OT: Police DNA Checkpoints Arriving at a City Near You Soon!!

[CA renter]

[quote=CDMA ENG][quote=CA renter]For one thing, this contractor is trying to get the BAC level lowered from .08 to .05. That way, more people can be arrested for DUI, and more people can be fined and go to those private jails. Hooray for privatization!

Of course, they will sell it as being “for our own good.”

[/quote]

I think I heard this same arguement from CCPOA.

CE[/quote]

I’ve searched, but couldn’t find anything. Any evidence or data? Links?

[paramount]

[quote=Blogstar]Whoa, the Oxnard cholo cop unclipped his gun holster to take a cell phone from an innocent person on a low rider bike( I suspect he was on a low rider bike because I lived there during HS.)…To be fair it is probably hard to get high level individuals to be cops in Oxnard. Well that might be true about almost any place, but Oxnard especially.

I bet the cop’s gang got out gang-banged by eastlake when he was a kid and he holds a grudge.[/quote]

He took his camera, he’s lucky he didn’t take his life.

The person filming the incident is very brave; on par with the filming of a gang committing a crime. Oops, my bad, that’s what he was doing…

[spdrun]

At least the assistant chief guy owned up to it and didn’t try to protect the cops.

[NotCranky]

[quote=paramount][quote=Blogstar]Whoa, the Oxnard cholo cop unclipped his gun holster to take a cell phone from an innocent person on a low rider bike( I suspect he was on a low rider bike because I lived there during HS.)…To be fair it is probably hard to get high level individuals to be cops in Oxnard. Well that might be true about almost any place, but Oxnard especially.

I bet the cop’s gang got out gang-banged by eastlake when he was a kid and he holds a grudge.[/quote]

He took his camera, he’s lucky he didn’t take his life.

The person filming the incident is very brave; on par with the filming of a gang committing a crime. Oops, my bad, that’s what he was doing…[/quote]

I meant camera I thought he was using a cell phone camera. I guess he is brave you have to be brave to be in that park.

The cops are waging a proxy war for the middle class….just fighting crime I guess, but it used to be they pretty much would not go into some of these neighborhoods. Here is some back story…The city or county has put some injunctions on the gangs basically restraining orders and curfews on their ability to be in public. This isn’t happening to nice people like you.

http://www.vcreporter.com/cms/story/detail/justice_for_oxnard/10751/

This is the thing, It might be unfair to someone, but I really do not want to use cop vs. gang warfare to support the anti-privacy complaints in america. It’s kind of goofy. These are later generations of gangs who terrorized me and my friends and killed and raped some of them or their relatives. It’s happened all over the country ….what are you some kind of soft on crime liberal.

[temeculaguy]

[quote=CA renter]I’m adamantly anti-crime and anti-criminal, and totally understand the desire to have the DNA samples of violent criminals in a database, but I have a serious problem with law-abiding people (a classification that, in itself, is not entirely well-defined and can change too easily if the wrong people get into power) being subjected to tests and procedures that make it easier for the government to track them in any way.[/quote]

Herein lies the problem, there are more first time offenders than repeat offenders. There are more first time child molesters or murderers than 3rd timers, so when do we take someone’s DNA, only after they’ve killed someone? Every rapist has a first time but far less have a 10th, it’s pure math. Don’t take this as an insult or an attack, but read closely, what you meant to say is that you want to be protected from them, but don’t want to be bothered yourself. “Watch them but not me.” Well it doesn’t work that way, you can’t get half pregnant. And don’t worry, they (the government) have far too few people to worry about you, they can barely keep up with the evil folks out there.
I’ll submit my every move, my moves aren’t that interesting, I’m guessing yours aren’t either. If the NSA is watching me right now, I’ll save them the trouble, I’m going to go to espn.com next and check some scores. After that I might go to a porn site and look at some women with a little extra meat on their bones doing some fairly interesting things, then off to bed. In the morning I’m going to have coffee and metamucil, then a really good bowel movement before getting a haircut and then back for some college football. I’m sure they’ve had a few briefings regarding whose going to watch me doing what, I pity the guy that gets the bowel movement detail, my Saturday post coffee/metamucil movements are epic.

