OT: Is it just me or is this really sleezy?

[CardiffBaseball]

I think you guys haven’t seen a lot of cheerleaders lately. I happen too because I have tall athletic kids who are above avg athletes (maybe college baseball someday who knows).

The girls today are not the doe-eyed little princesses who are skinny and petite while young, and soften into the middle ages. These girls hit gymnnastics training which is typically pretty grueling. Watch a college football troupe and you can bounce a quarter off the rear-end of most of those girls. It’s definitely a lot different than when I was chasing their skirts after games these girls work out much harder.

Having said all that if I had a daughter instead of two sons, I don’t know if we’d be going the dance route either. My wife was a college athlete and could have been a D1 swimmer had she not gotten tired of being in a pool before school every day of her life (to the chagrin of her parents she abruptly quit at 16 and never did it again). I tend to prefer team sports and softball or basketball I’d encourage and possibly volleyball since it’s not during softball. (for boys it’s right in the middle of baseball season in high school).

Also I find this dance recital to be tasteless as far as answering the original poster’s question. And I am far from prudish. Where I disagree is that I think almost every woman’s sport I watch on TV also has some degree of sexuality being sold (outside of maybe basketball). Volleyball you have tall fit girls wearing very tight clothing. Has anyone watched the women’s college softball championships lately? The uniforms are generally designed to flatter and these are not the same girls that played 20 years ago. A lot more Jenny Finch types than Rosie O’Donnell types.

Remember that there is a fine line between a woman wanting to feel pretty and sexy without but not looking to obvious. I was sitting around Encinitas Discount Tire today and saw two different 40+ women who could not have weighed more than 105 lbs, wearing the absolute tightest workout pants they could possibly paint on. These women were basically flawless in terms of figure, you could literally see the hamstring bulge on their tiny little legs. I personally find this to be VERY sexually appealing, every bit as much as a short business-suit and possibly more so. If a 42 year old hottie is going to wear something that appealing for the world to see what is her little girl going to wear? The message sent to these girls “look good”.

[NotCranky]

[quote=Allan from Fallbrook][quote=edna_mode]I’m one of those girls who practiced tae kwon do as a kid, and then migrated to aikido in my adulthood. I was one of the few girls who stuck for longer than a few months, and I vividly remember one girl who was using the testosterone imbalance to her advantage, practicing her flirting skills more than her punches. Needless to say, I would pound her whenever we sparred.

It was good preparation for going into male-dominated professions. However, I will also say that the same behavior (extremely decisive attitude, ability to think and articulate clearly and independently) gets interpreted very differently when exhibited by boys vs. girls. I try to steer towards environments where these qualities are appreciated in men and women. But there are still a lot of regressive enclaves (and you have to suss out certain personalities, even in the better places) where the ability to couch these strengths in diplomacy, request language vs. demands, willingness to convince others slowly rather than lay out all the logic and expect others to capitulate their clearly less defensible position…well, let’s just say that learning *persuasion* by means other than strict force or logic is one of the reasons I switched martial arts.[/quote]

Edna: Interesting post and I enjoyed your parsing in terms of using your particular skillset.

My dad, a former Marine DI, used to refer to the “scalpel and the sledgehammer” when I was growing up. I did martial arts (karate, boxing and Kendo), as well as played football and then the Army. What I found when I got to the corporate world was that there are far more tools than just a scalpel or sledgehammer and that diplomacy and building a reasoned case for action went far further and was appreciated far more (than the autocratic “diktat” approach).

The most successful leaders I worked with were true consensus builders, but not afraid to be forceful and decisive when the time came. Those that bullied subordinates and underlings and used fear as motivator (“The beatings will continue until morale improves!”) were generally not rewarded with hard work and loyalty.

