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ucodegen
ParticipantTrue. However, the fact that single mothers constitute a disproportionate number of people living at/below the poverty level makes me think that single/divorced women with children suffer financially compared to women without children.
You can’t use that particular analysis to support the position that divorce is the cause of single mother living at/below poverty level. You add in unwed mothers, teen children bearing children and you add in the issue of the welfare state. We were covering the issue of the effect of divorce. Single women bearing children out of wedlock is a completely different subject and has much different causes, underlying issues etc.
Question: would you have preferred that your parents divorce, or have them work on developing a better marriage and staying married?
Simple.. divorced. We wished they had done it sooner. It was driving all the kids insane.
I guess I see more options that just “stay married and miserable” or divorce.
There are more options than stay-married+miserable vs divorce. But there are also situations where stay together and get it to work.. won’t work.. ever!
ucodegen
ParticipantTrue. However, the fact that single mothers constitute a disproportionate number of people living at/below the poverty level makes me think that single/divorced women with children suffer financially compared to women without children.
You can’t use that particular analysis to support the position that divorce is the cause of single mother living at/below poverty level. You add in unwed mothers, teen children bearing children and you add in the issue of the welfare state. We were covering the issue of the effect of divorce. Single women bearing children out of wedlock is a completely different subject and has much different causes, underlying issues etc.
Question: would you have preferred that your parents divorce, or have them work on developing a better marriage and staying married?
Simple.. divorced. We wished they had done it sooner. It was driving all the kids insane.
I guess I see more options that just “stay married and miserable” or divorce.
There are more options than stay-married+miserable vs divorce. But there are also situations where stay together and get it to work.. won’t work.. ever!
ucodegen
Participant@CA renter
Slight problem with statistics on this one. Notice the careful wording they are using:
Recent studies have proved that as many as 53.4% of the single mothers with children are below the poverty line.
They are not removing unwed mothers with children born out of wedlock, teen mothers etc. Note that they said single mothers and not divorced mothers. Notice that it has a problem aligning with the next statement:
In addition, studies also prove that while men tend to experience only a 10% drop in incomes post-divorce, women are likely to experience as much as 30% drop in income after divorce.
Note several things here:
1) The number for the men at 10% drop is an average.
2) The number provided for women is ‘as much as 30%’ or a maximum amount.
To get 53.4% under poverty line, they would have to be awfully close to the poverty line to begin with to have the 30% drop them below.The main reason for this is that when women tend to start their careers after taking a long break from their careers, they do not get hired for highly skilled jobs.
Depends. If they had a skilled job to begin with, they can restart their careers near where they left off.
Let’s face it, NOBODY “wins” in a divorce. **Everybody** is much poorer after divorce because, after divorce, they have to pay for TWO households instead of one, and both get HALF of the marital assets, leaving each with half of what they once had.
This is one of the biggest problems with divorce, but you also then step back and ask yourself that with these costs, are they ahead or behind, when compared to individuals who have been single the entire time, because of the period of time they were married.
I’m focusing especially on divorced mothers, because there is a tremendous difference between divorced with kids (BIG deal), and divorced without kids.
Age of the kids also has a significant contribution to this difference too.
Divorce sucks — for mothers, fathers, and especially the kids.
Sometimes.. and this is from a former ‘kid’ who grew up in a divorced family. Sometimes the peace and quiet and reduction in stress is worth the reduction in material goods.
ucodegen
Participant@CA renter
Slight problem with statistics on this one. Notice the careful wording they are using:
Recent studies have proved that as many as 53.4% of the single mothers with children are below the poverty line.
They are not removing unwed mothers with children born out of wedlock, teen mothers etc. Note that they said single mothers and not divorced mothers. Notice that it has a problem aligning with the next statement:
In addition, studies also prove that while men tend to experience only a 10% drop in incomes post-divorce, women are likely to experience as much as 30% drop in income after divorce.
Note several things here:
1) The number for the men at 10% drop is an average.
2) The number provided for women is ‘as much as 30%’ or a maximum amount.
To get 53.4% under poverty line, they would have to be awfully close to the poverty line to begin with to have the 30% drop them below.The main reason for this is that when women tend to start their careers after taking a long break from their careers, they do not get hired for highly skilled jobs.
