Investing in Non Performing Loans (NPNs)

[clearfund]

Gentlemen – I bowed out of this conversation as it veered way off track from the initial topic of purchasing Non-Performing Loans to a philisophical discussion of investing vs speculating and whether real estate is a worthy endeavor (now I am hesitant to call it an investment…). As a fund manager I still have a job to do (and hopefully keep). My paid content writer was fired last year.

Whether anyone wants to, or chooses not to, invest in real estate is fine. This is why there are investments in gold, emerging markets, treasuries, etc with risk, return, and fundamentals all across the spectrum.

I believe that if one chooses to dive into commercial real estate, now is the time that opportunities will begin to surface, albeit not every transaction is worthy.

In today’s environment one of the best avenues to properties with distressed ownership is via the direct bank channel (note I stated distressed ownership vs. distressed property…very different). Now working your way to these loans and a real discount/pricing from the lender is 1,000x more difficult than any video promoter will let on. Banks don’t want to accept reality and take the hit any more than the former owner did.

Thus, if this thread can get back on topic via anyone with tangible experience acquiring notes as a principal, taking the property through foreclosure dodging lawsuits/bankruptcy filings, and repositioning the asset into a profitable cash flowing deal, I’d love to hear your experiences.

[Anonymous]

[quote=justdoitstewart]I’m not following you here, who’s peddling anything?[/quote]

There is another thread with a similar theme (GSE) bonds. I agree that there is some good information in both threads. But both threads also have someone who is dropping hints, fishing for a PM.

The pattern is always the same: “Well, now that you mention it, I’ve been getting great returns for a while doing XYZ, and I just happen to be starting a fund, but it’s for only for a select few, …”

If one thinks they are going to pick up some easy, lucrative deal offered by someone that happened along this site, then they are just counting on random luck. And that is never a good investment strategy.

[Anonymous]

[quote=justdoitstewart]I’m not following you here, who’s peddling anything?[/quote]

There is another thread with a similar theme (GSE) bonds. I agree that there is some good information in both threads. But both threads also have someone who is dropping hints, fishing for a PM.

The pattern is always the same: “Well, now that you mention it, I’ve been getting great returns for a while doing XYZ, and I just happen to be starting a fund, but it’s for only for a select few, …”

If one thinks they are going to pick up some easy, lucrative deal offered by someone that happened along this site, then they are just counting on random luck. And that is never a good investment strategy.

[Anonymous]

[quote=justdoitstewart]I’m not following you here, who’s peddling anything?[/quote]

There is another thread with a similar theme (GSE) bonds. I agree that there is some good information in both threads. But both threads also have someone who is dropping hints, fishing for a PM.

The pattern is always the same: “Well, now that you mention it, I’ve been getting great returns for a while doing XYZ, and I just happen to be starting a fund, but it’s for only for a select few, …”

If one thinks they are going to pick up some easy, lucrative deal offered by someone that happened along this site, then they are just counting on random luck. And that is never a good investment strategy.

[Anonymous]

[quote=justdoitstewart]I’m not following you here, who’s peddling anything?[/quote]

There is another thread with a similar theme (GSE) bonds. I agree that there is some good information in both threads. But both threads also have someone who is dropping hints, fishing for a PM.

The pattern is always the same: “Well, now that you mention it, I’ve been getting great returns for a while doing XYZ, and I just happen to be starting a fund, but it’s for only for a select few, …”

If one thinks they are going to pick up some easy, lucrative deal offered by someone that happened along this site, then they are just counting on random luck. And that is never a good investment strategy.

[Anonymous]

[quote=justdoitstewart]I’m not following you here, who’s peddling anything?[/quote]

There is another thread with a similar theme (GSE) bonds. I agree that there is some good information in both threads. But both threads also have someone who is dropping hints, fishing for a PM.

The pattern is always the same: “Well, now that you mention it, I’ve been getting great returns for a while doing XYZ, and I just happen to be starting a fund, but it’s for only for a select few, …”

If one thinks they are going to pick up some easy, lucrative deal offered by someone that happened along this site, then they are just counting on random luck. And that is never a good investment strategy.