I agree with some of what Russell is saying about football, in terms of some of the negative lessons (might makes right and the use of physical intimidation), but I think, in his broad brush approach, he misses the far more important lessons that football (and other sports) imparts: Teamwork, character built through adversity, striving for a common goal and the absolutely repulsive taste of losing. I can remember picking myself up off the turf and wanting nothing more than to quit and go home, but I refused, absolutely refused, to lose. Only one place to learn that most invaluable of all lessons.[/quote]
I didn’t mention football once, Allan.

[NotCranky]

[quote=Allan from Fallbrook][quote=edna_mode]I’m one of those girls who practiced tae kwon do as a kid, and then migrated to aikido in my adulthood. I was one of the few girls who stuck for longer than a few months, and I vividly remember one girl who was using the testosterone imbalance to her advantage, practicing her flirting skills more than her punches. Needless to say, I would pound her whenever we sparred.

It was good preparation for going into male-dominated professions. However, I will also say that the same behavior (extremely decisive attitude, ability to think and articulate clearly and independently) gets interpreted very differently when exhibited by boys vs. girls. I try to steer towards environments where these qualities are appreciated in men and women. But there are still a lot of regressive enclaves (and you have to suss out certain personalities, even in the better places) where the ability to couch these strengths in diplomacy, request language vs. demands, willingness to convince others slowly rather than lay out all the logic and expect others to capitulate their clearly less defensible position…well, let’s just say that learning *persuasion* by means other than strict force or logic is one of the reasons I switched martial arts.[/quote]

Edna: Interesting post and I enjoyed your parsing in terms of using your particular skillset.

My dad, a former Marine DI, used to refer to the “scalpel and the sledgehammer” when I was growing up. I did martial arts (karate, boxing and Kendo), as well as played football and then the Army. What I found when I got to the corporate world was that there are far more tools than just a scalpel or sledgehammer and that diplomacy and building a reasoned case for action went far further and was appreciated far more (than the autocratic “diktat” approach).

The most successful leaders I worked with were true consensus builders, but not afraid to be forceful and decisive when the time came. Those that bullied subordinates and underlings and used fear as motivator (“The beatings will continue until morale improves!”) were generally not rewarded with hard work and loyalty.

I agree with some of what Russell is saying about football, in terms of some of the negative lessons (might makes right and the use of physical intimidation), but I think, in his broad brush approach, he misses the far more important lessons that football (and other sports) imparts: Teamwork, character built through adversity, striving for a common goal and the absolutely repulsive taste of losing. I can remember picking myself up off the turf and wanting nothing more than to quit and go home, but I refused, absolutely refused, to lose. Only one place to learn that most invaluable of all lessons.[/quote]
I didn’t mention football once, Allan.

[NotCranky]

[quote=Allan from Fallbrook][quote=edna_mode]I’m one of those girls who practiced tae kwon do as a kid, and then migrated to aikido in my adulthood. I was one of the few girls who stuck for longer than a few months, and I vividly remember one girl who was using the testosterone imbalance to her advantage, practicing her flirting skills more than her punches. Needless to say, I would pound her whenever we sparred.

It was good preparation for going into male-dominated professions. However, I will also say that the same behavior (extremely decisive attitude, ability to think and articulate clearly and independently) gets interpreted very differently when exhibited by boys vs. girls. I try to steer towards environments where these qualities are appreciated in men and women. But there are still a lot of regressive enclaves (and you have to suss out certain personalities, even in the better places) where the ability to couch these strengths in diplomacy, request language vs. demands, willingness to convince others slowly rather than lay out all the logic and expect others to capitulate their clearly less defensible position…well, let’s just say that learning *persuasion* by means other than strict force or logic is one of the reasons I switched martial arts.[/quote]

Edna: Interesting post and I enjoyed your parsing in terms of using your particular skillset.

My dad, a former Marine DI, used to refer to the “scalpel and the sledgehammer” when I was growing up. I did martial arts (karate, boxing and Kendo), as well as played football and then the Army. What I found when I got to the corporate world was that there are far more tools than just a scalpel or sledgehammer and that diplomacy and building a reasoned case for action went far further and was appreciated far more (than the autocratic “diktat” approach).

