Time for Jeff Bridges to dump Hyundai

[CA renter]

[quote=dbapig][quote=CONCHO]I have a college degree but because I don’t work for govt nor GM, I won’t be getting pension after I retire. Meanwhile auto workers graduated from high school and start working at car factory right away and end up with pension. I’m sure working on factory floor has its difficulties and all BUT it doesn’t make sense. That’s unsustainable. We can’t sustain what’s unsustainable.

Wow what an amazing example of the way we think here in the US. Note that pensions are common across Western Europe (and used to be here too!), where lots of good cars and other products come from. However here in the US they are considered “unsustainable” relics of a bygone era. Rather than thinking — “Hey why don’t we all have a pension like the autoworkers? We should organize and hassle our politicians to make that happen!” we instead think “those darned overpaid spoiled autoworkers! They should be totally f***ed like the rest of us and have to work until they drop!”

And most people here think this way. Go ahead and call me crazy for thinking otherwise, I’m used to it.[/quote]

Ok let’s say pension isn’t a crazy idea. Can you please tell me why I don’t have it? I have a college degree but don’t work for Govt./GM. BTW, Govt/GM are prime examples how things should NOT be managed. I would love to get pension so how can I get it?

It’s NOT sustainable. Look at what happened to GM.
[/quote]

You (and anyone else without pension/healthcare benefits) don’t have it because you are unwilling to fight for it. Unfortunately, Americans are lazy and apathetic, and all too eager to take the easy way out. They like to let someone else do the heavy lifting for them. Why weren’t you applying for these union jobs during the boom years?

For decades, the unions have done all the heavy lifting that has enabled the U.S. to have a large and stable middle class. Most people don’t realize that unions also protect the wages, benefits and rights of workers in non-union jobs because the non-union employers have to compete with union employers.

If you don’t have a decent compensation package, find an employer that does offer what you want. Join a union and fight for your own rights and the rights of other workers.

BTW, I think Concho hit the nail on the head. We should not compete with third-world wage earners. We need **fair trade** so we can trade with other countries that have similar environmental and labor protections and standards. Let’s encourage competition that is based on **quality** not on how cheaply (and poorly) something can be made.

[dbapig]

[quote=CA renter][quote=dbapig][quote=CONCHO]I have a college degree but because I don’t work for govt nor GM, I won’t be getting pension after I retire. Meanwhile auto workers graduated from high school and start working at car factory right away and end up with pension. I’m sure working on factory floor has its difficulties and all BUT it doesn’t make sense. That’s unsustainable. We can’t sustain what’s unsustainable.

Wow what an amazing example of the way we think here in the US. Note that pensions are common across Western Europe (and used to be here too!), where lots of good cars and other products come from. However here in the US they are considered “unsustainable” relics of a bygone era. Rather than thinking — “Hey why don’t we all have a pension like the autoworkers? We should organize and hassle our politicians to make that happen!” we instead think “those darned overpaid spoiled autoworkers! They should be totally f***ed like the rest of us and have to work until they drop!”

And most people here think this way. Go ahead and call me crazy for thinking otherwise, I’m used to it.[/quote]

Ok let’s say pension isn’t a crazy idea. Can you please tell me why I don’t have it? I have a college degree but don’t work for Govt./GM. BTW, Govt/GM are prime examples how things should NOT be managed. I would love to get pension so how can I get it?

It’s NOT sustainable. Look at what happened to GM.
[/quote]

You (and anyone else without pension/healthcare benefits) don’t have it because you are unwilling to fight for it. Unfortunately, Americans are lazy and apathetic, and all too eager to take the easy way out. They like to let someone else do the heavy lifting for them. Why weren’t you applying for these union jobs during the boom years?

For decades, the unions have done all the heavy lifting that has enabled the U.S. to have a large and stable middle class. Most people don’t realize that unions also protect the wages, benefits and rights of workers in non-union jobs because the non-union employers have to compete with union employers.

If you don’t have a decent compensation package, find an employer that does offer what you want. Join a union and fight for your own rights and the rights of other workers.

BTW, I think Concho hit the nail on the head. We should not compete with third-world wage earners. We need **fair trade** so we can trade with other countries that have similar environmental and labor protections and standards. Let’s encourage competition that is based on **quality** not on how cheaply (and poorly) something can be made.
[/quote]

Pity no such passion for computers BUILT in US.

