OT: Should I request mediation or try to get a restraining order…

[spdrun]

Why go to the police if they’re not helpful? If you have video of criminal activity, you could speak to someone at the DA’s office directly — the DA is the one who decides whether to press criminal charges, not the police.

If the DA refuses to help, one could always go to a local newspaper or the local cable channel. Bored local media sometimes jump on those sorts of things…

But I’d try some sort of segregated access agreement before playing hardball. After all, you still have to live next to those yobs, so may as well not make them hate you too much.

[NotCranky]

[quote=spdrun]Why go to the police if they’re not helpful? If you have video of criminal activity, you could speak to someone at the DA’s office directly — the DA is the one who decides whether to press criminal charges, not the police.

If the DA refuses to help, one could always go to a local newspaper or the local cable channel. Bored local media sometimes jump on those sorts of things…

But I’d try some sort of segregated access agreement before playing hardball. After all, you still have to live next to those yobs, so may as well not make them hate you too much.[/quote]

I don’t think I have enough for the DA even if I wanted to go that route. Could be but highly unlikely.

I don’t think anyone could negotiate the type of thing you are talking about with them. . They have locked iron gates and fences already and the easement runs alongside between two properties. They just don’t want anyone to have the use of the thing..period.

Maybe I am only being bullied because I am letting myself be? That’s a common story. Every time he causes trouble I have backed down and not gotten the crucial work done. The day the cops came out I should have forever put and end to abandoning my work and use of that easement. He is having a field day….and yet he is in his 50’s and not in Jail. So, I think he is more careful than he wants to let on. Also he has threatened to lawyer up when not threatening to kill me….let him lawyer up…maybe he never will , or the battle will be much smaller than if I initiate it. Either way I am ready for that just don’t want to do it and waste my time and money.

[CDMA ENG]

[quote=Blogstar]No arrests so far, when he came out with a gun to diffuse the situation I told him to go call the cops if he couldn’t deal with things. He did, and the police were completely unimpressed by any thing either of us had to say. They would not tell him to leave me alone even though he admitted I had rights to be doing what I was doing. They simply said he doesn’t have to listen to them. They may have told him not to give the impression of trapping me with his vehicle or they may not have. They do not want to deal with any of this kind of garbage. 99% of it does not end with someone actually shot even though a lot of it does because there are so many semi-crazies. Who knows what kind of lies the other guy tells the cops.

All the worst threats were when I was alone but the police told me they really didn’t care even if there were witnesses …the guy has some skill at trying to manipulate people sort of getting in trouble. The cops really want this stuff to go to civil court. Maybe after an injunction or something like that they would care more. There is so much of this stuff and so many people like this…when you call them they just treat you like you are as much a part of the problem as the other person.

I have talked with a lawyer even before the coercive letters and more harassment. He basically said what someone else on this thread said…court, even when you prevail doesn’t make a leopard change his spots…

A lot of people think video is the thing , the police tell people to take video, of course they do, but they want videos of hard core crimes not intimidation/bullying or even blatant verbal threats, yes he tried to slap the phone out of my hand it’s pretty evident on the video but not perfectly, but the cops won’t care![/quote]

Lol! He came out with a gun to diffuse the situation? Hardly believe a judge would buy that.

This is not a rational person.

CE

[NotCranky]

[quote=CDMA ENG][quote=Blogstar]No arrests so far, when he came out with a gun to diffuse the situation I told him to go call the cops if he couldn’t deal with things. He did, and the police were completely unimpressed by any thing either of us had to say. They would not tell him to leave me alone even though he admitted I had rights to be doing what I was doing. They simply said he doesn’t have to listen to them. They may have told him not to give the impression of trapping me with his vehicle or they may not have. They do not want to deal with any of this kind of garbage. 99% of it does not end with someone actually shot even though a lot of it does because there are so many semi-crazies. Who knows what kind of lies the other guy tells the cops.

All the worst threats were when I was alone but the police told me they really didn’t care even if there were witnesses …the guy has some skill at trying to manipulate people sort of getting in trouble. The cops really want this stuff to go to civil court. Maybe after an injunction or something like that they would care more. There is so much of this stuff and so many people like this…when you call them they just treat you like you are as much a part of the problem as the other person.

I have talked with a lawyer even before the coercive letters and more harassment. He basically said what someone else on this thread said…court, even when you prevail doesn’t make a leopard change his spots…

A lot of people think video is the thing , the police tell people to take video, of course they do, but they want videos of hard core crimes not intimidation/bullying or even blatant verbal threats, yes he tried to slap the phone out of my hand it’s pretty evident on the video but not perfectly, but the cops won’t care![/quote]

Lol! He came out with a gun to diffuse the situation? Hardly believe a judge would buy that.

This is not a rational person.

