BUY AMERICAN (avoid that made in China)

[jpinpb]

[quote=briansd1]
For example, take Ikea. They brought designer furniture to the masses. Of course the durability of their furniture doesn’t compare to the solid oak furniture of the past. But that oak furniture was crudely designed, finished, and expensive. Looking inside any old house that’s never been updated in decades and you’ll see the “quality” of the past.

Now young households can furnish their apartments cheaply and nicely for a certain period of time, then move on.

Today, we have so many more choices that our grandparents didn’t have. Granted, many of those new products are of bad quality. But we don’t have to buy them.[/quote]

I think that is an aspect of this argument. The quality/longevity and the necessity to purchase sooner b/c the product is not as good. You can look in an old house from, say, 1890-1920 and see the quality. They don’t make things as good today, IMO. Heck, look at houses from the 1950’s and they are rotting away compared to a house built in 1910, say.

I can only imagine what the houses built during this last boom will look like 50 years from now. Won’t matter to many of us. Just saying quality of things have deteriorated. Cheap. But not just in price.

BG – true about companies overseas that employ here. Your example, foreign company, but *made* here.

[briansd1]

[quote=jpinpb] You can look in an old house from, say, 1890-1920 and see the quality. They don’t make things as good today, IMO. Heck, look at houses from the 1950’s and they are rotting away compared to a house built in 1910, say.

I can only imagine what the houses built during this last boom will look like 50 years from now. Won’t matter to many of us. Just saying quality of things have deteriorated. Cheap. But not just in price.
[/quote]

I agree about the 1890-1920 houses. But remember that those “quality” houses were only for the rich of the time.

Most everybody else during that time was living in tenement housing. Those old houses survived because they were not average houses.

The iPhone is beautifully made with quality, in my opinion. But it’s not meant to last more a few years. If you drop it, it will break. The original old Motorola cell phones could be dropped multiple times and still work.

Another thing to look at would fine porcelain. Only “rich” families would afford them.

But now you can buy fine porcelain from China and Vietnam for cheap. The quality is pretty good and you they are even dishwasher safe. You can afford to use fine porcelain everyday, if you wish.

So I don’t think it’s a “made in” issue. It’s a design, utility and fitness to purpose issue.

Today, the value-added (or quality) is more in the design and marketing than in the manufacturing.

[briansd1]

[quote=jpinpb] You can look in an old house from, say, 1890-1920 and see the quality. They don’t make things as good today, IMO. Heck, look at houses from the 1950’s and they are rotting away compared to a house built in 1910, say.

I can only imagine what the houses built during this last boom will look like 50 years from now. Won’t matter to many of us. Just saying quality of things have deteriorated. Cheap. But not just in price.
[/quote]

I agree about the 1890-1920 houses. But remember that those “quality” houses were only for the rich of the time.

Most everybody else during that time was living in tenement housing. Those old houses survived because they were not average houses.

The iPhone is beautifully made with quality, in my opinion. But it’s not meant to last more a few years. If you drop it, it will break. The original old Motorola cell phones could be dropped multiple times and still work.

Another thing to look at would fine porcelain. Only “rich” families would afford them.

But now you can buy fine porcelain from China and Vietnam for cheap. The quality is pretty good and you they are even dishwasher safe. You can afford to use fine porcelain everyday, if you wish.

So I don’t think it’s a “made in” issue. It’s a design, utility and fitness to purpose issue.

Today, the value-added (or quality) is more in the design and marketing than in the manufacturing.

[briansd1]

[quote=jpinpb] You can look in an old house from, say, 1890-1920 and see the quality. They don’t make things as good today, IMO. Heck, look at houses from the 1950’s and they are rotting away compared to a house built in 1910, say.

I can only imagine what the houses built during this last boom will look like 50 years from now. Won’t matter to many of us. Just saying quality of things have deteriorated. Cheap. But not just in price.
[/quote]

I agree about the 1890-1920 houses. But remember that those “quality” houses were only for the rich of the time.

Most everybody else during that time was living in tenement housing. Those old houses survived because they were not average houses.

The iPhone is beautifully made with quality, in my opinion. But it’s not meant to last more a few years. If you drop it, it will break. The original old Motorola cell phones could be dropped multiple times and still work.

