ethical question; short sales

[urbanrealtor]

[quote=sdrealtor]I’d love to see you try and would love even more to see you suceed. The agents up in your market are the bottom of the barrel from what I have seen in SoCal and in the last two years I’ve seen them all over Socal.[/quote]

Ditto what Dave sez on this.

As an example of other non-respa items that have an effect upon the sale, I just locked up a deal today by agreeing that my buyer would handle a difficult tenant.

As a result, we get it for significantly below asking.

If that were a short sale, it would be similar.

The personal property price is more questionable but it would be very hard to prove that the offer to sell was anything more than wishful thinking of a desperate FB.

Also, what exactly would be the measure of your personal damage at not being selected as the buyer?

[CA renter]

[quote=walterwhite]SDRealtor, i think your position that sellers can sell whatever personal effects they want is untrue, wrong and silly.

In a situation where a Seller is sorting through offers on a short sale, and they are selling personal items at above-market value as part of a transaction where they are willing to accept a short sale offer the seller wouldn’t otherwise have accepted.

The seller is basically cheating the bank out of the money the bank would have gotten from the higher offer by accepting a lower offer and getting a great price on their used personal junk.

i think that portion of the excess monies received above fair market value for the personal junk is what is called a “bribe” or maybe just a “payment” in order to select the buyer. Isn’t the rule that sellers aren’t supposed to receive money from a short sale? I mean, if i pay 35,000 for an old couch if you accept my lowball offer, that’s bad, right? so your position that they can sell whatever they want for whatever price they can get at their pre-sale yard sale isn’t really true. Actually it’s just flat-out wrong. Maybe even criminal.[/quote]

This is exactly why it should be mandated that all short sale offers be presented directly to the banks (as well as the FB/”owner”).

The PTB know about these games though, and since they are not forcing people to submit offers directly to the banks, they are effectively condoning these tactics. In that case, bribe away — fraud seems to be the only way to get things done these days, unfortunately.

edit: like the OP said, rescind your offer and resubmit it at a lower price with a note (or verbal agreement) that you will buy their furniture for $X.XX.

Good luck, scaredy!

[CA renter]

[quote=walterwhite]SDRealtor, i think your position that sellers can sell whatever personal effects they want is untrue, wrong and silly.

In a situation where a Seller is sorting through offers on a short sale, and they are selling personal items at above-market value as part of a transaction where they are willing to accept a short sale offer the seller wouldn’t otherwise have accepted.

The seller is basically cheating the bank out of the money the bank would have gotten from the higher offer by accepting a lower offer and getting a great price on their used personal junk.

i think that portion of the excess monies received above fair market value for the personal junk is what is called a “bribe” or maybe just a “payment” in order to select the buyer. Isn’t the rule that sellers aren’t supposed to receive money from a short sale? I mean, if i pay 35,000 for an old couch if you accept my lowball offer, that’s bad, right? so your position that they can sell whatever they want for whatever price they can get at their pre-sale yard sale isn’t really true. Actually it’s just flat-out wrong. Maybe even criminal.[/quote]

This is exactly why it should be mandated that all short sale offers be presented directly to the banks (as well as the FB/”owner”).

The PTB know about these games though, and since they are not forcing people to submit offers directly to the banks, they are effectively condoning these tactics. In that case, bribe away — fraud seems to be the only way to get things done these days, unfortunately.

edit: like the OP said, rescind your offer and resubmit it at a lower price with a note (or verbal agreement) that you will buy their furniture for $X.XX.

Good luck, scaredy!

[CA renter]

[quote=walterwhite]SDRealtor, i think your position that sellers can sell whatever personal effects they want is untrue, wrong and silly.

In a situation where a Seller is sorting through offers on a short sale, and they are selling personal items at above-market value as part of a transaction where they are willing to accept a short sale offer the seller wouldn’t otherwise have accepted.

The seller is basically cheating the bank out of the money the bank would have gotten from the higher offer by accepting a lower offer and getting a great price on their used personal junk.

i think that portion of the excess monies received above fair market value for the personal junk is what is called a “bribe” or maybe just a “payment” in order to select the buyer. Isn’t the rule that sellers aren’t supposed to receive money from a short sale? I mean, if i pay 35,000 for an old couch if you accept my lowball offer, that’s bad, right? so your position that they can sell whatever they want for whatever price they can get at their pre-sale yard sale isn’t really true. Actually it’s just flat-out wrong. Maybe even criminal.[/quote]

This is exactly why it should be mandated that all short sale offers be presented directly to the banks (as well as the FB/”owner”).

The PTB know about these games though, and since they are not forcing people to submit offers directly to the banks, they are effectively condoning these tactics. In that case, bribe away — fraud seems to be the only way to get things done these days, unfortunately.

edit: like the OP said, rescind your offer and resubmit it at a lower price with a note (or verbal agreement) that you will buy their furniture for $X.XX.

