about many Piggs being incapable… It’s insulting to the point I have to say somethine (sic). Been there… done that… and stayed in school cause the jobs were a “nowhere” job and to expect anything more of it was ridiculous.

Stage rigging is not rocket science though I will admit it is tough work to turn a show in 24 hours and a certian (sic) degree of can-do and creativeness is required. That is true of any job.

And yes… they dont (sic) make that much money but I dont’ (sic) want to hear that bullshit comment “union guys do it better cause they are paid too.” Terrible arguement (sic) that continues to be brought up evey (sic) other minute on this site.

I am tired of your attitude concerning the white collar profesionals (sic) on this site. You have a case of white collar envy.

Most of us weren’t born with a silver spoon.

I came from a lower middle class broken home. I worked construction roofing houses three stories in the air. I worked for AD Scenery (if you want validation of my story). I have done all of those Dirty fucking jobs to get to where I am today as a degree’d (sic) engineer and I know a lot of ppl here went to the school of hard knock (sic) as well.

So for once get off your high fucking horse. If you had it so figured out, which you want ppl to think from your 1 page “googled” rants, why arent (sic) you suceeding more in life? Don’t tell us you are exactly where you want to be and doing what you want to do.

I could be a cop… or a firefighter… Plumber… or any other of these jobs… Why?!? Cause like I said I had to at on point in my life and knew that it was a stepping stone to another better job. I HAVE THE PYHSICAL (sic) APPITUDE (sic). I HAVE THE MENTAL AS WELL. As many ppl on this board do.

So stop making poor assumptions of other and saying stupid things.

I will do any job that I have to in order to make it in this world.

Right now, my job, as an engineer, is to tell union people and non-union people… how to do theirs…

Shove it.

CE[/quote](remarks/emphasis added)

I’m going to refrain here from telling YOU to “shove it,” CE, because I so very much enjoy “reading” your (very insightful and “telling”) posts.

You know that you and I have been down this road before …. at least once. Namely here:

[quote=CDMA ENG on May 11, 2012 – 4:30pm.] . . . And for the latest time… Everyone is fed up with “try it for yourself” arguement (sic)… I know I can do 99 percent of goverment (sic) jobs… I don’t need to tryi (sic) it. I’m a smart guy… Maybe not a treffic (sic) writer or speller because I am too lazy to put this in word (sic) first… But I could do police work, fire, administrator, planner, or whatever but I can say this… Most of those people couldn’t do my job.

CE[/quote]

(remarks/emphasis added)

http://piggington.com/more_public_pension_loony_tunes_now_providence_ri_is_in_trouble#comment-209500

By your own admission, you fall down the rabbit hole in the “report-writing” category.

CE, I don’t have a red pen to use on here but I daresay that you wouldn’t have been able to even get through the POST academy for those public law-enforcement position(s) you (once?) aspired to because you obviously had/have rather glaring problems with spelling, sentence/word structure and punctuation. If you were not/are not able to write coherent reports (to be reviewed by your superiors) about each “incident” you were a party to for every shift, I’m here to tell you that you wouldn’t possibly be able to “make the grade.”

Oh, and, by the way, those daily “reports” are often written “on the fly” while sitting in a vehicle, with no time to repeatedly consult a dictionary, thesaurus or The Elements of Style.

No matter who your choice employing-agency was/is, multiple lawyers and judges could very likely see many of your reports and even show them to juries. I’m sorry to be the bearer of bad news here but law-enforcement hiring agencies cannot hire recruits who appear to be “borderline illiterate,” which, as public entities, would obviously reflect back onto them. Thus, these deficient recruits wouldn’t be able to finish the academy in the time allotted to do so.

For your sake, I hope you have use of a competent secretary with your current employer. It takes ~15-20 years on the job for a small portion of former law-enforcement recruits to obtain the use of professional secretarial services on the job (by being promoted 2-3 times). And this individual does NOT usually write their reports for them.

***

Sorry for the hijack, tc. I couldn’t resist. Keep up the good work!

[bearishgurl]

[quote=spdrun]Really difficult to answer this. I’d say on average, costs other than housing in NYC are 1.25-1.5x those of San Diego.