CE[/quote]
Missing comma! When he came out with a gun, to diffuse the situation , I told him to call the cops, which he did. I haven’t seen the gun since. I was on a tractor with no phone. I know that’s weird that I told him to call the cops, I just wanted to break his momentum and let him to be the one to make the useless call so the cops would see and hopefully document how off center he is.Not saying I wasn’t afraid of the gun and all but I wanted to get him to leave. It worked out o.k. I went home when he left to call the cops and I should have kept working until they arrived and after and never quit using the easement and tried to put a stop this nonsense while police visit was fresh.

[paramount]

Reminder: It’s better to be judged by 12, than carried by 6.

[njtosd]

Just FYI for everyone here talking about recording things: California is a two party consent state. If you take a recording to the police that was done secretly, you could be seen as admitting to a crime. http://www.dmlp.org/legal-guide/california-recording-law. It might be worth the risk, but be aware –

[NotCranky]

[quote=njtosd]Just FYI for everyone here talking about recording things: California is a two party consent state. If you take a recording to the police that was done secretly, you could be seen as admitting to a crime. http://www.dmlp.org/legal-guide/california-recording-law. It might be worth the risk, but be aware -[/quote]

Thanks for that. The recording thing is tricky…I would not do it secretly, but then sticking a camera in someone’s face is pretty provocative. Not saying they don’t deserve it but still could be pouring fuel on the fire.

I think right now the thing to do is not go out there alone…start my road improvements and usage of the easement and never stop. Then, bring in the police and/or a lawyer, or encouraging him to get a lawyer I could talk with instead of him. In fact next time I see him I think I will tell him to have his lawyer call me. My neighbor is so in the wrong that I can’t imagine the lawyer threats as more than a bluff anyway. I hate wasting the time of the police over stupid childish stuff but if it takes that I will call them.

I’d definitely like to hear more about the camera use. I have not reported anything about the latest incident yet ,but I will at the very least ask the police about it and if I can call them if he starts try to slap my phone, or under any circumstances touches me.

I don’t like the name calling but it’s trivial really especially, compared to being touched or shoved or leaned on or the aggressive driving and parking too close to me and in ways that I can’t move my vehicles freely. There is so much space out there that there is no excuse for anything that looks like intimidating behavior with cars.

[no_such_reality]

Just out of curiosity, did you discuss this plan to create an improved access road with the actual landowner on essentially a previously set of abdicated easements?

Yes with the easements, you have rights, but you’ll essentially taking a once in decade used right of way and planning to turn it into the new primary assess for your property. Do I have that about right? That goes to CA Renter’s question. You’re really taking 3 easements which have little practical use to the people with them and now tying them together to drastically change the impact of the easements on the primary land owner.

I’ll also 2nd CDMA’s point, the horents nest is already kicked. I’m just reading between the lines, and when reading between the lines, you’re looking kinding like you’re doing an f-u, I want this.

How is the proximity from this road you’re planning on building and key areas of their property?

JMHO, you can be 100% legal and still totally schmucky, just like Donald Trump.

I don’t know if for your sake my reading between the lines is total wrong or if I’m right, not 100% sure which will generate more animosity in the long run.

[CDMA ENG]

Here is the thing about video…

You have to get the whole episode. You have to get him approaching you… Leaving and everything else in between.

I recently watched a video about how a news team, in Australia, followed a man whose soon had been accused for something. It was of some importance. Well one news team followed another that followed the man for twenty minutes and stuck their cameras in his face the man asked repeatedly to please give him some space and then the eventually got to close and he pushed them back. The camera crew then proceeded to call the man a terrorist and then things got ugly. The second crew documented all of this and eventually discredited the first because, of course, all they showed of the man is him losing his cool.

Point is that even video is suspect due to editing.

It has to appear that the video shows the whole event start to finish otherwise it will be suspect.

Regards,

CE

[NotCranky]

The easements are not once in a life usages. They were created by my title company for me, with the previous owner for a 40′ wide road for development is so desired. I have been to a lawyer and he provided me with documentation as to my rights. Even if it were restricted to a very humble road, which is it not, that does not bother me at this time and I am not exceeding that pastoral nature or what ever one might want to call it. Furthermore, one of the neighbors who also bought the same easement from the previous owner has already improved the road enough for now, with the exception of the VERY relatively small part I need to improve and where I am constantly harassed. They have changed their address to the nearest public road and posted a mailbox there. There is nothing unreasonable about what I want to do compared against the legal right from my easement.

“As to the F.U I want this”…I don’t want it, it is already mine, I paid, lots of money to previous owners. I bought this property speculating that I could get an improved road and did. How do you like it when someone unjustly takes your investment strategy and holds it back maybe robs you of it?? The road is already built. The only problem with proximity is of a garage that I mentioned. it is not even on any of the properties through which my easement passes. It is adjacent, unfortunately way to adjacent to the easement. An easement section that is already built and used by 3 property owners goes.

Also as suggested, I could be flexible in lots of ways, I could agree that only residents of my property use the road and we maintain the other for a service road. I could do a lot of cooperative things. There is no chance to that at this time. They want no other traffic and have been in a constant process of sabotage.