Good luck, scaredy!

[CA renter]

[quote=walterwhite]SDRealtor, i think your position that sellers can sell whatever personal effects they want is untrue, wrong and silly.

In a situation where a Seller is sorting through offers on a short sale, and they are selling personal items at above-market value as part of a transaction where they are willing to accept a short sale offer the seller wouldn’t otherwise have accepted.

The seller is basically cheating the bank out of the money the bank would have gotten from the higher offer by accepting a lower offer and getting a great price on their used personal junk.

i think that portion of the excess monies received above fair market value for the personal junk is what is called a “bribe” or maybe just a “payment” in order to select the buyer. Isn’t the rule that sellers aren’t supposed to receive money from a short sale? I mean, if i pay 35,000 for an old couch if you accept my lowball offer, that’s bad, right? so your position that they can sell whatever they want for whatever price they can get at their pre-sale yard sale isn’t really true. Actually it’s just flat-out wrong. Maybe even criminal.[/quote]

This is exactly why it should be mandated that all short sale offers be presented directly to the banks (as well as the FB/”owner”).

The PTB know about these games though, and since they are not forcing people to submit offers directly to the banks, they are effectively condoning these tactics. In that case, bribe away — fraud seems to be the only way to get things done these days, unfortunately.

edit: like the OP said, rescind your offer and resubmit it at a lower price with a note (or verbal agreement) that you will buy their furniture for $X.XX.

Good luck, scaredy!

[CA renter]

[quote=walterwhite]SDRealtor, i think your position that sellers can sell whatever personal effects they want is untrue, wrong and silly.

In a situation where a Seller is sorting through offers on a short sale, and they are selling personal items at above-market value as part of a transaction where they are willing to accept a short sale offer the seller wouldn’t otherwise have accepted.

The seller is basically cheating the bank out of the money the bank would have gotten from the higher offer by accepting a lower offer and getting a great price on their used personal junk.

i think that portion of the excess monies received above fair market value for the personal junk is what is called a “bribe” or maybe just a “payment” in order to select the buyer. Isn’t the rule that sellers aren’t supposed to receive money from a short sale? I mean, if i pay 35,000 for an old couch if you accept my lowball offer, that’s bad, right? so your position that they can sell whatever they want for whatever price they can get at their pre-sale yard sale isn’t really true. Actually it’s just flat-out wrong. Maybe even criminal.[/quote]

This is exactly why it should be mandated that all short sale offers be presented directly to the banks (as well as the FB/”owner”).

The PTB know about these games though, and since they are not forcing people to submit offers directly to the banks, they are effectively condoning these tactics. In that case, bribe away — fraud seems to be the only way to get things done these days, unfortunately.

edit: like the OP said, rescind your offer and resubmit it at a lower price with a note (or verbal agreement) that you will buy their furniture for $X.XX.

Good luck, scaredy!

[Anonymous]

My wife and I encountered the same situation on a home – five figure cash bribe outside of escrow in exchange for beat up furniture and the right to have your offer presented to the bank. The listing agent was to take a commission on the bribe. BTW no sympathy for the sellers either – they took out a $500K home equity line at the peak of the bubble that they walked away with free and clear.

We checked with the California Association of Realtors (CAR) and they stated this was fraudulent, illegal, and a federal offense. Sellers cannot profit in any way from a short sale. The bank is allowing the seller to walk away from their debts so what gives the seller the right to bank additional cash as a result of the sale?

Unfortunately, CAR was of no help and said they can’t stop someone from committing a crime. SDAR didn’t care. Contacted numerous people at the bank and no one could help. The home ended up selling $26K less than our bid to another party, and the bank never saw our offer. We will never know for sure whether the buyer paid the bribe.

It was a very frustrating ordeal so I understand completely. If you want the house bad enough hire a lawyer – we were told they can put a stop to the short sale.

[Anonymous]

My wife and I encountered the same situation on a home – five figure cash bribe outside of escrow in exchange for beat up furniture and the right to have your offer presented to the bank. The listing agent was to take a commission on the bribe. BTW no sympathy for the sellers either – they took out a $500K home equity line at the peak of the bubble that they walked away with free and clear.

We checked with the California Association of Realtors (CAR) and they stated this was fraudulent, illegal, and a federal offense. Sellers cannot profit in any way from a short sale. The bank is allowing the seller to walk away from their debts so what gives the seller the right to bank additional cash as a result of the sale?

Unfortunately, CAR was of no help and said they can’t stop someone from committing a crime. SDAR didn’t care. Contacted numerous people at the bank and no one could help. The home ended up selling $26K less than our bid to another party, and the bank never saw our offer. We will never know for sure whether the buyer paid the bribe.

It was a very frustrating ordeal so I understand completely. If you want the house bad enough hire a lawyer – we were told they can put a stop to the short sale.

