The cult of professional specialists

[sdrealtor]

DR B
To answer your question very few are underwater. They bought for the right reason and bought homes they will stay in long term.

I sold 24 hopmes between 2003 and 2007. Three have already sold for gains. Two sold for losses (short sales) but came out with little or no monetray losses and FICO scores intact. The 1st of those shorts would have stayed forever in the home they bought but had an incredible job opportunity so they moved. I got a short sale done for them which dropped their FICO’s from 800 to 780 (I saw the report 6 months after) and a full release from liability. The 2nd bought against my advice and was pushed into it by his young bride he has since divorced. I tried my best to talk him out of it.

Nearly all of the other 19 are all in homes they love and will stay in at least 5 to 10 years longer and many much longer. The most underwater bought in 2005 and I called and begged to them to sell in 2007. They were underwater and would have lost about $10K. They made over $200K a year and I told them to rent for 2 years and then buy back in. They would not listen and now wish they did. On the plus side they came to me committed to buying something in my area in 2005. A previous agent almost sold them a 1300 sf home for $50K more than the 2100 sf home I got them. While they are a bit trapped because they did not listen to my advice to sell and rent a couple years, they do have a enough space to live.

There is not a single client I cant look in the face and tell I did right by them.

[bearishgurl]

[quote=drboom]I think we’ll need some data to back up that assertion.

Also, do you care to answer the questions I asked in the last part of my post above? I think you owe me that much after all the questions I answered. :-)[/quote]

drboom, you really HAVEN’T clarified all my questions because you were UNCLEAR as to WHO performed your RE services for you PRIOR to when you entered into your (failed) short-sale and the legal relationship (if any) you had to those agents. You staunchly maintained you represented yourself throughout your posts on the “How to Buy w/out a Realtor” thread. You HAD to have viewed more properties and possibly made other offers that were rejected. How did you get into those properties and who made any previous offers for you? My point was that, like it or not, you were represented or “working” with an agent. You were not “self-represented.” In my lengthy experience, I have never seen such an arrangement (except with a FSBO property and often the buyer had a lawyer on retainer). You came off on that thread as having caused LESS COMMISSION TO BE PAID on your deal and this is just NOT the case. No money was saved by your sellers. You just managed to find an agent that was willing to rebate you without even a formal agreement. If you had tried to collect your commission (in small claims ct) from that agent (because he didn’t pay you in the end), you would have had to PROVE you had an oral agreement with him for a cut of his commission. Your spouse wouldn’t be able to help you because she would be a party also. I believe you would have been stuck and unable to prevail.

As far as the data you are seeking on FSBO’s, I don’t have that data, do you? I only “surmised” that it would be true because the “internationally known” economist who did the extensive survey stated that sellers typically recovered their 3% (buyers side) commission when they sold FSBO and didn’t have to to sell for a lower price than that of a listed property (in competition). Therefore, my point stands that a buyer CANNOT get any better deal if they are able to squeeze any portion of the commission out of it.

As to your question about my participation as a licensee in the recent “RE bubble,” I took my license down in approx. the third quarter of 2002 and have not rehung it since. My principal business has NEVER been RE sales. I have “hung” my license about five times for a few years each in the span of nearly three decades but never engaged in the business of RE sales as my principal source of income.

[bearishgurl]

[quote=drboom]I think we’ll need some data to back up that assertion.

Also, do you care to answer the questions I asked in the last part of my post above? I think you owe me that much after all the questions I answered. :-)[/quote]

drboom, you really HAVEN’T clarified all my questions because you were UNCLEAR as to WHO performed your RE services for you PRIOR to when you entered into your (failed) short-sale and the legal relationship (if any) you had to those agents. You staunchly maintained you represented yourself throughout your posts on the “How to Buy w/out a Realtor” thread. You HAD to have viewed more properties and possibly made other offers that were rejected. How did you get into those properties and who made any previous offers for you? My point was that, like it or not, you were represented or “working” with an agent. You were not “self-represented.” In my lengthy experience, I have never seen such an arrangement (except with a FSBO property and often the buyer had a lawyer on retainer). You came off on that thread as having caused LESS COMMISSION TO BE PAID on your deal and this is just NOT the case. No money was saved by your sellers. You just managed to find an agent that was willing to rebate you without even a formal agreement. If you had tried to collect your commission (in small claims ct) from that agent (because he didn’t pay you in the end), you would have had to PROVE you had an oral agreement with him for a cut of his commission. Your spouse wouldn’t be able to help you because she would be a party also. I believe you would have been stuck and unable to prevail.

As far as the data you are seeking on FSBO’s, I don’t have that data, do you? I only “surmised” that it would be true because the “internationally known” economist who did the extensive survey stated that sellers typically recovered their 3% (buyers side) commission when they sold FSBO and didn’t have to to sell for a lower price than that of a listed property (in competition). Therefore, my point stands that a buyer CANNOT get any better deal if they are able to squeeze any portion of the commission out of it.

