Megadrought Threatens California Power Blackouts This Summer

[phaster]

Wonder what drought and blackouts is going to do to real estate prices and the economy???

Megadrought Threatens California Power Blackouts This Summer

http://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2022-04-28/megadrought-on-the-u-s-west-coast-threatens-blackouts

A troubling sign for the south western USA is,…

Vegas water intake now visible at drought-stricken Lake Mead

http://apnews.com/article/climate-business-las-vegas-lakes-colorado-river-1c5396dc9c43bdb5d14835f4c8dcdb44

FYI looking at the science literature the South Western USA can have dry periods that lasts thousands of years

[XBoxBoy]

Anyone know why San Diego isn’t being hit with the watering restrictions that are happening in LA? Does San Diego get its water from somewhere else? Did San Diego make a better deal regarding how much water they would get?

[Coronita]

[quote=XBoxBoy]Anyone know why San Diego isn’t being hit with the watering restrictions that are happening in LA? Does San Diego get its water from somewhere else? Did San Diego make a better deal regarding how much water they would get?[/quote]

I’m surprised that Phaster hasn’t posted the specifics about San Diego….

From 2021: It’s an interesting read.

[quote]

“Despite a Punishing Drought, San Diego Has Water. It Wasn’t Easy. Sustainability measures that the city and county have taken over decades are paying off. But residents still might have to do more.”

….
For much of the past century, San Diego was almost entirely dependent on water that came from elsewhere in the state, or from the Colorado River. Their supplies were effectively controlled by water officials in Los Angeles — a contentious relationship that seeded long-running legal battles.

In 1991, during a punishing drought, San Diego reached a turning point. The Metropolitan Water District, the Los Angeles-based wholesaler that controlled nearly all of San Diego’s water, slashed the county’s supply by 30 percent for a little more than a year. Grass turned brown. Residents put bricks in their toilet tanks to make them flush less water.

And, crucially, the region’s burgeoning biotechnology industry was hammered by water shut-offs that came with little warning.

….In 1996, the San Diego County Water Authority struck a landmark agreement to buy water from farmers in the Imperial Valley, in California’s southeastern corner, that heralded the beginning of the region’s water divorce from Los Angeles.

Over the following two decades, the agency took on a series of significant — and expensive — infrastructure projects aimed at establishing more diverse sources of water, more places to keep it and more ways to move it around the county.

In 2010, the authority lined canals in the Imperial Valley with concrete to prevent water from seeping into the earth, and made a deal to take the water saved by the process — some 26 billion gallons a year. The authority finished raising the San Vicente Dam in 2014, adding more capacity to San Vicente Reservoir in the biggest water storage increase in the county’s history.

Then there was the long, fraught gestation of a seawater desalination plant, the largest in the United States and now the envy of desperate communities up the coast, in spite of environmental concerns. Since 2015, millions of gallons of seawater have flowed into the $1 billion facility in Carlsbad each day, where it is filtered into something that tastes like it came from an Evian bottle, not the Pacific Ocean.

Across the county, restrictions and conservation pushes have led per capita water use to fall by half over the past three decades.

The next major task? Expand the region’s so-called pure water programs, once given the derisive moniker “toilet to tap,” because they purify gray water to make it drinkable. Today, such programs are seen as some of the most promising paths forward, not just in San Diego but across the state. (The system in neighboring Orange County is often cited as a gold standard.)

San Diego has provided a road map for others now scrambling for water, said Toni Atkins, who is the president pro tem of the California Senate and previously served on the San Diego City Council. And she is proud of that.
[/quote]

Also….

San Diego Is Relatively Drought-Proof – and Has Prices to Prove it

Water Authority Confident in Local Water Supply, But Still Urges Conservation Amid Drought

Also. This was interesting…
https://www.sandiego.gov/public-utilities/sustainability/water-supply

And this…

https://www.sandiego.gov/sites/default/files/city_of_san_diego_2020_uwmp_final_6_29_2021_send.pdf

And this…
https://www.carlsbaddesal.com/faqs.html

And this

[an]

Considering the desalination plant in Carlsbad cost us $1b and can give us 8% of our water usage, we just need to build 12 more and we’re set. Considering global warming and sea level rise, that supply of water is only increasing. Maybe we can just do what OC did w/ their freeway and build 20 desalination plants, go bankrupt, and we’ll be set w/ water for a very long time.

[phaster]

[quote=Coronita][quote=XBoxBoy]Anyone know why San Diego isn’t being hit with the watering restrictions that are happening in LA? Does San Diego get its water from somewhere else? Did San Diego make a better deal regarding how much water they would get?[/quote]

I’m surprised that Phaster hasn’t posted the specifics about San Diego….

[/quote]

well seem’s I didn’t need too given ya posted lots of specifics about SD

anyway FWIW decades ago (just before 9/11) found myself exploring the aral sea (or what was left of it)

closest analog pigg’s would relate to is the Salton Sea region,… which most would say is harsh,… BUT having explored both areas have to say the Salton Sea region is akin to a walk in the park compared to,…

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Aral_Sea

sadly the same mindset (i.e. a lack of ‘situational awareness’) that caused the aral sea environmental destruction issue,… is happening here in the USA

WRT watering restrictions in LA vs SD,… if people were smart they would start conserving and look at water as a very precious resource which is a need for people to live (AND have a working economy)

said another way w/ out water an economy is not possible AND w/ out water a person is dead

[quote]

May 6 (Reuters) – California energy officials on Friday issued a sober forecast for the state’s electrical grid, saying it lacks sufficient capacity to keep the lights on this summer and beyond if heatwaves, wildfires or other extreme events take their toll.

…In an online briefing with reporters, the officials forecast a potential shortfall of 1,700 megawatts this year, a number that could go as high as 5,000 MW if the grid is taxed by multiple challenges that reduce available power while sending demand soaring, state officials said during an online briefing with reporters

http://www.reuters.com/world/us/california-says-it-needs-more-power-keep-lights-2022-05-06/
[/quote]

[an]

[quote=phaster]
WRT watering restrictions in LA vs SD,… if people were smart they would start conserving and look at water as a very precious resource which is a need for people to live (AND have a working economy)

said another way w/ out water an economy is not possible AND w/ out water a person is dead[/quote]
If people were smart, they would demand the cancellation of the $105B bullet train project and spend that $105B to build 105 desalination plants. We would stop talking about water right now and people would not die from lack of water. Afterall, we have virtually limitless water right next to us. If you want to go crazy, build 1000 desalination plants or build ways to collect water from the east and create water pipelines (like oil pipelines) to bring water to the West. It’s not a hard problem to solve, just require $.

[gzz]

Most of the train money is coming from the federal government.

It still should be cancelled.

From 2009-3/2020 I flew to the bay area about 10 times per year.

Only 1 time since then.

About 90% of court hearings now are video or telephone conference. Bluejeans, zoom. MS Teams, I do them all. State, federal, appellate. All remote.

Intra-city transit is also cheaper, used more, and has larger environmental benefits. Those above ground muni trams in SF were awful, usually packed to the brim with people and barely moving faster than a brisk walk.

[svelte]

[quote=gzz]
Those above ground muni trams in SF were awful, usually packed to the brim with people and barely moving faster than a brisk walk.[/quote]

We rode those once. It was relatively empty when we boarded but as we went through Chinatown that thing was wall to wall people. It would have been impossible to fit a sheet of paper between me and those surrounding me. I couldn’t even see where my wife was on that little tram.

That’s the only time I can honestly say I’ve felt claustrophobia. I can recall the thought going through my head that if I lived in SF there is no way in hell I would ride the tram. I’d rather walk.

[phaster]

[quote=an][quote=phaster]
WRT watering restrictions in LA vs SD,… if people were smart they would start conserving and look at water as a very precious resource which is a need for people to live (AND have a working economy)

said another way w/ out water an economy is not possible AND w/ out water a person is dead[/quote]

If people were smart, they would demand the cancellation of the $105B bullet train project and spend that $105B to build 105 desalination plants. We would stop talking about water right now and people would not die from lack of water. Afterall, we have virtually limitless water right next to us. If you want to go crazy, build 1000 desalination plants or build ways to collect water from the east and create water pipelines (like oil pipelines) to bring water to the West. It’s not a hard problem to solve, just require $.[/quote]

…about that ‘virtually limitless water right next to us’

spending $105B to build 105 desalination plants is simplistic thinking,… point being desalination plants and moving water requires lots of energy (so it might be a good idea to think about electrical generators)

things can get more complicated with other unaddressed ticking time bomb issues (for example),… ever wonder about the millions of pounds of spent fuel left on the beach at san onofre (basically spent fuel is left on the beach simply because democratic politicians ignored the science)

FYI in the meantime SoCal water departments are considering using physical water restrictors in affluent areas to prevent using water for outdoor landscaping

[an]

[quote=phaster]
spending $105B to build 105 desalination plants is simplistic thinking,… point being desalination plants and moving water requires lots of energy (so it might be a good idea to think about electrical generators)[/quote]
Of course, it’s simplistic thinking. But it can be done if we want to… but obviously, we don’t want to. We whine about it. As for energy, we have the desert east of us where we can spend another $100b to build solar farms, we can spend $100b to add a few more nuclear power plants, etc. We have the technology to solve the problems. Whether we really want to solve them is the real question. The Huntington beach desalination plant proposal was rejected. So, I don’t see it happening.

[barnaby33]

It’s not a hard problem to solve, just require $.

It is exactly a hard problem to solve because it is expensive to do so. Water is the foundation of our society, cheap water that is. It must be transported in bulk and is heavy. We consume more of it than our ecology can produce (at least the non-salt version.) Most importantly, people are not smart. Nobody cares as long as the taps still function.
Josh

[phaster]

[quote=barnaby33]

It’s not a hard problem to solve, just require $.