Depends. If they had a skilled job to begin with, they can restart their careers near where they left off.
Let’s face it, NOBODY “wins” in a divorce. **Everybody** is much poorer after divorce because, after divorce, they have to pay for TWO households instead of one, and both get HALF of the marital assets, leaving each with half of what they once had.
This is one of the biggest problems with divorce, but you also then step back and ask yourself that with these costs, are they ahead or behind, when compared to individuals who have been single the entire time, because of the period of time they were married.
I’m focusing especially on divorced mothers, because there is a tremendous difference between divorced with kids (BIG deal), and divorced without kids.
Age of the kids also has a significant contribution to this difference too.
Divorce sucks — for mothers, fathers, and especially the kids.
Sometimes.. and this is from a former ‘kid’ who grew up in a divorced family. Sometimes the peace and quiet and reduction in stress is worth the reduction in material goods.
ucodegen
Participant@CA renter
Slight problem with statistics on this one. Notice the careful wording they are using:
Recent studies have proved that as many as 53.4% of the single mothers with children are below the poverty line.
They are not removing unwed mothers with children born out of wedlock, teen mothers etc. Note that they said single mothers and not divorced mothers. Notice that it has a problem aligning with the next statement:
In addition, studies also prove that while men tend to experience only a 10% drop in incomes post-divorce, women are likely to experience as much as 30% drop in income after divorce.
Note several things here:
1) The number for the men at 10% drop is an average.
2) The number provided for women is ‘as much as 30%’ or a maximum amount.
To get 53.4% under poverty line, they would have to be awfully close to the poverty line to begin with to have the 30% drop them below.The main reason for this is that when women tend to start their careers after taking a long break from their careers, they do not get hired for highly skilled jobs.
Depends. If they had a skilled job to begin with, they can restart their careers near where they left off.
Let’s face it, NOBODY “wins” in a divorce. **Everybody** is much poorer after divorce because, after divorce, they have to pay for TWO households instead of one, and both get HALF of the marital assets, leaving each with half of what they once had.
This is one of the biggest problems with divorce, but you also then step back and ask yourself that with these costs, are they ahead or behind, when compared to individuals who have been single the entire time, because of the period of time they were married.
I’m focusing especially on divorced mothers, because there is a tremendous difference between divorced with kids (BIG deal), and divorced without kids.
Age of the kids also has a significant contribution to this difference too.
Divorce sucks — for mothers, fathers, and especially the kids.
Sometimes.. and this is from a former ‘kid’ who grew up in a divorced family. Sometimes the peace and quiet and reduction in stress is worth the reduction in material goods.
ucodegen
Participant@CA renter
Slight problem with statistics on this one. Notice the careful wording they are using:
Recent studies have proved that as many as 53.4% of the single mothers with children are below the poverty line.
They are not removing unwed mothers with children born out of wedlock, teen mothers etc. Note that they said single mothers and not divorced mothers. Notice that it has a problem aligning with the next statement:
In addition, studies also prove that while men tend to experience only a 10% drop in incomes post-divorce, women are likely to experience as much as 30% drop in income after divorce.
Note several things here:
1) The number for the men at 10% drop is an average.
2) The number provided for women is ‘as much as 30%’ or a maximum amount.
To get 53.4% under poverty line, they would have to be awfully close to the poverty line to begin with to have the 30% drop them below.The main reason for this is that when women tend to start their careers after taking a long break from their careers, they do not get hired for highly skilled jobs.
Depends. If they had a skilled job to begin with, they can restart their careers near where they left off.
Let’s face it, NOBODY “wins” in a divorce. **Everybody** is much poorer after divorce because, after divorce, they have to pay for TWO households instead of one, and both get HALF of the marital assets, leaving each with half of what they once had.
This is one of the biggest problems with divorce, but you also then step back and ask yourself that with these costs, are they ahead or behind, when compared to individuals who have been single the entire time, because of the period of time they were married.
I’m focusing especially on divorced mothers, because there is a tremendous difference between divorced with kids (BIG deal), and divorced without kids.
Age of the kids also has a significant contribution to this difference too.
Divorce sucks — for mothers, fathers, and especially the kids.