[dbapig]

[quote=CA renter][quote=dbapig][quote=CONCHO]I have a college degree but because I don’t work for govt nor GM, I won’t be getting pension after I retire. Meanwhile auto workers graduated from high school and start working at car factory right away and end up with pension. I’m sure working on factory floor has its difficulties and all BUT it doesn’t make sense. That’s unsustainable. We can’t sustain what’s unsustainable.

Wow what an amazing example of the way we think here in the US. Note that pensions are common across Western Europe (and used to be here too!), where lots of good cars and other products come from. However here in the US they are considered “unsustainable” relics of a bygone era. Rather than thinking — “Hey why don’t we all have a pension like the autoworkers? We should organize and hassle our politicians to make that happen!” we instead think “those darned overpaid spoiled autoworkers! They should be totally f***ed like the rest of us and have to work until they drop!”

And most people here think this way. Go ahead and call me crazy for thinking otherwise, I’m used to it.[/quote]

Ok let’s say pension isn’t a crazy idea. Can you please tell me why I don’t have it? I have a college degree but don’t work for Govt./GM. BTW, Govt/GM are prime examples how things should NOT be managed. I would love to get pension so how can I get it?

It’s NOT sustainable. Look at what happened to GM.
[/quote]

You (and anyone else without pension/healthcare benefits) don’t have it because you are unwilling to fight for it. Unfortunately, Americans are lazy and apathetic, and all too eager to take the easy way out. They like to let someone else do the heavy lifting for them. Why weren’t you applying for these union jobs during the boom years?

For decades, the unions have done all the heavy lifting that has enabled the U.S. to have a large and stable middle class. Most people don’t realize that unions also protect the wages, benefits and rights of workers in non-union jobs because the non-union employers have to compete with union employers.

If you don’t have a decent compensation package, find an employer that does offer what you want. Join a union and fight for your own rights and the rights of other workers.

BTW, I think Concho hit the nail on the head. We should not compete with third-world wage earners. We need **fair trade** so we can trade with other countries that have similar environmental and labor protections and standards. Let’s encourage competition that is based on **quality** not on how cheaply (and poorly) something can be made.
[/quote]

Pity no such passion for computers BUILT in US.

[dbapig]

[quote=CA renter][quote=dbapig][quote=CONCHO]I have a college degree but because I don’t work for govt nor GM, I won’t be getting pension after I retire. Meanwhile auto workers graduated from high school and start working at car factory right away and end up with pension. I’m sure working on factory floor has its difficulties and all BUT it doesn’t make sense. That’s unsustainable. We can’t sustain what’s unsustainable.

Wow what an amazing example of the way we think here in the US. Note that pensions are common across Western Europe (and used to be here too!), where lots of good cars and other products come from. However here in the US they are considered “unsustainable” relics of a bygone era. Rather than thinking — “Hey why don’t we all have a pension like the autoworkers? We should organize and hassle our politicians to make that happen!” we instead think “those darned overpaid spoiled autoworkers! They should be totally f***ed like the rest of us and have to work until they drop!”

And most people here think this way. Go ahead and call me crazy for thinking otherwise, I’m used to it.[/quote]

Ok let’s say pension isn’t a crazy idea. Can you please tell me why I don’t have it? I have a college degree but don’t work for Govt./GM. BTW, Govt/GM are prime examples how things should NOT be managed. I would love to get pension so how can I get it?

It’s NOT sustainable. Look at what happened to GM.
[/quote]

You (and anyone else without pension/healthcare benefits) don’t have it because you are unwilling to fight for it. Unfortunately, Americans are lazy and apathetic, and all too eager to take the easy way out. They like to let someone else do the heavy lifting for them. Why weren’t you applying for these union jobs during the boom years?

For decades, the unions have done all the heavy lifting that has enabled the U.S. to have a large and stable middle class. Most people don’t realize that unions also protect the wages, benefits and rights of workers in non-union jobs because the non-union employers have to compete with union employers.

If you don’t have a decent compensation package, find an employer that does offer what you want. Join a union and fight for your own rights and the rights of other workers.

BTW, I think Concho hit the nail on the head. We should not compete with third-world wage earners. We need **fair trade** so we can trade with other countries that have similar environmental and labor protections and standards. Let’s encourage competition that is based on **quality** not on how cheaply (and poorly) something can be made.
[/quote]

Pity no such passion for computers BUILT in US.

