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CoronitaParticipantthe we dont need another stinking paris hilton taxes: the rockefellers and morgans are still going strong even after surviving decades of stiff inheritance taxation. elimination of the tax would only amount to a paris hilton entitlement and acceleration of corporate consolidation and control of america. tort reform: just like inflation, tort reform is a con. medical expenses, insurance costs going up because of "frivolous" lawsuits? no, it's because those lawsuits that are justified and right don't and can't go far enough: merck killing people with unsafe drugs is only fined a few bucks. they immediately turn those costs over on future business. rather than… merck getting sued into non-operation and the persons responsible being barred from working in the industry, thereby allowing competition from new and small independants. illegal immigration: with a wave of the illegal immigration flag, nationalism and racism are immediately stirred, overwhelming the insect-like attention spans of the american people. immigrant employees, legal or illegal are only a problem now because of all the years of union busting and anti-labor policies.
I'm sure a lot of these folks here that are so anti-immigrants have native American blood oozingdoing their arms and legs 🙂
I don't understand what the f*ck is the big deal with this. I see these illegals hardworking and willing to do what a lot of american citizens who would rather take a welfare handout before considering doing what these folks do. The only gripe i have is that illegals don't pay taxes and they get the benefits of the state..But I would consider this a failed U.S. policy that apparently no one wants to address.
At the same time, they are contribute to this economy as spenders and earners. I hardly consider these folks "stealing our jobs", because I doubt most americans would want to work at these jobs to begin with. Even so consider if you couldn't find cheap labor. Those business (farms/etc) would dry up and move overseas, and we be importing even a heck of a lot more.
And frankly American labor is ridiculously expensive. $100/hr for a frickin plumber?
CoronitaParticipantThe "death tax" is too funny, the Republican spinmasters named it that so that Alabama Joe Sixpack would think it's an awful idea and that it needs to go. Little does Alabama Joe Sixpack know that unless he's got $2M in assets his estate won't be taxed a penny when he dies. (Alabama Joe Sixpack doesn't know how to use "the internets" or "the google" to look up the info on the IRS website, so he lets Fox News tell him everything he needs to know). As for those family businesses, they can definitely be stung by it but a good estate plan can help minimize the effects. How many people in the US even die with a $2M estate? It is so funny that people will vote to get rid of it when all they've got is $50K in their 401K. And of course some of the world's richest men are big supporters of the estate tax.
I disagree, especially if you live in california.
Take your SFH. That itself for is $1million (ok maybe $700k after the decline). Then figure if you're smart you have a $500k life insurance policy for you and another for your spouse. That's $2million. right there. Add in your 401k over your lifetime and your wife's lifetime, how hard is it to really exceed this amount before you are 60? Also, $2million in tomorrow's dollar will be worthless..more like $200k in today's dollars. A lot of you "average" joe's aren't really that below average.The really rich always have loopholes, so this death tax doesn't really matter to them. Yeah, sure you can setup the entire A and B trust thing to get around the $2.5 million. But let's face it, $1million isn't really a lot of money these days.Â
The other way I look at it, for those that think th inheritance is "unfair". Your kids don't deserve an inheritance any less than any of you that were "lucky" to be born with a U.S. citizenship. So I find it hypocritical that the same folks that think an estate inheritance is unfair but at the same time want to crack down on immigrants. If your heirs are really that stupid and lose everything you give to them, that's their stupidity. But I earned this money. I already paid taxes on this money. And I'll be damned if te government tells me what I can do with it upon my death.
CoronitaParticipantThe "death tax" is too funny, the Republican spinmasters named it that so that Alabama Joe Sixpack would think it's an awful idea and that it needs to go. Little does Alabama Joe Sixpack know that unless he's got $2M in assets his estate won't be taxed a penny when he dies. (Alabama Joe Sixpack doesn't know how to use "the internets" or "the google" to look up the info on the IRS website, so he lets Fox News tell him everything he needs to know). As for those family businesses, they can definitely be stung by it but a good estate plan can help minimize the effects. How many people in the US even die with a $2M estate? It is so funny that people will vote to get rid of it when all they've got is $50K in their 401K. And of course some of the world's richest men are big supporters of the estate tax.
I disagree, especially if you live in california.