As to your question about my participation as a licensee in the recent “RE bubble,” I took my license down in approx. the third quarter of 2002 and have not rehung it since. My principal business has NEVER been RE sales. I have “hung” my license about five times for a few years each in the span of nearly three decades but never engaged in the business of RE sales as my principal source of income.

[bearishgurl]

[quote=drboom]I think we’ll need some data to back up that assertion.

Also, do you care to answer the questions I asked in the last part of my post above? I think you owe me that much after all the questions I answered. :-)[/quote]

drboom, you really HAVEN’T clarified all my questions because you were UNCLEAR as to WHO performed your RE services for you PRIOR to when you entered into your (failed) short-sale and the legal relationship (if any) you had to those agents. You staunchly maintained you represented yourself throughout your posts on the “How to Buy w/out a Realtor” thread. You HAD to have viewed more properties and possibly made other offers that were rejected. How did you get into those properties and who made any previous offers for you? My point was that, like it or not, you were represented or “working” with an agent. You were not “self-represented.” In my lengthy experience, I have never seen such an arrangement (except with a FSBO property and often the buyer had a lawyer on retainer). You came off on that thread as having caused LESS COMMISSION TO BE PAID on your deal and this is just NOT the case. No money was saved by your sellers. You just managed to find an agent that was willing to rebate you without even a formal agreement. If you had tried to collect your commission (in small claims ct) from that agent (because he didn’t pay you in the end), you would have had to PROVE you had an oral agreement with him for a cut of his commission. Your spouse wouldn’t be able to help you because she would be a party also. I believe you would have been stuck and unable to prevail.

As far as the data you are seeking on FSBO’s, I don’t have that data, do you? I only “surmised” that it would be true because the “internationally known” economist who did the extensive survey stated that sellers typically recovered their 3% (buyers side) commission when they sold FSBO and didn’t have to to sell for a lower price than that of a listed property (in competition). Therefore, my point stands that a buyer CANNOT get any better deal if they are able to squeeze any portion of the commission out of it.

As to your question about my participation as a licensee in the recent “RE bubble,” I took my license down in approx. the third quarter of 2002 and have not rehung it since. My principal business has NEVER been RE sales. I have “hung” my license about five times for a few years each in the span of nearly three decades but never engaged in the business of RE sales as my principal source of income.

[bearishgurl]

[quote=drboom]I think we’ll need some data to back up that assertion.

Also, do you care to answer the questions I asked in the last part of my post above? I think you owe me that much after all the questions I answered. :-)[/quote]

drboom, you really HAVEN’T clarified all my questions because you were UNCLEAR as to WHO performed your RE services for you PRIOR to when you entered into your (failed) short-sale and the legal relationship (if any) you had to those agents. You staunchly maintained you represented yourself throughout your posts on the “How to Buy w/out a Realtor” thread. You HAD to have viewed more properties and possibly made other offers that were rejected. How did you get into those properties and who made any previous offers for you? My point was that, like it or not, you were represented or “working” with an agent. You were not “self-represented.” In my lengthy experience, I have never seen such an arrangement (except with a FSBO property and often the buyer had a lawyer on retainer). You came off on that thread as having caused LESS COMMISSION TO BE PAID on your deal and this is just NOT the case. No money was saved by your sellers. You just managed to find an agent that was willing to rebate you without even a formal agreement. If you had tried to collect your commission (in small claims ct) from that agent (because he didn’t pay you in the end), you would have had to PROVE you had an oral agreement with him for a cut of his commission. Your spouse wouldn’t be able to help you because she would be a party also. I believe you would have been stuck and unable to prevail.

As far as the data you are seeking on FSBO’s, I don’t have that data, do you? I only “surmised” that it would be true because the “internationally known” economist who did the extensive survey stated that sellers typically recovered their 3% (buyers side) commission when they sold FSBO and didn’t have to to sell for a lower price than that of a listed property (in competition). Therefore, my point stands that a buyer CANNOT get any better deal if they are able to squeeze any portion of the commission out of it.

As to your question about my participation as a licensee in the recent “RE bubble,” I took my license down in approx. the third quarter of 2002 and have not rehung it since. My principal business has NEVER been RE sales. I have “hung” my license about five times for a few years each in the span of nearly three decades but never engaged in the business of RE sales as my principal source of income.

[bearishgurl]

[quote=drboom]I think we’ll need some data to back up that assertion.

