4S ranch–Pienza Jan release

[4Sbuyer2002]

Bugs,

The 4.5 is fixed until November, 2012 which is just under 3 years before I retire with full benefits, sell my home, and move to Montana to be closer to family. So I have accepted an interest rate deviation risk for the years 2012 to 2015. A risk I deemed acceptible and prudent. As far as “downpayment investment capital.” Even at today’s prices for a similar home my downpayment has appreciated in value 200+% in four years. It had appreciated as high as 300 to 350% but has since retreated. As far as “now bleeding” (drop from 350% appreciation to 200%) a home is not a stock or a bar of gold. Sure it has come down from the high but you are not suggesting that once a home market hits the top the best move (financially, socially, family, etc.) is to sell at the top, rent, and reinvest the profit into alternative better returning investments are you???? Perhaps from a purely financial rate of return perspective (i.e. if I were a hope flipper) it is technically correct. I bought my home in 4S so my family can grow up, go to school, and make friends in as ideal an environment as possible. Its not all about the money. But from a money standpoint a current appreciation of 200% (100K down on 500k price for 3100 sq/ft SFH now available for 720k to 750k) something to be “grateful” for. I guess one could HELOC the equity out and invest it in the stock market but . . . that would be foolish wouldn’t it. I sleep well at 20% and fixed until November, 2012 at 4.5%. As far as I can tell, my current cost of ownership is still below the current cost to rent. Not to mention the intangible non-financial benefits of homeownership.

grateful owner . . . .

[gn]

4Sbuyer2002,

>> … “standing buy” and not going anywhere …

I didn’t said that you overpaid for your house in 2002 or that you’ll have to sell at a loss.

I was merely disputing your view that it takes “a nuclear strike on San Diego, a massive earthquake, a melt down at San Onofre” for a 3000 sq ft SFH in 4S to drop to ~$500k.

[PerryChase]

I’m with bugs on the point that “stability” is over-rated. It’s mostly what the parents want for their kids rather than what the children need.

I moved just about every 2 years with my dad working overseas in different countries. My parents were busy and I didn’t see them a lot. I went to independent summer camps, sometimes for the whole summer with other kids my age. As a teenager I used to take the bus/subway and explore the cities we lived in (that was in the early 80s and that might be seen as dangerous today). I think I turned out OK despite not have a “stable” childhood. I saw the world at an early age and I’m grateful for that. To me, the kids who grow up in sanitized suburbia are missing out on so much.

If I had kids, I’d take them on summer and winter travel around the world — see the jungles of South America, the lions and elephants of Africa, the bustling cities of Asia and the culture of Europe. Somehow, I’d take them out of their “safe” environments rather than lock them in there.

[Prufrock]

I do value stability and safety for my family. But what kind of stability might my children have if, while we are ensconced in our dream home for the next ten years, 50% of our neighbors are in over their heads? Will families fall apart due to financial strain in front of my children’s eyes? Will all the kids in the neighborhood become the latchkey-type after their moms go back to work to make ends meet? How will the bank-owned and otherwise vacant homes in the neighborhood be secured?

My biggest regret regarding the boom is the sociological effects due to come from the bust.

[4Sbuyer2002]

All,

In this we are in agreement . . . it is a social shame that a middle class family with 2.5 kids earning an upper middle class income can not even come close to affording an average sized SFH, with responsible financing, in a decent neighborhood within 20-30 minute commute from San Diego. It is lamentable. Sure some homeowners, who have been so for last 6-7years, have had an increase in their net worth . . . but at what macro social cost. The impact on the abilty of a middle class family to live and thrive is sad.

grateful owner . . . .

[sdrealtor]

I couldnt disagree with Bugs and Perry more. Stability is not overated it is underated. While I’m sure you both came out fine I have seen what stability can create and it is far beyond what you have achieved.

I grew up in a sanitized suburbia very much like where I live in North County. Our parents were successful but not anywhere near the level my generation has been. My best friends are guys I have known since I could walk. In fact they all lived within a block of my house and most were no farther than 4 or 5 houses away. A few moved away either across town or out of town and none of them stayed part of the group. If not for the rain, I’d be out golfing with a friend I’ve know since I was about 1 year old. To this day, I still talk with many of these friends every month. When I was about to get married, I was taken out for The Lunch, a dreaded 3 hour grilling by the gang. The Lunch was responsible for 2 cancelled weddings. Out of more than 2 dozen of us, there is only one divorce and he ended up regretting his decision to ignore us after his lunch. When I walked down the aisle it was after downing a couple shots with my friends who led the way down the aisle. I frequently fly back to attend events for the children of my friends and last month a several of us got together to celebrate some milestone birthdays in South Florida.