“Normal” housing in Manhattan (i.e. not condos bought by magnates and Russian heiresses) is probably 3-6x as expensive per sq ft than San Diego, depending on whether you rent or buy, but most people don’t have as much square footage, simple as that.

Housing in convenient/nice parts of NJ is actually about the same as San Diego as far as monthly nut if you buy. Higher taxes in general (with a few exceptions that I won’t advertise to vultures here 🙂 ), but lower purchase price per sq ft.

$400k would probably mean $250k take home after taxes. You could do pretty nicely with this, the more if you bought housing 20 years ago when it was cheap and have it mostly paid off by this point. Those are stagehands in the sense of senior management, not errand boys after all — they’re probably been there a while 🙂

If those people bought a brownstone in what used to be a bad area of Brooklyn for a few hundred thou 20 years ago, it may be worth north of a mill now, and they’ll still be paying $200/mo in property tax (property tax for houses in the city is actually super cheap).

I’m not sure if this really answers anyone’s question, because the NY area is so damn diverse that it all depends where exactly one chooses to live. And moving a mile in one direction or another can result in a significant difference in costs.

Upper East Side — it’s actually cheaper than some trendier areas of Manhattan these days. It’s never been trendy, it has only one subway line (changing ca. 2015-6) and it’s considered a bit of an older area. And there’s a big difference between what’s west of Park Ave and what’s east of 2nd or 3rd Ave as well.[/quote]

Thank you for your expertise, spdrun. From your post, I take it that the majority of Manhattan and close-in burrough residents live in smaller quarters than similarly-situated residents (those with similar demographics) of SD County. Of course, due to age and likely being built out many decades (or even >100 yrs) ago, there likely aren’t any 2500 – 4500 sf “mcmansions” there to choose from which are typical of those built in SD County in the last 15 yrs or so. So NYC residents are used to living in smaller quarters than CA residents (especially suburban and exurban CA residents). This doesn’t make them any less valuable, just smaller, just as smaller houses within a few miles of dtn SD cost just as much or more than many larger houses located 20+ miles away. Because of their small size, they do not generally attract too many Gen Y and younger Gen X buyers in SD, that is, unless the buyer has relatives living nearby. Because, unlike NYC, SD County worker-bee buyers DO have the choice to move out into suburbia and exurbia without crossing one or more (crowded) bridges twice daily into/out of another county or state. SD County buyers often get 2-3 times the space in an outlying area for the same price as an urban dwelling.

I find it interesting that property taxes on a typical Brooklyn brownstone are just ~$1200 annually. That has got to be a bargain as even if it is only 1500 sf, I seem to remember reading that they had basements.

My (armchair) experience with NY’s upper east side (spacious) flats/apts (co-ops?) was from the pages of Architectural Digest, lol. Its depicted “remodeled” apts appeared to be 2200 to 3600 sf (avg of abt 2500-2600 sf). The views from most of the windows were spectacular, as I recall.

I’ve never been to NYC (or NY, for that matter) but have helped send each of my kids to NYC on school trips (one twice). Maybe I’ll visit someday and have one or more of THEM show me all the tourist sites 🙂

It seems that the “culture” of a typical New Yorker is to be content with living in less space and there is nothing wrong with that. I’m sure other amenities they have outside their doorsteps which we don’t have here more than make up for that. And a family of 3 or 4 doesn’t need 3000 sf anyway, IMO.

[SK in CV]

[quote=bearishgurl]My (armchair) experience with NY’s upper east side (spacious) flats/apts (co-ops?) was from the pages of Architectural Digest, lol. Its depicted “remodeled” apts appeared to be 2200 to 3600 sf (avg of abt 2500-2600 sf). The views from most of the windows were spectacular, as I recall.

[/quote]

You may not realize it, but that kind of square footage is huge for anywhere in the city. 300 to 500 sq foot 1br or less apartments are more common, and even those sell for $700/sq foot and up. >2,000 sq foot is more often closer to $1,000/sq ft and up. And maintenance fees of over $1,000/mo. even in those smaller units are not uncommon. It really isn’t anything like the SD market.