It is exactly a hard problem to solve because it is expensive to do so. Water is the foundation of our society, cheap water that is. It must be transported in bulk and is heavy. We consume more of it than our ecology can produce (at least the non-salt version.) Most importantly, people are not smart. Nobody cares as long as the taps still function.
Josh[/quote]

yup 100% agree,… people are not smart. Nobody cares as long as the taps still function.

…infrastructure while necessary for survival, isn’t sexy or thought about by the masses till it no longer works

[an]

[quote=barnaby33]

It’s not a hard problem to solve, just require $.

It is exactly a hard problem to solve because it is expensive to do so. Water is the foundation of our society, cheap water that is. It must be transported in bulk and is heavy. We consume more of it than our ecology can produce (at least the non-salt version.) Most importantly, people are not smart. Nobody cares as long as the taps still function.
Josh[/quote]
CA have $100b surplus in just 1 year. Spend that $ to build infrastructure to increase our supplies on stuff that keep society running instead of trying to limit demand.

Storage, recycling, and desalination would be some of the solutions. I’m sure there are more. But given the rejection of desalination in Huntington Beach, I’m not encouraged that we’ll solve the supply problem.

[barnaby33]

CA have $100b surplus in just 1 year. Spend that $ to build infrastructure to increase our supplies on stuff that keep society running instead of trying to limit demand.

Woe to him who treats water as a market commodity. He shall reap what he sows. It takes decades to build the kind of infra you’re talking about. It won’t solve the problem. Humans are maximizers. All you are doing by playing the lets-expand-supply-game is heightening the fall. Water is the most fundamental human need. It almost doesn’t exist in Southern California. Market forces will not in any real sense lead us to a better place, or even a place where our society can survive. Think tragedy of the commons.

We will drill, drill, drill until the water runs out; or is too expensive to extract. That will presage a collapse. One where food will get much more expensive and millions around the world will starve. Lets just stop growing almonds and other stupid for profit, for export shit we don’t need and save the water for things we do.

Getting used to doing with less is the only way forward till fusion becomes a reality. Then all bets are off.
Josh

[an]

[quote=barnaby33]Woe to him who treats water as a market commodity. He shall reap what he sows. It takes decades to build the kind of infra you’re talking about. It won’t solve the problem. Humans are maximizers. All you are doing by playing the lets-expand-supply-game is heightening the fall. Water is the most fundamental human need. It almost doesn’t exist in Southern California. Market forces will not in any real sense lead us to a better place, or even a place where our society can survive. Think tragedy of the commons.

We will drill, drill, drill until the water runs out; or is too expensive to extract. That will presage a collapse. One where food will get much more expensive and millions around the world will starve. Lets just stop growing almonds and other stupid for profit, for export shit we don’t need and save the water for things we do.

Getting used to doing with less is the only way forward till fusion becomes a reality. Then all bets are off.
Josh[/quote]
We’ll just have to agree to disagree. With global warming and sea level rise, we not only have virtually limitless supply of water, but it’s also growing. With the technology we have today, we could solve this problem if we want to. Not everyone wants to, which is fine. But to say we’ll run out of water while staring out into the ocean boggles my mind. This is not 1800s. We have all the technology and tools we need to solve this problem. Not to mention inflation and passage of time, why not borrow $ today with a bond to build these infrastructures. Since future generations will use these infrastructures too, they should pay for it too.

We don’t need to do w/ less, and I don’t want to do with less, especially when we/I don’t have to.

[an]

We can build a few thousands of these too, to power the desalination plants https://electrek.co/2022/05/18/electrify-america-announces-new-solar-energy-farm-that-can-generate-up-to-75-mw-per-hour/

[barnaby33]

We’ll just have to agree to disagree.

Okie dokie.

We don’t need to do w/ less, and I don’t want to do with less, especially when we/I don’t have to.

Now you just sound like one of the scared old people in my HOA who don’t want change! We do need to do with less. The whole premise of this thread is that available sources of water are not running out in some distant unknowable future, they’re running out now. The investment and infrastructure necessary to rectify that for the present population is decades away, even if funded now.

[an]

[quote=barnaby33]

We’ll just have to agree to disagree.

Okie dokie.

We don’t need to do w/ less, and I don’t want to do with less, especially when we/I don’t have to.

Now you just sound like one of the scared old people in my HOA who don’t want change! We do need to do with less. The whole premise of this thread is that available sources of water are not running out in some distant unknowable future, they’re running out now. The investment and infrastructure necessary to rectify that for the present population is decades away, even if funded now.[/quote]
I love change, so I don’t know what you’re talking about. I have live through with much less, so I actually experience first hand what you’re asking for and I don’t want to go back there.

What I’m saying is drastic change from what we’re doing today. What you’re saying is no change. We’re doing exactly what you’re saying.

Also, it’s not realistic. We’re living longer, with advancement in medicine, that number will keep on increasing. We are also reproducing. So, even if we keep our living standard the same, our demand for those resources will increase due to population increase. It’s also not fair to expect our average living standard to be the same. I want poor people who someday enjoy the living standard that I do, so, naturally, that will increase the average living standard, which will increase the demand for resources.

So, I don’t see how we can lower demand in any meaningful way.

BTW, I reject the premise of this thread. The premise of this thread doesn’t make sense as I look at the Pacific Ocean and the desalination plant in Carlsbad and the solar and wind farms popping up everywhere. Not to mention nuclear. So, no, we’re not running out of water, not now, not ever.

[barnaby33]

BTW, I reject the premise of this thread. The premise of this thread doesn’t make sense as I look at the Pacific Ocean and the desalination plant in Carlsbad and the solar and wind farms popping up everywhere. Not to mention nuclear. So, no, we’re not running out of water, not now, not ever.

You are totally engaging in Sophistry and a weird form of mis/re-direction. If you’d started your first post with “I totally reject the premise,” then worked into details, basically descended the paradigm, I’d buy what you’re saying. I wouldn’t agree with it, but I’d buy it.

Infrastructure, whether it’s for water, oil, moving cars, what-have-you, takes time to build; even if funded now. What we have is western water law which is 150 years old and is basically setup to induce maximum consumption. It doesn’t take a genius to say that’s not a great idea long term in a desert. It’s just that where we appear to be today is in the grip of long term shortage state/region wide. Leaving the emotional histrionics out of it, there just isn’t enough to go around at a price people are willing to pay. Otherwise those magical desalination plants would already exist. Pumping water is insanely expensive, so is desalination. Maybe with fusion the cost will drop enough that you can have your acre green lawn and 20 minute showers along with fresh fruit and veg from half a state away. I am terrible at predicting the future. I have however studied water somewhat, having grown up on a failed apple farm in Valley Center.

What you want and what the universe can reasonably provide are often very different. Did you know AN that the majority of water consumed in the central valley for irrigation is pumped up from the ground? That’s not water income, that’s water inheritance and it is running out FAST! How hurt will your feelings be when the regional water authority tells you you only get to water your lawn 2 times a week or even a month? Will your wants be satisfied be imposed restrictions because it just isn’t there and we collectively didn’t take steps to stop what we reasonably see coming? How does that make you feel? Do you need a hug? I give great hugs!

Josh

[sdrealtor]

After last Saturday night I reject the premise that you give great hugs

[an]

[quote=barnaby33]
Infrastructure, whether it’s for water, oil, moving cars, what-have-you, takes time to build; even if funded now.[/quote]
If we don’t start, we will never finish.

[quote=barnaby33]there just isn’t enough to go around at a price people are willing to pay.[/quote]
What you’re willing to pay and what I’m willing to pay could and probably is totally different.

[quote=barnaby33] Otherwise those magical desalination plants would already exist.[/quote]
Wrong, those plants doesn’t exist because environmentalist prevent them from being built. Just look at the Huntington Beach proposal as a prime example of what’s happening now.

[quote=barnaby33]Pumping water is insanely expensive, so is desalination. Maybe with fusion the cost will drop enough that you can have your acre green lawn and 20 minute showers along with fresh fruit and veg from half a state away. I am terrible at predicting the future. I have however studied water somewhat, having grown up on a failed apple farm in Valley Center. [/quote]Again, your definition of expensive is different than mine.

[quote=barnaby33]Did you know AN that the majority of water consumed in the central valley for irrigation is pumped up from the ground?[/quote]
Yes, I do know that. If you say, lets ban farmers from pumping water from the ground, then I can understand where you want to go w/ the solution. I don’t agree with it, but I would understand.

[quote=barnaby33]That’s not water income, that’s water inheritance and it is running out FAST! How hurt will your feelings be when the regional water authority tells you you only get to water your lawn 2 times a week or even a month?[/quote]Nothing new, LA is already doing it and SD did it before. I won’t be hurt. I don’t agree with it, but there are many things I don’t agree with, but that’s life. I fully expect CA government will do it in the future. We have no appetite to increase supply, so I fully expect rationing in the future. It’s not a matter of “if”, but it’s a matter of “when”. When that happened, I’ll convert to artificial turf. Not going to lose sleep over it. Life moves on. No sweat off my back. I’m adaptable. I don’t stress about things that I can’t control.

[quote=barnaby33]Will your wants be satisfied be imposed restrictions because it just isn’t there and we collectively didn’t take steps to stop what we reasonably see coming?[/quote]
If we don’t take steps to increase supply, then we reap what we sow.

