Guy has a good example as to why Obamanomics won’t work.

[wannabe2077]

Bush is a royal screw up. His general incompetence/lack of curiosity is scary.
Republicans deserve to be punished hard for nominating Bush twice for the presidency. I gave up in 2000 trying to convince Republicans to support McCain over Bush.

Republicans openly support the big and small business alike. There are no hidden agendas.

Democrats are worse. They pretend to champion the little guy. They collect tons of money from the same Wall Street interests that ran this country down. You won’t have any Democrat asking how Obama is shattering fund raising records.

The achiles heels for the Democrats are illegal immigrants, public employees, entitlements.
It is ridicuous to pamper government employees with pensions etc. when people in the private sector are being creamed.

The Democrats support for public schools and opposition to school choice/vouchers is the singular reason for home price appreciation price war that have destroyed this country. The damage from this misguided policies exceeds any damage Bush could do.

[wannabe2077]

Bush is a royal screw up. His general incompetence/lack of curiosity is scary.
Republicans deserve to be punished hard for nominating Bush twice for the presidency. I gave up in 2000 trying to convince Republicans to support McCain over Bush.

Republicans openly support the big and small business alike. There are no hidden agendas.

Democrats are worse. They pretend to champion the little guy. They collect tons of money from the same Wall Street interests that ran this country down. You won’t have any Democrat asking how Obama is shattering fund raising records.

The achiles heels for the Democrats are illegal immigrants, public employees, entitlements.
It is ridicuous to pamper government employees with pensions etc. when people in the private sector are being creamed.

The Democrats support for public schools and opposition to school choice/vouchers is the singular reason for home price appreciation price war that have destroyed this country. The damage from this misguided policies exceeds any damage Bush could do.

[wannabe2077]

Bush is a royal screw up. His general incompetence/lack of curiosity is scary.
Republicans deserve to be punished hard for nominating Bush twice for the presidency. I gave up in 2000 trying to convince Republicans to support McCain over Bush.

Republicans openly support the big and small business alike. There are no hidden agendas.

Democrats are worse. They pretend to champion the little guy. They collect tons of money from the same Wall Street interests that ran this country down. You won’t have any Democrat asking how Obama is shattering fund raising records.

The achiles heels for the Democrats are illegal immigrants, public employees, entitlements.
It is ridicuous to pamper government employees with pensions etc. when people in the private sector are being creamed.

The Democrats support for public schools and opposition to school choice/vouchers is the singular reason for home price appreciation price war that have destroyed this country. The damage from this misguided policies exceeds any damage Bush could do.

[wannabe2077]

Bush is a royal screw up. His general incompetence/lack of curiosity is scary.
Republicans deserve to be punished hard for nominating Bush twice for the presidency. I gave up in 2000 trying to convince Republicans to support McCain over Bush.

Republicans openly support the big and small business alike. There are no hidden agendas.

Democrats are worse. They pretend to champion the little guy. They collect tons of money from the same Wall Street interests that ran this country down. You won’t have any Democrat asking how Obama is shattering fund raising records.

The achiles heels for the Democrats are illegal immigrants, public employees, entitlements.
It is ridicuous to pamper government employees with pensions etc. when people in the private sector are being creamed.

The Democrats support for public schools and opposition to school choice/vouchers is the singular reason for home price appreciation price war that have destroyed this country. The damage from this misguided policies exceeds any damage Bush could do.

[wannabe2077]

Bush is a royal screw up. His general incompetence/lack of curiosity is scary.
Republicans deserve to be punished hard for nominating Bush twice for the presidency. I gave up in 2000 trying to convince Republicans to support McCain over Bush.

Republicans openly support the big and small business alike. There are no hidden agendas.

Democrats are worse. They pretend to champion the little guy. They collect tons of money from the same Wall Street interests that ran this country down. You won’t have any Democrat asking how Obama is shattering fund raising records.

The achiles heels for the Democrats are illegal immigrants, public employees, entitlements.
It is ridicuous to pamper government employees with pensions etc. when people in the private sector are being creamed.

The Democrats support for public schools and opposition to school choice/vouchers is the singular reason for home price appreciation price war that have destroyed this country. The damage from this misguided policies exceeds any damage Bush could do.

[wannabe2077]

Bush is a royal screw up. His general incompetence/lack of curiosity is scary.
Republicans deserve to be punished hard for nominating Bush twice for the presidency. I gave up in 2000 trying to convince Republicans to support McCain over Bush.