I spent a few minutes looking and this one doesn’t seem atypical.

http://www.trulia.com/property/3130465039-123-E-88th-St-2C-New-York-NY-10128

675 sq ft
$450K
Monthy fee: $1,013
Needs renovation

[bearishgurl]

[quote=SK in CV][quote=bearishgurl]My (armchair) experience with NY’s upper east side (spacious) flats/apts (co-ops?) was from the pages of Architectural Digest, lol. Its depicted “remodeled” apts appeared to be 2200 to 3600 sf (avg of abt 2500-2600 sf). The views from most of the windows were spectacular, as I recall.

[/quote]

You may not realize it, but that kind of square footage is huge for anywhere in the city. 300 to 500 sq foot 1br or less apartments are more common, and even those sell for $700/sq foot and up. >2,000 sq foot is more often closer to $1,000/sq ft and up. And maintenance fees of over $1,000/mo. even in those smaller units are not uncommon. It really isn’t anything like the SD market.

I spent a few minutes looking and this one doesn’t seem atypical.

http://www.trulia.com/property/3130465039-123-E-88th-St-2C-New-York-NY-10128

675 sq ft
$450K
Monthy fee: $1,013
Needs renovation[/quote]

SK, it is possible that since I was looking at NY apts featured in Architectural Digest that they are “flats” which were formerly two or more units (or take up a whole floor in a bldg, like the typical “flat” in SF). In that magazine, the NY apts featured were all heavily remodeled and redecorated professionally by their well-known affluent New Yorker and celebrity owners from all over the world … ALL very deep-pocketed and who didn’t live there or even move in until the work was completed to their liking. A couple of NY apts I remember seeing in there in the last year-plus were owned by Beyonce/Jay-Z and Anne Hathaway, as I recall.

Your listing link is undoubtedly much more representative of what a typical worker-bee who owns a residence on the upper east side would own and live in. And it is still very nice … nicer than a dtn SD condo in the same price range in that its hardwood floors and walls are original oak (or mahogany) and plaster. Maybe your listing is referring to a needed kitchen or bathroom remodel because it doesn’t show any pictures of those areas. From the photos, I don’t see where it needs extensive renovation as it says in the description.

The $64M question is, “Why are the (HOA?/Co-op?) monthly dues 100-150% higher in Manhattan than for a similarly-situated urban unit in SD?” I’m also wondering what is included in a typical owned NY apt’s monthly dues.

Any answers? spdrun?

[spdrun]

Why are dues much higher…?

They almost always include:
(1) Heat
(2) Hot water
(3) Gas
(4) Water

They sometimes include electricity, especially in older buildings built with no electrical submetering. There are much fewer buildings with doormen, elevators, and live-in supers in SD than NYC.

Co-op dues also include property taxes, which are unfortunately higher than those for single-family up to three-family brownstones. Tax on apartments ends to be about 1% of value as opposed to 1/5 that for brownstones, though the formula is based on rental price and other factors, not sale price.

Lastly … you’re dealing with much older buildings which require more upkeep than your typical 1970s condo development in San Diego. Maybe the most apt comparison would be the El-Cortez Hotel Condos in San Diego, which also has pretty high HOA dues. Co-op boards can also take their own mortgages, so some of the dues can be underlying debt service.

Interestingly, if you get the right building, you can end up with very low dues including taxes. Like under $600/mo for a two-bedroom, or $250-400 for a 1/1.

[bearishgurl]

[quote=spdrun]Why are dues much higher…?

They almost always include:
(1) Heat
(2) Hot water
(3) Gas
(4) Water

They sometimes include electricity, especially in older buildings built with no electrical submetering.

Co-op dues also include property taxes, which are unfortunately higher than those for single-family up to three-family brownstones. Tax on apartments ends to be about 1% of value as opposed to 1/5 that for brownstones, though the formula is based on rental price and other factors, not sale price.

Lastly … you’re dealing with much older buildings which require more upkeep than your typical 1970s condo development in San Diego. Maybe the most apt comparison would be the El-Cortez Hotel Condos in San Diego, which also has pretty high HOA dues.[/quote]

Ahh, yes, thank you, spdrun. If we compare the monthly expenses (besides monthly principal and interest, if applicable) of a typical NYC co-op with a dtn SD condo (both ~$450K and ~675 sf):

Dtn SD condo typically has:

-Interior insurance premium: $35
-Gas portion of SDG&E: $20
-Electric portion of SDG&E: $30
-Cable internet/TV/landline phone: $140 (w/2 yr contract)
-HOA dues: $365 (avg)
-Taxes/12 mos: $439
(SD water/sewer & trash p/u paid by HOA)

Total $1029 mo.

