Prius fatality rate is half of national average–

[svelte]

[quote=briansd1]

And so what is Prius owners are smug and and feel “superior” for driving their cars? Don’t you think that BMW, Ferrari, even Ford F350 drivers feel smug in some ways also?

In our culture, people identify with their cars. Better a Prius than a gas guzzler.
[/quote]

I think you missed the point. Prius owners shouldn’t be smug about saving resources if they really aren’t….if they are driving over 2K more miles a year than a Mazda3 or Civic owner, they really aren’t saving resources.

And let’s take a look at a “gas guzzler” driver – me. My cars get in the low 20 MPGs. But I drive under 10K miles a year – 7K to work and a couple thousand more on weekends. So I’m roughly burning the same number of gallons as the average Prius owner who puts on over 15K miles a year! Yet you think the Prius owner should be looked up to…

[Coronita]

[quote=svelte]Hybrid’s Unlikely Rival: Plain Old Cars

http://www.businessweek.com/articles/2012-02-23/hybrids-unlikely-rival-plain-old-cars

[quote=briansd1]
People who drive Prius, eat organic food, tend veggie garden, people who value science and education should be admired, not denigrated.[/quote]

The Efficiency Paradox: Drving a Prius is wrong, and other inconvenient truths:

http://www.businessweek.com/articles/2012-02-09/book-review-em-the-conundrum-em-by-david-owen

It doesn’t take long for him to establish the Prius Fallacy: “a belief that switching to an ostensibly more efficient travel mode turns mobility itself into an environmental positive.” Owen cites statistics showing that as government officials have moved to increase automobile fuel efficiency, our gas consumption has gone up, not down. We simply drive more miles as a species. He also disses HOV lanes, traffic-control systems, and even smartphone apps for finding a parking spot as “counterproductive from an environmental point of view because they make drivers even happier with cars than they were already.”

I think we proved earlier in this thread that Prius driver *do* drive more…by about 40 miles/week.

This same phenomena can be seen in Christmas lights. A few decades ago when huge, power hungry bulbs were strung along the fronts of houses, people only put up 100 or so lights. Now, with ultra efficient LEDs, people have switched to icycle lights and now string up 1000 more more on a regular basis![/quote]

You know svelte, I’ve been saying this all along. The key to saving gas that automakers will need to do, is (a) improve the efficiency of the current engines, which they can do and are proving can be done… and (b) reduce weight of the vehicles without compromising on safety (which they are doing)….

Auto companies simply weren’t motivated to do this before when gas was cheaper because consumers wouldn’t have paid for the extra dollars spent for efficiency and consumers didn’t care so much about spending more money at the pump… It’s a completely different set of rules now…

The fact that automakers can put a 4 cylinder forced induction engine recently that outputs as much power or even more power than 2-3 year old 6 cylinders is just one example. Looking around, the latest offers from german big three have 4 cylinder forced induction engines in there lower trim cars…. (Audi A4’s,A5’s, BMW 128,328,x3-xDrive28)..Other automakers have done similiar Ford’s Ecoboost 4 cylinder, Hyundai’s 4 turbo offering.. I have a lot of respect for Hyundai in particular because they caught up and even surpassed some of their japanese competitors and did so in much less time than the japanese competitors did)… Some of these 4 bangers are putting out 250hp some up to more…Hyundai’s got one at 278 hp…

Meanwhile 6 cylinder FI engines are made tremendous progress as the upgraded engine offering…Never would think that an F-150 would ever be powered by a 6 cylinder eco-boost engine…Nor did I think a I-6 turbo charge would ever make it into a BMW

The next step where it makes sense for automakers is to seriously put offerings with aluminum and/or composite material to save on weight….Audi’s have been doing this already in their higher end offers with aluminum offer. Ditto with BMW’s…

Remember when folks use to laugh at Saturns for their dent resistant doors? I thought those things were the coolest inventions of the time…Because not only were they more or less dent resistent, they were corrosion resistent and weighed less… BMW took one of the playbook… The X5 front fenders are all plastic composites….As well as the 3series….

[Coronita]

[quote=svelte][quote=briansd1]

And so what is Prius owners are smug and and feel “superior” for driving their cars? Don’t you think that BMW, Ferrari, even Ford F350 drivers feel smug in some ways also?

In our culture, people identify with their cars. Better a Prius than a gas guzzler.
[/quote]

I think you missed the point. Prius owners shouldn’t be smug about saving resources if they really aren’t….if they are driving over 2K more miles a year than a Mazda3 or Civic owner, they really aren’t saving resources.

And let’s take a look at a “gas guzzler” driver – me. My cars get in the low 20 MPGs. But I drive under 10K miles a year – 7K to work and a couple thousand more on weekends. So I’m roughly burning the same number of gallons as the average Prius owner who puts on over 15K miles a year! Yet you think the Prius owner should be looked up to…[/quote]

No one is also addressing the issue on what to do with these battery packs once their lives are over.

[briansd1]

[quote=svelte]
I think you missed the point. Prius owners shouldn’t be smug about saving resources if they really aren’t….if they are driving over 2K more miles a year [/quote]

I agree with you svelte on the saving gas point.

But perhaps Prius drivers need to drive more for whatever reasons.