Republicans openly support the big and small business alike. There are no hidden agendas.

Democrats are worse. They pretend to champion the little guy. They collect tons of money from the same Wall Street interests that ran this country down. You won’t have any Democrat asking how Obama is shattering fund raising records.

The achiles heels for the Democrats are illegal immigrants, public employees, entitlements.
It is ridicuous to pamper government employees with pensions etc. when people in the private sector are being creamed.

The Democrats support for public schools and opposition to school choice/vouchers is the singular reason for home price appreciation price war that have destroyed this country. The damage from this misguided policies exceeds any damage Bush could do.

[kewp]

[quote=wannabe2077]
It is ridicuous to pamper government employees with pensions etc. when people in the private sector are being creamed.
[/quote]
I work for the UC system.

Salaries are *nowhere near* competitive to private sector gigs. I get 2-3 calls a month from recruiters offering me junior positions for 20-30% more than I’m making now. My friends that are sales engineers make more than twice what I do. On top of that we have a wage freeze due to the budget crisis.

We don’t have a 401k, bonuses, or stock options. You will also usually have the same job for life, as its almost impossible to get promoted.

The benefits package, including medical, dental, vision and a pension plan, are necessary to attract and retain competent employees. Which is actually very challenging even in the current environment.

There is no free lunch. Everyone that works in public service is entitled to be taken care of during their retirement. We’ve earned it.

[kewp]

[quote=wannabe2077]
It is ridicuous to pamper government employees with pensions etc. when people in the private sector are being creamed.
[/quote]
I work for the UC system.

Salaries are *nowhere near* competitive to private sector gigs. I get 2-3 calls a month from recruiters offering me junior positions for 20-30% more than I’m making now. My friends that are sales engineers make more than twice what I do. On top of that we have a wage freeze due to the budget crisis.

We don’t have a 401k, bonuses, or stock options. You will also usually have the same job for life, as its almost impossible to get promoted.

The benefits package, including medical, dental, vision and a pension plan, are necessary to attract and retain competent employees. Which is actually very challenging even in the current environment.

There is no free lunch. Everyone that works in public service is entitled to be taken care of during their retirement. We’ve earned it.

[kewp]

[quote=wannabe2077]
It is ridicuous to pamper government employees with pensions etc. when people in the private sector are being creamed.
[/quote]
I work for the UC system.

Salaries are *nowhere near* competitive to private sector gigs. I get 2-3 calls a month from recruiters offering me junior positions for 20-30% more than I’m making now. My friends that are sales engineers make more than twice what I do. On top of that we have a wage freeze due to the budget crisis.

We don’t have a 401k, bonuses, or stock options. You will also usually have the same job for life, as its almost impossible to get promoted.

The benefits package, including medical, dental, vision and a pension plan, are necessary to attract and retain competent employees. Which is actually very challenging even in the current environment.

There is no free lunch. Everyone that works in public service is entitled to be taken care of during their retirement. We’ve earned it.

[kewp]

[quote=wannabe2077]
It is ridicuous to pamper government employees with pensions etc. when people in the private sector are being creamed.
[/quote]
I work for the UC system.

Salaries are *nowhere near* competitive to private sector gigs. I get 2-3 calls a month from recruiters offering me junior positions for 20-30% more than I’m making now. My friends that are sales engineers make more than twice what I do. On top of that we have a wage freeze due to the budget crisis.

We don’t have a 401k, bonuses, or stock options. You will also usually have the same job for life, as its almost impossible to get promoted.

The benefits package, including medical, dental, vision and a pension plan, are necessary to attract and retain competent employees. Which is actually very challenging even in the current environment.

There is no free lunch. Everyone that works in public service is entitled to be taken care of during their retirement. We’ve earned it.

[kewp]

[quote=wannabe2077]
It is ridicuous to pamper government employees with pensions etc. when people in the private sector are being creamed.
[/quote]
I work for the UC system.

Salaries are *nowhere near* competitive to private sector gigs. I get 2-3 calls a month from recruiters offering me junior positions for 20-30% more than I’m making now. My friends that are sales engineers make more than twice what I do. On top of that we have a wage freeze due to the budget crisis.

We don’t have a 401k, bonuses, or stock options. You will also usually have the same job for life, as its almost impossible to get promoted.

The benefits package, including medical, dental, vision and a pension plan, are necessary to attract and retain competent employees. Which is actually very challenging even in the current environment.

There is no free lunch. Everyone that works in public service is entitled to be taken care of during their retirement. We’ve earned it.