Take your SFH. That itself for is $1million (ok maybe $700k after the decline). Then figure if you're smart you have a $500k life insurance policy for you and another for your spouse. That's $2million. right there. Add in your 401k over your lifetime and your wife's lifetime, how hard is it to really exceed this amount before you are 60? Also, $2million in tomorrow's dollar will be worthless..more like $200k in today's dollars. A lot of you "average" joe's aren't really that below average.The really rich always have loopholes, so this death tax doesn't really matter to them. Yeah, sure you can setup the entire A and B trust thing to get around the $2.5 million. But let's face it, $1million isn't really a lot of money these days.Â
The other way I look at it, for those that think th inheritance is "unfair". Your kids don't deserve an inheritance any less than any of you that were "lucky" to be born with a U.S. citizenship. So I find it hypocritical that the same folks that think an estate inheritance is unfair but at the same time want to crack down on immigrants. If your heirs are really that stupid and lose everything you give to them, that's their stupidity. But I earned this money. I already paid taxes on this money. And I'll be damned if te government tells me what I can do with it upon my death.
CoronitaParticipantWhat is more likely to affect a larger number of Piggingtonians – estate tax reform or tort reform. I'd posit that Bush's biggest blunder is abandoning the cause of tort reform. If ANYTHING would help turn this country away from it's entrenched nanny-state ways – keeping the lawyer's filthy mitts off our cash would be a great place to start. How many of us pay too much for medical care, car insurance and other necessities? How many will be in the position of needing to be concerned with estate tax? I think the second number is dramatically smaller – but it does seem to have the effect of making a lot of people feel a lot more important when they bitch about it.
The way I see it. A lot of people are paying way to much in terms of cost because they choose to do it. They choose to drive big SUVs. They choose spend $100/month on cable, another, $100/month on a cell phone, choose drive expensive cars, and hence choose to pay a lot of car insurance. How is this everyone elses problems???????
There's no doubt Health care is wacked. The first thing would be to stop giving it away imho. But I believe some things like health care need some part of socialization. But the only problem is, no one has figured out how to pay for it. No one wants to pay for higher taxes, for those who can afford to pay taxes (I don’t mind personally if taxes rise slightly as long as everyone bears some amount if it). And as far as cutting benefits, I see the health care issue many for hourly workers. Sorry ,but my advise is get out of that job. Go get yourself a decent education, with a decent career or self/business so you aren't so dependent on crappy hourly pay/with crappy healh care. If you truely have done all that, and then still need financial assistance, apply for welfare at that point..I would be happy that my tax dollars would subsidize those people who have really tried but couldn't make it..
The only irony to this immigrant bill which is pretty funny is that all those H1-B holders who work at tech companies are probably going to have to wait longer to get their green card than illegal immigrants…That’s pretty pathetic.
CoronitaParticipantWhat is more likely to affect a larger number of Piggingtonians – estate tax reform or tort reform. I'd posit that Bush's biggest blunder is abandoning the cause of tort reform. If ANYTHING would help turn this country away from it's entrenched nanny-state ways – keeping the lawyer's filthy mitts off our cash would be a great place to start. How many of us pay too much for medical care, car insurance and other necessities? How many will be in the position of needing to be concerned with estate tax? I think the second number is dramatically smaller – but it does seem to have the effect of making a lot of people feel a lot more important when they bitch about it.
The way I see it. A lot of people are paying way to much in terms of cost because they choose to do it. They choose to drive big SUVs. They choose spend $100/month on cable, another, $100/month on a cell phone, choose drive expensive cars, and hence choose to pay a lot of car insurance. How is this everyone elses problems???????
There's no doubt Health care is wacked. The first thing would be to stop giving it away imho. But I believe some things like health care need some part of socialization. But the only problem is, no one has figured out how to pay for it. No one wants to pay for higher taxes, for those who can afford to pay taxes (I don’t mind personally if taxes rise slightly as long as everyone bears some amount if it). And as far as cutting benefits, I see the health care issue many for hourly workers. Sorry ,but my advise is get out of that job. Go get yourself a decent education, with a decent career or self/business so you aren't so dependent on crappy hourly pay/with crappy healh care. If you truely have done all that, and then still need financial assistance, apply for welfare at that point..I would be happy that my tax dollars would subsidize those people who have really tried but couldn't make it..
The only irony to this immigrant bill which is pretty funny is that all those H1-B holders who work at tech companies are probably going to have to wait longer to get their green card than illegal immigrants…That’s pretty pathetic.
CoronitaParticipantyour fat lazy stupid smug kid doesnt deserve anything that you worked for except what clothes and education you can provide him during your lifetime. republicans are not the only ones who want cheap labor.
