Another crash in 2012? Any thoughts?

[CA renter]

[quote=paramount][quote=CA renter]It’s just the fad right now to blame everything on public employees.

[/quote]

No, it’s not a fad, it’s an awakening:

While the rest of us (private sector workers) have been struggling to keep our jobs and pay our bills through this recession(yes… your wages are most of our taxes), you have been sitting at your desk, feet ontop, fat & happpy, not a care in the world.

Every morning you drive to work and sit at your desk and serf the web for the first 3 hours. You day dream about that nice little pension your going to get after just 15 years, which will be 2 or 3 times your salary. You drool with complacity as you enjoy the 100% stated funded healthcare benefits, the nice little income tax breaks you get on your house, and just laugh. Silly private sector workers.

There is no level of accountability with your bunch either. Mediocrity is not penalized, everyone just turns their head the other way. If you stink at your job or are just plain lazy, no one worries, the Union thugs & Democratic politicians protect you.

Whenever people oppose your lavish benefits, you all get together and accuse them of being racist, xenophobic, wealthy, Republican, etc. with the hope that they go away. You group even goes so far as to threaten them with acts of intimidation, violence, vandalism, etc. “You think back to when you have broken car windows, thrown bricks through windows and eggs at houses of non Union members that have opposed your union.”

After leaving work at 3:30 in the afternoon while the rest of us are struggling to pay your HUGE salary & benefits, you see house after house in foreclusure, see businesses closing and people losing their livehoods.

But you don’t care. Your politicial buddies will surely raise TAXES AGAIN to pay for your cookies. You hold your head up high, flip all them desperate people the birdie and think about the green wad in your wallet. F” them you think.

2010 & 2012. REALITY CHECK! Your ridiculous cookie benefits and gravey train is about to END. We are bankrupt! We have no more money to give you! You can’t fool us with this tax the rich garbage anymore. Your Unions have forced tax rates so high that OUR private employers are fleeing the country to stay in business. We have lost almost everything BECAUSE OF YOU!!!

SAY NO TO UNIONS!!! SAY NO TO MORE TAXS INCREASES!!!! AND SAY NO TO SPOILED LOUD MOUTHED PUBLIC UNION WORKERS!!!!![/quote]

Holy cow, paramount. Who is this “you” you’re talking about? I’m no longer a public employee, don’t surf the web for three hours (and don’t know any public employees who do that), don’t go home at 3:30 p.m., etc.

You are no more a private sector worker than the other public sector workers your rant about (assuming you still work in the defense industry). Your income comes from taxpayers just the same as every other public employee. Where in the heck did you get the notion that you’re any different than all the other workers who “suck off the government teat”?

[paramount]

CAR: Sorry, no not you – that was a comment from Howard Jarvis.

[CA renter]

Okay, I’m sorry for going off on you like that, paramount.

[Anonymous]

[quote=CA renter]Once again, when somebody presents facts that you don’t like, you counter with…another personal attack.[/quote]

Speaking of facts, you still have not provided any to support your “Wall Street stole the pensions” argument.

Where are the details of your solution?

We are still waiting for a list of names and net worth values that will cover the shortfall.

I’ve got my pitchfork in hand, now tell me who to go after.

In the meantime, the shortfall is still there, and the taxpayers are still on the hook…

[(former)FormerSanDiegan]

I haven’t read this entire thread (frankly, I can’t bear to read the longer posts, so I skim them and read responses).

But, what I want to knwo it, how the heck did we go from the question of whether the stock markket will crash in 2012 to a pissing contest about public employees.

Maybe we should creat a separate thread for that subject ?

[CA renter]

[quote=pri_dk][quote=CA renter]Once again, when somebody presents facts that you don’t like, you counter with…another personal attack.[/quote]

Speaking of facts, you still have not provided any to support your “Wall Street stole the pensions” argument.

Where are the details of your solution?

We are still waiting for a list of names and net worth values that will cover the shortfall.

I’ve got my pitchfork in hand, now tell me who to go after.