NYC condo featured in SK’s listing has:

-Interior insurance premium: $35
-Co-op dues: $1013

Total $1048 mo.

I believe we still have a cable company monopoly in dtn SD (Cox) and for those buildings on streets w/o fibre optic and/or too old (and expensive) to retrofit for cable, we have a choice of ATT U-verse (DSL and Dish) and perhaps a couple of small, obscure providers.

spdrun, do you know if cable internet/phone/landline service typically included in NYC co-op monthly dues? I know of one complex here which has always had cable TV included in their dues (Marina Park). Its dues were about $265 month upon opening in 1982-ish and I have no idea how much they are today. I believe Brittany Tower (circa 1984-ish – north side of Laurel street) also has cable included in its mo dues.

What about at least one underground parking space per unit (as SD dtn condos have)?

And I’m sure a few condo complexes in dtn SD (with $450K units) have HOA dues of up to $600 month and/or stagger the cost of monthly dues upon the size of unit. Since there have been so many units built down there in the last ten years or so, I don’t know how many of them today have TV/cable internet expense built into their HOA dues.

I’m trying to compare apples-to-apples living costs here between urban (mainly dtn) SD and NYC and I’m really not sure they’re that much different for the bottom 95%. Yet the salaries in NY (as in SF) are MUCH higher than SD for the same position. And, of course, there aren’t as many jobs in as many fields available in or near dtn SD as there are in Manhattan, NYC. So we may have to factor in commuting costs (by private vehicle) for a portion of dtn SD residents who are still working (not yet “retired”). In SD, it isn’t very practical to ride the trolley and/or bus(es) more than ten miles for a one-way trip as it would take far too long to arrive at most destinations due to transfer glitches and service cuts.

A lot of people shun SF as a place to live due to perceived cost but if you own your bldg or unit outright (or lease a rent-controlled unit), it isn’t any more expensive than doing same in SD and in many cases is probably cheaper than your expenses would be if you owned a comparable dtn SD unit outright. This is mainly due to size because most of the apts in SF are considered “flats” (take up a whole floor) and are over ~1600 sf. When you factor in the ultra cheap transportation available there which coordinates like clockwork with each other (bus/cable car/streetcar) and the fact that comparable jobs there pay ~45% more than SD, the cost of living there seems much more reasonable. This doesn’t even include other tangible employer benefits (such as 401K funds-matching at a higher salary point) and the fact that employees there can put on their resumes $XX as their last salary (in SF) vs. $X as their last salary (in SD) which makes them seem more “valuable” to the next employer.

[SK in CV]

BG, sometimes I think you just pull numbers out of your backside. Most SF jobs don’t pay 45% more than SD. It’s more like 15 to 20% more, with the cost of living differential just a couple % more.

The cost of living in NY is much as 30 to 75% more than SD. Salary differential varies but most sources have it as about 10 to 20%.

[bearishgurl]

[quote=SK in CV]BG, sometimes I think you just pull numbers out of your backside. Most SF jobs don’t pay 45% more than SD. It’s more like 15 to 20% more, with the cost of living differential just a couple % more.[/quote]

My own kid(s) are currently making 40-45% more in SF than they ever could in SD County. In addition, employees there are promoted faster, often MUCH faster than they would be in SD County.

As you know, SD has a porous int’l border and there are too many people (Americans and Mexicans alike) willing to work for less in SD because they can live much cheaper in MX and commute to work every day on a Sentri Pass. You might be shocked to learn that many of these daily int’l commuters are actually doctors, dentists, lawyers, other professionals and various para-professionals. They are NOT all gardeners, busboys and dishwashers as is a common belief.

In addition, there are still 2-3 dozen mobile home/manufactured home parks which allow families (under age 55) to reside in them in all areas of SD County except dtn SD and close-in metro communities. SF Bay area doesn’t have those unless a SF/SV worker who lives in one is willing to cross an east-west bridge every day and commute another 20++ miles east after that, making their daily commute close to 3 hrs RT.

