How much did you pay for solar?

[skerzz]

Any reputable Solar company will not suggest that you install solar unless your SDGE electric bill (excluding gas) is in excess of $125/month. So I agree, as do most in the industry, that solar does not make sense in your situation.

I live in an area that does not have access to SDGE gas service. My wife and I with one infant child were running SDGE bills in excess of $250/month without using the A/C (the unit was non-functional). To reduce my SDGE bills down to a more reasonable level, I would have had to put in new insulation ($3K+), replace the single pane windows ($8K+), put a new energy efficient A/C and air handler ($10K+), take cold showers, and possibly install a propane tank/run gas lines, and replace water heater, dryer, stove-top to run on propane ($expensive).

Instead (and for less money), I installed a solar system for $23K (after tax credits) that reduces my SDGE bill to $0 and paid less than $1,500 to replace my A/C with one of those out-dated, but brand new, energy inefficient R-22 A/C units that works with my air handler (luckily I’ve got a family connection in the industry that was able to get one of these units for me). I now use as much energy as I want without pause and have locked my $0 SDGE bill in for the next 20+ years. Perhaps in the future I’ll make the energy efficiency home improvements you suggested and use the savings to charge an electric and reduce my monthly payment to the local Chevron station.

Not all buyers are the same, but if deciding between two identical houses, I’d definitely assign a premium to the one without an SDGE bill.

[bearishgurl]

[quote=skerzz]Any reputable Solar company will not suggest that you install solar unless your SDGE electric bill (excluding gas) is in excess of $125/month. So I agree, as do most in the industry, that solar does not make sense in your situation.

I live in an area that does not have access to SDGE gas service. My wife and I with one infant child were running SDGE bills in excess of $250/month without using the A/C (the unit was non-functional). To reduce my SDGE bills down to a more reasonable level, I would have had to put in new insulation ($3K+), replace the single pane windows ($8K+), put a new energy efficient A/C and air handler ($10K+), take cold showers, and possibly install a propane tank/run gas lines, and replace water heater, dryer, stove-top to run on propane ($expensive).

Instead (and for less money), I installed a solar system for $23K (after tax credits) that reduces my SDGE bill to $0 and paid less than $1,500 to replace my A/C with one of those out-dated, but brand new, energy inefficient R-22 A/C units that works with my air handler (luckily I’ve got a family connection in the industry that was able to get one of these units for me). I now use as much energy as I want without pause and have locked my $0 SDGE bill in for the next 20+ years. Perhaps in the future I’ll make the energy efficiency home improvements you suggested and use the savings to charge an electric and reduce my monthly payment to the local Chevron station.

Not all buyers are the same, but if deciding between two identical houses, I’d definitely assign a premium to the one without an SDGE bill.[/quote]

skerzz, do you live somewhere in the mtns? Wildcat Cyn or Pine Valley, possibly …?

[skerzz]

When you are under a net energy metering (“NEM”) agreement, SDGE will net your monthly over/under production on an annual basis and bill or refund on the net amount. ex. If I use 1,000kWh more than I produce Jan – May, and produce 900kWh more than I use June – December, I’ll pay SDGE for the 100kWh at the annual true-up period. I believe there’s a cap on the amount of systems that can be installed under the current NEM agreement, so these rules may be changing soon (my understanding is that the new NEM agreement will not be as favorable as the current NEM).

[an]

[quote=Clifford]>> SDG&E pay you back in wholesale price
>> (which is lower than $0.17/kWh you’re paying for Tier 1),
>> so it’s not a good ROI to get a system that over produce.

When you have net metering, how does SDG&E determines that your system is over producing ? Because, you could be over producing one month & then under producing another month.[/quote]From month to month, it averages out. But I think at the end of the year, if you have a surplus, they’ll pay you out. Don’t quote me on this, since my system doesn’t over produce. On months where I over produce, it keep on adding up until months where I under produce and the the kWh will be used.