[EconProf]

At the height of the mania for real estate (perhaps 2006 for residential, 2007 for commercial) the popular mood among investors was the sky’s the limit, look at recent appreciation, everything makes sense, drain your liquidity and borrow to the limit, etc., etc.
In retrospect, we were all drunk. Very few escaped the party atmosphere, although remarkably, many now claim they did.
I’d venture to say that everyone who bought then was speculating, rolling the dice.
Now that values have collapsed, buyers should be more characterized as investors than speculators. They are more likely to make money on cash flow than previous owners because they can slash rents below prevailing levels, attract tenants, and beat the competition who have high basis prices.
Additional evidence: When, throughout history, have RE buyers made the most money? When things look bleakest! Try 1933 anywhere in America, 1975 and 1985 in CA, 1995 in San Diego. Also, some of the price action of the REITS and other bottom fishers now suggests a bottom.
I am certainly not calling a bottom, and investing now is not for the faint of heart. But there are postiive signs out there along with all the negatives that many on this site are downplaying.

[EconProf]

At the height of the mania for real estate (perhaps 2006 for residential, 2007 for commercial) the popular mood among investors was the sky’s the limit, look at recent appreciation, everything makes sense, drain your liquidity and borrow to the limit, etc., etc.
In retrospect, we were all drunk. Very few escaped the party atmosphere, although remarkably, many now claim they did.
I’d venture to say that everyone who bought then was speculating, rolling the dice.
Now that values have collapsed, buyers should be more characterized as investors than speculators. They are more likely to make money on cash flow than previous owners because they can slash rents below prevailing levels, attract tenants, and beat the competition who have high basis prices.
Additional evidence: When, throughout history, have RE buyers made the most money? When things look bleakest! Try 1933 anywhere in America, 1975 and 1985 in CA, 1995 in San Diego. Also, some of the price action of the REITS and other bottom fishers now suggests a bottom.
I am certainly not calling a bottom, and investing now is not for the faint of heart. But there are postiive signs out there along with all the negatives that many on this site are downplaying.

[EconProf]

At the height of the mania for real estate (perhaps 2006 for residential, 2007 for commercial) the popular mood among investors was the sky’s the limit, look at recent appreciation, everything makes sense, drain your liquidity and borrow to the limit, etc., etc.
In retrospect, we were all drunk. Very few escaped the party atmosphere, although remarkably, many now claim they did.
I’d venture to say that everyone who bought then was speculating, rolling the dice.
Now that values have collapsed, buyers should be more characterized as investors than speculators. They are more likely to make money on cash flow than previous owners because they can slash rents below prevailing levels, attract tenants, and beat the competition who have high basis prices.
Additional evidence: When, throughout history, have RE buyers made the most money? When things look bleakest! Try 1933 anywhere in America, 1975 and 1985 in CA, 1995 in San Diego. Also, some of the price action of the REITS and other bottom fishers now suggests a bottom.
I am certainly not calling a bottom, and investing now is not for the faint of heart. But there are postiive signs out there along with all the negatives that many on this site are downplaying.

[EconProf]

At the height of the mania for real estate (perhaps 2006 for residential, 2007 for commercial) the popular mood among investors was the sky’s the limit, look at recent appreciation, everything makes sense, drain your liquidity and borrow to the limit, etc., etc.
In retrospect, we were all drunk. Very few escaped the party atmosphere, although remarkably, many now claim they did.
I’d venture to say that everyone who bought then was speculating, rolling the dice.
Now that values have collapsed, buyers should be more characterized as investors than speculators. They are more likely to make money on cash flow than previous owners because they can slash rents below prevailing levels, attract tenants, and beat the competition who have high basis prices.
Additional evidence: When, throughout history, have RE buyers made the most money? When things look bleakest! Try 1933 anywhere in America, 1975 and 1985 in CA, 1995 in San Diego. Also, some of the price action of the REITS and other bottom fishers now suggests a bottom.
I am certainly not calling a bottom, and investing now is not for the faint of heart. But there are postiive signs out there along with all the negatives that many on this site are downplaying.