The way I look at it. Better giving it to my "fat, lazy, stupid kid" than
your or other people's fat lazy stupid kid that will knee deep in debt. Or worse….Fat lazy stupid people that got knee deep in debt because they wanted to drive around BMW's when they should have been planning for THEIR future. I give enough subsidies to everyone else in terms of paying taxes. I've done my part in terms of socialization. If the government wants to waste money on my tax dollars and/or if individuals are stupid and going to buy that BMW instead of of saving for their future retirement because they are counting on social security, that's really not my problem.
By the time I retire, I estimate 2/3 of americans will be living off of subsidies, while the remaining 1/3 of us will be paying up our noses for the rest of you. And that probably would be a conservative estimate.
CoronitaParticipantyour fat lazy stupid smug kid doesnt deserve anything that you worked for except what clothes and education you can provide him during your lifetime. republicans are not the only ones who want cheap labor.
The way I look at it. Better giving it to my "fat, lazy, stupid kid" than
your or other people's fat lazy stupid kid that will knee deep in debt. Or worse….Fat lazy stupid people that got knee deep in debt because they wanted to drive around BMW's when they should have been planning for THEIR future. I give enough subsidies to everyone else in terms of paying taxes. I've done my part in terms of socialization. If the government wants to waste money on my tax dollars and/or if individuals are stupid and going to buy that BMW instead of of saving for their future retirement because they are counting on social security, that's really not my problem.
By the time I retire, I estimate 2/3 of americans will be living off of subsidies, while the remaining 1/3 of us will be paying up our noses for the rest of you. And that probably would be a conservative estimate.
CoronitaParticipantI will give you some idea:
Buy Vanguard Total Intl Stock Index (VGTSX)
$20k is not a lot of money to pick individual stocks. I personally will put in it international index and avoid any management fee. The transaction fee for index fund is usually lower.
Min Initial Investment: $3,000
Year to date: 7.92% return
Top holdings:
Vanguard European Stock Index 58.17%
Vanguard Pacific Stock Index 26.13%
Vanguard Emerging Mkts Stock Idx 15.66%Masayako
You know I have had a significant stake in this fund for the past 3 years. And it's been a great three years. But I've actually stopped contributing to international (I haven't pulled out, just stopped adding to my position in this fund). Where I've been putting heavily into is big large cap domestic index funds. I know a lot of folks will probably think this is stupid. U.S. is headed for a decline, companies are going to suck on guidance here, housing collapse etc,etc,etc,etc….
I am considering where the media/general attention is telling you to put money now, and do completely the opposite. The issue that I have with the international indexes is that while their returns have been great over the years (namely due to the dollar decline, not real performance), this can't keep going on forever. The problem that I see now it seems everyone is all over "international investments". Every media is telling you to invest in overseas markets. My rule is that by the time the media is reporting what you should be doing, it's already too late to actually do it. I think the international markets have had their run, and pretty much it's over when Average Joe at the office's water cooler starts to talk about how he's putting money into a International Index Fund because he read about it being "smart" to do from BusinessWeek.
Where I have been building up a position over the last 2 years and will continue to do this this year is in big cap domestic indexes here. It's been pathetic for the past couples years. Don't think these can return that low for that long. Some folks argue that well U.S. business is shrinking. Yes, I would agree. But I've noticed part of the frenzy these days have also been through a lot of M&A activities that's proping these markets (as opposed to IPOs). Big CO's are swallowing smaller CO's (in the process laying off a bunch of people to cut expenses and redundancy)…I think what we are seeing now is just the tip of M&A activities. Also, several of these big companies have been massively buying back their own stock. So while I think there's some merit to the doom and gloom for the real estate companies, I don't see a complete meltdown in the U.S. financial markets: namely because the big I-banks make money in more than 1 way…. The current trend is via M&A deals (and I have several friends are/were M&A Investment Bankers that are having a field day now…Because during the 90's it was mostly about IPOs and not M&A)
So it were me, I'd take the entire $20k and do Vanguard Growth Index Fund Investor Shares. Or, more diversify, I'd do $10k in the Vanguard Total Stock Market Index and another$10k in the Vanguard Total International Stock Market Index if I were to be afraid of missing any further rise in the international markets.
I would also recommend spending $20 and buy the book The 4 Pillars of Investing by William J. Bernstein…Or for the mathematically inclined, his previous book Intelligent Asset Allocator.
You can take a look at the performance of the Vanguard Funds over the past couple of years and see for yourself..if both the stellar international performance and the cruddy domestic large cap performance are really sustainable at their respective levels.
