CA passed “Anti-Arizona” law to shield illegals

[Anonymous]

Sure there is a huge underground economy that is not taken into account by the immigration policy.

But for the illegal immigration appologists, their main argument is that these are jobs that nobody else will do. Or the argument that without illegals we will pay twice as much for a box of strawberries. In other words, their fundamental assumption is that effectively our society is so dependent on cheap illegal immigrant behavior that that we can’t survive without it.

That is a fundamental assumption that I don’t agree with. But granted, if the government really decided to enforce immigration employment, they may need to make policy adjustments to offer more seasonal employment Visa for agricultural workers, etc.

But my fundamental viewpoint has always been that any particular business or industry in the U.S. that is reliant on illegal immigrant workers to survive is simply not a viable business and should fail. So what if we can’t harvest affordable strawberries? If they are too expenseive here then import them from Mexico. That way Mexican farm workers can actually find work in their own country.. what a concept. The only people truly benefiting from the illegal workers here are the rich business owners.

[svelte]

You, madam, are prejudiced.

[quote=ninaprincess]
#1 Most illegals have extremely low income at or near minimum wage.
I could find some sources but I don’t need to. I can’t imagine the income of people picking fruits, wash dishes, clean hotel rooms, stand around home depots are high.
[/quote]

Usually, the first generation of immigrants from ANY part of the world do the lower end jobs. Italians, Irish, Chinese, you name it…they took lower end jobs just to make ends meet in this land of opportunity.

[quote=ninaprincess]
#2
“Half of illegal children fail to graduate from HS.”
41 percent of all Mexicans between ages 16 and 19 in the city [of NY] have dropped out of school, according to census data.

This is for all Mexicans, legal and illegal. I am sure the dropout percentage of illegal only is higher.
[/quote]

So you exhaggerated. Your original post did not specify it was NYC only – and it stated a figure of 41%, not half.

Second I know a few illegal immigrants. And I can tell you they are the hardest working people I know. They are good, decent, people who work twice as hard as most American citizens that I know. Whether they have a degree or not.

[quote=ninaprincess]
#3 “Most of the gangsters in this states are illegals or children of illegals.”
http://www.judicialwatch.org/blog/2009/01/illegal-immigrant-gangs-commit-most-u-s-crime/
[/quote]

The link to the study sited in the article is broken. You still need to provide a reference…

[quote=ninaprincess]
#4
“How often you see illegals with one or two children walking beside them, one in a stroller, one in their arms, and one in the belly”
The children of illegal immigrants accounted for 8 percent of all babies, even though those immigrants are about 4 percent of the adult population.
http://articles.orlandosentinel.com/2010-08-12/news/os-illegal-immigration-children-20100811_1_illegal-immigrants-immigrant-advocates-center-for-immigration-studies
[/quote]

You fail to mention why babies are a bad thing. And once you do come up with a reason, you need to tell the Catholic Church.

[quote=ninaprincess]
#5
“Of course, with their diet consist mostly of KFC , Tamales and sodas they will be obese”
http://johnshopkins.academia.edu/GilbertoLopez/Papers/318437/_Why_are_we_so_Fat_Mexican_Immigrant_Perceptions_of_Obesity_in_Californias_Central_Valley%5B/quote%5D

I see your point. We should ban all overweight people from the country. Let’s start by looking through YOUR family tree.

Seriously, posts like this make me want to puke.

As a coincidence, I’ve been tracing back my family tree this year. Several branches of that tree came across the Atlantic in the early 1600s. They came to a place that did not give them permission to come – they had no visas and the Indian natives fought them tremendously – several of my relatives were killed or injured by Indians. Yet we now sit here full of pomp and prejudice spewing half truths or shaded truths to justify keeping others out.

[Anonymous]

[quote=deadzone]Or the argument that without illegals we will pay twice as much for a box of strawberries. In other words, their fundamental assumption is that effectively our society is so dependent on cheap illegal immigrant behavior that that we can’t survive without it.[/quote]

Let me rephrase that for you. Removing the hyperbole:

– The group of people we call “illegals” impose an economic cost on our society.

– They also bring economic benefits.

Do the costs outweigh the benefits? You’ll get dramatically answers depending upon who you ask.

I’m not convinced that the costs are that high. Even if there is a net cost, I’m also not sure the costs are higher than the cost of trying to prevent it (e.g. the solution could be worse than the problem.)

[Hobie]

Nice accurate summary Cra. But remember that the Reagan amnesty was to, ‘wipe the slate clean’ and to prove that the GOP could reach across the aisle and compromise.

Problem is that the Fed’s never followed up with effective border control and enforcement and the problem resurfaced and ballooned.

I think this perceived giving in by the GOP with no benefit is one of the current contributing factors as to why the GOP is not willing to compromise much these days.

[sdduuuude]

Won’t be too long before a good concrete work costs $50 an hour in AZ and $5/hr in CA.