[dbapig]

[quote=CA renter][quote=dbapig][quote=CONCHO]I have a college degree but because I don’t work for govt nor GM, I won’t be getting pension after I retire. Meanwhile auto workers graduated from high school and start working at car factory right away and end up with pension. I’m sure working on factory floor has its difficulties and all BUT it doesn’t make sense. That’s unsustainable. We can’t sustain what’s unsustainable.

Wow what an amazing example of the way we think here in the US. Note that pensions are common across Western Europe (and used to be here too!), where lots of good cars and other products come from. However here in the US they are considered “unsustainable” relics of a bygone era. Rather than thinking — “Hey why don’t we all have a pension like the autoworkers? We should organize and hassle our politicians to make that happen!” we instead think “those darned overpaid spoiled autoworkers! They should be totally f***ed like the rest of us and have to work until they drop!”

And most people here think this way. Go ahead and call me crazy for thinking otherwise, I’m used to it.[/quote]

Ok let’s say pension isn’t a crazy idea. Can you please tell me why I don’t have it? I have a college degree but don’t work for Govt./GM. BTW, Govt/GM are prime examples how things should NOT be managed. I would love to get pension so how can I get it?

It’s NOT sustainable. Look at what happened to GM.
[/quote]

You (and anyone else without pension/healthcare benefits) don’t have it because you are unwilling to fight for it. Unfortunately, Americans are lazy and apathetic, and all too eager to take the easy way out. They like to let someone else do the heavy lifting for them. Why weren’t you applying for these union jobs during the boom years?

For decades, the unions have done all the heavy lifting that has enabled the U.S. to have a large and stable middle class. Most people don’t realize that unions also protect the wages, benefits and rights of workers in non-union jobs because the non-union employers have to compete with union employers.

If you don’t have a decent compensation package, find an employer that does offer what you want. Join a union and fight for your own rights and the rights of other workers.

BTW, I think Concho hit the nail on the head. We should not compete with third-world wage earners. We need **fair trade** so we can trade with other countries that have similar environmental and labor protections and standards. Let’s encourage competition that is based on **quality** not on how cheaply (and poorly) something can be made.
[/quote]

Pity no such passion for computers BUILT in US.

[dbapig]

[quote=CA renter][quote=dbapig][quote=CONCHO]I have a college degree but because I don’t work for govt nor GM, I won’t be getting pension after I retire. Meanwhile auto workers graduated from high school and start working at car factory right away and end up with pension. I’m sure working on factory floor has its difficulties and all BUT it doesn’t make sense. That’s unsustainable. We can’t sustain what’s unsustainable.

Wow what an amazing example of the way we think here in the US. Note that pensions are common across Western Europe (and used to be here too!), where lots of good cars and other products come from. However here in the US they are considered “unsustainable” relics of a bygone era. Rather than thinking — “Hey why don’t we all have a pension like the autoworkers? We should organize and hassle our politicians to make that happen!” we instead think “those darned overpaid spoiled autoworkers! They should be totally f***ed like the rest of us and have to work until they drop!”

And most people here think this way. Go ahead and call me crazy for thinking otherwise, I’m used to it.[/quote]

Ok let’s say pension isn’t a crazy idea. Can you please tell me why I don’t have it? I have a college degree but don’t work for Govt./GM. BTW, Govt/GM are prime examples how things should NOT be managed. I would love to get pension so how can I get it?

It’s NOT sustainable. Look at what happened to GM.
[/quote]

You (and anyone else without pension/healthcare benefits) don’t have it because you are unwilling to fight for it. Unfortunately, Americans are lazy and apathetic, and all too eager to take the easy way out. They like to let someone else do the heavy lifting for them. Why weren’t you applying for these union jobs during the boom years?

For decades, the unions have done all the heavy lifting that has enabled the U.S. to have a large and stable middle class. Most people don’t realize that unions also protect the wages, benefits and rights of workers in non-union jobs because the non-union employers have to compete with union employers.

If you don’t have a decent compensation package, find an employer that does offer what you want. Join a union and fight for your own rights and the rights of other workers.

BTW, I think Concho hit the nail on the head. We should not compete with third-world wage earners. We need **fair trade** so we can trade with other countries that have similar environmental and labor protections and standards. Let’s encourage competition that is based on **quality** not on how cheaply (and poorly) something can be made.
[/quote]

Pity no such passion for computers BUILT in US.