The most successful leaders I worked with were true consensus builders, but not afraid to be forceful and decisive when the time came. Those that bullied subordinates and underlings and used fear as motivator (“The beatings will continue until morale improves!”) were generally not rewarded with hard work and loyalty.

I agree with some of what Russell is saying about football, in terms of some of the negative lessons (might makes right and the use of physical intimidation), but I think, in his broad brush approach, he misses the far more important lessons that football (and other sports) imparts: Teamwork, character built through adversity, striving for a common goal and the absolutely repulsive taste of losing. I can remember picking myself up off the turf and wanting nothing more than to quit and go home, but I refused, absolutely refused, to lose. Only one place to learn that most invaluable of all lessons.[/quote]
I didn’t mention football once, Allan.

[NotCranky]

[quote=Allan from Fallbrook][quote=edna_mode]I’m one of those girls who practiced tae kwon do as a kid, and then migrated to aikido in my adulthood. I was one of the few girls who stuck for longer than a few months, and I vividly remember one girl who was using the testosterone imbalance to her advantage, practicing her flirting skills more than her punches. Needless to say, I would pound her whenever we sparred.

It was good preparation for going into male-dominated professions. However, I will also say that the same behavior (extremely decisive attitude, ability to think and articulate clearly and independently) gets interpreted very differently when exhibited by boys vs. girls. I try to steer towards environments where these qualities are appreciated in men and women. But there are still a lot of regressive enclaves (and you have to suss out certain personalities, even in the better places) where the ability to couch these strengths in diplomacy, request language vs. demands, willingness to convince others slowly rather than lay out all the logic and expect others to capitulate their clearly less defensible position…well, let’s just say that learning *persuasion* by means other than strict force or logic is one of the reasons I switched martial arts.[/quote]

Edna: Interesting post and I enjoyed your parsing in terms of using your particular skillset.

My dad, a former Marine DI, used to refer to the “scalpel and the sledgehammer” when I was growing up. I did martial arts (karate, boxing and Kendo), as well as played football and then the Army. What I found when I got to the corporate world was that there are far more tools than just a scalpel or sledgehammer and that diplomacy and building a reasoned case for action went far further and was appreciated far more (than the autocratic “diktat” approach).

The most successful leaders I worked with were true consensus builders, but not afraid to be forceful and decisive when the time came. Those that bullied subordinates and underlings and used fear as motivator (“The beatings will continue until morale improves!”) were generally not rewarded with hard work and loyalty.

I agree with some of what Russell is saying about football, in terms of some of the negative lessons (might makes right and the use of physical intimidation), but I think, in his broad brush approach, he misses the far more important lessons that football (and other sports) imparts: Teamwork, character built through adversity, striving for a common goal and the absolutely repulsive taste of losing. I can remember picking myself up off the turf and wanting nothing more than to quit and go home, but I refused, absolutely refused, to lose. Only one place to learn that most invaluable of all lessons.[/quote]
I didn’t mention football once, Allan.

[NotCranky]

[quote=Allan from Fallbrook][quote=edna_mode]I’m one of those girls who practiced tae kwon do as a kid, and then migrated to aikido in my adulthood. I was one of the few girls who stuck for longer than a few months, and I vividly remember one girl who was using the testosterone imbalance to her advantage, practicing her flirting skills more than her punches. Needless to say, I would pound her whenever we sparred.

It was good preparation for going into male-dominated professions. However, I will also say that the same behavior (extremely decisive attitude, ability to think and articulate clearly and independently) gets interpreted very differently when exhibited by boys vs. girls. I try to steer towards environments where these qualities are appreciated in men and women. But there are still a lot of regressive enclaves (and you have to suss out certain personalities, even in the better places) where the ability to couch these strengths in diplomacy, request language vs. demands, willingness to convince others slowly rather than lay out all the logic and expect others to capitulate their clearly less defensible position…well, let’s just say that learning *persuasion* by means other than strict force or logic is one of the reasons I switched martial arts.[/quote]

Edna: Interesting post and I enjoyed your parsing in terms of using your particular skillset.