[CA renter]

I really do understand your point about first-time offenders/people who’ve been caught for the first time. It still doesn’t change the fact that this DNA information (along with other very personal information that is being collected these days) can be used in nefarious ways if this gets into the hands of the wrong people. On one hand, one can see why some people would want the cops to have cameras on every corner and DNA samples of every person on the planet, OTOH, it’s easy to see why some totally law-abiding citizens would not.

There is no perfect solution, but I’m willing to give up some safety in exchange for freedom.

[temeculaguy]

Then you will be free to be a victim, people get the government they deserve. Somebody famous said that but i can’t remember who. Old age can be unkind, by the time one gains the wisdom one has always sought, their faculties betray them.

[CA renter]

Do you honestly think that people who don’t want the government tracking them are all idiots?

[spdrun]

Frankly, I’m less bothered by crime, which has gone down a lot since the 80s than by intrusive and outright abusive government. (Environmental factors may be in play here — there’s an interesting study about leaded gas use and crime out there.)

In fact, I consider some crime and violence to be the price we pay for living in a free society. But if we really want to fight it, we need to fix our schools, end the stupid “war on drugs”, guarantee higher educational opportunity to all who are smart enough, etc. Wholesale abuse of civil liberties by state-employed thugs is an unacceptable solution. This goes for every government agency, from the NSA to the Podunk, Pennsylvania police force.

As far as terrorism, think about this one… A few thousand people died on 9/11, and we’ve turned our Constitution into toilet paper as a result. Yet, 8 to 10,000 people per annum are murdered with firearms in the US, and we’re unwilling to enact reasonable laws because of the “Constitution.” Tell me, where’s the fucking logic?

[CDMA ENG]

[quote=CA renter][quote=CDMA ENG][quote=CA renter]For one thing, this contractor is trying to get the BAC level lowered from .08 to .05. That way, more people can be arrested for DUI, and more people can be fined and go to those private jails. Hooray for privatization!

Of course, they will sell it as being “for our own good.”

[/quote]

I think I heard this same arguement from CCPOA.

CE[/quote]

I’ve searched, but couldn’t find anything. Any evidence or data? Links?[/quote]

Three Strikes Law? Get all those felons off the street was supposed to be for our own good too.

CE

P.S. This is actually a terrible point to use for debate. It could be argued from either side as effective or ineffective depending upon the metric used.

A better and more to the point debate would be around prop 69.

Which is in my eyes unconstitionual.

[CA renter]

IMO, Three Strikes is one of the primary reasons behind the falling crime rate over the past couple of decades.

[spdrun]

Who knows? One of the most likely theories for the rise and drop of crime rates in the US involves the introduction and prohibition of leaded gasoline…

http://www.forbes.com/sites/alexknapp/2013/01/03/how-lead-caused-americas-violent-crime-epidemic/

“Three strikes” is the typical American mentality of punishment over prevention and rehabilitation.

[CA renter]

California Crimes, 1983-2009:

http://oag.ca.gov/sites/all/files/agweb/pdfs/cjsc/glance/chart1.pdf?

The “Three Strikes” laws started being passed in various states beginning around 1993.

[CA renter]

[quote=spdrun]Who knows? One of the most likely theories for the rise and drop of crime rates in the US involves the introduction and prohibition of leaded gasoline…

http://www.forbes.com/sites/alexknapp/2013/01/03/how-lead-caused-americas-violent-crime-epidemic/

“Three strikes” is the typical American mentality of punishment over prevention and rehabilitation.[/quote]

Anything is possible, and it’s likely that there are many factors. But I still think that Three Strikes played an important part in the reduction in crime over the years.

[spdrun]

Correlation doesn’t prove causation. Unlike your graph, the lead study actually looked at crime in different states and countries to establish a stronger causal relationship.

(1993 was also about 20 years after leaded fuel started to be phased out.) Things like Three Strikes, at least where there is no possibility of parole, are inhumane in my book, since they don’t take the possibility of rehabilitation into account.

A person is far different at age 45 than at age 20 or 25, and the law should allow for that.

[Author]

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