[fm]

[quote=Rt.66]The Chevy Malibu is built here of a very high US parts content. The profits stay here.[/quote]

Not sure what profits you are talking about. Since it goes to the upper level execs. who make decisions so they can keep their jobs. If that means bringing a German car with a restyling to sell in North America, or use an Australian car platform to redesign for the Camaro then build in Canada, whatever it takes to be successful to keep their upper level jobs is what they will do.

[quote=Rt.66]
Why would anyone compare a Malibu/Camry/Accord with a BMW or Audi sports sedan? [/quote]

I’m talking in general, even a basic Honda drives fairly well. I drove a Civic and much larger Odyssey minivan and they don’t drive much different aside from weight. This is compared to general vehicles such as HHR, Cobalt, etc… There is a difference in handling, as I pointed out, because the cars are aimed at slightly different groups.

[quote=Rt.66]
If thats what you like then go take a look at Cadillac.

So you rented a luxury sedan and it did not drive like a sports sedan so it sucks? [/quote]

That’s why your point about what to buy doesn’t make sense. You are expecting everyone to want the same thing? If they don’t drive similarly then the potential buyers are going to be different people.

[quote=Rt.66]
I stand by my statement about lame and outragious excuses made by import buyers. Its comical really.

Just admit that you WANT a foriegn car and we can respect that, but these lame excuses are growing old. [/quote]

You missed some details. I don’t have a problem with American cars, I would consider the Tesla cars (because their spirit and idea is good), maybe Ford (moving more design work to local teams), perhaps Chrysler (very good styling) if the quality ever came back up. The issue is that I look at the way companies are run and managed (considering how many products GM makes, many are not based on US designs (in the long run this will be a problem for them, they are going to lose the Opel connection, they will end up relying more on the Korea and Australian teams), are they really trying to be “American” cars, in truth they are just trying to make money like any other company). So the idea that everyone should look at GM cars if they are interested in buying a car isn’t what I want someone “yelling” out to me.

[fm]

[quote=Rt.66]The Chevy Malibu is built here of a very high US parts content. The profits stay here.[/quote]

Not sure what profits you are talking about. Since it goes to the upper level execs. who make decisions so they can keep their jobs. If that means bringing a German car with a restyling to sell in North America, or use an Australian car platform to redesign for the Camaro then build in Canada, whatever it takes to be successful to keep their upper level jobs is what they will do.

[quote=Rt.66]
Why would anyone compare a Malibu/Camry/Accord with a BMW or Audi sports sedan? [/quote]

I’m talking in general, even a basic Honda drives fairly well. I drove a Civic and much larger Odyssey minivan and they don’t drive much different aside from weight. This is compared to general vehicles such as HHR, Cobalt, etc… There is a difference in handling, as I pointed out, because the cars are aimed at slightly different groups.

[quote=Rt.66]
If thats what you like then go take a look at Cadillac.

So you rented a luxury sedan and it did not drive like a sports sedan so it sucks? [/quote]

That’s why your point about what to buy doesn’t make sense. You are expecting everyone to want the same thing? If they don’t drive similarly then the potential buyers are going to be different people.

[quote=Rt.66]
I stand by my statement about lame and outragious excuses made by import buyers. Its comical really.

Just admit that you WANT a foriegn car and we can respect that, but these lame excuses are growing old. [/quote]

You missed some details. I don’t have a problem with American cars, I would consider the Tesla cars (because their spirit and idea is good), maybe Ford (moving more design work to local teams), perhaps Chrysler (very good styling) if the quality ever came back up. The issue is that I look at the way companies are run and managed (considering how many products GM makes, many are not based on US designs (in the long run this will be a problem for them, they are going to lose the Opel connection, they will end up relying more on the Korea and Australian teams), are they really trying to be “American” cars, in truth they are just trying to make money like any other company). So the idea that everyone should look at GM cars if they are interested in buying a car isn’t what I want someone “yelling” out to me.

[fm]

[quote=Rt.66]The Chevy Malibu is built here of a very high US parts content. The profits stay here.[/quote]

Not sure what profits you are talking about. Since it goes to the upper level execs. who make decisions so they can keep their jobs. If that means bringing a German car with a restyling to sell in North America, or use an Australian car platform to redesign for the Camaro then build in Canada, whatever it takes to be successful to keep their upper level jobs is what they will do.