[phaster]

[quote=an]we reap what we sow.[/quote]

yup,… we reap what we sow

people should realize, humanity currently is experiencing the knock on effects of living way beyond the Earth’s natural systems supply ability

said another way, people should not be too surprised at all the problems humanity is causing itself

let’s ponder the “self inflected” drought wound in the south western USA by specifically looking at (for example) what is happening in the imperial valley from a birds eye view

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Imperial_Valley,_California

it should not take a genius to recognize that verdant green fields is unnatural,… AND the only reason there are wide swaths of unnatural green all over the south western USA region is because humans withdrew ground water from aquifers (which took eons to form)

basically using ground water from aquifers is akin to an irresponsible person having access to credit cards to live it up over the short run AND not having any means whatsoever of making enough money to pay back the “principal borrowed” along the “interest payment” charged by the bank

bottom line, the party is ending AND people have to wake up to the fact that ‘infinite economic growth on a finite planet is impossible’ because of depletion of natural resources

since most don’t have a multidisciplinary scientific understanding (or have the inclination to actually read the scientific texts to understand the graph),… here is the issue in a nutshell

[quote=an][quote=barnaby33]Pumping water is insanely expensive, so is desalination. Maybe with fusion the cost will drop enough that you can have your acre green lawn and 20 minute showers along with fresh fruit and veg from half a state away. I am terrible at predicting the future. I have however studied water somewhat, having grown up on a failed apple farm in Valley Center. [/quote]Again, your definition of expensive is different than mine.
[/quote]

sigh,… fusion

seems people have no clue about nuclear power plant technology (or knock on effects costs),… when I was in school fusion was 30 years away,… well 30 years has passed (and fusion is still 30 years away)

BTW ever wonder about the millions of pounds of spent fuel left on the beach at San Onofre (basically spent fuel is left on the beach simply because democratic politicians ignored the science)

long story short,… back in the 1980’s yucca mountain was designated to be the nations official designated site to contain spent fuel BUT what ended up happening is Democratic Party politics killed off funding for the project AND the unintended consequences of de-funding yucca mountain is there was no repository where to specifically store spent nuclear fuel assemblies,… so the spent fuel assemblies from the decommissioned San Onofre reactors were essentially abandoned right by the shoreline

anyway here is an interesting fact,… the spent fuel left on the beach at San Onofre can be an asset (if one thinks like a nuclear physicist),… this is because high level spent fuel can be used as nuclear kindling in a reactor designed to burn thorium

http://interestingengineering.com/video/thorium-reactors

India FYI has lots of thorium but very little uranium,… so for 70 years india had to first construct uranium reactors in order to build up a stockpile of ‘nuclear kindling’

just sayin for a brighter future w/ jobs and stable energy in the USA, the best long term investment (in the nuclear power plant space) Americans should seriously throw resources at,… is molten salt thorium reactors

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Molten_salt_reactor

fusion (as I read the tea leaves) is just too far a technical leap

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fusion_power

sadly stable nuclear power is viewed by scientifically illiterate ‘woke’ liberals (AND their political leadership) as something to be feared,… so FWIW here is a BBC podcast about nuclear power AND includes a segment about an environmental activist who started off protesting nuclear power, but eventually was awakened to the fact that nuclear power is a carbon free “base line” source of electrical energy

http://www.bbc.co.uk/sounds/play/w3ct3khw

[barnaby33]

AN I suppose we can’t talk about water without talking about energy, but you’ve done a couple of 180s so I’m not even sure what we’re debating about. Fusion is code word for clean cheap energy, regardless of how many years out it is. Nuclear is neither clean nor cheap. I’d be all for Nuclear if the communities that consumed it were then responsible for it’s waste management in their own community. Yucca Mtn is geologically stable as far as we know, but it’s also I believe exporting the waste to poor brown people, also known as Indians. I’m totally not in favor of doing that anymore.

So back to the water. You advocate finding more sources, I advocate learning to live within our means, because as I see it technology cannot save us from this. It’s just techno narcist fantasy to believe we can grow forever and that is assuming we could even agree on what is growth. The drought is and has been here for a while, more funding won’t solve the problem, more sources for water will only temporarily alleviate it, whereas learning to live with what we can locally/regionally get actually is a solution.

Josh

[an]

From my very first reply

[quote=an]Considering the desalination plant in Carlsbad cost us $1b and can give us 8% of our water usage, we just need to build 12 more and we’re set. Considering global warming and sea level rise, that supply of water is only increasing. Maybe we can just do what OC did w/ their freeway and build 20 desalination plants, go bankrupt, and we’ll be set w/ water for a very long time.[/quote]

I was quite clear, I see no problem here that we can’t solve with current technology. You obviously disagree and that’s fine. We’ll just agree to disagree.

[phaster]

[quote=an]
BTW, I reject the premise of this thread. The premise of this thread doesn’t make sense as I look at the Pacific Ocean and the desalination plant in Carlsbad and the solar and wind farms popping up everywhere. Not to mention nuclear. So, no, we’re not running out of water, not now, not ever.[/quote]

sigh,… infrastructure to provide potable water can’t be ordered up like something from amazon and delivered the next day

the simple truth is infrastructure for potable water takes a very long time to build AND is subject to the whims of no talent ass clown politicians like Todd Gloria and the rest of the ‘woke’ city council (who seem more interested in social justice issues to appease their political base than building infrastructure),… for example

…yet again seems local politicians have their heads stuck up their ass (given the newspaper headline)

[quote]
East County’s $950M water recycling project could be in jeopardy as San Diego nixes pipeline deal

East County officials fear a $950 million sewage recycling project could get flushed down the drain because of a pipeline deal gone awry.

Leaders spearheading the endeavor blame San Diego Mayor Todd Gloria — who signed off on building an eight-mile “brine line” as recently as last year but has since reneged on that commitment.

The pipeline would prevent concentrated waste generated by the East County project’s reverse osmosis filtration system from entering into the city’s own $5 billion Pure Water sewage recycling project now under construction. Instead the byproduct would be routed into the city’s larger wastewater system.

San Diego still wants the pipeline to be built, but now it’s calling on the East County Advanced Water Purification Program to foot the roughly $35 million bill.

https://www.sandiegouniontribune.com/news/environment/story/2022-05-17/east-county-water-recycling-jeopardy

[/quote]

for those interested about 1990,… when I was an undergrad @UCSD took a PoliSci seminar class where researchers from SIO and UCSD would give presentations on various topics they were working on

anyway one of the presentations was about water issues specifically about the waste treatment plant at Point Loma and the scientific/economic idiocy of secondary water treatment for water that was going to be dumped into the ocean

basically Revelle (the guy instrumental in founding UCSD) and some other researchers three decades ago mentioned if politicians were smart they would instead somehow build an upgraded water treatment plant AND pipe line to the San Vicente reservoir (so the water could be re-used and increase the supply)

http://www.sandiego.gov/reservoirs-lakes/san-vicente-reservoir

meanwhile (back to the present),… political leadership at the state level like local elected officials seem to also have their head where the sun does not shine (because),…

[quote]
Big Water Abusers Ignored as California Drought Persists

In response to the drought, Governor Newsom has largely ignored these large corporate water sources. Instead, he has taken small measures aimed at the most wasteful of urban water uses, asked for voluntary conservation

Big Water Abusers Ignored As California Drought Persists

[/quote]

FYI military troops (especially pilots) are trained to have ‘situational awareness’ because it is the difference between life or death

given what I know,… the end result of all this short-sighted obliviousness toward the drought in the region is an increased probability of a famine (of biblical proportions) or perhaps something worst (i.e. the extinction of homo-sapients)

[quote]
The school’s Scripps Institution of Oceanography published a paper that said there is a 5 percent chance of catastrophic change within roughly three decades, and a smaller chance that it would broadly wipe out human life.

http://www.sandiegouniontribune.com/news/science/sd-me-scripps-climatechange-20170914-story.html
[/quote]

(as a reminder) the water levels that millions of people depend on are alarmingly dropping

http://mead.uslakes.info/Level/

(for Colorado River ‘situational awareness’ context)

PS FWIW found the following ‘woke’ online petition sorta a hopeful sign,…

[quote]
California is running out of water fast. While corporate interests guzzle up our precious, finite water resources, more than 1 million Californians lack access to safe drinking water.

Our elected leaders have failed to hold corporate interests accountable for their egregious water abuses. We need Governor Newsom to step up to the challenge and use his broad executive authority to rebalance California’s water allocation.

Add your name to tell Governor Newsom to put people over corporate profits and protect the human right to water NOW.

https://secure.foodandwaterwatch.org/act/defend-california-human-right-water?ms=fwws_np_05172022_big-water-abusers&oms=fwws_np_05172022_big-water-abusers
[/quote]

[svelte]

[quote=an]
We’ll just have to agree to disagree. With global warming and sea level rise, we not only have virtually limitless supply of water, but it’s also growing. With the technology we have today, we could solve this problem if we want to. Not everyone wants to, which is fine. But to say we’ll run out of water while staring out into the ocean boggles my mind. This is not 1800s. We have all the technology and tools we need to solve this problem…

We don’t need to do w/ less, and I don’t want to do with less, especially when we/I don’t have to.[/quote]

This is probably true.

And I think nuclear energy will be part of our future for a lot longer than people want to believe. Not the massive facilities we all think of, but small reactors that will be located around the world. This is part of what will power desal plants and I’m pretty sure desal will be a bigger and bigger part of our future. It will also power the plethora of EVs we are about to produce.

I know environmentalists think solar and wind will give us what we need, but somehow I doubt that.

We don’t live in a perfect world and the solutions we find won’t be perfect either.