My point is different and is more related to our car culture. Mercedes drivers are “rich”; truck drivers are “manly”; sport car drivers are “enthusiasts”, etc…

I’m OK with giving Prius owners credit for “environmentalism”.

Culture and desirability create markets and drive product innovation. I’m perfectly fine with the Prius as more of a premium brand.

[svelte]

Well, everyone does have a choice in how much they drive. If you don’t live close to work, either move or find a job closer to home. That type of freedom is what we all cherish as Americans.

I guess we see things fairly similarly. It’s like we are on opposites sides of the fence, but we’re both standing right up against the fence.

Howdy, neighbor. 🙂

[temeculaguy]

brian, you’ve defended every allegation regarding cars and your views except your three strikes rule. I wasn’t joking, do you know why I said it? Because relationships tend to change our perspective, even if they don’t last (which they usually don’t and that’s ok) we come away a slighlty different person. I grew up a conservative republican, but after a falling in love with a few wild eyed leftists, I became a moderate, a populist if you will. I grew up a bit of a homophobe, then fell for a girl who was bi sexual, it changed my view, a view I’ll never forget, but I digress. I was once somewhat of an elitist, I grew up with money, then I fell for a girl who lives paycheck to paycheck, who parked her car in different places to dodge the repo men. I changed again. I used to judge a woman by her shape, then a fat girl came a long and was better in bed than all who had preceded her, I changed again. I grew up in pretty much white suburbia, minorities made me nervous, till I fell for some, then I became color blind.

You think because you are liberal, environmentally aware and pregressive that you are past all that, but your bias is just the same as mine was, just in the opposite direction. It would really help you to fall in love with someone who is different than you. Get rid of the three strikes rule or at least suspend it. Save time, combine them all into the same woman. In the end, you’ll see that everybody is the same and maybe you can become like svelte and I a decade or two ahead of schedule. I actually think you will be pleasantly surprised with your new view of the world.

[svelte]

oh man have you and I lived similar lives, TG. Virtually everything you said brings back a similar memory!

I must admit I did not get ff at all until I met a woman who whispered to me about a side of life she’d like to explore together….it was like a door opened to a world of tangerine trees and marmalade skies…I followed those kaleidoscope eyes where she led me and what a journey through cheetahs laps and unicorns and oh so much more. Something I would have never understood or experienced without her.

TMI maybe. I’m sure your tale is similar. Man, I’m gonna drive to work with a smile today.

It’s surprising where a Prius discussion goes, eh?

[scaredyclassic]

It’s a small step from prius to priapism.

[briansd1]

[quote=temeculaguy]

You think because you are liberal, environmentally aware and pregressive that you are past all that, but your bias is just the same as mine was, just in the opposite direction. It would really help you to fall in love with someone who is different than you. Get rid of the three strikes rule or at least suspend it. Save time, combine them all into the same woman. In the end, you’ll see that everybody is the same and maybe you can become like svelte and I a decade or two ahead of schedule. I actually think you will be pleasantly surprised with your new view of the world.[/quote]

I agree TG, someone different from me would be great.

TG, as someone who’s an admitted regular consumer of porn, I can’t you see voting for Rick Santorum, so a leftward drift must be very liberating. Me, I don’t know that I can go in the opposite direction, though there is a conservative strain in me. I value conservative ideals such good education and good upbringing.

I really don’t know what to make of the conservative pitchfork peasant movement we are seeing today. The general disdain for education and the sciences.

I wouldn’t mind meeting a cowgirl who’s into horses and rodeos. We could go ridin’ off to Davy Crocket’s Wild Frontier of Eastern Tennessee.

[Coronita]

[quote=briansd1][quote=temeculaguy]

You think because you are liberal, environmentally aware and pregressive that you are past all that, but your bias is just the same as mine was, just in the opposite direction. It would really help you to fall in love with someone who is different than you. Get rid of the three strikes rule or at least suspend it. Save time, combine them all into the same woman. In the end, you’ll see that everybody is the same and maybe you can become like svelte and I a decade or two ahead of schedule. I actually think you will be pleasantly surprised with your new view of the world.[/quote]

I agree TG, someone different from me would be great.

TG, as someone who’s an admitted regular consumer of porn, I can’t you see voting for Rick Santorum, so a leftward drift must be very liberating. Me, I don’t know that I can go in the opposite direction, though there is a conservative strain in me. I value conservative ideals such good education and good upbringing.

I really don’t know what to make of the conservative pitchfork peasant movement we are seeing today. The general disdain for education and the sciences.

I wouldn’t mind meeting a cowgirl who’s into horses and rodeos. We could go ridin’ off to Davy Crocket’s Wild Frontier of Eastern Tennessee.[/quote]

How the hell do we get from talking about Prius’es (Prii) to talking about Rick Santorum????????????????????

[briansd1]

[quote=flu]

How the hell do we get from talking about Prius’es (Prii) to talking about Rick Santorum????????????????????[/quote]

The conversation branched off to frequent sex (that would require contraception) and porn.

[scaredyclassic]

I’m still chuckling about my priapism joke. Not that priapism is funny.

[briansd1]

[quote=walterwhite]I’m still chuckling about my priapism joke. Not that priapism is funny.[/quote]

I enjoyed your joke. Your comments are terse but meaningful.

[svelte]

[quote=walterwhite]It’s a small step from prius to priapism.[/quote]

Love it!

[Author]

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