[quote=Rt.66]
Why would anyone compare a Malibu/Camry/Accord with a BMW or Audi sports sedan? [/quote]

I’m talking in general, even a basic Honda drives fairly well. I drove a Civic and much larger Odyssey minivan and they don’t drive much different aside from weight. This is compared to general vehicles such as HHR, Cobalt, etc… There is a difference in handling, as I pointed out, because the cars are aimed at slightly different groups.

[quote=Rt.66]
If thats what you like then go take a look at Cadillac.

So you rented a luxury sedan and it did not drive like a sports sedan so it sucks? [/quote]

That’s why your point about what to buy doesn’t make sense. You are expecting everyone to want the same thing? If they don’t drive similarly then the potential buyers are going to be different people.

[quote=Rt.66]
I stand by my statement about lame and outragious excuses made by import buyers. Its comical really.

Just admit that you WANT a foriegn car and we can respect that, but these lame excuses are growing old. [/quote]

You missed some details. I don’t have a problem with American cars, I would consider the Tesla cars (because their spirit and idea is good), maybe Ford (moving more design work to local teams), perhaps Chrysler (very good styling) if the quality ever came back up. The issue is that I look at the way companies are run and managed (considering how many products GM makes, many are not based on US designs (in the long run this will be a problem for them, they are going to lose the Opel connection, they will end up relying more on the Korea and Australian teams), are they really trying to be “American” cars, in truth they are just trying to make money like any other company). So the idea that everyone should look at GM cars if they are interested in buying a car isn’t what I want someone “yelling” out to me.

[fm]

[quote=Rt.66]The Chevy Malibu is built here of a very high US parts content. The profits stay here.[/quote]

Not sure what profits you are talking about. Since it goes to the upper level execs. who make decisions so they can keep their jobs. If that means bringing a German car with a restyling to sell in North America, or use an Australian car platform to redesign for the Camaro then build in Canada, whatever it takes to be successful to keep their upper level jobs is what they will do.

[quote=Rt.66]
Why would anyone compare a Malibu/Camry/Accord with a BMW or Audi sports sedan? [/quote]

I’m talking in general, even a basic Honda drives fairly well. I drove a Civic and much larger Odyssey minivan and they don’t drive much different aside from weight. This is compared to general vehicles such as HHR, Cobalt, etc… There is a difference in handling, as I pointed out, because the cars are aimed at slightly different groups.

[quote=Rt.66]
If thats what you like then go take a look at Cadillac.

So you rented a luxury sedan and it did not drive like a sports sedan so it sucks? [/quote]

That’s why your point about what to buy doesn’t make sense. You are expecting everyone to want the same thing? If they don’t drive similarly then the potential buyers are going to be different people.

[quote=Rt.66]
I stand by my statement about lame and outragious excuses made by import buyers. Its comical really.

Just admit that you WANT a foriegn car and we can respect that, but these lame excuses are growing old. [/quote]

You missed some details. I don’t have a problem with American cars, I would consider the Tesla cars (because their spirit and idea is good), maybe Ford (moving more design work to local teams), perhaps Chrysler (very good styling) if the quality ever came back up. The issue is that I look at the way companies are run and managed (considering how many products GM makes, many are not based on US designs (in the long run this will be a problem for them, they are going to lose the Opel connection, they will end up relying more on the Korea and Australian teams), are they really trying to be “American” cars, in truth they are just trying to make money like any other company). So the idea that everyone should look at GM cars if they are interested in buying a car isn’t what I want someone “yelling” out to me.

[fm]

[quote=Rt.66]The Chevy Malibu is built here of a very high US parts content. The profits stay here.[/quote]

Not sure what profits you are talking about. Since it goes to the upper level execs. who make decisions so they can keep their jobs. If that means bringing a German car with a restyling to sell in North America, or use an Australian car platform to redesign for the Camaro then build in Canada, whatever it takes to be successful to keep their upper level jobs is what they will do.

[quote=Rt.66]
Why would anyone compare a Malibu/Camry/Accord with a BMW or Audi sports sedan? [/quote]

I’m talking in general, even a basic Honda drives fairly well. I drove a Civic and much larger Odyssey minivan and they don’t drive much different aside from weight. This is compared to general vehicles such as HHR, Cobalt, etc… There is a difference in handling, as I pointed out, because the cars are aimed at slightly different groups.

[quote=Rt.66]
If thats what you like then go take a look at Cadillac.