[an]

[quote=svelte][quote=an]
We’ll just have to agree to disagree. With global warming and sea level rise, we not only have virtually limitless supply of water, but it’s also growing. With the technology we have today, we could solve this problem if we want to. Not everyone wants to, which is fine. But to say we’ll run out of water while staring out into the ocean boggles my mind. This is not 1800s. We have all the technology and tools we need to solve this problem…

We don’t need to do w/ less, and I don’t want to do with less, especially when we/I don’t have to.[/quote]

This is probably true.

And I think nuclear energy will be part of our future for a lot longer than people want to believe. Not the massive facilities we all think of, but small reactors that will be located around the world. This is part of what will power desal plants and I’m pretty sure desal will be a bigger and bigger part of our future. It will also power the plethora of EVs we are about to produce.

I know environmentalists think solar and wind will give us what we need, but somehow I doubt that.

We don’t live in a perfect world and the solutions we find won’t be perfect either.[/quote]
100% agree, nuclear is the power source that can give us what we need to go full desalination and EV. We can and should add solar and wind to the mix too.

[phaster]

sigh,… given California has almost a 100 billion dollar budget surplus

http://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2022-05-13/california-governor-sees-record-97-5-billion-operating-surplus

…so just like TRUMP (spending other people’s money)

http://money.yahoo.com/coronavirus-stimulus-checks-trump-tweet-172756371.html

seems Newsom sees fit to hand out checks to voters?!?!

http://abc30.com/california-gas-rebate-checks-delayed-newsom-report/11828736/

…meanwhile there are water and power shortages

http://www.latimes.com/california/story/2022-05-06/colorado-rivers-california-arizona-powell-mead-risks

http://www.wsj.com/articles/electricity-shortage-warnings-grow-across-u-s-11652002380

Just thinking out loud,… seems sending out checks is a calculated political move that does nothing to address the problem of insufficient water AND insufficient electrical power generating capacity in the South Western USA

Perhaps concerned citizens (and especially elected officials) should be made aware there is a wiser way to spend taxpayers money (such as) ‘Covering the 4,000 miles of California’s water canals could save billions of gallons of water and generate renewable power for the state every year, according to a new study.’

http://news.ucmerced.edu/news/2021/solar-panels-over-canals-can-save-money-energy-and-water-study-shows

[scaredyclassic]

I see no technology that a problem can’t solve. Maybe Ted k. Was not entirely nuts. True, bombing people is bad, but the manifesto has aged pretty well, from it’s opening declaration onward…

“The Industrial Revolution and its consequences have been a disaster for the human race. They have greatly increased the life-expectancy of those of us who live in “advanced” countries, but they have destabilized society, have made life unfulfilling, have subjected human beings to indignities, have led to widespread psychological suffering (in the Third World to physical suffering as well) and have inflicted severe damage on the natural world. The continued development of technology will worsen the situation.”

[barnaby33]

and have inflicted severe damage on the natural world. The continued development of technology will worsen the situation.”

Weirdly I agree with scaredy and phaster (mostly weird that I’m agreeing with scaredy)

AN specifically for you, I’m linking my favorite essay. I know it’s a bit of a read, maybe 30 minutes, but I re-read it every few years. This nails it!

Phaster, I make no sure and certain claim when fusion, or if fusion is our energy future. I just see no viable path forward without it. You and I seem to agree on water, it’s just that water is a subset of energy availability. Currently oil still has the best EROEI, but has nasty long tail costs. In fact all current energy sources except geothermal have those costs, especially nuclear. My biggest fear about nuclear power is that it dovetails so cleanly with human capacity for short term thinking at the cost of long term environmental health.

Back to water. My preference would be a combination of restrictions on usage, raising of prices and outright banning of growing certain crops. Almonds for export are the poster child, but in CA rice and cotton should never be grown either. Market forces by themselves will not stabilize or assure food availability or the survival of civilization in a desert.
Josh

[phaster]

[quote=barnaby33]

Back to water. My preference would be a combination of restrictions on usage, raising of prices and outright banning of growing certain crops. Almonds for export are the poster child, but in CA rice and cotton should never be grown either. Market forces by themselves will not stabilize or assure food availability or the survival of civilization in a desert.

Josh[/quote]

the unsustainable drought poster crop in California and the rest of the arid SW USA IMHO is alfalfa,… and the reason is because it is grown AND exported as feed for live stock in china

California Alfalfa Exports Take Hit from China Tariffs

AND saudia arabia

http://www.purewatergazette.net/blog/sending-california-water-to-saudia-arabia-in-the-form-of-alfalfa-march-10-2016/

…basically the reason the farmers in California (and other parts of the USA) are growing alfalfa is because people in other parts of the world want to to consume more animal protein

…AND FWIW data seems to indicate because of the Putin “Military Action” in Ukraine along w/ excess global debt that appears to be unserviceable odds are there is going to be a global famine (on a biblical scale)

PS FYI

[quote]
Everyone gets less water during a drought. But the breakdowns of the state and federal projects’ water allocations show some groups — particularly farmers who have longtime rights to divert water — faring better than others.

They also reflect the overwhelming thirst of Southern California towns and cities — some of the most arid, and populous, parts of the state. The Chronicle analyzed this year’s expected water allocations from the California State Water Project and the federal Central Valley Project, and how they break down and compare to previous years.

Here are some of the biggest takeaways of who got more from where:

State Water Project

The State Water Project, which includes the 444-mile long California Aqueduct and the Oroville Dam, supplies water to some 27 million Californians and 750,000 acres of farmland, according to the state water department, its operator. It also generates power and provides for recreational areas in the state.

The project has 29 long-term contractors — smaller, regional water providers, including cities, towns and irrigation districts, that sell the water to customers. For the past two decades, about a third of State Water Project water was for agricultural use and two-thirds for municipal, industrial or residential uses, state officials said. For the second year in a row, the State Water Project is expected to deliver only 5% of the amount requested from contractors. The last time allocation was that low was in 2014 — the third year in that drought spell. “We’re not going to expect much additional precipitation on the horizon,” said Molly White, the project’s water operations manager. The 2022 cuts were deep across the board among the 29 contractors, but some cuts were less harsh than others. Most were approved for just 5% of their requested amounts, but the state awarded larger percentages to communities with critical health and safety needs. “Folks at the Department of Water Resources have been very clear that they’re not going to reduce allocation to 5% if that supplier’s going to have to turn off water to residences,” White said.

Napa and Solano counties’ water districts were approved for 15% of their requested amounts, compared with the 5% contractors in the Central Valley and Southern California received. But these Bay Area communities requested far smaller amounts to begin with. The allocation amounts are based on a variety of factors, including river flows, water storage conditions, environmental requirements and how much rain and snow there has been, the water operations manager said. In terms of the total amount of water, Southern California water agencies still take the bulk — nearly half — of State Water Project water, with the Metropolitan Water District of Southern California expected to get the most, at almost 96,000 acre-feet. The Metropolitan Water District is a public regional wholesaler cooperative supplying water to roughly 19 million people in California through its numerous member agencies. This year, for the first time, it required significant cutbacks from its users, who must limit lawn-watering to one day a week. Small water suppliers, especially those who rely entirely on one source and don’t have alternatives to fall back on, tend to be much more vulnerable to water shortage, according to the water department. Most water suppliers don’t rely solely on one source of water, however. Many, like the East Bay Municipal Utility District, have several sources, including access to reservoirs, groundwater pumping and purchasing water from other providers. Annually, the State Water Project delivers 2 million to 4 million acre-feet of water. An acre-foot — about 326,000 gallons — generally provides enough water for one to two households for a year. By comparison, the Colorado River — another huge water source for the state, especially farmers in Southern California — is supposed to deliver 4.4 million acre-feet annually to California, though cutbacks are on the horizon due to the drought. Central Valley Project

California’s Central Valley Project, run by the U.S. Bureau of Reclamation, is much bigger than the State Water Project and is geared more toward agriculture. It counts more than 270 contractors, including the big irrigation districts in the San Joaquin Valley. It has historically supplied water for 3 million acres of farmland. The federal waterworks also serves communities in the Bay Area and wildlife refuges.

The project, which captures water from the southern Cascades to the southern Sierra Nevada, consists of 20 dams and reservoirs – including the state’s largest, Shasta Lake — and operates more than 500 miles of canals and pipelines to deliver water. It also operates 11 power plants. This year, because of the drought, federal water managers announced that no project water would be sent to many of its contractors, effectively a 0% allocation. Those who receive water are doing so because of contractual obligations that date back decades or because of health and safety issues. Faring best are senior water rights holders, typically farmers and irrigation districts.

This is not because the project allocates water based on water rights but because the federal government, in order to operate its project, committed to providing water to senior users who were drawing water from the Sacramento and San Joaquin river watersheds before the project began drawing water. Senior users are those with water rights dating back the longest. But even those users are falling far short of what they normally get: This year, because of low flows, federal water managers made a deal with senior users in the Sacramento River watershed to take less than what they’re due — just 18% of what they requested.

While the project’s municipal and industrial contractors were officially allocated no water, the federal government is providing these customers enough to meet minimum health and safety needs. The Contra Costa Water District in the East Bay, for example, is getting 34% of its requested allocation. Agricultural contractors who don’t have senior water rights in the Sacramento and San Joaquin river watersheds are not getting any project water. In the Friant (Fresno County) area, some contractors are receiving limited deliveries because the source of water there is different than in the rest of the project area, and federal managers say water is available. The Central Valley Project has historically delivered about 7 million acre feet of water annually. By comparison, the Colorado River is supposed to deliver 4.4 million acre-feet annually to California, though cutbacks are on the horizon due to the drought.

http://www.sfchronicle.com/climate/article/California-drought-17269648.php
[/quote]

[scaredyclassic]

[quote=barnaby33]

and have inflicted severe damage on the natural world. The continued development of technology will worsen the situation.”