Also, do you care to answer the questions I asked in the last part of my post above? I think you owe me that much after all the questions I answered. :-)[/quote]

drboom, you really HAVEN’T clarified all my questions because you were UNCLEAR as to WHO performed your RE services for you PRIOR to when you entered into your (failed) short-sale and the legal relationship (if any) you had to those agents. You staunchly maintained you represented yourself throughout your posts on the “How to Buy w/out a Realtor” thread. You HAD to have viewed more properties and possibly made other offers that were rejected. How did you get into those properties and who made any previous offers for you? My point was that, like it or not, you were represented or “working” with an agent. You were not “self-represented.” In my lengthy experience, I have never seen such an arrangement (except with a FSBO property and often the buyer had a lawyer on retainer). You came off on that thread as having caused LESS COMMISSION TO BE PAID on your deal and this is just NOT the case. No money was saved by your sellers. You just managed to find an agent that was willing to rebate you without even a formal agreement. If you had tried to collect your commission (in small claims ct) from that agent (because he didn’t pay you in the end), you would have had to PROVE you had an oral agreement with him for a cut of his commission. Your spouse wouldn’t be able to help you because she would be a party also. I believe you would have been stuck and unable to prevail.

As far as the data you are seeking on FSBO’s, I don’t have that data, do you? I only “surmised” that it would be true because the “internationally known” economist who did the extensive survey stated that sellers typically recovered their 3% (buyers side) commission when they sold FSBO and didn’t have to to sell for a lower price than that of a listed property (in competition). Therefore, my point stands that a buyer CANNOT get any better deal if they are able to squeeze any portion of the commission out of it.

As to your question about my participation as a licensee in the recent “RE bubble,” I took my license down in approx. the third quarter of 2002 and have not rehung it since. My principal business has NEVER been RE sales. I have “hung” my license about five times for a few years each in the span of nearly three decades but never engaged in the business of RE sales as my principal source of income.

[sdrealtor]

DR B
I have special insights to many things RE related but you are twisting things as we were talking about comps. What I have that you dont is access to databases that I pay for. If you were to spend a few thousand a year you could have the same information.

I also just went back and I confused you with Steveno who I said may very well have done well on his transactions. However, I never said you didnt do well or did poorly. I said we dont know and I stand by that. I offered you the chance to have me take an unbiased look at it and you politely refused which I’m OK with. We still dont know and thats fine by me.

Also please dont confuse me with BG who is an entirely different viewpoint. She is not an active REa gent and is in the legal profession so she is overly sensitive to the intracies of the contract law. While I cant argue with her interpreations of the legalities the reality of what actually happens in the open market tendss to be quite different.

[sdrealtor]

DR B
I have special insights to many things RE related but you are twisting things as we were talking about comps. What I have that you dont is access to databases that I pay for. If you were to spend a few thousand a year you could have the same information.

I also just went back and I confused you with Steveno who I said may very well have done well on his transactions. However, I never said you didnt do well or did poorly. I said we dont know and I stand by that. I offered you the chance to have me take an unbiased look at it and you politely refused which I’m OK with. We still dont know and thats fine by me.

Also please dont confuse me with BG who is an entirely different viewpoint. She is not an active REa gent and is in the legal profession so she is overly sensitive to the intracies of the contract law. While I cant argue with her interpreations of the legalities the reality of what actually happens in the open market tendss to be quite different.

[sdrealtor]

DR B
I have special insights to many things RE related but you are twisting things as we were talking about comps. What I have that you dont is access to databases that I pay for. If you were to spend a few thousand a year you could have the same information.

I also just went back and I confused you with Steveno who I said may very well have done well on his transactions. However, I never said you didnt do well or did poorly. I said we dont know and I stand by that. I offered you the chance to have me take an unbiased look at it and you politely refused which I’m OK with. We still dont know and thats fine by me.

Also please dont confuse me with BG who is an entirely different viewpoint. She is not an active REa gent and is in the legal profession so she is overly sensitive to the intracies of the contract law. While I cant argue with her interpreations of the legalities the reality of what actually happens in the open market tendss to be quite different.

[sdrealtor]

DR B
I have special insights to many things RE related but you are twisting things as we were talking about comps. What I have that you dont is access to databases that I pay for. If you were to spend a few thousand a year you could have the same information.

I also just went back and I confused you with Steveno who I said may very well have done well on his transactions. However, I never said you didnt do well or did poorly. I said we dont know and I stand by that. I offered you the chance to have me take an unbiased look at it and you politely refused which I’m OK with. We still dont know and thats fine by me.

Also please dont confuse me with BG who is an entirely different viewpoint. She is not an active REa gent and is in the legal profession so she is overly sensitive to the intracies of the contract law. While I cant argue with her interpreations of the legalities the reality of what actually happens in the open market tendss to be quite different.

[sdrealtor]

DR B
I have special insights to many things RE related but you are twisting things as we were talking about comps. What I have that you dont is access to databases that I pay for. If you were to spend a few thousand a year you could have the same information.