So you rented a luxury sedan and it did not drive like a sports sedan so it sucks? [/quote]

That’s why your point about what to buy doesn’t make sense. You are expecting everyone to want the same thing? If they don’t drive similarly then the potential buyers are going to be different people.

[quote=Rt.66]
I stand by my statement about lame and outragious excuses made by import buyers. Its comical really.

Just admit that you WANT a foriegn car and we can respect that, but these lame excuses are growing old. [/quote]

You missed some details. I don’t have a problem with American cars, I would consider the Tesla cars (because their spirit and idea is good), maybe Ford (moving more design work to local teams), perhaps Chrysler (very good styling) if the quality ever came back up. The issue is that I look at the way companies are run and managed (considering how many products GM makes, many are not based on US designs (in the long run this will be a problem for them, they are going to lose the Opel connection, they will end up relying more on the Korea and Australian teams), are they really trying to be “American” cars, in truth they are just trying to make money like any other company). So the idea that everyone should look at GM cars if they are interested in buying a car isn’t what I want someone “yelling” out to me.

[fm]

[quote=AN]
The Mercury Mariner is a entry level luxury CUV, same with the RX300. Neither one of them are sporty. The RX300 is as far from sporty as you can get. It rides very smooth though.[/quote]

But the Mercury was worse than a Civic and worse than even the Chevy HHR. No SUV is truly “sporty” due to the weight and higher center of gravity, but I’m talking relative to other vehicles in their type/size class. I wouldn’t have expected a 5 year older Lexus to be a lot better than a newer Mercury.

[quote=AN]
People don’t have to make excuses for their purchase. They bought a certain vehicle because that vehicle fits their criterias.[/quote]

Exactly. Ford is actually coming out with some good things, like the Fusion Hybrid. But people still rail on hybrid vehicles too, just because it doesn’t match their requirements. But I don’t tell those people to look at hybrids. I don’t care what other people do.

[fm]

[quote=AN]
The Mercury Mariner is a entry level luxury CUV, same with the RX300. Neither one of them are sporty. The RX300 is as far from sporty as you can get. It rides very smooth though.[/quote]

But the Mercury was worse than a Civic and worse than even the Chevy HHR. No SUV is truly “sporty” due to the weight and higher center of gravity, but I’m talking relative to other vehicles in their type/size class. I wouldn’t have expected a 5 year older Lexus to be a lot better than a newer Mercury.

[quote=AN]
People don’t have to make excuses for their purchase. They bought a certain vehicle because that vehicle fits their criterias.[/quote]

Exactly. Ford is actually coming out with some good things, like the Fusion Hybrid. But people still rail on hybrid vehicles too, just because it doesn’t match their requirements. But I don’t tell those people to look at hybrids. I don’t care what other people do.

[fm]

[quote=AN]
The Mercury Mariner is a entry level luxury CUV, same with the RX300. Neither one of them are sporty. The RX300 is as far from sporty as you can get. It rides very smooth though.[/quote]

But the Mercury was worse than a Civic and worse than even the Chevy HHR. No SUV is truly “sporty” due to the weight and higher center of gravity, but I’m talking relative to other vehicles in their type/size class. I wouldn’t have expected a 5 year older Lexus to be a lot better than a newer Mercury.

[quote=AN]
People don’t have to make excuses for their purchase. They bought a certain vehicle because that vehicle fits their criterias.[/quote]

Exactly. Ford is actually coming out with some good things, like the Fusion Hybrid. But people still rail on hybrid vehicles too, just because it doesn’t match their requirements. But I don’t tell those people to look at hybrids. I don’t care what other people do.

[fm]

[quote=AN]
The Mercury Mariner is a entry level luxury CUV, same with the RX300. Neither one of them are sporty. The RX300 is as far from sporty as you can get. It rides very smooth though.[/quote]

But the Mercury was worse than a Civic and worse than even the Chevy HHR. No SUV is truly “sporty” due to the weight and higher center of gravity, but I’m talking relative to other vehicles in their type/size class. I wouldn’t have expected a 5 year older Lexus to be a lot better than a newer Mercury.

[quote=AN]
People don’t have to make excuses for their purchase. They bought a certain vehicle because that vehicle fits their criterias.[/quote]

Exactly. Ford is actually coming out with some good things, like the Fusion Hybrid. But people still rail on hybrid vehicles too, just because it doesn’t match their requirements. But I don’t tell those people to look at hybrids. I don’t care what other people do.

[Author]

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