Weirdly I agree with scaredy and phaster (mostly weird that I’m agreeing with scaredy)

AN specifically for you, I’m linking my favorite essay. I know it’s a bit of a read, maybe 30 minutes, but I re-read it every few years. This nails it!

Phaster, I make no sure and certain claim when fusion, or if fusion is our energy future. I just see no viable path forward without it. You and I seem to agree on water, it’s just that water is a subset of energy availability. Currently oil still has the best EROEI, but has nasty long tail costs. In fact all current energy sources except geothermal have those costs, especially nuclear. My biggest fear about nuclear power is that it dovetails so cleanly with human capacity for short term thinking at the cost of long term environmental health.

Back to water. My preference would be a combination of restrictions on usage, raising of prices and outright banning of growing certain crops. Almonds for export are the poster child, but in CA rice and cotton should never be grown either. Market forces by themselves will not stabilize or assure food availability or the survival of civilization in a desert.
Josh[/quote]

Frankly I disagree with almost everything I think within a couple days.

[flyer]

Fantastic posts from Phaster, Josh and Scaredy, and, for the most part, my sentiments, exactly. Regardless of how complex the analysis, and however brilliant we believe ourselves to be, it all really boils down to this summation, “Civilizations and empires, in the end, are just ripples in the ocean of time.”

[scaredyclassic]

When this civilization falls it will be an incredibly short period of time before there is almost no trace it existed.just a little sliver in the geologic record.

Have you ever heard of the 10000 year clock?

https://www.10000yearclock.net/learnmore.html

Cool engineering project in remote desert to build a desert clock that will outlast the destruction of everything you know as us.

Difficult task…the earth tends to swallow everything

“Welcome to the 10,000 Year Clock website
We are building a 10,000 Year Clock. It’s a special Clock, designed to be a symbol, an icon for long-term thinking. It’s of monumental scale inside a mountain in West Texas. The father of the Clock is Danny Hillis. He’s been thinking about and working on the Clock since 1989. He wanted to build a Clock that ticks once a year, where the century hand advances once every 100 years, and the cuckoo comes out on the millennium. The vision was, and still is, to build a Clock that will keep time for the next 10,000 years. I’ve been helping Danny with the project for the last half dozen years. As I see it, humans are now technologically advanced enough that we can create not only extraordinary wonders but also civilization-scale problems. We’re likely to need more long-term thinking.”

[barnaby33]

…

[phaster]

[quote=scaredyclassic]I see no technology that a problem can’t solve. Maybe Ted k. Was not entirely nuts. True, bombing people is bad, but the manifesto has aged pretty well, from it’s opening declaration onward…

“The Industrial Revolution and its consequences have been a disaster for the human race. They have greatly increased the life-expectancy of those of us who live in “advanced” countries, but they have destabilized society, have made life unfulfilling, have subjected human beings to indignities, have led to widespread psychological suffering (in the Third World to physical suffering as well) and have inflicted severe damage on the natural world. The continued development of technology will worsen the situation.”[/quote]

being lucky enough to win the pussy lottery (i.e. be born a citizen of an “advanced” country) AND also been fortunate enough to have visited in “shit hole” countries (as TRUMP would say)

http://time.com/5100058/donald-trump-shithole-countries/

IMHO,… have to say KAZANSKI was targeting the wrong idea,… technology as I see things is just a tool that can be used for “good ” or “evil”

think of it this way a scapal (which is a piece of technology) in the hands of skilled surgeon can save a persons life if for example an appendix burst and needs to be removed,… OR consider a scapal in the hands of a young child, which is a disaster in the making,… capeesh?!

as I see things the root problem humanity faces AND a problem few actually think about is not being able to differentiate a “want” from a “need”

truth is from ancient times there have been not so subtle hints that “wants” are evil and deadly,… for example consider the story of king Midas (who wanted everything he touched, turn to gold)

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Midas

another example is the New Testament story of the rich man asking Jesus what he needed to do to gain entry to heaven

http://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=Mark+10%3A17-31&version=RSVCE

another example of “wants” are evil and deadly, is the tolstoy story how much land does a man need

http://www.online-literature.com/tolstoy/2738/

AND yet another another example of “wants” are evil and deadly (but actually turned into a false religious belief is “the prosperity gospel”

http://www.christianitytoday.com/ct/topics/p/prosperity-gospel/

actually should point out not being able to differentiate a “want” from a “need” even applies to BLM,… in other words,… “buy large mansions” which is a greedy self serving misguided cluster fuck that is political in nature

http://www.msn.com/en-us/news/us/black-lives-matter-was-all-about-using-white-guilt-to-make-green/ar-AAVY6gT

http://www.foxnews.com/us/california-report-comprehensive-reparations

bottom line as I see things,… humanity is slowly but surely killing itself on spaceship earth because of consumerism AND greed,… in other words people in general cannot differentiate a “want” from a “need”

[quote]
There’s a general awareness today that China and its massive industrial sector generate more carbon emissions than any other country, which is one of the reasons that parts of the nation have to endure some serious issues with smog and airborne pollutants.

But according to a new study, if you want to know what’s really driving the impact on the planet, you need to look past the obvious primary factors taking a toll on the environment – like industry and agriculture – and instead realise whose needs those things are servicing.

From that perspective, researchers say household consumers are by far the biggest drain on the planet, which makes for a very different picture to purely nation-focused analyses of environmental impact. In other words, before we start blaming whole countries for the state of the planet, we should probably be looking at our own habits and demands.

http://www.sciencealert.com/consumers-have-a-bigger-impact-on-the-environment-than-anything-else-study-finds
[/quote]

PS FWIW given this is a real estate forum, if humanity is going to dodge extinction, this is how I think real estate “rental” housing is going to evolve in an era of diminished natural resources

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iCGXVk-cBVk

[scaredyclassic]

on the other hand, life probably sucked thousands of years ago too. But at least they left the planet inhabitable for us.

[phaster]

[quote=scaredyclassic]on the other hand, life probably sucked thousands of years ago too . But at least they left the planet inhabitable for us.[/quote]

thousands of years ago the bronze age collapse happened

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=B965f8AcNbw

in South Western part of the USA and in Central America (about a thousand years ago) there were periods of severe drought that caused organized societies to collapse

http://www.cambridge.org/core/journals/american-antiquity/article/abs/cannibalism-warfare-and-drought-in-the-mesa-verde-region-during-the-twelfth-century-ad/D345F6ECE2D92C6085C5513F2084F701

http://www.cambridge.org/core/journals/ancient-mesoamerica/article/drought-and-the-maya-collapse/B6B6AE2657A4635D65D520142D402DC1

thought I’d point out these historical events because there is an expression,… “Those Who Do Not Learn History Are Doomed To Repeat It”

FWIW WRT drought

Global Drought Could Impact More Than 75% of World Population by 2050: UN Report

basically the topic of climate-change AND drought has been on the radar screen of military strategists for a while (but because politicians and the public at large have essentially no backbone, the issue has not been addressed so that is why we are where we are)

Climate Change and National Security in the 2014 Quadrennial Defense Review

said another way the drought issue isn’t going to magically fix itself AND from what I know have to say the drought (in the next decade) is going to make covid look like a walk in the park (given current trends)!

I mention my pessimism because one of my failed venture capital investments was in “waterfx” which was a group that tried to raise 10 million to build a pilot concentrated solar still on an industrial scale

California’s First Concentrated Solar Power Desalination Plant to Bring Freshwater to the Central Valley

http://www.wwdmag.com/san-francisco-agency-launches-crowdfunding-campaign-california-water-project

sadly I pitched in but there wasn’t enough interest in the market place so had my money returned to me

as I envisioned things, concentrated solar desal could be installed in local urban areas like existing salt evaporation ponds (like in san diego south bay or up in the bay area which could be a win win situation)

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/South_Bay_Salt_Works

http://www.cargill.com/page/sf/sf-bay-salt-ponds

…in other words if an up front investment was made in scaleable concentrated solar stills (years ago), over the long run production for “salt” would increase and provide a useful by-product “fresh water” that could be used locally

PS here is yet another example of political leadership in CA having their head where the sun don’t shine,…

[quote=CNBC]

Lithium industry executives say California officials are asking for a fixed payment of $800 to $1,200 for every ton of metal produced at the southern end of the Salton Sea, and argue that such a high tax would wipe out production before it starts.

“The state is talking about a flat-rate taxarray . . . with a ridiculous figure that wipes out the lithium industry in the United States,” said Rod Colwell, CEO of CT Resources, one of three corporations running the best pilot and scale systems. giant lithium mining projects from a giant underground reserve.

He said the proposed constant tonnage rates “make Chinese lithium much less expensive to import” than domestic compounds that would be produced in imperial county.

http://www.desertsun.com/story/news/environment/2022/06/02/stellantis-buy-lithium-produced-salton-sea-controlled-thermal-resources/7483424001/

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zfZqpdt3Zy0
[/quote]

[evolusd]

Given the drop in water level at Lake Mead, started reading a bit and came across this:

https://www.pewtrusts.org/en/trend/archive/spring-2019/a-map-of-the-future-of-water

Wondering if it might be smart to buy some land in one of those blue areas with groundwater well potential to promote water security for my family if the current trend in So Cal continues to accelerate. The northwest has always been interesting to me as a mountain biker and lover of forests.