[EconProf]

At the height of the mania for real estate (perhaps 2006 for residential, 2007 for commercial) the popular mood among investors was the sky’s the limit, look at recent appreciation, everything makes sense, drain your liquidity and borrow to the limit, etc., etc.
In retrospect, we were all drunk. Very few escaped the party atmosphere, although remarkably, many now claim they did.
I’d venture to say that everyone who bought then was speculating, rolling the dice.
Now that values have collapsed, buyers should be more characterized as investors than speculators. They are more likely to make money on cash flow than previous owners because they can slash rents below prevailing levels, attract tenants, and beat the competition who have high basis prices.
Additional evidence: When, throughout history, have RE buyers made the most money? When things look bleakest! Try 1933 anywhere in America, 1975 and 1985 in CA, 1995 in San Diego. Also, some of the price action of the REITS and other bottom fishers now suggests a bottom.
I am certainly not calling a bottom, and investing now is not for the faint of heart. But there are postiive signs out there along with all the negatives that many on this site are downplaying.

[CA renter]

[quote=pri_dk][quote=justdoitstewart]I’m not following you here, who’s peddling anything?[/quote]

There is another thread with a similar theme (GSE) bonds. I agree that there is some good information in both threads. But both threads also have someone who is dropping hints, fishing for a PM.

The pattern is always the same: “Well, now that you mention it, I’ve been getting great returns for a while doing XYZ, and I just happen to be starting a fund, but it’s for only for a select few, …”

If one thinks they are going to pick up some easy, lucrative deal offered by someone that happened along this site, then they are just counting on random luck. And that is never a good investment strategy.[/quote]

If that’s regarding my first response, I can assure you that I’m not selling anything and have nothing to gain if someone wants to invest in the notes I’ve mentioned. The thread is specifically asking about buying non-performing notes, and I responded based on some research I’ve done regarding the same kind of investments. I’m looking into it myself as an investor, not as a salesperson.

[CA renter]

[quote=pri_dk][quote=justdoitstewart]I’m not following you here, who’s peddling anything?[/quote]

There is another thread with a similar theme (GSE) bonds. I agree that there is some good information in both threads. But both threads also have someone who is dropping hints, fishing for a PM.

The pattern is always the same: “Well, now that you mention it, I’ve been getting great returns for a while doing XYZ, and I just happen to be starting a fund, but it’s for only for a select few, …”

If one thinks they are going to pick up some easy, lucrative deal offered by someone that happened along this site, then they are just counting on random luck. And that is never a good investment strategy.[/quote]

If that’s regarding my first response, I can assure you that I’m not selling anything and have nothing to gain if someone wants to invest in the notes I’ve mentioned. The thread is specifically asking about buying non-performing notes, and I responded based on some research I’ve done regarding the same kind of investments. I’m looking into it myself as an investor, not as a salesperson.

[CA renter]

[quote=pri_dk][quote=justdoitstewart]I’m not following you here, who’s peddling anything?[/quote]

There is another thread with a similar theme (GSE) bonds. I agree that there is some good information in both threads. But both threads also have someone who is dropping hints, fishing for a PM.

The pattern is always the same: “Well, now that you mention it, I’ve been getting great returns for a while doing XYZ, and I just happen to be starting a fund, but it’s for only for a select few, …”

If one thinks they are going to pick up some easy, lucrative deal offered by someone that happened along this site, then they are just counting on random luck. And that is never a good investment strategy.[/quote]

If that’s regarding my first response, I can assure you that I’m not selling anything and have nothing to gain if someone wants to invest in the notes I’ve mentioned. The thread is specifically asking about buying non-performing notes, and I responded based on some research I’ve done regarding the same kind of investments. I’m looking into it myself as an investor, not as a salesperson.

[CA renter]

[quote=pri_dk][quote=justdoitstewart]I’m not following you here, who’s peddling anything?[/quote]

There is another thread with a similar theme (GSE) bonds. I agree that there is some good information in both threads. But both threads also have someone who is dropping hints, fishing for a PM.

The pattern is always the same: “Well, now that you mention it, I’ve been getting great returns for a while doing XYZ, and I just happen to be starting a fund, but it’s for only for a select few, …”

If one thinks they are going to pick up some easy, lucrative deal offered by someone that happened along this site, then they are just counting on random luck. And that is never a good investment strategy.[/quote]

If that’s regarding my first response, I can assure you that I’m not selling anything and have nothing to gain if someone wants to invest in the notes I’ve mentioned. The thread is specifically asking about buying non-performing notes, and I responded based on some research I’ve done regarding the same kind of investments. I’m looking into it myself as an investor, not as a salesperson.

[Author]

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