Another thing to look at would fine porcelain. Only “rich” families would afford them.

But now you can buy fine porcelain from China and Vietnam for cheap. The quality is pretty good and you they are even dishwasher safe. You can afford to use fine porcelain everyday, if you wish.

So I don’t think it’s a “made in” issue. It’s a design, utility and fitness to purpose issue.

Today, the value-added (or quality) is more in the design and marketing than in the manufacturing.

[briansd1]

[quote=jpinpb] You can look in an old house from, say, 1890-1920 and see the quality. They don’t make things as good today, IMO. Heck, look at houses from the 1950’s and they are rotting away compared to a house built in 1910, say.

I can only imagine what the houses built during this last boom will look like 50 years from now. Won’t matter to many of us. Just saying quality of things have deteriorated. Cheap. But not just in price.
[/quote]

I agree about the 1890-1920 houses. But remember that those “quality” houses were only for the rich of the time.

Most everybody else during that time was living in tenement housing. Those old houses survived because they were not average houses.

The iPhone is beautifully made with quality, in my opinion. But it’s not meant to last more a few years. If you drop it, it will break. The original old Motorola cell phones could be dropped multiple times and still work.

Another thing to look at would fine porcelain. Only “rich” families would afford them.

But now you can buy fine porcelain from China and Vietnam for cheap. The quality is pretty good and you they are even dishwasher safe. You can afford to use fine porcelain everyday, if you wish.

So I don’t think it’s a “made in” issue. It’s a design, utility and fitness to purpose issue.

Today, the value-added (or quality) is more in the design and marketing than in the manufacturing.

[briansd1]

[quote=jpinpb] You can look in an old house from, say, 1890-1920 and see the quality. They don’t make things as good today, IMO. Heck, look at houses from the 1950’s and they are rotting away compared to a house built in 1910, say.

I can only imagine what the houses built during this last boom will look like 50 years from now. Won’t matter to many of us. Just saying quality of things have deteriorated. Cheap. But not just in price.
[/quote]

I agree about the 1890-1920 houses. But remember that those “quality” houses were only for the rich of the time.

Most everybody else during that time was living in tenement housing. Those old houses survived because they were not average houses.

The iPhone is beautifully made with quality, in my opinion. But it’s not meant to last more a few years. If you drop it, it will break. The original old Motorola cell phones could be dropped multiple times and still work.

Another thing to look at would fine porcelain. Only “rich” families would afford them.

But now you can buy fine porcelain from China and Vietnam for cheap. The quality is pretty good and you they are even dishwasher safe. You can afford to use fine porcelain everyday, if you wish.

So I don’t think it’s a “made in” issue. It’s a design, utility and fitness to purpose issue.

Today, the value-added (or quality) is more in the design and marketing than in the manufacturing.

[SanDiegoDave]

Joining the discussion late, but wanted to add my $0.02.

I think the most American thing you can do when making purchasing decision is to base it on your own personal system of values and economics. That’s really what America is about: self-determination. Decide what’s best for you and your family rather than allowing group think tactics to guilt you into something one way or the other, or a government that forces you to do it a certain way.

If I do my own research and determine that foreign made goods are suitable for my needs and at a price I want, it’s more American of me to make that purchase than it is to sit there and feel guilty or pressured by people who may not share my same values. Likewise, I would not presume to tell the person buying the American-made equivalent of that product that they’re wasting their money or buying for the “wrong reasons”. I don’t know what their reasons are, and even if I did, who am I to judge that?

[SanDiegoDave]

Joining the discussion late, but wanted to add my $0.02.

I think the most American thing you can do when making purchasing decision is to base it on your own personal system of values and economics. That’s really what America is about: self-determination. Decide what’s best for you and your family rather than allowing group think tactics to guilt you into something one way or the other, or a government that forces you to do it a certain way.

If I do my own research and determine that foreign made goods are suitable for my needs and at a price I want, it’s more American of me to make that purchase than it is to sit there and feel guilty or pressured by people who may not share my same values. Likewise, I would not presume to tell the person buying the American-made equivalent of that product that they’re wasting their money or buying for the “wrong reasons”. I don’t know what their reasons are, and even if I did, who am I to judge that?