[phaster]

[quote=evolusd]Given the drop in water level at Lake Mead, started reading a bit and came across this:

https://www.pewtrusts.org/en/trend/archive/spring-2019/a-map-of-the-future-of-water

Wondering if it might be smart to buy some land in one of those blue areas with groundwater well potential to promote water security for my family if the current trend in So Cal continues to accelerate. The northwest has always been interesting to me as a mountain biker and lover of forests.[/quote]

real estate in the northwest could be an interesting play (if you are actually serious about moving there),… BUT as I read the tea leaves San Diego real estate “price appreciation” will still out perform many other global regions (including the USA market,… even given the thus far unresolved “political” drought issue in the SW USA)

https://www.piggington.com/east_county_sd_v_st_george_gzz’s_budget_mcmansion_lifestyle?page=1#comment-299601

the reason I think the SD area is going to be a safer long term “bet” even w/ $hit for brains political leadership like Gavin Newsom

[quote]
In his time at the California State Water Resources Control Board, Max Gomberg has witnessed the state grapple with two devastating droughts and the accelerating effects of climate change.

Now, after 10 years of recommending strategies for making California more water resilient, the board’s climate and conservation manager is calling it quits. The reason: He no longer believes Gov. Gavin Newsom and his administration are willing to pursue the sorts of transformational changes necessary in an age of growing aridification.

https://www.latimes.com/california/story/2022-07-28/california-drought-official-blasts-newsom-administration
[/quote]

…is because of the various “local” military bases that protect the US southern border (on the coast) along w/ the higher level education university schools (in particular UCSD)

Bottom line given climate change, the severe drought in the SW region AND high global debt levels

is going to all combine and result in de-globalization,… so interior SW cities in the USA like “lost wages” and phoenix are going to decline as time goes forward

https://www.piggington.com/california_real_estate_international_store_value

PS sadly one other environmental “water” issue is,…

[quote]
Rainwater everywhere on the planet is unsafe to drink due to levels of toxic chemicals known as PFAS that exceed the latest guidelines, according to a new study by Stockholm University scientists.

Commonly known as ‘forever chemicals’ because they disintegrate extremely slowly, PFAS (per- and polyfluoroalkyl substances) were initially found in packaging, shampoo or makeup but have spread to our entire environment, including water and air.

“There is nowhere on Earth where the rain would be safe to drink, according to the measurements that we have taken,” Ian Cousins, a professor at the university and the lead author of the study published in Environmental Science and Technology

https://phys.org/news/2022-08-rainwater-unsafe-due-chemicals.html
[/quote]

[The-Shoveler]

They (the experts) are saying we need to cut water usage by about 25%,

75% is used (really really inefficiently) watering crops, (basically just letting it run down watering furrows or using large sprinklers shooting enormous amounts of water several hundred feet through the air).

IMO really all we need to do is fix that.

[flyer]

The federal government is now stepping in to regulate water cuts. For now, only AZ and NV are effected, but CA may also eventually be on the chopping block.

I know San Diego is in a better position than most areas of the state, so it will be interesting to see how it all plays out for us, locally.

https://calmatters.org/environment/2022/08/colorado-river-water-california/

[phaster]

[quote=flyer]The federal government is now stepping in to regulate water cuts. For now, only AZ and NV are effected, but CA may also eventually be on the chopping block.

I know San Diego is in a better position than most areas of the state, so it will be interesting to see how it all plays out for us, locally.

https://calmatters.org/environment/2022/08/colorado-river-water-california/
[/quote]

actually what most do not realize is the global magnitude of the “drought” problem,…

CHINA

https://www.reuters.com/world/china/china-takes-action-alleviate-drought-record-heatwave-continues-2022-08-17/

https://apnews.com/article/china-asia-droughts-chongqing-a6b831a3e718f5fb5f46ee5f63cf331d

https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2022-08-16/china-joins-europe-in-facing-threats-from-worsening-drought

INDIA

https://indianexpress.com/article/explained/india-monsoon-rainfall-deficit-uttar-pradesh-jharkhand-bihar-farmers-drought-8087529/

https://www.telegraphindia.com/india/drought-hit-bihar-gets-free-seeds/cid/1880771

EUROPE

https://www.theatlantic.com/photo/2022/08/photos-europe-drought/671143/

https://www.newscientist.com/article/2333938-europes-extreme-drought-is-exacerbating-food-and-energy-crises/

LATINA AMERICA

Latin America and the Caribbean 2021: ‘mega-drought, extreme rainfall, heatwaves, glacier melt’

AFRICA

https://www.i24news.tv/en/news/international/environment/1660485429-africa-s-drought-sees-the-masai-way-of-life-evaporate

basically “drought” is happening on a global scale and sad fact of the matter is looking at the trends being reported in the “news” the odds are billions of people will feel the adverse knock on effects of water resource mismanagement

the question I wonder about is how long will the public at large remain blind to the scientific fact(s)

yeah I know there is the expression “ignorance is bliss,…” BUT as I see things, this only compounds the overall suffering

[flyer]

Yes, sadly, I realize the global impact of every facet of our climate crisis. We travel often, and have seen and felt the many changes taking place here in the states, and around the world.

We’re heading to Europe again in the fall, which is our favorite time to travel, and, although we spend more time in the cities and coastal regions, it will, no doubt, be sad to see how the fires have ravaged some of the once beautiful countrysides of France and Spain.

I can only hope things will get better as we, as a society, try to make improvements, but, and I hope I’m wrong, the most glorious days of planet earth may be behind us.

[scaredyclassic]

since we all know this, it would seem like we’d all be driven to some form of radical action, since we probably have people who will survive us in the fuutre we give a shit about, but surprisingly, we only care about ourselves and our small pleasures in the present moment, so onwards to more steak, dairy gas and environmental destruction for bigger houses, bigger lawns, bigger cars, more for us now to enjoy and nibble away so that the entire system dies with us or shortly thereafter.

Hooray for us. We are all little Trumps.

[flyer]

Yes, Scaredy, I think most of us who are aware of the issues facing the future of our earth are trying to do all we can as individuals, but, until ALL of the major players, and industrial offenders globally, are on board and are taking action to make changes, our individual efforts will remain a drop in the bucket. That said, we all have to keep trying.

[scaredyclassic]

[quote=flyer]Yes, Scaredy, I think most of us who are aware of the issues facing the future of our earth are trying to do all we can as individuals, but, until ALL of the major players, per the link below, globally, are on board and are taking action to make changes, our individual efforts will remain a drop in the bucket. That said, we all have to keep trying.

https://news.yahoo.com/what-are-the-major-contributors-to-climate-change-204535627.html%5B/quote%5D

Really? Doing all we can do? Really?

MARC maron riffing on the subject, “we did everything we could”. pretty funny.

not one less airplane trip. gotta get to europe, before the world ends.

It is absolutely immoral to eat any meat or dairy at this moment in time.

[flyer]

Yes, scaredy, short of not living, we are trying to do everything we can, but, apparently, we are grossly uninformed, so please let us all know exactly what you and any other “authorities” you would care to quote, are doing to save the earth, and we can all try to follow suit. I’ll make sure we definitely make some life changes based upon your suggestions, so not to worry.

[scaredyclassic]

The percentage of greenhouse gases from meat alone not dairy contributing to global warming is disputed but the UN says 15percebt. Others say considerably higher…25-30 percent. Google meat and global warming. Not an obscure topic. Dairy is a fucking nightmare.

Simple to stop it all instantly. Just….stop…

[flyer]

We’ve pretty much checked those boxes also + water conservation, electric cars, along with others which are now used less, biking + e-bikes for longer jaunts, green appliances, green heating and cooling systems, gardening, all organic foods for the most part, no plastic or single use–and that’s the short list.

The airlines are definitely polluters, but, like most, we still fly, and hope to see the new supersonics around 2030, which “may” be carbon neutral. Used to fly on the Concorde, and, although not climate friendly, definitely fantastic experiences. American Airlines, from which I retired early in my 50’s a couple of years ago, offered great pilot retirement packages during the pandemic, and have now just ordered 20 supersonics this week.

Will new N.C.-made supersonic jets really be carbon-neutral? It depends, experts say

[an]

Nuclear war killing off 1/2 of the earth population and the other 1/2 experience a depression worst than a great depression will solve it. We all could go back to mud hut and farm for our own food. Hunter and gatherer roots.

[scaredyclassic]

People hate any change. Just asking people to give up cars and meat isn’t quite mud huts …

It’s all so sick.

they begin to see it from vegan

[an]

Evolution suck. Damn you science.

[flyer]

Yes, nothing and no one lasts forever. We can also add this scenario to our possible apocalyptic future, but there is still some hope:

https://www.cnn.com/2022/08/12/weather/california-megaflood-study/index.html

[gzz]

Flyer, I don’t think the supersonic plane is actually going to happen.

A large passenger jet realistically costs over $15 billion to get to the production stage, and profits are so thin this requires massive gov subsidies to even hit breakeven.

What the market really wants is cheap, even if is a little slower and more crowded. The other big trend is the decline of hub and spoke.

Personally I don’t mind the normal transatlantic flight time. Have a meal, watch a movie, take a nap, and I’m there.

Now my two transpacific flights I’d pay extra to shorten. All four of my Transpacific legs were LAX to Taipei on China Air.

[flyer]

Should be interesting to see if it does happen, as orders are being taken by the major carriers, per:

https://www.businessinsider.com/meet-overture-the-boom-supersonic-aircraft-that-united-just-ordered-2021-6

We lived all over the world when I was flying internationally early in my career, after college, (until I was senior enough to call it in on reserve and fly about once a month, lol.) Have also flown many private jets, so I think the market is there, especially among a certain niche.

Imo, they won’t need the masses looking for cheap fares to be successful. Along with others in their target demographic, a considerable number of private jet owners would love to get rid of their expenses, and yet, still enjoy a luxury experience. I know we, and many others, enjoyed flying on the supersonic Concorde, which was retired in 2003, so I’m optimistic about this new incarnation, but only time will tell.

