How hard is it to DIY this plumbing job yourself?

[Coronita]

The water shutoff valve into the house stopped working awhile ago, and I figure now’s a good time to replace it.

[img_assist|nid=26173|link=node|align=left|width=500]

I’d like to replace it with something like

I feel like being cheap and was thinking DIYing this, with a plumber on standby in case i foobar it.

All you folks that know how to turn a wrench, how hard is this?

Or am I grossly underestimating the difficulty of replacing this? I’m thinking, rust/corrosion for 20+ years and this thing is going to be a a real PITA to deal with…

[Hobie]

Replace the pressure regulator too. And get the ball valves with sweat (smooth bore) connections on both sides.

After you shut off the water from the street. Wire brush the top and bottom elbows to remove the paint. Then heat both top and bottom to remove assembly straight out in one piece. Not top then bottom.

Propane might do the job, but a little hotter gas(Mapp)will make your life easier. The trick is to heat fast and get out. You don’t want to cook the seals in both the valve and regulator.

Emery cloth or scotchbright the inside and outside of all new parts, paste flux, and acid core solder. Heat one side and apply solder to the other. At the correct temp, it will flow around easily. Not too much or it will overflow. Just a dab or two of the solder is all it needs.

Preassemble all parts for perfect fit before soldering.

If the pipes are still draining a bit of water, stuff a wad of Wonder white bread into the pipe. No crust. It will block the water long enough to dry and solder. Then will open the closest outside bib to blow it out when finished.

Turn water back on slowly to avoid ‘slamming’ and possible creating a new leak.

Set the water pressure to about 60psi. Makes it easier on the dishwasher and water maker valves. You won’t notice any difference in the shower.

You can do this!

[Coronita]

Thanks hobbie. I have a propane torch, but maybe this is a good excuse for me to go get a mapp one.

So if I understand you correctly,

1. I need to remove both the valve the regulator together, by desoldering the elbows from both ends…..

2. Since I end up desoldering the both the valve and the regulator, I might as well replace the regulator too since it’s 20 years old too

My concern is that I don’t know if the regulators built today are going to last as well as things built 20 years ago, that’s why I was hoping to keep the old one. I’m finding a lot of the new plumbing hardware just isn’t as reliable.

Do you have a recommendation on a brand of valve and regulator? I think the diameter of my pipes are 1″….Given that the valve as a “1” on it 🙂

For example, what is the difference between

http://www.homedepot.com/p/Watts-1-in-Lead-Free-Brass-FPT-x-FPT-Water-Pressure-Reducing-Valve-1-LF25AUB-Z3/203804614

http://www.homedepot.com/p/Watts-1-in-Lead-Free-Brass-FPT-x-FPT-Pressure-Reducing-Valve-LFN45BU1-M1-1/203473943?MERCH=REC-_-PIPHorizontal1_rr-_-203804614-_-203473943-_-N

besides the $70-$130 price difference. I’ll gladly pay for the one that costs more, if it means it’s of higher quality. But are you really getting more?

[Hobie]

You can clean regulators but they tend to get ‘soft’ with age. You will see this as pressure fluctuation when taking shower and washing machine starts. Properly functioning regulator with a good supply ( ie. not a old house with a undersized supply line) will not notice flow fluctuations.

The larger reg ($126)is what you want as it has higher flow capacity. Watts is good brand. Regs tend to be ok wrt long term reliability.

#1 Yes, the horizontal section closest to house. Heat the elbows only not the pipe. Tape several layers of aluminum foil to the house with a cutout for the pipe. It will help protect the house paint from your torch. Aim the flame away from the building.

Heat will conduct into the wall through the pipe. Be wary of fire. Bucket of water is a good idea. Be quick with the torch and if you have access wrap a wet rag on the other side of the pipe. ( Looks like it goes into an enclosed wall so can’t be done. )

Ball valves are non-directional but check where the handle position is when open. Looks like you may be close to the ground and you need it to fully open.

When you pre-assemble everything, be sure to paint flux everwhere that will be soldered. Inside slip joints as well as the male ends and solder when installed in place.

[FlyerInHi]

Hobbie is right you can do it. I do all my plumbing and it’s not bad.
Do it when your family is away so they don’t pressure you (pun intended) to quickly restore water. You will save about $300.

You may wish to get a Kevlar shield to avoid burning the drywall. Most plumbers don’t even use it so they leave behind burn marks that look very unprofessional. I second Hobbie, before you shut off water have a bucket of water and rags ready. I use disposable gloves so I don’t damage my beautiful hands. I buy gloves at harbor freight.