[Coronita]

[quote=kewp][quote=wannabe2077]
It is ridicuous to pamper government employees with pensions etc. when people in the private sector are being creamed.
[/quote]
I work for the UC system.

Salaries are *nowhere near* competitive to private sector gigs. I get 2-3 calls a month from recruiters offering me junior positions for 20-30% more than I’m making now. My friends that are sales engineers make more than twice what I do. On top of that we have a wage freeze due to the budget crisis.

We don’t have a 401k, bonuses, or stock options. You will also usually have the same job for life, as its almost impossible to get promoted.

The benefits package, including medical, dental, vision and a pension plan, are necessary to attract and retain competent employees. Which is actually very challenging even in the current environment.

There is no free lunch. Everyone that works in public service is entitled to be taken care of during their retirement. We’ve earned it.
[/quote]

Kewp, I hate to bring this up question (because frankly I do like you)

….But, I recall a few months (maybe a year ago) you mentioned that you wanted to be working in the public sector because

(1) you felt the job was more stable than the private sector.
(2) the hours were better

As such, I recall you mentioned a few times, that was why you wanted to stay in the public sector instead of the private sector. You had said a few times when this economy tanks, all these private sector employees that are your counterparts will be losing their jobs left and right, and that being in the public sector, your job will stable and weather the economic downturn, and as a result you accepted the apparent disparity in compensation between being in the public sector versus your private sector counterparts.

Perhaps I’m reading your above comment incorrectly though. It seems like you’re suggesting though that public sector’s benefits should be beefed up,despite this economic climate, because it was never on par was the private sector.

That’s sort of what I’m confused about..Because I thought the entire point of folks joining the public sector versus private was out of personal choice. Acknowledgement that working in the public sector, compensation was not going to be on par versus private, but the position was going to be more “stable”. In good times, that sort of works against public sector employees, in bad times the reverse (ideally) is true.

Anyway, it just seems like this entire public versus private sector choice is like everything else in life…Risk versus Reward. People that do things that take on more risk generally are compensated more for taking on that risk. People that take the safer approach aren’t going to be compensated equally as more risky approaches. If that wasn’t the case, there would be little motivation for someone to unnecessarily assume more risk to get the same result.

Don’t get me wrong. I think that public sector positions should have decent benefits package, as if they are entirely crappy, you won’t find anyone working in those positions. But to me, it’s stretch to ever expect them to be on par with the private sector. If the discrepancy is so bothersome, there’s no reason why one couldn’t work in the private sector and assume more risk. I guess I just am not following the rationale for why public sector employee “package” you think should be on par with the private sector. Arguably, your job offers more security than the private sector. And asking for a compensation that is on par with the private sector to me seems like asking for a cookie and eating it too. The reverse is also true. All those private sector tech workers that have lost or are about too lose their jobs really can’t complain they have no job security…Because they chose to assume more risk by not working in a public sector, more secure job…

Of course, if you now feel that public sector tech jobs are just as insecure as private sector tech jobs… Well, that’s an entirely different line of thinking. (Frankly, that is my line of thinking…That when the economy is *that* bad, it doesn’t really matter if you’re a tech worker in public or private..everyone’s impacted. So you might as well take the one that has more risk and potentially a better comp package..But that’s just again my personal choice).

BTW: a lot of us private sector folks, worrying about wage freezes are the last things on our mind.

[Coronita]

[quote=kewp][quote=wannabe2077]
It is ridicuous to pamper government employees with pensions etc. when people in the private sector are being creamed.
[/quote]
I work for the UC system.

Salaries are *nowhere near* competitive to private sector gigs. I get 2-3 calls a month from recruiters offering me junior positions for 20-30% more than I’m making now. My friends that are sales engineers make more than twice what I do. On top of that we have a wage freeze due to the budget crisis.

We don’t have a 401k, bonuses, or stock options. You will also usually have the same job for life, as its almost impossible to get promoted.

The benefits package, including medical, dental, vision and a pension plan, are necessary to attract and retain competent employees. Which is actually very challenging even in the current environment.

There is no free lunch. Everyone that works in public service is entitled to be taken care of during their retirement. We’ve earned it.
[/quote]

Kewp, I hate to bring this up question (because frankly I do like you)

….But, I recall a few months (maybe a year ago) you mentioned that you wanted to be working in the public sector because

(1) you felt the job was more stable than the private sector.
(2) the hours were better

As such, I recall you mentioned a few times, that was why you wanted to stay in the public sector instead of the private sector. You had said a few times when this economy tanks, all these private sector employees that are your counterparts will be losing their jobs left and right, and that being in the public sector, your job will stable and weather the economic downturn, and as a result you accepted the apparent disparity in compensation between being in the public sector versus your private sector counterparts.