I also just went back and I confused you with Steveno who I said may very well have done well on his transactions. However, I never said you didnt do well or did poorly. I said we dont know and I stand by that. I offered you the chance to have me take an unbiased look at it and you politely refused which I’m OK with. We still dont know and thats fine by me.

Also please dont confuse me with BG who is an entirely different viewpoint. She is not an active REa gent and is in the legal profession so she is overly sensitive to the intracies of the contract law. While I cant argue with her interpreations of the legalities the reality of what actually happens in the open market tendss to be quite different.

[njtosd]

sdrealtor –

I will remember in the future to instruct any real estate agent that I contract with to bring all potential buyers to my attention (and as you know the fiduciary duty of an agent includes a duty of obedience). I would like to be sure that all potential buyers are treated in a welcoming manner. Furthermore, I would appreciate it if you did not include your real estate fantasies in your posts. I’m sure there are lots of other places to let those feelings out. As an alternative, you could choose among hundreds of other less distasteful ways to express your feelings here.

bearishgurl –

Although I’m not in favor of anecdotes, here goes: We are currently selling our home on the east coast and received an offer after our listing agreement had expired and before we relisted (we had gotten kind of discouraged and had decided to put off relisting until the kids were back in school). We were much more willing to come down in price (and did come down more than we had originally planned to) since we didn’t have an agent’s fee to pay. The final steps of the negotiation here take place in the “attorney review” process, so our attorney is taking care of some of the jobs that would be done by an agent/broker in CA. So in this case, the buyer is getting a better deal than he would have otherwise because there is no listing agent involved.

[njtosd]

sdrealtor –

I will remember in the future to instruct any real estate agent that I contract with to bring all potential buyers to my attention (and as you know the fiduciary duty of an agent includes a duty of obedience). I would like to be sure that all potential buyers are treated in a welcoming manner. Furthermore, I would appreciate it if you did not include your real estate fantasies in your posts. I’m sure there are lots of other places to let those feelings out. As an alternative, you could choose among hundreds of other less distasteful ways to express your feelings here.

bearishgurl –

Although I’m not in favor of anecdotes, here goes: We are currently selling our home on the east coast and received an offer after our listing agreement had expired and before we relisted (we had gotten kind of discouraged and had decided to put off relisting until the kids were back in school). We were much more willing to come down in price (and did come down more than we had originally planned to) since we didn’t have an agent’s fee to pay. The final steps of the negotiation here take place in the “attorney review” process, so our attorney is taking care of some of the jobs that would be done by an agent/broker in CA. So in this case, the buyer is getting a better deal than he would have otherwise because there is no listing agent involved.

[njtosd]

sdrealtor –

I will remember in the future to instruct any real estate agent that I contract with to bring all potential buyers to my attention (and as you know the fiduciary duty of an agent includes a duty of obedience). I would like to be sure that all potential buyers are treated in a welcoming manner. Furthermore, I would appreciate it if you did not include your real estate fantasies in your posts. I’m sure there are lots of other places to let those feelings out. As an alternative, you could choose among hundreds of other less distasteful ways to express your feelings here.

bearishgurl –

Although I’m not in favor of anecdotes, here goes: We are currently selling our home on the east coast and received an offer after our listing agreement had expired and before we relisted (we had gotten kind of discouraged and had decided to put off relisting until the kids were back in school). We were much more willing to come down in price (and did come down more than we had originally planned to) since we didn’t have an agent’s fee to pay. The final steps of the negotiation here take place in the “attorney review” process, so our attorney is taking care of some of the jobs that would be done by an agent/broker in CA. So in this case, the buyer is getting a better deal than he would have otherwise because there is no listing agent involved.

[njtosd]

sdrealtor –

I will remember in the future to instruct any real estate agent that I contract with to bring all potential buyers to my attention (and as you know the fiduciary duty of an agent includes a duty of obedience). I would like to be sure that all potential buyers are treated in a welcoming manner. Furthermore, I would appreciate it if you did not include your real estate fantasies in your posts. I’m sure there are lots of other places to let those feelings out. As an alternative, you could choose among hundreds of other less distasteful ways to express your feelings here.

bearishgurl –

Although I’m not in favor of anecdotes, here goes: We are currently selling our home on the east coast and received an offer after our listing agreement had expired and before we relisted (we had gotten kind of discouraged and had decided to put off relisting until the kids were back in school). We were much more willing to come down in price (and did come down more than we had originally planned to) since we didn’t have an agent’s fee to pay. The final steps of the negotiation here take place in the “attorney review” process, so our attorney is taking care of some of the jobs that would be done by an agent/broker in CA. So in this case, the buyer is getting a better deal than he would have otherwise because there is no listing agent involved.

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