In the meantime, the shortfall is still there, and the taxpayers are still on the hook…[/quote]

Scroll up…

[sdrealtor]

You mean this guy?

In an interview, Herb Sandler said the couple plans to give all their money away through a foundation that that they set up years ago.

[briansd1]

[quote=pri_dk]

Speaking of facts, you still have not provided any to support your “Wall Street stole the pensions” argument.

Where are the details of your solution?

We are still waiting for a list of names and net worth values that will cover the shortfall.

I’ve got my pitchfork in hand, now tell me who to go after.

In the meantime, the shortfall is still there, and the taxpayers are still on the hook…[/quote]

The pensions went “poof! just like that” along with some other great Wall Street fortunes.

CA renter really needs to accept that the pensions evaporated with the economic crash. There is nowhere to get that money from but from an economic rebound and recovery in asset prices, or higher taxes on everybody.

[Anonymous]

I apologize for contributing to the thread drift.

Will move it to the other thread, where we shall continue to wait for the list…

[Arraya]

[quote=briansd1]

CA renter really needs to accept that the pensions evaporated with the economic crash. There is nowhere to get that money from but from an economic rebound and recovery in asset prices, or higher taxes on everybody.[/quote]

Yes and deflation would obliterate those pensions.

[briansd1]

[quote=Arraya][quote=briansd1]

CA renter really needs to accept that the pensions evaporated with the economic crash. There is nowhere to get that money from but from an economic rebound and recovery in asset prices, or higher taxes on everybody.[/quote]

Yes and deflation would obliterate those pensions.[/quote]

That’s why I find her positions extremely selfish and self-centered.

She wants an economic crash and deflation for everybody. But she wants employment contracts to protect public salaries and pensions at peak levels, no matter what the economic conditions are.

She recognizes the majority of pension funds’ assets were based on Wall Street investment returns. But then those asset values went poof with the financial crisis. Now she wants the taxpayers to make up the loss pension fund values.

As pri_dk pointed out, seizing the money of bankers will only make up a small amount of the pension funds’ shortfall.

[Aecetia]

Looks like the Euro is going down:
“PARIS – The eurozone economy plunged back into crisis on Friday as France and Austria were stripped of their top triple-A credit ratings and Standard and Poor’s downgraded a swathe of debt-laden EU members. Only Germany escaped unscathed, as all other eurozone members were either downgraded — some by two notches — or else warned their current ratings were being re-examined amid fears about sovereign deficits.”

http://www.abs-cbnnews.com/business/01/14/12/euro-crisis-deepens-ratings-agency-strikes

[CA renter]

[quote=briansd1][quote=Arraya][quote=briansd1]

CA renter really needs to accept that the pensions evaporated with the economic crash. There is nowhere to get that money from but from an economic rebound and recovery in asset prices, or higher taxes on everybody.[/quote]

Yes and deflation would obliterate those pensions.[/quote]

That’s why I find her positions extremely selfish and self-centered.

She wants an economic crash and deflation for everybody. But she wants employment contracts to protect public salaries and pensions at peak levels, no matter what the economic conditions are.

She recognizes the majority of pension funds’ assets were based on Wall Street investment returns. But then those asset values went poof with the financial crisis. Now she wants the taxpayers to make up the loss pension fund values.

As pri_dk pointed out, seizing the money of bankers will only make up a small amount of the pension funds’ shortfall.[/quote]

Brian,

I’ve said **multiple** times that I favor deflation and would gladly roll back public employee compensation to pre-bubble levels (mid-90s? mid-70s?) as long as **everyone** takes the hit together — including those who own assets.

Compensation for public employees is ALREADY down from peak levels, as I’ve mentioned many times before. Where did I say it was at peak levels and shouldn’t change?

Not only that, but I’ve stated **multiple** times that I disagreed with the pension boost passed during the dot-com era when pension funds were overfunded and disagreed when public agencies stopped paying into their employees’ retirement accounts (pension contribution holidays should never have happened).