Perhaps I’m reading your above comment incorrectly though. It seems like you’re suggesting though that public sector’s benefits should be beefed up,despite this economic climate, because it was never on par was the private sector.

That’s sort of what I’m confused about..Because I thought the entire point of folks joining the public sector versus private was out of personal choice. Acknowledgement that working in the public sector, compensation was not going to be on par versus private, but the position was going to be more “stable”. In good times, that sort of works against public sector employees, in bad times the reverse (ideally) is true.

Anyway, it just seems like this entire public versus private sector choice is like everything else in life…Risk versus Reward. People that do things that take on more risk generally are compensated more for taking on that risk. People that take the safer approach aren’t going to be compensated equally as more risky approaches. If that wasn’t the case, there would be little motivation for someone to unnecessarily assume more risk to get the same result.

Don’t get me wrong. I think that public sector positions should have decent benefits package, as if they are entirely crappy, you won’t find anyone working in those positions. But to me, it’s stretch to ever expect them to be on par with the private sector. If the discrepancy is so bothersome, there’s no reason why one couldn’t work in the private sector and assume more risk. I guess I just am not following the rationale for why public sector employee “package” you think should be on par with the private sector. Arguably, your job offers more security than the private sector. And asking for a compensation that is on par with the private sector to me seems like asking for a cookie and eating it too. The reverse is also true. All those private sector tech workers that have lost or are about too lose their jobs really can’t complain they have no job security…Because they chose to assume more risk by not working in a public sector, more secure job…

Of course, if you now feel that public sector tech jobs are just as insecure as private sector tech jobs… Well, that’s an entirely different line of thinking. (Frankly, that is my line of thinking…That when the economy is *that* bad, it doesn’t really matter if you’re a tech worker in public or private..everyone’s impacted. So you might as well take the one that has more risk and potentially a better comp package..But that’s just again my personal choice).

BTW: a lot of us private sector folks, worrying about wage freezes are the last things on our mind.

[Coronita]

[quote=kewp][quote=wannabe2077]
It is ridicuous to pamper government employees with pensions etc. when people in the private sector are being creamed.
[/quote]
I work for the UC system.

Salaries are *nowhere near* competitive to private sector gigs. I get 2-3 calls a month from recruiters offering me junior positions for 20-30% more than I’m making now. My friends that are sales engineers make more than twice what I do. On top of that we have a wage freeze due to the budget crisis.

We don’t have a 401k, bonuses, or stock options. You will also usually have the same job for life, as its almost impossible to get promoted.

The benefits package, including medical, dental, vision and a pension plan, are necessary to attract and retain competent employees. Which is actually very challenging even in the current environment.

There is no free lunch. Everyone that works in public service is entitled to be taken care of during their retirement. We’ve earned it.
[/quote]

Kewp, I hate to bring this up question (because frankly I do like you)

….But, I recall a few months (maybe a year ago) you mentioned that you wanted to be working in the public sector because

(1) you felt the job was more stable than the private sector.
(2) the hours were better

As such, I recall you mentioned a few times, that was why you wanted to stay in the public sector instead of the private sector. You had said a few times when this economy tanks, all these private sector employees that are your counterparts will be losing their jobs left and right, and that being in the public sector, your job will stable and weather the economic downturn, and as a result you accepted the apparent disparity in compensation between being in the public sector versus your private sector counterparts.

Perhaps I’m reading your above comment incorrectly though. It seems like you’re suggesting though that public sector’s benefits should be beefed up,despite this economic climate, because it was never on par was the private sector.

That’s sort of what I’m confused about..Because I thought the entire point of folks joining the public sector versus private was out of personal choice. Acknowledgement that working in the public sector, compensation was not going to be on par versus private, but the position was going to be more “stable”. In good times, that sort of works against public sector employees, in bad times the reverse (ideally) is true.

Anyway, it just seems like this entire public versus private sector choice is like everything else in life…Risk versus Reward. People that do things that take on more risk generally are compensated more for taking on that risk. People that take the safer approach aren’t going to be compensated equally as more risky approaches. If that wasn’t the case, there would be little motivation for someone to unnecessarily assume more risk to get the same result.