In numerous SF bay area cities, mobile home parks have been long banned, and, in any case, the land there is too valuable to bother with trying to manage one. In at least a dozen Peninsula cities, there haven’t been any residential building permits issued (except for a major remodel of 1-4 units) in 10-20 years.

In short, there are far more nontraditional housing alternatives available in SD County than in SF and the Bay area and all of these “affordable” communities have workers in residence who can afford to work for less and do and will continue to do so until they retire because they are not going anywhere.

Then there is the ever-present “sunshine tax” in SD County, as Pigg ER has so eloquently posted here a few times. Unlike the strong winds in the SF peninsula frequently blowing up against the Santa Cruz mtn range, SD has a balmy breeze, more beaches and warmer water 11 mos out of the year. The mantra of SD employers is, “This is what we pay. If you don’t like the salary here, you are welcome to look for a position elsewhere.”

Even local city/county job payscales for the close-in SF Bay Area are 20-50% higher than SD County for the same or similar classifications. I’ve posted them here before for SF and a couple of surrounding counties but of course, this was before Vallejo went BK and the public outrage of city/county pension levels.

[quote=SK in CV]The cost of living in NY is much as 30 to 75% more than SD. Salary differential varies but most sources have it as about 10 to 20%.[/quote]

SK, besides not including cable TV/internet expense and not knowing if your $450K listing has an underground pkg space, why do you think the cost of living in NYC is 30-75% higher than SD?

I don’t know but I’m surmising that water/sewer and trash pickup expense is included in NYC co-op dues because spdrun stated that the rest of the (necessary) utilities typically are.

[SK in CV]

There’s no reason to argue with you BG, check some sources. Here’s a place to start.

http://swz.salary.com/CostOfLivingWizard/LayoutScripts/Coll_Start.aspx

There are lots more sources out there.

The listing doesn’t include parking. If it did, it would say so. Parking is scarce in NYC and very expensive, which is why most people who live in NYC don’t own cars. In all but the north end of the Manhattan, a lot fewer than 1/2 own cars. Even fewer own two.

Restaurants are much more expensive than in SD. As is food. And people eat out much more because kitchens are tiny, and without cars, big shopping trips are difficult. There are markets on every other corner, but most people don’t have room to store 16 rolls of paper towels from Costco. (Though I think there is one on the island now.) There is no such thing as an apples for apples comparison. Lifestyles are different. And it is a much more expensive lifestyle by necessity there.

[spdrun]

More info:

Sewer: almost always included, as is water.
Trash pickup: that’s part of city tax for anything residential, so also included.

Very basic cable (i.e. the air channels + C-SPAN + a few other channels): generally included
Internet/phone/advanced cable: virtually never included. Choices for phone/internet are generally Verizon (FiOS or DSL), or cable (Time Warner or Optonline, depending on area). Without advanced cable TV, you’re talking $60-80/mo.

Question is, is downtown SD vs Manhattan an apples-to-apples comparison, or are the more residential parts of Manhattan equivalent to North Park, with the trency parts of Brooklyn being equivalent to the beach cities? Or vice versa, or something.

Downtown SD seems more equivalent to Midtown Manhattan and the Wall St. area, if anything.

[bearishgurl]

spdrun, how much does an adult monthly subway pass cost in Manhattan?

And SK, I have never bought 16 rolls at a time of paper towels in my life. I just buy ONE at a time and go thru 2-3 rolls per yr (yes, even when I had kids at home). Being able to “stock up” while living in a 675 sf unit in the middle of a city is not a necessity. Believe it or not, there is a Costco, Trader Joes, Bed Bath & Beyond, Office Depot, Ikea, Best Buy, and other various and sundry “big box” stores in SF, as well as a large indoor mall plus all the (flagship) dept stores in Union Square. Many of the “big box” stores are not in plain view because they are partially or completely underground :=] There is even a Safeway and I think a former Lucky-Market-turned-Albertsons in or just north of the Sunset District. In any case, a SF resident can drive down the peninsula or across a bridge once a month or more and shop anyplace they wish in order to “stock up.” It’s no big deal.