Sometimes.. and this is from a former ‘kid’ who grew up in a divorced family. Sometimes the peace and quiet and reduction in stress is worth the reduction in material goods.
ucodegen
Participant@CA renter
Slight problem with statistics on this one. Notice the careful wording they are using:
Recent studies have proved that as many as 53.4% of the single mothers with children are below the poverty line.
They are not removing unwed mothers with children born out of wedlock, teen mothers etc. Note that they said single mothers and not divorced mothers. Notice that it has a problem aligning with the next statement:
In addition, studies also prove that while men tend to experience only a 10% drop in incomes post-divorce, women are likely to experience as much as 30% drop in income after divorce.
Note several things here:
1) The number for the men at 10% drop is an average.
2) The number provided for women is ‘as much as 30%’ or a maximum amount.
To get 53.4% under poverty line, they would have to be awfully close to the poverty line to begin with to have the 30% drop them below.The main reason for this is that when women tend to start their careers after taking a long break from their careers, they do not get hired for highly skilled jobs.
Depends. If they had a skilled job to begin with, they can restart their careers near where they left off.
Let’s face it, NOBODY “wins” in a divorce. **Everybody** is much poorer after divorce because, after divorce, they have to pay for TWO households instead of one, and both get HALF of the marital assets, leaving each with half of what they once had.
This is one of the biggest problems with divorce, but you also then step back and ask yourself that with these costs, are they ahead or behind, when compared to individuals who have been single the entire time, because of the period of time they were married.
I’m focusing especially on divorced mothers, because there is a tremendous difference between divorced with kids (BIG deal), and divorced without kids.
Age of the kids also has a significant contribution to this difference too.
Divorce sucks — for mothers, fathers, and especially the kids.
Sometimes.. and this is from a former ‘kid’ who grew up in a divorced family. Sometimes the peace and quiet and reduction in stress is worth the reduction in material goods.
ucodegen
ParticipantThe conservative idea of marriage is marry for progeny and estate planning. Stay married to protect your name and legacy. Everything else is out of sight out of mind.
Umm.. how do you explain some of the Kennedy men? As for me, I tend towards the conservative and this is not my approach.
Do you want to spend your weekend lying to your MIL about how you really “enjoy” helping her with the dishes and the BBQ?
Actually I prefer to do the BBQ and the dishes are not that much of a problem. She does the initial rinse and I stack.. or visa versa. Done in no time at all. Same way we set up a tent when camping.. tag-team style. BTW, for me, she is not my wife but Significant Other(SO)… and I have met the parents.
I also do some of the vacuuming, as well as the one who selected the type of vacuum (Dyson).
Do want to run to the store and buy her the butter or whatever she ran out of?
Actually I do a bit more. I maintain a list of things we are about to run out of.. and if I am going by a store on other errands, I pick the items up.
Do you want to bail-out your wife’s brother because he made a bad investment?
She knows that something like this is a no-no. She knows to not even ask.
Do you really want to join your wife’s sisters’ families on a trip to Disneyland?
Yes.. and camping too.
Do you want to run to the your MIL’s bed-side whenever she has some minor ailments. Of course, she’s lonely so there’s always some drama.
We try to filter out major from minor.. it saves on general wear and tear for both of us.
Do you want to not have any individual time of your own?
Yes.
Do you want to live the rest of your life like that?
Yes.. btw, she also likes Ford GTs(ie. GT40), AC Cobras, classic Mustang Cobras as well as Mustangs in general. She’d love to have an ‘Eleanore’, though I don’t know if she is up to handling it. She’s not too fond of Corvettes and DeTomaso(s) though.. gotta work on that.
So how does this conservative stack up?? Oh yes, I have also torn down and rebuilt at least 4 different types of car engines, built 4 houses, my first car was a Q series mustang and I am an engineer by education… so I am not exactly panty-whipped either. In fact, looking back at your statements.. you look more like a ‘conservative’ than I, where is your open minded liberal (marriage=loves=respect=sharing=commitment).. yet I am a registered Republican… go figure. Oh yeah, one more thing, I am considering becoming an NRA member too… 8-P
PS: The Playboy life is also a very ‘liberal’ concept.. game women for sex and leave them when you are done…
As Acetia said, that’s the result of liberal teachings where “young males are being feminized and medicated for being boys in the public schools.