[Anonymous]

My wife and I encountered the same situation on a home – five figure cash bribe outside of escrow in exchange for beat up furniture and the right to have your offer presented to the bank. The listing agent was to take a commission on the bribe. BTW no sympathy for the sellers either – they took out a $500K home equity line at the peak of the bubble that they walked away with free and clear.

We checked with the California Association of Realtors (CAR) and they stated this was fraudulent, illegal, and a federal offense. Sellers cannot profit in any way from a short sale. The bank is allowing the seller to walk away from their debts so what gives the seller the right to bank additional cash as a result of the sale?

Unfortunately, CAR was of no help and said they can’t stop someone from committing a crime. SDAR didn’t care. Contacted numerous people at the bank and no one could help. The home ended up selling $26K less than our bid to another party, and the bank never saw our offer. We will never know for sure whether the buyer paid the bribe.

It was a very frustrating ordeal so I understand completely. If you want the house bad enough hire a lawyer – we were told they can put a stop to the short sale.

[Anonymous]

My wife and I encountered the same situation on a home – five figure cash bribe outside of escrow in exchange for beat up furniture and the right to have your offer presented to the bank. The listing agent was to take a commission on the bribe. BTW no sympathy for the sellers either – they took out a $500K home equity line at the peak of the bubble that they walked away with free and clear.

We checked with the California Association of Realtors (CAR) and they stated this was fraudulent, illegal, and a federal offense. Sellers cannot profit in any way from a short sale. The bank is allowing the seller to walk away from their debts so what gives the seller the right to bank additional cash as a result of the sale?

Unfortunately, CAR was of no help and said they can’t stop someone from committing a crime. SDAR didn’t care. Contacted numerous people at the bank and no one could help. The home ended up selling $26K less than our bid to another party, and the bank never saw our offer. We will never know for sure whether the buyer paid the bribe.

It was a very frustrating ordeal so I understand completely. If you want the house bad enough hire a lawyer – we were told they can put a stop to the short sale.

[Anonymous]

My wife and I encountered the same situation on a home – five figure cash bribe outside of escrow in exchange for beat up furniture and the right to have your offer presented to the bank. The listing agent was to take a commission on the bribe. BTW no sympathy for the sellers either – they took out a $500K home equity line at the peak of the bubble that they walked away with free and clear.

We checked with the California Association of Realtors (CAR) and they stated this was fraudulent, illegal, and a federal offense. Sellers cannot profit in any way from a short sale. The bank is allowing the seller to walk away from their debts so what gives the seller the right to bank additional cash as a result of the sale?

Unfortunately, CAR was of no help and said they can’t stop someone from committing a crime. SDAR didn’t care. Contacted numerous people at the bank and no one could help. The home ended up selling $26K less than our bid to another party, and the bank never saw our offer. We will never know for sure whether the buyer paid the bribe.

It was a very frustrating ordeal so I understand completely. If you want the house bad enough hire a lawyer – we were told they can put a stop to the short sale.

[scaredyclassic]

Well the damages are we didn’t get our dream house; but who can put a price on that? (joke). The time we spent looking and negotiating, and statutory unfair trade practice damages. Admittedly not much … Maybe 3000? I’ll settle for 5000.

The evidence that it’s not just wishful think is that it’s Occurong prior to selecting offers. It’s reasonable to Infer that that figures into sellers selection. If it were just wishful thinking and had no bearing on which offer was selected , then wish upon the buyer you’ve selected who can best make the bank whole

[scaredyclassic]

Well the damages are we didn’t get our dream house; but who can put a price on that? (joke). The time we spent looking and negotiating, and statutory unfair trade practice damages. Admittedly not much … Maybe 3000? I’ll settle for 5000.

The evidence that it’s not just wishful think is that it’s Occurong prior to selecting offers. It’s reasonable to Infer that that figures into sellers selection. If it were just wishful thinking and had no bearing on which offer was selected , then wish upon the buyer you’ve selected who can best make the bank whole

[scaredyclassic]

Well the damages are we didn’t get our dream house; but who can put a price on that? (joke). The time we spent looking and negotiating, and statutory unfair trade practice damages. Admittedly not much … Maybe 3000? I’ll settle for 5000.

The evidence that it’s not just wishful think is that it’s Occurong prior to selecting offers. It’s reasonable to Infer that that figures into sellers selection. If it were just wishful thinking and had no bearing on which offer was selected , then wish upon the buyer you’ve selected who can best make the bank whole

[scaredyclassic]

Well the damages are we didn’t get our dream house; but who can put a price on that? (joke). The time we spent looking and negotiating, and statutory unfair trade practice damages. Admittedly not much … Maybe 3000? I’ll settle for 5000.

The evidence that it’s not just wishful think is that it’s Occurong prior to selecting offers. It’s reasonable to Infer that that figures into sellers selection. If it were just wishful thinking and had no bearing on which offer was selected , then wish upon the buyer you’ve selected who can best make the bank whole

[Author]

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