[SanDiegoDave]

Joining the discussion late, but wanted to add my $0.02.

I think the most American thing you can do when making purchasing decision is to base it on your own personal system of values and economics. That’s really what America is about: self-determination. Decide what’s best for you and your family rather than allowing group think tactics to guilt you into something one way or the other, or a government that forces you to do it a certain way.

If I do my own research and determine that foreign made goods are suitable for my needs and at a price I want, it’s more American of me to make that purchase than it is to sit there and feel guilty or pressured by people who may not share my same values. Likewise, I would not presume to tell the person buying the American-made equivalent of that product that they’re wasting their money or buying for the “wrong reasons”. I don’t know what their reasons are, and even if I did, who am I to judge that?

[SanDiegoDave]

Joining the discussion late, but wanted to add my $0.02.

I think the most American thing you can do when making purchasing decision is to base it on your own personal system of values and economics. That’s really what America is about: self-determination. Decide what’s best for you and your family rather than allowing group think tactics to guilt you into something one way or the other, or a government that forces you to do it a certain way.

If I do my own research and determine that foreign made goods are suitable for my needs and at a price I want, it’s more American of me to make that purchase than it is to sit there and feel guilty or pressured by people who may not share my same values. Likewise, I would not presume to tell the person buying the American-made equivalent of that product that they’re wasting their money or buying for the “wrong reasons”. I don’t know what their reasons are, and even if I did, who am I to judge that?

[SanDiegoDave]

Joining the discussion late, but wanted to add my $0.02.

I think the most American thing you can do when making purchasing decision is to base it on your own personal system of values and economics. That’s really what America is about: self-determination. Decide what’s best for you and your family rather than allowing group think tactics to guilt you into something one way or the other, or a government that forces you to do it a certain way.

If I do my own research and determine that foreign made goods are suitable for my needs and at a price I want, it’s more American of me to make that purchase than it is to sit there and feel guilty or pressured by people who may not share my same values. Likewise, I would not presume to tell the person buying the American-made equivalent of that product that they’re wasting their money or buying for the “wrong reasons”. I don’t know what their reasons are, and even if I did, who am I to judge that?

[CA renter]

[quote=briansd1][quote=CA renter]
Brian,

Perhaps your experience is different from ours (and everyone else I know). Maybe you’ve managed to find goods made in China that were somehow equal to the quality we used to get in US made goods. Personally, I’ve never seen it.[/quote]

Ok, that might well be.

I’ve always had an eye for quality so I don’t buy junk.

I’m a big fan of globalization because it brought “luxury” the masses.

Quality is not about durability but design and utility.

For example, take Ikea. They brought designer furniture to the masses. Of course the durability of their furniture doesn’t compare to the solid oak furniture of the past. But that oak furniture was crudely designed, finished, and expensive. Looking inside any old house that’s never been updated in decades and you’ll see the “quality” of the past.

Now young households can furnish their apartments cheaply and nicely for a certain period of time, then move on.

Today, we have so many more choices that our grandparents didn’t have. Granted, many of those new products are of bad quality. But we don’t have to buy them.[/quote]

We disagree greatly on what “quality” means. To me, quality is ALL about durability.

BTW, I think you consider yourself to be an environmentalist. Do you think it’s better that a piece of furniture lasts generations, or is it better for the environment if people can “move on” with new things? As an example, I have an Ethan Allen set that was purchased from a neighbor in the 1970s, when it was already old and used; it’s still in perfectly good condition, and will probably easily last another hundred years or more.
Are you considering the environmental impact from initial production (pollution and resource usage) to the disposal of the goods? Building durable goods that last as long as possible is tantamount to protecting our environment.

[CA renter]

[quote=briansd1][quote=CA renter]
Brian,

Perhaps your experience is different from ours (and everyone else I know). Maybe you’ve managed to find goods made in China that were somehow equal to the quality we used to get in US made goods. Personally, I’ve never seen it.[/quote]

Ok, that might well be.

I’ve always had an eye for quality so I don’t buy junk.

I’m a big fan of globalization because it brought “luxury” the masses.