Additionally, I’ve always said that public employees should (and will) end up paying far more toward their retirement accounts.

If you can show that I’ve said otherwise, please link to my post(s). Until then, stop putting words in my mouth.

What I HAVE said is that those who created our financial mess should take the first hit. I’ve never wavered on that, and I never will.

[Coronita]

(begin rant)
———————————————-

How the hell did a thread about what the markets would do this year turn into a pissing match about government worker pensions?

You know, I wish I could open up this thread, and some person or people would have said “hey, FLU, I invested in XYZ and think it’s going to make a killing”… “Or hey, folks, I made this thing, and check it out. It’s going to be the next big thing…Wanna invest?
Then I would look at it, think about it, and hell, might even take a chance on it”… Yes, yes, some of you folks pinged me before, but come on, I was getting fvcking medial treatment, it was the last thing on my mind at the time…Now that things really aren’t going to be known in the near term, I’m like screw the medical treatment crap…and move on….

(end rant)
……

Would you folks quit complaining about everything and tell me how to put more money in my wallet?

I have a few suggestions as topics for discussion…..

1)How can one cheat on your taxes legally?

2)How can I sit on my fat lazy butt and make 1 million dollars in 1 week without doing anything (that includes applying for a government job)…Hell, if I’m going to be lazy, might as well go all out and be lazy.

3)When do you think we will see 0% financing on a home loan?

4)How can I take advantage of the foreclosures that are suppose to be soon to be released by Freddie and Fannie?

5)With the new domain name registration opening up,
http://www.dailyherald.com/article/20120114/business/701149965/

do you think one can make a lot of money being a cyber squatter on names like “.fvck” ,”.sex”, “.bxxxjob”, etc,etc,etc,etc. for instance, if I have the .fvck suffix, would it be profitable that I could then have companies register a domain name like “www.iliketo.fvck”, “www.youliketo.fvck”, or “www.everyonelikes.sex”???

6)If the euro comes crashing down, and the USD gets trashed, do you think gold/silver/precious metals price will go up or down?

7)Do you think sin stock is the way to go? PM is at a all time high. Monsanto is holding very well. What else evil vice stock, morales asside, do you think will do good in 2012?

Sorry folks… I’m really desperate here. I need to make a gillion dollars very soon without really working, and you folks aren’t helping me at all….

And remember, the greatest accomplishments and successes in wealth in america was motivated by greed+laziness.
Thank you…
——- 🙂

(btw, I’m kidding…sort of)

[Anonymous]

flu,

I’d love to help you out – not because I’m nice guy – but, because if I had the answers you are looking for, I’d certainly use them myself.

The reason the topic of market predictions doesn’t really interest me is because I have become a very firm believer in a very basic principle. I can’t remember where I first heard it, but it tells me almost everything I need to know:

“The small investor is not rewarded for extra effort.”

I pay careful attention to my personal finances and investments (in fact it’s essentially my “job” these days), but I also accept that there is only so much the little guy can know, and there’s really no benefit from pouring over details, trying to spot the next “fad,” timing the market, etc.

Essentially, I believe in the Efficient Market Hypothesis and try to act on that belief as best I can.

Of course there is an obvious contradiction here: I’m also a Pigg and know that markets don’t always behave rationally or efficiently. Knowledge of this sort should influence any investor’s decisions, but it’s only useful for somewhat long-term time frames, and once you know the basics (e.g. “housing is historically overvalued right now”), there’s no need to agonize over the details.

I’ve also learned that it’s impossible to time the market, even using the “coarse-grained” time-frame of a year. Nobody can answer questions like “will there be a crash in 2012?” (However, many will make this type of prediction, and some will get lucky – be careful about believing that the “lucky monkey” has some sort of “skill”)

The only questions that we have a chance of answering with any certainty is “what asset classes are over/under valued right now?” Fairly boring and generally easy to answer stuff.

So I can’t help you get rich quick. All I can recommend is to do fundamental/historical analysis like Rich does (or just let him manage some of your money) and be patient.

Or just put it all on red…

[Author]

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