Total Int’l Stock Index Returns
1yr, 3yr, 5yr, 10yr, Since Inception(04/29/1996)
9.62% 18.78% 17.36% 8.66% 7.85%Growth Index Fund (Large Cap Growth) Returns
1yr, 3yr, 5yr, 10yr, Since Indeception(11/02/1992)
7.40% 11.46% 6.25% 6.53% 9.81%One additional caveat. If you are SURE you are going to need to use this money in 2-3 years…You really shouldn’t put all of it into the market at all imho. It should be liquid earning the highest possible return in an almost guarentee-like fashion. First, there is the possibility that all of us at piggington are wrong, and both the international markets/domestic market/precious metal market all have a bad rap over the next 2-3years. Second, you could have bad luck and pick the wrong indexes. Third, you definitely shouldn’t pick individual stocks unless you are prepared that you have a chance of losing this amount. In all my major purchases, I alwyas plan 1-2 years ahead. The funds I need for those major purchases are ALWAYS held liquidable in an insured short term cd/interest account, even though it may be declining due to inflation.
Numerous times, I’ve made the following mistake and personally witnessed others that did the same thing. I looked at a CD/savings account and said, “wow 5% sucks..If I left the money in the stock market up until the point that i really need it, I could be earning like 10-15%…” Well, my dumb luck was that that every time i did this, when I needed the funds, it was always during when the market was “correcting” for some random short term news. So it was actually worse for me to leave in the market, than had I just taken the 5% cd….If you are sure you are going to buy a house in 2 years, I wouldn’t even keep all the “other” 80k in the stock market.
CoronitaParticipantI will give you some idea:
Buy Vanguard Total Intl Stock Index (VGTSX)
$20k is not a lot of money to pick individual stocks. I personally will put in it international index and avoid any management fee. The transaction fee for index fund is usually lower.
Min Initial Investment: $3,000
Year to date: 7.92% return
Top holdings:
Vanguard European Stock Index 58.17%
Vanguard Pacific Stock Index 26.13%
Vanguard Emerging Mkts Stock Idx 15.66%Masayako
You know I have had a significant stake in this fund for the past 3 years. And it's been a great three years. But I've actually stopped contributing to international (I haven't pulled out, just stopped adding to my position in this fund). Where I've been putting heavily into is big large cap domestic index funds. I know a lot of folks will probably think this is stupid. U.S. is headed for a decline, companies are going to suck on guidance here, housing collapse etc,etc,etc,etc….
I am considering where the media/general attention is telling you to put money now, and do completely the opposite. The issue that I have with the international indexes is that while their returns have been great over the years (namely due to the dollar decline, not real performance), this can't keep going on forever. The problem that I see now it seems everyone is all over "international investments". Every media is telling you to invest in overseas markets. My rule is that by the time the media is reporting what you should be doing, it's already too late to actually do it. I think the international markets have had their run, and pretty much it's over when Average Joe at the office's water cooler starts to talk about how he's putting money into a International Index Fund because he read about it being "smart" to do from BusinessWeek.
Where I have been building up a position over the last 2 years and will continue to do this this year is in big cap domestic indexes here. It's been pathetic for the past couples years. Don't think these can return that low for that long. Some folks argue that well U.S. business is shrinking. Yes, I would agree. But I've noticed part of the frenzy these days have also been through a lot of M&A activities that's proping these markets (as opposed to IPOs). Big CO's are swallowing smaller CO's (in the process laying off a bunch of people to cut expenses and redundancy)…I think what we are seeing now is just the tip of M&A activities. Also, several of these big companies have been massively buying back their own stock. So while I think there's some merit to the doom and gloom for the real estate companies, I don't see a complete meltdown in the U.S. financial markets: namely because the big I-banks make money in more than 1 way…. The current trend is via M&A deals (and I have several friends are/were M&A Investment Bankers that are having a field day now…Because during the 90's it was mostly about IPOs and not M&A)
So it were me, I'd take the entire $20k and do Vanguard Growth Index Fund Investor Shares. Or, more diversify, I'd do $10k in the Vanguard Total Stock Market Index and another$10k in the Vanguard Total International Stock Market Index if I were to be afraid of missing any further rise in the international markets.
I would also recommend spending $20 and buy the book The 4 Pillars of Investing by William J. Bernstein…Or for the mathematically inclined, his previous book Intelligent Asset Allocator.
You can take a look at the performance of the Vanguard Funds over the past couple of years and see for yourself..if both the stellar international performance and the cruddy domestic large cap performance are really sustainable at their respective levels.