[skerzz]

That’s correct. You get full retail billing credit for the energy produced up to the point where you are a net zero energy user. If you’re left with overproduction at the end of the true-up period you get paid out at some reduced rate (not full retail). I have not had my system on for the full year, so I can’t tell you what that reduce rate is, but I know it’s not enough to justify (financially) purchasing a system that overproduces.

[skerzz]

AN,
I’m in the Coronado Hills Neighborhood of San Marcos (epicenter of last year’s Cocos fire).

[bearishgurl]

[quote=skerzz]Coronado Hills Neighborhood of San Marcos (epicenter of last year’s Cocos fire).[/quote]

skerzz, is the fire the reason you no longer have gas service or were gas lines never installed there?

I seem to remember that area was near (or overlooking) CSUSM (predated CSUSM) … not sure.

I guess you must be paying $3K+ yr homeowner’s insurance premiums as well … with a limited selection of carriers to choose from ….

[skerzz]

[quote=bearishgurl][quote=skerzz]Coronado Hills Neighborhood of San Marcos (epicenter of last year’s Cocos fire).[/quote]

skerzz, is the fire the reason you no longer have gas service or were gas lines never installed there?

I seem to remember that area was near (or overlooking) CSUSM (predated CSUSM) … not sure.

I guess you must be paying $3K+ yr homeowner’s insurance premiums as well … with a limited selection of carriers to choose from ….[/quote]

An,

SDGE only provides electrical service to the area (gas lines never put in), so it’s all electrical unless you pay for a propane tank. That’s the area. The west side of the hill overlooks CSUSM and the east side looks out over parts of San Marcos, Escondido, Ramona, Poway.

I’m insured through statefarm for less than $2K per year. I’m a loyal customer with several policies and they have always treated me right. Not sure if it would be difficult to find another insurer because of the recent fires (the risk of fire is low now that all the brush has burned)…I’ve haven’t tried since statefarm is one of the few insurers that doesn’t discriminate against dog breeds (I have a “scary” rottweiler).

[LAAFTERHOURS]

[quote=skerzz]When you are under a net energy metering (“NEM”) agreement, SDGE will net your monthly over/under production on an annual basis and bill or refund on the net amount. ex. If I use 1,000kWh more than I produce Jan – May, and produce 900kWh more than I use June – December, I’ll pay SDGE for the 100kWh at the annual true-up period. I believe there’s a cap on the amount of systems that can be installed under the current NEM agreement, so these rules may be changing soon (my understanding is that the new NEM agreement will not be as favorable as the current NEM).[/quote]

best site for all of these answers is solarpaneltalk.com. Based upon a thread in that forum, the NEM will run out middle of 2016 at its current install rate. The rate you get at the end of a 12 month period is something like 35 cents so yes better than tier 1 but not enough to make up for oversizing considerably.

[skerzz]

[quote=LAAFTERHOURS][quote=skerzz]When you are under a net energy metering (“NEM”) agreement, SDGE will net your monthly over/under production on an annual basis and bill or refund on the net amount. ex. If I use 1,000kWh more than I produce Jan – May, and produce 900kWh more than I use June – December, I’ll pay SDGE for the 100kWh at the annual true-up period. I believe there’s a cap on the amount of systems that can be installed under the current NEM agreement, so these rules may be changing soon (my understanding is that the new NEM agreement will not be as favorable as the current NEM).[/quote]

best site for all of these answers is solarpaneltalk.com. Based upon a thread in that forum, the NEM will run out middle of 2016 at its current install rate. The rate you get at the end of a 12 month period is something like 35 cents so yes better than tier 1 but not enough to make up for oversizing considerably.[/quote]

Per SDGE, the rate paid for excess is somewhere around .04 per kWh. Tier 1 rates are .17 per kWh. Cost of solar per kWh is somewhere in the range of .06 – .07 per kwh in Southern CA, so it’s not economical to pay for a system that overproduces.