I haven’t checked but I’m sure many of these same retailers are available in NYC. For one or two people living in a 675 sf unit (like SK’s listing), I don’t see how or why they would need to “stock up” while living in the middle of everything. WHO CARES? And how many burners on the stove is enough? Will a “kitchenette” with two burners and four sf of counter space do? Who the h@ll cares about such things when they are living on one of the nicest streets in the city just a ~5 minute-or-less walk from the lake at Central Park?

Trust me, if I lived on the upper east side of Manhattan, NYC, the last thing I would be “worried about” would be whether I was going to run out of paper towels … or not.

That is not the type of apt for more than two people to live comfortably so I don’t see how its possible lack of a “standard kitchen” is a huge negative. It’s not the type of unit to raise two or more kids in.

FWIW, LOTS of dtn SD apts (Banker’s Hill/Golden Hill) are 85+ yrs old and have one small sink in the kitchen and room for only a 14 cubic ft (or less) refrigerator.

You’re right, SK. It’s a different lifestyle in NYC than SD (not appreciably different than living in a dtn SD apt or condo, though). Whether or not living in NYC is actually a better or worse lifestyle than living in SD is in the eye of the beholder.

[SK in CV]

[quote=bearishgurl]
You’re right, SK. It’s a different lifestyle in NYC than SD (not appreciably different than living in a dtn SD apt or condo, though). Whether or not living in NYC is actually a better or worse lifestyle than living in SD is in the eye of the beholder.[/quote]

Oy. Yes it is appreciably different. It isn’t even close.

[CDMA ENG]

[quote=bearishgurl][quote=CDMA ENG][quote=bearishgurl][quote=tc]I am a union stagehand. And I find that to be unacceptable.
I can also assure everyone that reads this that the stagehands in the San Diego theaters make enough to take care of their families and pay for a mortgage on a small house and no more. And many of us work 60+ hours a week.
Also the average non-union stagehand earns $14 an hour with no retirement or healthcare. So when they end up in the ER guess who ends up paying the bill.
And on a final note next time you go to a concert and look up to the 140,000 pounds of equipment over your head. Who do you want hanging it? A person making just enough to share an apartment with a bunch of other drug attics or a guy who has a family and a home to take care of.[/quote]

I’d want YOU to install it over my head, tc, with all of the professionalism you have always demonstrated.

You’re probably aware that SD isn’t NY and the salaries here are a far cry from those in NYC, yet the cost of living here is the same or close to NYC.

Some of these jobs which are “unionized” no doubt look like a walk in the park to a lot of these Piggs who likely couldn’t possibly perform them themselves. Nor would they live in the “small (modest?) house” you bought with your “lavish” union wages.

Case in point: your $14 hr non-union counterpart whose family may be regularly utilizing SD’s emergency rooms who may or may not be doing the exact same job as you and likely doesn’t stay past a year on the job.

Thanks for posting, tc.[/quote]

I have done this exact job as a non-union memember (sic) in Las Vegas and I can tell you the Union Guys werent (sic) that good. In fact many times my team was called in to do the job when the unions guy (sic) weren’t getting it done fast enough cause “this guy can only do this and that guy can only do that bullshit”.

So don’t tell me that shit BG about many Piggs being incapable… It’s insulting to the point I have to say somethine (sic). Been there… done that… and stayed in school cause the jobs were a “nowhere” job and to expect anything more of it was ridiculous.

Stage rigging is not rocket science though I will admit it is tough work to turn a show in 24 hours and a certian (sic) degree of can-do and creativeness is required. That is true of any job.

And yes… they dont (sic) make that much money but I dont’ (sic) want to hear that bullshit comment “union guys do it better cause they are paid too.” Terrible arguement (sic) that continues to be brought up evey (sic) other minute on this site.

I am tired of your attitude concerning the white collar profesionals (sic) on this site. You have a case of white collar envy.

Most of us weren’t born with a silver spoon.

I came from a lower middle class broken home. I worked construction roofing houses three stories in the air. I worked for AD Scenery (if you want validation of my story). I have done all of those Dirty fucking jobs to get to where I am today as a degree’d (sic) engineer and I know a lot of ppl here went to the school of hard knock (sic) as well.