[phaster]

[quote=flyer]
The airlines are definitely polluters, but, like most, we still fly, and hope to see the new supersonics around 2030, which “may” be carbon neutral. Used to fly on the Concorde, and, although not climate friendly, definitely fantastic experiences. American Airlines, from which I retired early in my 50’s a couple of years ago, offered great pilot retirement packages during the pandemic, and have now just ordered 20 supersonics this week.

Will new N.C.-made supersonic jets really be carbon-neutral? It depends, experts say

[/quote]

IMHO new supersonic transports around 2030 won’t happen AND the technical reason being before an airframe can be built, one needs a suitable power plant from a manufacturer such as GE, rolls-royce or pratt & whitney

long story short none of these companies is going to bet the farm on developing a suitable power plant for a supersonic transport so dreams of mach 1+ travel,… is just more wishful thinking

sure flying is fun but ever stop and realize that the majority of humanity has never traveled in an airplane???

https://www.smithsonianmag.com/air-space-magazine/how-much-worlds-population-has-flown-airplane-180957719/

actually started flying myself (as a pilot) while still in high school, and have always been interested in flying (starting off as a toddler) because basically one of my uncles had an aircraft charter service (and the family lived on an airfield)

then there is the fact my dad and his friends were aero space engineers,… so I grew up listening to stories of how the j58 was tested to destruction in a pratt & whitney test cell so “operational” data could be obtained

FYI the j58 was used on something people might have heard of,… the YF12 and its more famous relative the SR71 “blackbird”

anyway years ago had an epiphany that that my flying hobby is pretty environmentally destructive when I was in a yak 52 and just for shits and giggle did a quick chemical combustion calculation

basically the yak @ takeoff power settings burns 35 GPH,… so since burning one gal of gasoline releases about 20 lbs of CO2,… just flying round the pattern for touch & go’s releases large amounts of CO2 (that will stay in the atmosphere for upwards of a thousand years “trapping infrared” radiation)

bottom line,… because of humanity releasing thousands of gigatons of CO2 which traps “infrared” radiation,… this is causing,…

[quote=flyer]
Yes, nothing and no one lasts forever. We can also add this scenario to our possible apocalyptic future, but there is still some hope:

https://www.cnn.com/2022/08/12/weather/california-megaflood-study/index.html
[/quote]

as a pilot calculating fuel burn becomes second nature because if an aircraft runs out of gas, it no longer is able to stay aloft

same idea should be applied to “water”

in other words if we burn up our supply of water,… organized society “crashes”

https://www.12news.com/article/news/local/water-wars/arizona-farmers-struggle-to-find-solutions-after-unprecedented-colorado-river-water-cuts/75-d677a202-8687-480c-94b4-63784044002f

PS a megaflood (in california) due to atmospheric rivers causing all kinds of damage is just another example of people in general not considering (or preparing for) systemic failures,… said another way, as a pilot you have trained to deal w/ various emergencies,… point being people have not trained to deal w/ climatic emergencies so at some point “shit will hit the fan” and create an avoidable catastrophe

[flyer]

You definitely make some very good points, and as a person with degrees from MIT, I definitely could have made other career choices, but flying and real estate investment were in my blood, so, I went with those. Retired early from American Airlines during the pandemic, but will continue in real estate investment until we pass everything along to our kids

Knowing what I know now, my choices would have likely been different wrt aviation. Other than continuing to fly, in both our professional and personal lives, we’ve gone about as green as you can go, but that’s still just a drop in the bucket. Every person and every industry will need to be on board in order to save our planet, and profound changes will be required from each. Only time will tell if our efforts were successful.

[scaredyclassic]

[quote=flyer]You definitely make some very good points, and as a person with degrees from MIT, I definitely could have made other career choices, but flying and real estate investment were in my blood, so, I went with those. Retired early from American Airlines during the pandemic, but will continue in real estate investment until we pass everything along to our kids

Knowing what I know now, my choices would have likely been different wrt aviation. Other than continuing to fly, in both our professional and personal lives, we’ve gone about as green as you can go, but that’s still just a drop in the bucket. Every person and every industry will need to be on board in order to save our planet, and profound changes will be required from each. Only time will tell if our efforts were successful.[/quote]

Unless each person gives up meat, cars, buying shit and having kids, we are screwed, which means we are screwed. I hate cars and I still need to use one next week.

Fuck it, let’s just get on with it and all go to heaven, where the supplies are plentiful. The suckers after us can deal with it.

[flyer]

I’m afraid you might be right, scaredy, but we can all keep trying.

[teaboy]

[quote=scaredyclassic]Unless each person gives up … having kids, we are screwed[/quote]

Not according to Elon Musk.

[img_assist|nid=27730|title=|desc=https://twitter.com/elonmusk/status/1563020169160851456?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw%7Ctwcamp%5Etweetembed%7Ctwterm%5E1563020169160851456%7Ctwgr%5E4a87f91079b8642ec1bec4856177c014da8e435a%7Ctwcon%5Es1_&ref_url=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.business-standard.com%2Farticle%2Finternational%2Fpopulation-collapse-due-to-low-birth-rates-a-bigger-risk-than-climate-musk-122082900918_1.html|link=url|align=left|width=300|height=154]

tb

[teaboy]

this is too good not to share, although i cant vouch for its authenticity.

tb

[img_assist|nid=27731|title=|desc=|link=node|align=left|width=379|height=500]

[scaredyclassic]

https://vegnews.com/2022/8/clint-eastwood-plant-based-diet-planet

Clint’s even anti meat

[phaster]

FWIW,… some news about the drought that is having dramatic effects in other regions of the USA

[quote]
Traffic jams and stuck barges are clogging up a critical artery of the U.S. economy, as a prolonged drought pushes the Mississippi River’s water levels to near-record lows.

Around 500 million tons of supplies are ferried along the Mississippi River every year with trade value worth $130 billion, according to the Port of New Orleans, mainly agricultural products, like corn and soybeans, along with fuel products. The Mississippi River Basin produces more than 90% of U.S. agricultural exports, according to the National Park Service, and nearly 80% of the world’s grain exports.

But all that is coming to a standstill amid historic drought conditions that are making the river untraversable for most shipping barges. River levels are now at their lowest level in a decade after historically low rainfall in recent months, becoming the latest supply-chain snag to hit the U.S.

“America is going to shut down if we shut down,” Mike Ellis, CEO of American Commercial Barge Line in Indiana, told the Wall Street Journal this week.

River traffic jams

The low water levels have clogged up entire sections of the Mississippi River in recent weeks, wreaking havoc on the local economy.

At least 2,000 barges were backed up along the river last week, Bloomberg reported, citing data from the U.S. Coast Guard. Also last week, the Coast Guard warned that at least eight heavy barges had become “grounded” in particularly shallow parts of the river.

With fewer barges able to navigate the river and longer wait times, prices are starting to go up.

“It’s definitely having an impact on the local economy, because the commercial use of this river has almost completely stopped,” George Flaggs, mayor of Vicksburg, Miss., told local news channel WAPT earlier this week, adding that the river around Vicksburg is the lowest he’s seen it in nearly 70 years.

“This will actually affect us in a very negative way. We have to have less cargo on our barges and less tonnage moving. It affects our revenues,” Austin Golding, president of Golding Barge Line, told WAPT.

It’s the worst possible time for a drought in the Mississippi, as early fall is typically when grain is harvested in the Mississippi Basin and sent down the river. Soybeans are the most commonly shipped commodity on the river, according to the Bureau of Transportation Statistics, but the low water levels are throwing the supply chain into chaos.

https://finance.yahoo.com/news/america-going-shut-down-shut-204307435.html
[/quote]

bottom line,… “drought” is happening all over and people (in general) are not aware of the the disaster (of biblical proportions) that actually is a self inflected wound (caused by humanity)

https://www.piggington.com/waking_veganism_cholesterol#comment-299912

[phaster]

[quote=scaredyclassic][quote=flyer]You definitely make some very good points, and as a person with degrees from MIT, I definitely could have made other career choices, but flying and real estate investment were in my blood, so, I went with those. Retired early from American Airlines during the pandemic, but will continue in real estate investment until we pass everything along to our kids

Knowing what I know now, my choices would have likely been different wrt aviation. Other than continuing to fly, in both our professional and personal lives, we’ve gone about as green as you can go, but that’s still just a drop in the bucket. Every person and every industry will need to be on board in order to save our planet, and profound changes will be required from each. Only time will tell if our efforts were successful.[/quote]

Unless each person gives up meat, cars, buying shit and having kids, we are screwed, which means we are screwed. I hate cars and I still need to use one next week.

Fuck it, let’s just get on with it and all go to heaven, where the supplies are plentiful. The suckers after us can deal with it.
[/quote]

since you mentioned “heaven” AND given this is a real estate forum FYI as I see things the parable of the vineyard owner,… is a theological way to view the topic of “climate change and drought” mismanagement

[quote]

…a landowner set forth a vineyard with great care and lavish attention

he then entrusted it to tenant farmers

at harvest time, he sought his share of the produce

yet instead of giving the owner what was due him, the tenant farmers refused, ridiculing, beating, and even killing the servants sent to collect his share

they end by killing the owner’s own son

when jesus asks his audience what they thought the owner would do in response, they replied that he would put the men to a wretched death and lease his vineyard to other tenants who would give him the produce at the proper time

obviously, they did not realize that in the parable the landlord was actually describing them,… and that such a judgment would be upon them unless they repented

https://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=Matthew+21%3A33-46&version=NCB
[/quote]

PS FWIW here is the mainstream view about environmental stewardship (AND is the reason why we are where we are,…)

[quote]
Californians Explain Why They Oppose Drought Restrictions

Perry Peterson (Construction Worker)

“For reasons I cannot possibly understand, my self-worth is extremely tied up in how well-maintained my lawn appears.”