Per the SDGE website (http://www.sdge.com/clean-energy/excess-generation-credit/annual-compensation-excess-generation):

“Compensation is made up of two components, one for the wholesale value of the commodity, and one for the Renewable Energy Credit (REC). The wholesale compensation price is a rolling average based on the utility’s Default Load Aggregation Point (DLAP) price from 7 a.m. to 5 p.m. This is a wholesale market price that the utility pays other generators. It’s currently averaging just under 4 cents per kWh. Your account will automatically be credited for the wholesale value should there be any excess generation after your annual true-up. We’ll multiply the number of excess kWh you have by the average price applicable to your true-up month. See true-up table below.”

[bearishgurl]

[quote=skerzz][quote=bearishgurl][quote=skerzz]Coronado Hills Neighborhood of San Marcos (epicenter of last year’s Cocos fire).[/quote]

skerzz, is the fire the reason you no longer have gas service or were gas lines never installed there?

I seem to remember that area was near (or overlooking) CSUSM (predated CSUSM) … not sure.

I guess you must be paying $3K+ yr homeowner’s insurance premiums as well … with a limited selection of carriers to choose from ….[/quote]

An,

SDGE only provides electrical service to the area (gas lines never put in), so it’s all electrical unless you pay for a propane tank. That’s the area. The west side of the hill overlooks CSUSM and the east side looks out over parts of San Marcos, Escondido, Ramona, Poway.

I’m insured through statefarm for less than $2K per year. I’m a loyal customer with several policies and they have always treated me right. Not sure if it would be difficult to find another insurer because of the recent fires (the risk of fire is low now that all the brush has burned)…I’ve haven’t tried since statefarm is one of the few insurers that doesn’t discriminate against dog breeds (I have a “scary” rottweiler).[/quote]

Oh, I just remember the area where the fire started from the TV coverage. That’s great your home is still eligible for coverage by a well-known, reputable carrier, skerzz. <$2K yr is not too bad for a fire prone area. I pay <$1K yr for a Farmer's "Protector Plus" (replacement value) policy but I live in an urban area which is not close to any fire-prone areas. I find it odd that your micro area does not have access to natural gas. Did your area predate the incorporation of SM? Is there a reason that gas lines could not be dug there? Maybe other longtime SM dwellers can shed light as to why .... svelte??

[Clifford]

[quote=skerzz]That’s correct. You get full retail billing credit for the energy produced up to the point where you are a net zero energy user. If you’re left with overproduction at the end of the true-up period you get paid out at some reduced rate (not full retail). I have not had my system on for the full year, so I can’t tell you what that reduce rate is, but I know it’s not enough to justify (financially) purchasing a system that overproduces.[/quote]

>> … at the end of the true-up period

Is this the same as the end of the calendar year ?

[bearishgurl]

Gas is more economical than electricity, esp in SD County. And gas cooktops, gas water heaters, gas dryers and gas furnaces are superior to electric models, IMO. I’ve never lived anyplace in SD County where I wasn’t able to have all of the above items in my home.

[skerzz]

[quote=bearishgurl]Gas is more economical than electricity, esp in SD County. And gas cooktops, gas water heaters and gas dryers are superior to electric models, IMO. I’ve never lived anyplace in SD County where I wasn’t able to have the above three items in my home.[/quote]

I used to think the same way. But decided the trade-offs (Huge view, lot size, wildlife, etc) were worth it. I don’t notice the difference in the dryer and water heater, but I do occasionally miss having a gas range.

[skerzz]

[quote=Clifford][quote=skerzz]That’s correct. You get full retail billing credit for the energy produced up to the point where you are a net zero energy user. If you’re left with overproduction at the end of the true-up period you get paid out at some reduced rate (not full retail). I have not had my system on for the full year, so I can’t tell you what that reduce rate is, but I know it’s not enough to justify (financially) purchasing a system that overproduces.[/quote]

>> … at the end of the true-up period

Is this the same as the end of the calendar year ?[/quote]

The true up period corresponds with when you entered the NEM agreement (date solar was installed).

[Author]

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