So for once get off your high fucking horse. If you had it so figured out, which you want ppl to think from your 1 page “googled” rants, why arent (sic) you suceeding more in life? Don’t tell us you are exactly where you want to be and doing what you want to do.

I could be a cop… or a firefighter… Plumber… or any other of these jobs… Why?!? Cause like I said I had to at on point in my life and knew that it was a stepping stone to another better job. I HAVE THE PYHSICAL (sic) APPITUDE (sic). I HAVE THE MENTAL AS WELL. As many ppl on this board do.

So stop making poor assumptions of other and saying stupid things.

I will do any job that I have to in order to make it in this world.

Right now, my job, as an engineer, is to tell union people and non-union people… how to do theirs…

Shove it.

CE[/quote](remarks/emphasis added)

I’m going to refrain here from telling YOU to “shove it,” CE, because I so very much enjoy “reading” your (very insightful and “telling”) posts.

You know that you and I have been down this road before …. at least once. Namely here:

[quote=CDMA ENG on May 11, 2012 – 4:30pm.] . . . And for the latest time… Everyone is fed up with “try it for yourself” arguement (sic)… I know I can do 99 percent of goverment (sic) jobs… I don’t need to tryi (sic) it. I’m a smart guy… Maybe not a treffic (sic) writer or speller because I am too lazy to put this in word (sic) first… But I could do police work, fire, administrator, planner, or whatever but I can say this… Most of those people couldn’t do my job.

CE[/quote]

(remarks/emphasis added)

http://piggington.com/more_public_pension_loony_tunes_now_providence_ri_is_in_trouble#comment-209500

By your own admission, you fall down the rabbit hole in the “report-writing” category.

CE, I don’t have a red pen to use on here but I daresay that you wouldn’t have been able to even get through the POST academy for those public law-enforcement position(s) you (once?) aspired to because you obviously had/have rather glaring problems with spelling, sentence/word structure and punctuation. If you were not/are not able to write coherent reports (to be reviewed by your superiors) about each “incident” you were a party to for every shift, I’m here to tell you that you wouldn’t possibly be able to “make the grade.”

Oh, and, by the way, those daily “reports” are often written “on the fly” while sitting in a vehicle, with no time to repeatedly consult a dictionary, thesaurus or The Elements of Style.

No matter who your choice employing-agency was/is, multiple lawyers and judges could very likely see many of your reports and even show them to juries. I’m sorry to be the bearer of bad news here but law-enforcement hiring agencies cannot hire recruits who appear to be “borderline illiterate,” which, as public entities, would obviously reflect back onto them. Thus, these deficient recruits wouldn’t be able to finish the academy in the time allotted to do so.

For your sake, I hope you have use of a competent secretary with your current employer. It takes ~15-20 years on the job for a small portion of former law-enforcement recruits to obtain the use of professional secretarial services on the job (by being promoted 2-3 times). And this individual does NOT usually write their reports for them.

***

Sorry for the hijack, tc. I couldn’t resist. Keep up the good work![/quote]

Don’t need too…

In a work enviroment I use spell check and re-read everything before I submit.

Don’t need to here you get the point.

And yes I could make it through the academy… Lets face it… It’s not rocket science… and it’s not the Navy SEALs…

In fact I have know many flunkies that went through academy… You see junvile antics from the police department all the time.

As for you. I will give it to you that you write extremely well but I will call you on your bullshit… On all of these subject you are an expert and carry yourself as so but all you are doing is regurtating things you have googled from the web.

Curiousity is one thing but to carry yourself the way you do is funny…

Worst case of white collar envy I have seen in a while… and I get it a lot at work…

You have said rude things to me before and I never once came back at you until today.

So while I am being “petty” go fuck yourself!

I have achieved more than you and will continue to do so. You are at the end of your career and I am at the mid point in mind.

And I am sure if you reviewed a lot of these Ad-Hoc review by the police I am sure that are borderline illerate by your “high standards”.

My writing to me is not important. If I conveyed the information esstential to the point then that is fine. I dont have time to polish over and over again.

You obviously understood what I wrote just fine and again I take offense to you catergorizing “a lot of Piggs” on this site.

CE

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