Total Int’l Stock Index Returns
1yr, 3yr, 5yr, 10yr, Since Inception(04/29/1996)
9.62% 18.78% 17.36% 8.66% 7.85%Growth Index Fund (Large Cap Growth) Returns
1yr, 3yr, 5yr, 10yr, Since Indeception(11/02/1992)
7.40% 11.46% 6.25% 6.53% 9.81%One additional caveat. If you are SURE you are going to need to use this money in 2-3 years…You really shouldn’t put all of it into the market at all imho. It should be liquid earning the highest possible return in an almost guarentee-like fashion. First, there is the possibility that all of us at piggington are wrong, and both the international markets/domestic market/precious metal market all have a bad rap over the next 2-3years. Second, you could have bad luck and pick the wrong indexes. Third, you definitely shouldn’t pick individual stocks unless you are prepared that you have a chance of losing this amount. In all my major purchases, I alwyas plan 1-2 years ahead. The funds I need for those major purchases are ALWAYS held liquidable in an insured short term cd/interest account, even though it may be declining due to inflation.
Numerous times, I’ve made the following mistake and personally witnessed others that did the same thing. I looked at a CD/savings account and said, “wow 5% sucks..If I left the money in the stock market up until the point that i really need it, I could be earning like 10-15%…” Well, my dumb luck was that that every time i did this, when I needed the funds, it was always during when the market was “correcting” for some random short term news. So it was actually worse for me to leave in the market, than had I just taken the 5% cd….If you are sure you are going to buy a house in 2 years, I wouldn’t even keep all the “other” 80k in the stock market.
CoronitaParticipantAt least they would pay taxes now :(.
Besides, if they aren’t going to pick the strawberries you eat, who will? You wanna pay $10/lb for strawberries when farmers hire unionized ex-UAW to pick the fields??????
Getting rid of welfare for those who haven’t contributed to the system in the past say 5 years. That would work.
But seriously, do you really expect this to pass????? Nothing is going to get done until election. This is the best time for the financial markets imho. The only gripe i had was that the republicans had 1 shot at getting rid of the estate tax. And they blew it. Now I have to figure out other ways to shelter what I earn away from all the welfare/taxes/subsidies/credit drenched/financially irresponsible american that always scream bailout when they f* up their own finances.
CoronitaParticipantAt least they would pay taxes now :(.
Besides, if they aren’t going to pick the strawberries you eat, who will? You wanna pay $10/lb for strawberries when farmers hire unionized ex-UAW to pick the fields??????
Getting rid of welfare for those who haven’t contributed to the system in the past say 5 years. That would work.
But seriously, do you really expect this to pass????? Nothing is going to get done until election. This is the best time for the financial markets imho. The only gripe i had was that the republicans had 1 shot at getting rid of the estate tax. And they blew it. Now I have to figure out other ways to shelter what I earn away from all the welfare/taxes/subsidies/credit drenched/financially irresponsible american that always scream bailout when they f* up their own finances.
CoronitaParticipantGood points rustico. What people don't get is that sure housing may be down 10-20% over the next few years but interest rates will be up couple percent so what happens? A complete wash. The decrease people will expect for their monthly payments due to a cheaper home won't happen because the higher interest rates will bring the payments back up.
Yes, the clock is ticking. The issues that I see is that is that even though home prices are falling,inflation is creeping up pretty fast (despite what the gov is telling you). Also, mortgage rates aren't going to stay this low, especially when gov starts to tighten…That and the dollar keeps falling. So i think the idea of just "saving" to buy a home in the future might have issues unless you're also actively trying to keep your saved dollars above inflation and the dollar's decline.
CoronitaParticipantGood points rustico. What people don't get is that sure housing may be down 10-20% over the next few years but interest rates will be up couple percent so what happens? A complete wash. The decrease people will expect for their monthly payments due to a cheaper home won't happen because the higher interest rates will bring the payments back up.
Yes, the clock is ticking. The issues that I see is that is that even though home prices are falling,inflation is creeping up pretty fast (despite what the gov is telling you). Also, mortgage rates aren't going to stay this low, especially when gov starts to tighten…That and the dollar keeps falling. So i think the idea of just "saving" to buy a home in the future might have issues unless you're also actively trying to keep your saved dollars above inflation and the dollar's decline.
CoronitaParticipantSpend it!
It will be worth much less a year from now!
That would be the typical American thing to do :(.. Spend whatever money we have left over.
Anyway, my advice is that it's basically $20k. Put it into a index fund. Anything less won't keep up with inflation, and if you have only $20k to invest freely, it's probably not enough to buy a basket of individual stocks. If you just bought 1 stock, you'd be assuming a lot of risk unless you don't mind potentially losing a chunk of it. If you have less than $100k working cash, you really shouldn't be buying individual stocks imho.
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