[spdrun]

BTW – the easy fix is to leave the valve in place and either replace the washer(s) and stuffing, or the entire stem. The washer seats are probably just fine.

Basically, you want to shut water off at the street valve, and unscrew the fitting furthest from the handle to get to the washers. The stuffing is accessed via the “nut” closer to the handle.

It’s a 5 min job once you get the parts.

[FlyerInHi]

Oh, to desolder, brush some flux on the joints. It helps “lubricate” as you apply heat so you can remove.

[La Jolla Renter]

do it yourself… watch a bunch of YouTube vids.

My experience after managing a down to the studs house remodel last year, is that if you watch a lot of YouTube videos to determine the best techniques and you are a bit of a perfectionist, you have a 90% chance you will do a better job than the “pros”.

Fyi, the 2 trades I fired half way through the project were the plumber and the tile setter. Both were from referrals and licensed. I wanted to leave bad reviews online, but didn’t trust them as they know where I live.

[FlyerInHi]

[quote=La Jolla Renter] if you watch a lot of YouTube videos to determine the best techniques and you are a bit of a perfectionist, you have a 90% chance you will do a better job than the “pros”.
[/quote]

That’s is so true! Anyone who has a science degree should figure things out logically.

I find that often the trades are hackjobs whose motto is “good enough”. They don’t have the science background to calculate and figure things out logically. What they have is lots of experience.

Unless you hire a good general contractor who is a perfectionist, and pay a lot, you may as well be your own supervisor, if you have the time.

[Coronita]

Thanks guy. For most plumbing jobs I normally tackle the job myself but this one has me concerned as I thought that getting things off would be a PITA. I remember the last guy that replaced my water heater changed the valve and was using a torch to install a new valve near the water heater, and he did end up sorching my walls, which annoyed me.

I think what I will do is order the parts, try it myself, and worst comes to worse get a plumber to bail me out.

[NotCranky]

The biggest risk/challenge with this job is that the bottom sweat fittings are very near to the stucco wall and side walk which was poured after the original piping work.

Anyway, worst case scenario is the you have to breaks some of that masonry.

The pressure regulator can be removed first with two wrenches . you should do that so it doesn’t act as a heat sink while you are trying to sweat apart the water valve. HOWEVER, first make sure that your water main valve actually stops the flow of water. You don’t want to break this open and find out it doesn’t, which is pretty common.

Definitely buy the mapp gas and a decent torch. Better to avoid putting too much heat than mess around not getting enough.

EDIT, Read B’s post, if that is drywall, not stucco, I guess you will just break it out and do a patch after. Use a piece of galvanized flashing as a heat shield for soldering, you can get one in the roofing dept. About 8×10 piece of metal that you can easily bend.

[Coronita]

Thanks guys for more advice. Yes the walls are drywall in the garage. I know because when I was installing some cabinets years ago, I drove a screw right through the drywall into a drain pipe thinking it was stud and as a result created a pinhole leak…I found out about it when my drywall ended up being a dampwall a few weeks later, and ended up ripping it out and replacing it. I guess worst comes to worst I can bust it out.

Why of why did I not cover up the pipes when I spray painted the walls of my garage years ago… :(.

Looks like I’ll need to stock up on a lot of elbow grease.

http://kalecoauto.com/index.php?main_page=product_info&cPath=9&products_id=23&zenid=lhcxOiPzn,1ikTnpz6r,c2

[Coronita]

Will a thin piece of aluminum work as a heat shield? I bought a large sheet about 1/32 of an inch thick…i guess it’s the material you can use for roof flashing you can cut with shears….I think I have some leftover from making a underpan for my race Miata, after it caught on fire and melted the plastic underpan…(Never mind what happened there, separate story. )

I am just catching on my long list “things around the house that need attention since a few years ago” debt that I haven’t been working off.

[moneymaker]

I put a ball valve in many years ago but used shark bite fittings as I did not want to use torches (oxy acetalene) as that was all I had at the time. had no problems but did have to have the water department replace their valve as it was defective at the street, they put a ball valve in as well after freezing the line with liquid nitrogen, talk about working quickly, they had to finish before the line thawed.

[Hobie]

Yes the al will be fine. You just want to prevent the flame from blowing under the shield and onto the wall.

I wasn’t clear before but it is easier to rebuild the entire assembly rather than trying to reuse elbows.

I would sawzall the top and bottom elbows through the curve so as to not cut horizontal (house )section to remove the assembly. Then heat and remove the top then bottom ell. It will be easier than trying to keep both heated.

Then clean the old pipe extending from the house by heating it and wiping it with a damp rag. It will smooth the old solder so a new elbow will slide on.

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