Don’t get me wrong. I think that public sector positions should have decent benefits package, as if they are entirely crappy, you won’t find anyone working in those positions. But to me, it’s stretch to ever expect them to be on par with the private sector. If the discrepancy is so bothersome, there’s no reason why one couldn’t work in the private sector and assume more risk. I guess I just am not following the rationale for why public sector employee “package” you think should be on par with the private sector. Arguably, your job offers more security than the private sector. And asking for a compensation that is on par with the private sector to me seems like asking for a cookie and eating it too. The reverse is also true. All those private sector tech workers that have lost or are about too lose their jobs really can’t complain they have no job security…Because they chose to assume more risk by not working in a public sector, more secure job…

Of course, if you now feel that public sector tech jobs are just as insecure as private sector tech jobs… Well, that’s an entirely different line of thinking. (Frankly, that is my line of thinking…That when the economy is *that* bad, it doesn’t really matter if you’re a tech worker in public or private..everyone’s impacted. So you might as well take the one that has more risk and potentially a better comp package..But that’s just again my personal choice).

BTW: a lot of us private sector folks, worrying about wage freezes are the last things on our mind.

[Coronita]

[quote=kewp][quote=wannabe2077]
It is ridicuous to pamper government employees with pensions etc. when people in the private sector are being creamed.
[/quote]
I work for the UC system.

Salaries are *nowhere near* competitive to private sector gigs. I get 2-3 calls a month from recruiters offering me junior positions for 20-30% more than I’m making now. My friends that are sales engineers make more than twice what I do. On top of that we have a wage freeze due to the budget crisis.

We don’t have a 401k, bonuses, or stock options. You will also usually have the same job for life, as its almost impossible to get promoted.

The benefits package, including medical, dental, vision and a pension plan, are necessary to attract and retain competent employees. Which is actually very challenging even in the current environment.

There is no free lunch. Everyone that works in public service is entitled to be taken care of during their retirement. We’ve earned it.
[/quote]

Kewp, I hate to bring this up question (because frankly I do like you)

….But, I recall a few months (maybe a year ago) you mentioned that you wanted to be working in the public sector because

(1) you felt the job was more stable than the private sector.
(2) the hours were better

As such, I recall you mentioned a few times, that was why you wanted to stay in the public sector instead of the private sector. You had said a few times when this economy tanks, all these private sector employees that are your counterparts will be losing their jobs left and right, and that being in the public sector, your job will stable and weather the economic downturn, and as a result you accepted the apparent disparity in compensation between being in the public sector versus your private sector counterparts.

Perhaps I’m reading your above comment incorrectly though. It seems like you’re suggesting though that public sector’s benefits should be beefed up,despite this economic climate, because it was never on par was the private sector.

That’s sort of what I’m confused about..Because I thought the entire point of folks joining the public sector versus private was out of personal choice. Acknowledgement that working in the public sector, compensation was not going to be on par versus private, but the position was going to be more “stable”. In good times, that sort of works against public sector employees, in bad times the reverse (ideally) is true.

Anyway, it just seems like this entire public versus private sector choice is like everything else in life…Risk versus Reward. People that do things that take on more risk generally are compensated more for taking on that risk. People that take the safer approach aren’t going to be compensated equally as more risky approaches. If that wasn’t the case, there would be little motivation for someone to unnecessarily assume more risk to get the same result.

Don’t get me wrong. I think that public sector positions should have decent benefits package, as if they are entirely crappy, you won’t find anyone working in those positions. But to me, it’s stretch to ever expect them to be on par with the private sector. If the discrepancy is so bothersome, there’s no reason why one couldn’t work in the private sector and assume more risk. I guess I just am not following the rationale for why public sector employee “package” you think should be on par with the private sector. Arguably, your job offers more security than the private sector. And asking for a compensation that is on par with the private sector to me seems like asking for a cookie and eating it too. The reverse is also true. All those private sector tech workers that have lost or are about too lose their jobs really can’t complain they have no job security…Because they chose to assume more risk by not working in a public sector, more secure job…

Of course, if you now feel that public sector tech jobs are just as insecure as private sector tech jobs… Well, that’s an entirely different line of thinking. (Frankly, that is my line of thinking…That when the economy is *that* bad, it doesn’t really matter if you’re a tech worker in public or private..everyone’s impacted. So you might as well take the one that has more risk and potentially a better comp package..But that’s just again my personal choice).

BTW: a lot of us private sector folks, worrying about wage freezes are the last things on our mind.

[Author]

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