My dad, a former Marine DI, used to refer to the “scalpel and the sledgehammer” when I was growing up. I did martial arts (karate, boxing and Kendo), as well as played football and then the Army. What I found when I got to the corporate world was that there are far more tools than just a scalpel or sledgehammer and that diplomacy and building a reasoned case for action went far further and was appreciated far more (than the autocratic “diktat” approach).

The most successful leaders I worked with were true consensus builders, but not afraid to be forceful and decisive when the time came. Those that bullied subordinates and underlings and used fear as motivator (“The beatings will continue until morale improves!”) were generally not rewarded with hard work and loyalty.

I agree with some of what Russell is saying about football, in terms of some of the negative lessons (might makes right and the use of physical intimidation), but I think, in his broad brush approach, he misses the far more important lessons that football (and other sports) imparts: Teamwork, character built through adversity, striving for a common goal and the absolutely repulsive taste of losing. I can remember picking myself up off the turf and wanting nothing more than to quit and go home, but I refused, absolutely refused, to lose. Only one place to learn that most invaluable of all lessons.[/quote]
I didn’t mention football once, Allan.

[scaredyclassic]

There’s a lot to be said for graceful losing as much of life is spent losing.

[scaredyclassic]

There’s a lot to be said for graceful losing as much of life is spent losing.

[scaredyclassic]

There’s a lot to be said for graceful losing as much of life is spent losing.

[scaredyclassic]

There’s a lot to be said for graceful losing as much of life is spent losing.

[scaredyclassic]

There’s a lot to be said for graceful losing as much of life is spent losing.

[Allan from Fallbrook]

[quote=Russell]
I didn’t mention football once, Allan.[/quote]

Gee, Russell, when you referred to the “national sports obsession”, I figured you were including the most popular (and aggressive) sport in America. You know: Football?

Of course, I’m sure the Marine Corps just loves basketball and baseball players, too.

Ask any Army or USMC recruiter about their favorite sport (from a “raw material” standpoint) and they’ll all answer the same: Football. It stresses unquestioning obedience to authority, sacrifice for the team and the warrior ethos. That was what you were referring to, right?

[Allan from Fallbrook]

[quote=Russell]
I didn’t mention football once, Allan.[/quote]

Gee, Russell, when you referred to the “national sports obsession”, I figured you were including the most popular (and aggressive) sport in America. You know: Football?

Of course, I’m sure the Marine Corps just loves basketball and baseball players, too.

Ask any Army or USMC recruiter about their favorite sport (from a “raw material” standpoint) and they’ll all answer the same: Football. It stresses unquestioning obedience to authority, sacrifice for the team and the warrior ethos. That was what you were referring to, right?

[Allan from Fallbrook]

[quote=Russell]
I didn’t mention football once, Allan.[/quote]

Gee, Russell, when you referred to the “national sports obsession”, I figured you were including the most popular (and aggressive) sport in America. You know: Football?

Of course, I’m sure the Marine Corps just loves basketball and baseball players, too.

Ask any Army or USMC recruiter about their favorite sport (from a “raw material” standpoint) and they’ll all answer the same: Football. It stresses unquestioning obedience to authority, sacrifice for the team and the warrior ethos. That was what you were referring to, right?

[Allan from Fallbrook]

[quote=Russell]
I didn’t mention football once, Allan.[/quote]

Gee, Russell, when you referred to the “national sports obsession”, I figured you were including the most popular (and aggressive) sport in America. You know: Football?

Of course, I’m sure the Marine Corps just loves basketball and baseball players, too.

Ask any Army or USMC recruiter about their favorite sport (from a “raw material” standpoint) and they’ll all answer the same: Football. It stresses unquestioning obedience to authority, sacrifice for the team and the warrior ethos. That was what you were referring to, right?

[Author]

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