[no_such_reality]

JMHO, if your lead in position, is I’ve talked to the lawyer and have the legal right… well, you’ve got the legal right. And that’s all you’ve got. Now go beat your neighbor over the head with a legal right and see how neighborly they are.

[quote]The easements are not once in a life usages. They were created by my title company for me, with the previous owner for a 40′ wide road for [/quote]
Wait a minute, did I just read that right. You bought the easement from the prior owner. So these people that are harrassing you bought AFTER you bought the easement?

If that’s the case, they’re idiot crackjobs. Still would be a nice courtesy to pre-discuss improvement with them.

They don’t happen to be preppers are they?

I also wonder if 40ft road easements were discussed during their purchase of the property.

[NotCranky]

[quote=CDMA ENG]Here is the thing about video…

You have to get the whole episode. You have to get him approaching you… Leaving and everything else in between.

I recently watched a video about how a news team, in Australia, followed a man whose soon had been accused for something. It was of some importance. Well one news team followed another that followed the man for twenty minutes and stuck their cameras in his face the man asked repeatedly to please give him some space and then the eventually got to close and he pushed them back. The camera crew then proceeded to call the man a terrorist and then things got ugly. The second crew documented all of this and eventually discredited the first because, of course, all they showed of the man is him losing his cool.

Point is that even video is suspect due to editing.

It has to appear that the video shows the whole event start to finish otherwise it will be suspect.

Regards,

CE[/quote]

Yeah my video is crap, i spoke with the sherif. Pushing, slapping phones at best allows me to process a citizens arrest against him on a misdemeanor. The sherif offered to do that. We get a court case and I have to argue to win a misdemeanor. Doesn’t solve much either way. I would rather spend that energy on a restraining order or some other civil action that enables progress towards a restraining order. My property lawyer, who I respect very much, has given me some referrals to litigators to interview for a possible restraining order.

Back to the camera issue, I did talk with the Sheriff. He can not slap the phone out of my hand…he can not touch me but it is only a misdemeanor and I have to take court proceedings against him. Law enforcement will not do that.. Yes, now you see why poor people are screwed and more violent. Anyway, if I can get a restraining order then the camera can record any violations against that and they can enforce that. I guess everybody already understands that.

[NotCranky]

[quote=no_such_reality]JMHO, if your lead in position, is I’ve talked to the lawyer and have the legal right… well, you’ve got the legal right. And that’s all you’ve got. Now go beat your neighbor over the head with a legal right and see how neighborly they are.

[quote]The easements are not once in a life usages. They were created by my title company for me, with the previous owner for a 40′ wide road for [/quote]
Wait a minute, did I just read that right. You bought the easement from the prior owner. So these people that are harrassing you bought AFTER you bought the easement?

If that’s the case, they’re idiot crackjobs. Still would be a nice courtesy to pre-discuss improvement with them.

They don’t happen to be preppers are they?

I also wonder if 40ft road easements were discussed during their purchase of the property.[/quote]

Yes, I bought the easement from 3 people, one sold to this hostile person. Nobody wants courtesy or respects it will never be nurture by parties involved for sure.

One would think he had a title company that plotted the easements for him and gave him all the policy exclusions, but maybe not. I hope whatever judge we face has the same opinion of him as you do. There is no hardship to balance here.

I’ll try to refrain from too many comments on what they are. Doesn’t help, but they are not hardened criminals. Not on probation or anything like that as far as I know. One has a long history of dubious litigation.

They were definitely in the hole as far as education about easements and property rights go. Not anymore. This is pure belligerence at best.

Anyway , deciding on opening the restraining order can of worms or not. It’s likely, probably a no brainer. They have plenty of money to behave just as badly in the legal system as they do on the road.
A legal system that I somewhat loathe anyway.

[no_such_reality]

[quote=Blogstar]
Yes, I bought the easement from 3 people, one sold to this hostile person. Nobody wants courtesy or respects it will never be nurture by parties involved for sure. [/quote]

Yea, pretty simple then. They’re either ignorant and their problem with lack of disclosure by the prior owner or they’re not and they’re just bullying.

Put the restraining order on them to keep their distance during improvements and then call the cops every single time they violate it.

And take your sweet time improving.

And as CDMA said, never go out alone over there. Always remember, 80% of the population simply runs on might makes right. That’s why as you go down the economic ladde aggression becomes a more and more common negotiation tactic.

[Hobie]

I would skip doing the improvements yourself and pay a crew. One day, done.

Your time on the easement would now be limited to your transiting. Makes it harder for him to harass you.

But be prepared to when he parks some vehicle at the road entry blocking your access. You know, “it just ran out of gas” Maybe some sign notice is necessary: “Video recording in progress” and “Blocking Access will be towed at your expense”

Sounds like security cams would be prudent.

[Author]

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