I don’t know if it’s liberal teachings. I do know that my sister is in danger of ruining her son; To the point of getting my rather liberal mother upset.
ucodegen
ParticipantThe conservative idea of marriage is marry for progeny and estate planning. Stay married to protect your name and legacy. Everything else is out of sight out of mind.
Umm.. how do you explain some of the Kennedy men? As for me, I tend towards the conservative and this is not my approach.
Do you want to spend your weekend lying to your MIL about how you really “enjoy” helping her with the dishes and the BBQ?
Actually I prefer to do the BBQ and the dishes are not that much of a problem. She does the initial rinse and I stack.. or visa versa. Done in no time at all. Same way we set up a tent when camping.. tag-team style. BTW, for me, she is not my wife but Significant Other(SO)… and I have met the parents.
I also do some of the vacuuming, as well as the one who selected the type of vacuum (Dyson).
Do want to run to the store and buy her the butter or whatever she ran out of?
Actually I do a bit more. I maintain a list of things we are about to run out of.. and if I am going by a store on other errands, I pick the items up.
Do you want to bail-out your wife’s brother because he made a bad investment?
She knows that something like this is a no-no. She knows to not even ask.
Do you really want to join your wife’s sisters’ families on a trip to Disneyland?
Yes.. and camping too.
Do you want to run to the your MIL’s bed-side whenever she has some minor ailments. Of course, she’s lonely so there’s always some drama.
We try to filter out major from minor.. it saves on general wear and tear for both of us.
Do you want to not have any individual time of your own?
Yes.
Do you want to live the rest of your life like that?
Yes.. btw, she also likes Ford GTs(ie. GT40), AC Cobras, classic Mustang Cobras as well as Mustangs in general. She’d love to have an ‘Eleanore’, though I don’t know if she is up to handling it. She’s not too fond of Corvettes and DeTomaso(s) though.. gotta work on that.
So how does this conservative stack up?? Oh yes, I have also torn down and rebuilt at least 4 different types of car engines, built 4 houses, my first car was a Q series mustang and I am an engineer by education… so I am not exactly panty-whipped either. In fact, looking back at your statements.. you look more like a ‘conservative’ than I, where is your open minded liberal (marriage=loves=respect=sharing=commitment).. yet I am a registered Republican… go figure. Oh yeah, one more thing, I am considering becoming an NRA member too… 8-P
PS: The Playboy life is also a very ‘liberal’ concept.. game women for sex and leave them when you are done…
As Acetia said, that’s the result of liberal teachings where “young males are being feminized and medicated for being boys in the public schools.
I don’t know if it’s liberal teachings. I do know that my sister is in danger of ruining her son; To the point of getting my rather liberal mother upset.
ucodegen
ParticipantThe conservative idea of marriage is marry for progeny and estate planning. Stay married to protect your name and legacy. Everything else is out of sight out of mind.
Umm.. how do you explain some of the Kennedy men? As for me, I tend towards the conservative and this is not my approach.
Do you want to spend your weekend lying to your MIL about how you really “enjoy” helping her with the dishes and the BBQ?
Actually I prefer to do the BBQ and the dishes are not that much of a problem. She does the initial rinse and I stack.. or visa versa. Done in no time at all. Same way we set up a tent when camping.. tag-team style. BTW, for me, she is not my wife but Significant Other(SO)… and I have met the parents.
I also do some of the vacuuming, as well as the one who selected the type of vacuum (Dyson).
Do want to run to the store and buy her the butter or whatever she ran out of?
Actually I do a bit more. I maintain a list of things we are about to run out of.. and if I am going by a store on other errands, I pick the items up.
Do you want to bail-out your wife’s brother because he made a bad investment?
She knows that something like this is a no-no. She knows to not even ask.
Do you really want to join your wife’s sisters’ families on a trip to Disneyland?
Yes.. and camping too.
Do you want to run to the your MIL’s bed-side whenever she has some minor ailments. Of course, she’s lonely so there’s always some drama.
We try to filter out major from minor.. it saves on general wear and tear for both of us.
Do you want to not have any individual time of your own?
Yes.
Do you want to live the rest of your life like that?