Quality is not about durability but design and utility.

For example, take Ikea. They brought designer furniture to the masses. Of course the durability of their furniture doesn’t compare to the solid oak furniture of the past. But that oak furniture was crudely designed, finished, and expensive. Looking inside any old house that’s never been updated in decades and you’ll see the “quality” of the past.

Now young households can furnish their apartments cheaply and nicely for a certain period of time, then move on.

Today, we have so many more choices that our grandparents didn’t have. Granted, many of those new products are of bad quality. But we don’t have to buy them.[/quote]

We disagree greatly on what “quality” means. To me, quality is ALL about durability.

BTW, I think you consider yourself to be an environmentalist. Do you think it’s better that a piece of furniture lasts generations, or is it better for the environment if people can “move on” with new things? As an example, I have an Ethan Allen set that was purchased from a neighbor in the 1970s, when it was already old and used; it’s still in perfectly good condition, and will probably easily last another hundred years or more.
Are you considering the environmental impact from initial production (pollution and resource usage) to the disposal of the goods? Building durable goods that last as long as possible is tantamount to protecting our environment.

[CA renter]

[quote=briansd1][quote=CA renter]
Brian,

Perhaps your experience is different from ours (and everyone else I know). Maybe you’ve managed to find goods made in China that were somehow equal to the quality we used to get in US made goods. Personally, I’ve never seen it.[/quote]

Ok, that might well be.

I’ve always had an eye for quality so I don’t buy junk.

I’m a big fan of globalization because it brought “luxury” the masses.

Quality is not about durability but design and utility.

For example, take Ikea. They brought designer furniture to the masses. Of course the durability of their furniture doesn’t compare to the solid oak furniture of the past. But that oak furniture was crudely designed, finished, and expensive. Looking inside any old house that’s never been updated in decades and you’ll see the “quality” of the past.

Now young households can furnish their apartments cheaply and nicely for a certain period of time, then move on.

Today, we have so many more choices that our grandparents didn’t have. Granted, many of those new products are of bad quality. But we don’t have to buy them.[/quote]

We disagree greatly on what “quality” means. To me, quality is ALL about durability.

BTW, I think you consider yourself to be an environmentalist. Do you think it’s better that a piece of furniture lasts generations, or is it better for the environment if people can “move on” with new things? As an example, I have an Ethan Allen set that was purchased from a neighbor in the 1970s, when it was already old and used; it’s still in perfectly good condition, and will probably easily last another hundred years or more.
Are you considering the environmental impact from initial production (pollution and resource usage) to the disposal of the goods? Building durable goods that last as long as possible is tantamount to protecting our environment.

[CA renter]

[quote=briansd1][quote=CA renter]
Brian,

Perhaps your experience is different from ours (and everyone else I know). Maybe you’ve managed to find goods made in China that were somehow equal to the quality we used to get in US made goods. Personally, I’ve never seen it.[/quote]

Ok, that might well be.

I’ve always had an eye for quality so I don’t buy junk.

I’m a big fan of globalization because it brought “luxury” the masses.

Quality is not about durability but design and utility.

For example, take Ikea. They brought designer furniture to the masses. Of course the durability of their furniture doesn’t compare to the solid oak furniture of the past. But that oak furniture was crudely designed, finished, and expensive. Looking inside any old house that’s never been updated in decades and you’ll see the “quality” of the past.

Now young households can furnish their apartments cheaply and nicely for a certain period of time, then move on.

Today, we have so many more choices that our grandparents didn’t have. Granted, many of those new products are of bad quality. But we don’t have to buy them.[/quote]

We disagree greatly on what “quality” means. To me, quality is ALL about durability.

BTW, I think you consider yourself to be an environmentalist. Do you think it’s better that a piece of furniture lasts generations, or is it better for the environment if people can “move on” with new things? As an example, I have an Ethan Allen set that was purchased from a neighbor in the 1970s, when it was already old and used; it’s still in perfectly good condition, and will probably easily last another hundred years or more.
Are you considering the environmental impact from initial production (pollution and resource usage) to the disposal of the goods? Building durable goods that last as long as possible is tantamount to protecting our environment.

[Author]

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