Jose Harper (Financial Advisor)

“Sacrificing my own petty comforts for the survival of the planet is anti-American.”

https://www.theonion.com/californians-explain-why-they-oppose-drought-restrictio-1849480008

[/quote]

[scaredyclassic]

no point

[The-Shoveler]

IMO time for geo engineering,

I have long advocated for it, even if USA were to completely go green how do you get the rest of the world on board when 80% of the world is living hand to mouth. So IMO geo engineering is only real option.

[phaster]

[quote=The-Shoveler]IMO time for geo engineering,

I have long advocated for it, even if USA were to completely go green how do you get the rest of the world on board when 80% of the world is living hand to mouth. So IMO geo engineering is only real option.[/quote]

time for geo engineering?!

fact is from 1850 to 2019, human activity has released 2,400 gigatons of CO2,… point being humanity is already “geo engineering”

[quote=Roger Revelle (1957) UCSD “founder”]
“Thus human beings are now carrying out a large scale geophysical experiment of a kind that could not have happened in the past nor be reproduced in the future. Within a few centuries we are returning to the atmosphere and oceans the concentrated organic carbon stored in sedimentary rocks over hundreds of millions of years. This experiment, if adequately documented, may yield a far-reaching insight into the processes determining weather and climate. It therefore becomes of prime importance to attempt to determine the way in which carbon dioxide is partitioned between the atmosphere, the oceans, the biosphere and the lithosphere.”

[/quote]

The Keeling Curve

[phaster]

FWIW here is a news item that appeared on todays front page of the SDUT

[quote]
Growing fears of ‘dead pool’ on Colorado River as drought threatens Hoover Dam water

The Colorado River’s largest reservoirs stand nearly three-quarters empty, and federal officials now say there is a real danger the reservoirs could drop so low that water would no longer flow past Hoover Dam in two years.

That dire scenario — which would cut off water supplies to California, Arizona and Mexico — has taken center stage at the annual Colorado River conference in Las Vegas this week, where officials from seven states, water agencies, tribes and the federal government are negotiating over how to decrease usage on a scale never seen before.

Outlining their latest projections for Lake Powell and Lake Mead, the nation’s two largest reservoirs, federal water managers said there is a risk Lake Mead could reach “dead pool” levels in 2025. If that were to happen, water would no longer flow downstream from Hoover Dam.

“We are in a crisis. Both lakes could be two years away from either dead pool or so close to dead pool that the flow out of those dams is going to be a horribly small number. And it just keeps getting worse,” said Tom Buschatzke, director of the Arizona Department of Water Resources.

He said there is a real danger that if the coming year is extremely dry, “it might be too late to save the lakes.”

https://www.latimes.com/environment/story/2022-12-16/risk-of-dead-pool-looms-at-colorado-river-meeting
[/quote]

[barnaby33]

Phaster I vehemently disagree, it’s “self inflicted,” not “self inflected.”

We are about (at least in my area) to get a 25% rise in the price of water, not because of shortages, but just to fix our pipes. Dios mio I can’t imagine the usage charge increases that will come on top of that.
Josh

[phaster]

[quote=barnaby33]Phaster I vehemently disagree, it’s “self inflicted,” not “self inflected.”

We are about (at least in my area) to get a 25% rise in the price of water, not because of shortages, but just to fix our pipes. Dios mio I can’t imagine the usage charge increases that will come on top of that.
Josh[/quote]

infrastructure does not last forever AND infrastructure needs to be updated to keep water safe to drink

sigh,… people here in the USA have no clue what it is like to live w/ out a safe and abundant supply of water

I actually have a somewhat different take on the price of water since I’ve had the opportunity to travel in other parts of the world where there was not a safe and abundant supply of water

ever hear how fucked up Venezuela is???

the reason I mention Venezuela is because they have lots of oil reserves and really low gas prices ($0.02 USD/Liter)

http://take-profit.org/en/statistics/gasoline-prices/venezuela/

point being the power that be don’t want to raise gas prices because this appeases the citizen’s enough to keep the politicians in power BUT the trade off is an economy that does not functional very good over all

sadly as I see things, seems politicians here in the USA do pretty much the same thing as politicians do in Venezuela,… simply stated politicians do their best to suppress the prices of various natural resources like gasoline and water, which keeps everyone happy for the short run,… BUT over the long run this really fucks things up

WRT to the issue of “self inflicted” wounds,… actually suppressing the prices of various natural resources like gasoline and water, keeps everyone happy for the short run,… BUT over the long run this really fucks things up,… an example is “aridity”

which is caused by Big-Ag wanting to make as much profit as possible in the short term

[quote=USGS]
Irrigation accounted for most total withdrawals in the CRB [Colorado River Basin], excluding instream use for hydroelectric power and interbasin transfers, averaging 85 percent from 1985 to 2010.

http://pubs.er.usgs.gov/publication/sir20185049
[/quote]

ever consider looking at the economically suppressed gasoline and water price problem in terms of military command doctrine (when it come to fighting a war)???

since a picture is worth a 1000 words

…point I’m trying to make is, basically politicians, business interests and consumers all around the world are operating at the “tactical” level,… here everyone wants to try and lock in as much short term gains/profits as possible,… BUT few are pondering the “operations” level of of war AND essentially no one is considering the “strategic” (i.e. big picture) level of of war

when no one has the “strategic” (i.e. big picture) level of of war, it is impossible to win a war,… for example WRT the Colorado River Basin, which is the key water supply for 40+ million people, since politicians, business interests and consumers don’t want to give up their gains, there is a very real possibility than the water will be all used up (because no one will care and the water will flow from taps, up until the point there is no more water in Lake Powell, Lake Mead, Lake Mohave, etc.)

[barnaby33]

So maybe Dennis Leary was right, we should all use the resources as fast as we can. Give ourselves as much short term comfort as we can, there is no fix. Short term maximizers FTW!

Seriously though maybe it’s because deep down I’m a socialist, or worse can extrapolate into the future, but the smack down on water isn’t coming it’s here. Over the course of my short (very handsome) life I’ve watched San Diego go from a massive exporter of fruit and veg to an almost total importer because of the cost of water. It’s not even subtle. That shift while maintaining supply was only possible because oil was cheap. Well now were running out of water and gas/oil/energy are relentlessly climbing in price. A lot of the bleating I hear about cost of living increases is food. That food all has to be imported because we don’t grow it here, why?

– Expensive land
– Expensive water
– Too many people (which is why the aforementioned are expensive)

Maybe dog will bless us and end the drought, but I doubt it. We should probably have a plan B. Mine was use less and be more deliberate about how we use it. But hey maximizing has it’s upside too!
Josh

[phaster]

[quote=barnaby33]Over the course of my short (very handsome) life I’ve watched San Diego go from a massive exporter of fruit and veg to an almost total importer because of the cost of water. It’s not even subtle. That shift while maintaining supply was only possible because oil was cheap. Well now were running out of water and gas/oil/energy are relentlessly climbing in price. A lot of the bleating I hear about cost of living increases is food. That food all has to be imported because we don’t grow it here, why?

– Expensive land
– Expensive water
– Too many people (which is why the aforementioned are expensive)

Maybe dog will bless us and end the drought, but I doubt it. We should probably have a plan B.[/quote]

A Colorado River Doomsday is inevitably going to happen,…

The only way to avoid A Colorado River Doomsday is when elected political leadership and something like 90+% of the public at large admit and understand there are limits to growth (i.e. grasp water is a limited natural resource),… in addition to people taking into account the scientific idea of feedback loops

[quote]
…faced with doomsday projections from the Bureau of Reclamation about major reservoirs, officials agreed that harmony has not yet extended to how best to address the shortfalls triggered by more than two decades of drought, which have dramatically constricted both the river’s flows and water storage

…Officials from seven states — Colorado, New Mexico, Utah and Wyoming in the Upper Basin and Arizona, California and Nevada in the Lower Basin — spent three days publicly discussing which state or region must bear the brunt of any reductions, and privately deliberated on a multistate agreement.

Faced with a Feb. 1 [2023] deadline to provide an agreement to the Interior Department — and potentially circumvent a federally imposed fix — water managers acknowledged in interviews with E&E News they are still short of a deal.

Scant progress on Colorado River cuts as crisis deepens

http://www.knpr.org/show/knprs-state-of-nevada/2022-12-15/key-water-conference-for-colorado-river-users-held-in-las-vegas
[/quote]

[quote]
In his time at the California State Water Resources Control Board, Max Gomberg has witnessed the state grapple with two devastating droughts and the accelerating effects of climate change.

Now, after 10 years of recommending strategies for making California more water resilient, the board’s climate and conservation manager is calling it quits. The reason: He no longer believes Gov. Gavin Newsom and his administration are willing to pursue the sorts of transformational changes necessary in an age of growing aridification.

http://www.latimes.com/california/story/2022-07-28/california-drought-official-blasts-newsom-administration
[/quote]

[quote]

Irrigation accounted for most total withdrawals in the CRB [Colorado River Basin], excluding instream use for hydroelectric power and interbasin transfers, averaging 85 percent from 1985 to 2010.

http://pubs.er.usgs.gov/publication/sir20185049
[/quote]

[quote]
With agriculture responsible for roughly 80 percent of California’s water use, many question the practicality of crops that cannot be fallowed and the viability of producing food for export.

http://www.nationalgeographic.com/science/article/150508-which-california-exports-crops-are-worth-the-water
[/quote]

[Author]

Posts