Yes.. btw, she also likes Ford GTs(ie. GT40), AC Cobras, classic Mustang Cobras as well as Mustangs in general. She’d love to have an ‘Eleanore’, though I don’t know if she is up to handling it. She’s not too fond of Corvettes and DeTomaso(s) though.. gotta work on that.
So how does this conservative stack up?? Oh yes, I have also torn down and rebuilt at least 4 different types of car engines, built 4 houses, my first car was a Q series mustang and I am an engineer by education… so I am not exactly panty-whipped either. In fact, looking back at your statements.. you look more like a ‘conservative’ than I, where is your open minded liberal (marriage=loves=respect=sharing=commitment).. yet I am a registered Republican… go figure. Oh yeah, one more thing, I am considering becoming an NRA member too… 8-P
PS: The Playboy life is also a very ‘liberal’ concept.. game women for sex and leave them when you are done…
As Acetia said, that’s the result of liberal teachings where “young males are being feminized and medicated for being boys in the public schools.
I don’t know if it’s liberal teachings. I do know that my sister is in danger of ruining her son; To the point of getting my rather liberal mother upset.
ucodegen
ParticipantThe conservative idea of marriage is marry for progeny and estate planning. Stay married to protect your name and legacy. Everything else is out of sight out of mind.
Umm.. how do you explain some of the Kennedy men? As for me, I tend towards the conservative and this is not my approach.
Do you want to spend your weekend lying to your MIL about how you really “enjoy” helping her with the dishes and the BBQ?
Actually I prefer to do the BBQ and the dishes are not that much of a problem. She does the initial rinse and I stack.. or visa versa. Done in no time at all. Same way we set up a tent when camping.. tag-team style. BTW, for me, she is not my wife but Significant Other(SO)… and I have met the parents.
I also do some of the vacuuming, as well as the one who selected the type of vacuum (Dyson).
Do want to run to the store and buy her the butter or whatever she ran out of?
Actually I do a bit more. I maintain a list of things we are about to run out of.. and if I am going by a store on other errands, I pick the items up.
Do you want to bail-out your wife’s brother because he made a bad investment?
She knows that something like this is a no-no. She knows to not even ask.
Do you really want to join your wife’s sisters’ families on a trip to Disneyland?
Yes.. and camping too.
Do you want to run to the your MIL’s bed-side whenever she has some minor ailments. Of course, she’s lonely so there’s always some drama.
We try to filter out major from minor.. it saves on general wear and tear for both of us.
Do you want to not have any individual time of your own?
Yes.
Do you want to live the rest of your life like that?
Yes.. btw, she also likes Ford GTs(ie. GT40), AC Cobras, classic Mustang Cobras as well as Mustangs in general. She’d love to have an ‘Eleanore’, though I don’t know if she is up to handling it. She’s not too fond of Corvettes and DeTomaso(s) though.. gotta work on that.
So how does this conservative stack up?? Oh yes, I have also torn down and rebuilt at least 4 different types of car engines, built 4 houses, my first car was a Q series mustang and I am an engineer by education… so I am not exactly panty-whipped either. In fact, looking back at your statements.. you look more like a ‘conservative’ than I, where is your open minded liberal (marriage=loves=respect=sharing=commitment).. yet I am a registered Republican… go figure. Oh yeah, one more thing, I am considering becoming an NRA member too… 8-P
PS: The Playboy life is also a very ‘liberal’ concept.. game women for sex and leave them when you are done…
As Acetia said, that’s the result of liberal teachings where “young males are being feminized and medicated for being boys in the public schools.
I don’t know if it’s liberal teachings. I do know that my sister is in danger of ruining her son; To the point of getting my rather liberal mother upset.
ucodegen
ParticipantThe conservative idea of marriage is marry for progeny and estate planning. Stay married to protect your name and legacy. Everything else is out of sight out of mind.
Umm.. how do you explain some of the Kennedy men? As for me, I tend towards the conservative and this is not my approach.
Do you want to spend your weekend lying to your MIL about how you really “enjoy” helping her with the dishes and the BBQ?
Actually I prefer to do the BBQ and the dishes are not that much of a problem. She does the initial rinse and I stack.. or visa versa. Done in no time at all. Same way we set up a tent when camping.. tag-team style. BTW, for me, she is not my wife but Significant Other(SO)… and I have met the parents.