Our parents were all well educated and had decent but not spectacular careers. Nearly all of us earned advanced degrees. We all pushed and supported each other. We continue to do so. My closest friends now include an attorney/Sports Agent who counts one of the Top 5 NBA players as his clients, another attorney brought into the Sports agency business by that friend who now has many NFL clients, an Envirnomental Engineer/Attorney that redevelops Super Fund sites with clients that include Donald Trump, a Financial Advisor (one fo the few w/o a graduate degree but more certifications than I have ever heard of CLU, CFP, CHFC etc) who works with Fortune 500 execs and has earned 7 figures annually for over 15 years, the retired CEO/founder of a Gov’t Defense IT Contractor that sold out a couple years back for mid 8 figures, a neurosurgeon, a plastic surgeon, 2 opthalmalogists, a cardiologist, a top Oil/Gas attorney, an orthopedic surgeon, 3 radiologists, a few very successful entreprenuers, a Cal berkley professor, a Sports Writer for a major US daily newspaper, the head of a major Bay Area Research organization, a couple involved in large family businesses and me who walked away from a great career track to care for my parents which I don’t regret for one moment. It is in fact one of the things I am most proud of in my life.

I could go on and on. With one or two exceptions, none of us are even close to brilliant. None of us graduated at the top of our clasess. None of us inherited great wealth, looks, atheletic talent and none of us got where we are today with outside help. What we all share in common is a sense of comfort with who were are, self-confidence, self-motivation, inner drive and friendly outgoing personalities. Everyone us feels very fortunate to be where we are and we often wonder how all us achieved so much. When it comes down to it and we try to figure it out the only thing truly separates us from many others who were raised in similar environments is each other.

It may be a bit pollyannaish but this is what I hope for my kids who already have a core of friends they have known their entire albeit short lives.

[Chrispy]

“I could go on and on…”

Oh, but you have.

[lniles]

Cheese doodles just shot out of my nose.

[Critter]

Nice visual! But, I think Chrispy has a point (or two, or three).

[schizo2buyORnot]

[img_assist|nid=3204|title=Pienza Prices|desc=|link=node|align=left|width=466|height=55]

http://www.fieldstone-homes.com/availablehomes/

In search of a crystal ball . . . .

[sdcellar]

sdrealtor– So, let me get this straight. All these people you reference lived within a few blocks of the house you were raised in? They’re all successful? Where the heck are you from? It would seem like Long Island or something.

I don’t think anyone can argue that stability isn’t nice, but you make it sound like you’re doomed if you move around a bit as a kid.

Well, check this out. My cursed parents moved me out of the O.C. and down to dreaded San Diego when I was smack dab in the middle of high school. And guess what happened?

During my final years of high school, I established life-long relationships that remain to this day. As a matter of fact, I saw a number of these people on this very day today. Most of the guys are like you in that they’d known each other since grade school, but oddly enough, they let a few nomads like myself become part of this circle of friends.

One difference for our circle is that some of them are quite successful, others less so. I can’t figure out why that is. Wait, maybe because that’s normal?

So yeah, I do think your perspective is a bit pollyanaish. Heck, I think it’s downright storybook. Do you want the best for your children? No doubt. Do I, the lowly renter, want the best for my children? You can bet your life on it.

[sdrealtor]

SDC,
My intent was not to make it sound like renters are doomed. My intent was to show that security and stability are NOT overated like PC and Bugs said. One of my best friends out here grew up in a trailer park in Reno and is hugely successful. He’s brilliant and succeeded in spite of his challenges. In fact he’s far more brilliant than any of us. The truth is we succeeded in spite of any of us being really brilliant. The highest any of us scored on SAT’s was probably in the mid 1300’s and several were just over 1000.

Personally I believe being surrounded by a great group of peers when growing up can be just as important as parents. It can make up for alot and is an integral piece of the puzzle. It is what I wish for my children and for your children. It is why i am so frustrated that good, itelligent people in SD are forced to raise their children under less than ideal conditions. So much of what happens to our kids when they grow up does not happen under their parents watchuful eyes. My friends and I were not perfect, far from it. But the stability of the environment we grew up in is a major part of who we all became.

[sdcellar]

sdr– As usual, it turns out that we’re actually pretty much in agreement on the core of the issue. I too, was never trying to suggest that stability doesn’t have its benefits (I think I even stated that). It’s simply a matter of “at what cost?” and I share in your frustration.

[Eugene]

So. Fast forward 8 months and what do we see?

Plan 2901 starting at $755,990
Plan 3079 starting at $762,660
Plan 3212 starting at $780,720

At this rate I’ll grow old and die before we see 3000 sqft houses in 4S for $500k again 🙁

[Eugene]

So. Fast forward 8 months and what do we see?

Plan 2901 starting at $755,990
Plan 3079 starting at $762,660
Plan 3212 starting at $780,720

At this rate I’ll grow old and die before we see 3000 sqft houses in 4S for $500k again 🙁

[Author]

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