I also do some of the vacuuming, as well as the one who selected the type of vacuum (Dyson).
Do want to run to the store and buy her the butter or whatever she ran out of?
Actually I do a bit more. I maintain a list of things we are about to run out of.. and if I am going by a store on other errands, I pick the items up.
Do you want to bail-out your wife’s brother because he made a bad investment?
She knows that something like this is a no-no. She knows to not even ask.
Do you really want to join your wife’s sisters’ families on a trip to Disneyland?
Yes.. and camping too.
Do you want to run to the your MIL’s bed-side whenever she has some minor ailments. Of course, she’s lonely so there’s always some drama.
We try to filter out major from minor.. it saves on general wear and tear for both of us.
Do you want to not have any individual time of your own?
Yes.
Do you want to live the rest of your life like that?
Yes.. btw, she also likes Ford GTs(ie. GT40), AC Cobras, classic Mustang Cobras as well as Mustangs in general. She’d love to have an ‘Eleanore’, though I don’t know if she is up to handling it. She’s not too fond of Corvettes and DeTomaso(s) though.. gotta work on that.
So how does this conservative stack up?? Oh yes, I have also torn down and rebuilt at least 4 different types of car engines, built 4 houses, my first car was a Q series mustang and I am an engineer by education… so I am not exactly panty-whipped either. In fact, looking back at your statements.. you look more like a ‘conservative’ than I, where is your open minded liberal (marriage=loves=respect=sharing=commitment).. yet I am a registered Republican… go figure. Oh yeah, one more thing, I am considering becoming an NRA member too… 8-P
PS: The Playboy life is also a very ‘liberal’ concept.. game women for sex and leave them when you are done…
As Acetia said, that’s the result of liberal teachings where “young males are being feminized and medicated for being boys in the public schools.
I don’t know if it’s liberal teachings. I do know that my sister is in danger of ruining her son; To the point of getting my rather liberal mother upset.
ucodegen
ParticipantQuick question about the tax implications of these two options. My assumption (and I could very well be wrong) is that if I hire a money manager to invest for me, that I’m not taxed on the increase in my portfolio until I choose to sell/cash out.
No. It is the same as if you had done the trades yourself. You should get a 1099 or equiv showing a breakdown in long and short term gains as shown above. In using a money manager, you are paying for their ‘expertise’ in making investment decisions.
If so, is there a way to manage your own money/investments without paying taxes until you cash out or something similar?
Yes, well sort of … Build a portfolio based on index ETFs and hold without selling. You will have dividends, but no captial gains until you sell.
yes.. see: http://www.fool.com/investing/etf/2006/10/27/etfs-can-be-taxing.aspx
However, if the money manager takes your funds and puts them in a pool, e.g. a mutual fund, then you are taxed each year based on the net gains/losses incurred by that fund in each year.
Kind of.. gets more complicated..
http://individual.troweprice.com/public/Retail/Planning-&-Research/Tax-Planning/Learn-More-About-Taxes/Tax-Issues-for-Mutual-Fund-Investorsucodegen
ParticipantQuick question about the tax implications of these two options. My assumption (and I could very well be wrong) is that if I hire a money manager to invest for me, that I’m not taxed on the increase in my portfolio until I choose to sell/cash out.
No. It is the same as if you had done the trades yourself. You should get a 1099 or equiv showing a breakdown in long and short term gains as shown above. In using a money manager, you are paying for their ‘expertise’ in making investment decisions.
If so, is there a way to manage your own money/investments without paying taxes until you cash out or something similar?
Yes, well sort of … Build a portfolio based on index ETFs and hold without selling. You will have dividends, but no captial gains until you sell.
yes.. see: http://www.fool.com/investing/etf/2006/10/27/etfs-can-be-taxing.aspx
However, if the money manager takes your funds and puts them in a pool, e.g. a mutual fund, then you are taxed each year based on the net gains/losses incurred by that fund in each year.
Kind of.. gets more complicated..
http://individual.troweprice.com/public/Retail/Planning-&-Research/Tax-Planning/Learn-More-About-Taxes/Tax-Issues-for-Mutual-Fund-Investors -
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