[Anonymous]

[quote=ninaprincess]With the percentage of low income, lack of education, high crime, and high cost (# of children, obesity) population increasing I think this state is going down the drain. Let’s address each of these issues:

1. Most illegals have extremely low income at or near minimum wage.
2. Half of illegal children fail to graduate from HS.
3. Most of the gangsters in this states are illegals or children of illegals. Have you been to Santa Ana, Compton or Los Angeles lately?
4. How often you see illegals with one or two children walking beside them, one in a stroller, one in their arms, and one in the belly?
5. Of course, with their diet consist mostly of KFC , Tamales and sodas they will be obese.

So while they pay almost nothing in Taxes, they send their numerous children to schools with minimal results, they crowded our jails and hospitals and our politicians continue to cater to them. With the Unions already draining our budget, obviously this doesn’t work for too long.[/quote]

And the problem is?????

[Anonymous]

[quote=svelte]You, madam, are prejudiced.

[quote=ninaprincess]
#1 Most illegals have extremely low income at or near minimum wage.
I could find some sources but I don’t need to. I can’t imagine the income of people picking fruits, wash dishes, clean hotel rooms, stand around home depots are high.
[/quote]

Usually, the first generation of immigrants from ANY part of the world do the lower end jobs. Italians, Irish, Chinese, you name it…they took lower end jobs just to make ends meet in this land of opportunity.

[quote=ninaprincess]
#2
“Half of illegal children fail to graduate from HS.”
41 percent of all Mexicans between ages 16 and 19 in the city [of NY] have dropped out of school, according to census data.

This is for all Mexicans, legal and illegal. I am sure the dropout percentage of illegal only is higher.
[/quote]

So you exhaggerated. Your original post did not specify it was NYC only – and it stated a figure of 41%, not half.

Second I know a few illegal immigrants. And I can tell you they are the hardest working people I know. They are good, decent, people who work twice as hard as most American citizens that I know. Whether they have a degree or not.

[quote=ninaprincess]
#3 “Most of the gangsters in this states are illegals or children of illegals.”
http://www.judicialwatch.org/blog/2009/01/illegal-immigrant-gangs-commit-most-u-s-crime/
[/quote]

The link to the study sited in the article is broken. You still need to provide a reference…

[quote=ninaprincess]
#4
“How often you see illegals with one or two children walking beside them, one in a stroller, one in their arms, and one in the belly”
The children of illegal immigrants accounted for 8 percent of all babies, even though those immigrants are about 4 percent of the adult population.
http://articles.orlandosentinel.com/2010-08-12/news/os-illegal-immigration-children-20100811_1_illegal-immigrants-immigrant-advocates-center-for-immigration-studies
[/quote]

You fail to mention why babies are a bad thing. And once you do come up with a reason, you need to tell the Catholic Church.

[quote=ninaprincess]
#5
“Of course, with their diet consist mostly of KFC , Tamales and sodas they will be obese”
http://johnshopkins.academia.edu/GilbertoLopez/Papers/318437/_Why_are_we_so_Fat_Mexican_Immigrant_Perceptions_of_Obesity_in_Californias_Central_Valley%5B/quote%5D

I see your point. We should ban all overweight people from the country. Let’s start by looking through YOUR family tree.

Seriously, posts like this make me want to puke.

As a coincidence, I’ve been tracing back my family tree this year. Several branches of that tree came across the Atlantic in the early 1600s. They came to a place that did not give them permission to come – they had no visas and the Indian natives fought them tremendously – several of my relatives were killed or injured by Indians. Yet we now sit here full of pomp and prejudice spewing half truths or shaded truths to justify keeping others out.[/quote]

And how did that “illegal immigration” thing work out for those Native Americans?

[CA renter]

Lots of good information about gangs here:

There are approximately 1.4 million active street, prison, and OMG gang members comprising more than 33,000 gangs in the United States. Gang membership increased most significantly in the Northeast and Southeast regions, although the West and Great Lakes regions boast the highest number of gang members. Neighborhood-based gangs, hybrid gang members, and national-level gangs such as the Sureños are rapidly expanding in many jurisdictions. Many communities are also experiencing an increase in ethnic-based gangs such as African, Asian, Caribbean, and Eurasian gangs.

Gangs are responsible for an average of 48 percent of violent crime in most jurisdictions and up to 90 percent in several others, according to NGIC analysis. Major cities and suburban areas experience the most gang-related violence. Local neighborhood-based gangs and drug crews continue to pose the most significant criminal threat in most communities. Aggressive recruitment of juveniles and immigrants, alliances and conflict between gangs, the release of incarcerated gang members from prison, advancements in technology and communication, and Mexican Drug Trafficking Organization (MDTO) involvement in drug distribution have resulted in gang expansion and violence in a number of jurisdictions.

http://www.fbi.gov/stats-services/publications/2011-national-gang-threat-assessment/

This is already outdated. It would be interesting to see current numbers:

Age and race/ethnicity of gang members were measured in the
1996, 1998, and 1999 surveys. In 1996, respondents reported
that 50 percent of gang members were juveniles (i.e., younger
than 18) and 50 percent were adults (i.e., 18 and older). In 1999,
these numbers were 37 percent and 63 percent, respectively. In
1999, respondents reported that 47 percent of gang members were
Hispanic, 31 percent African American, 13 percent white, 7 percent
Asian, and 2 percent “other.” The distribution of race/ethnicity of
gang members varied little across measurement years.

https://www.ncjrs.gov/pdffiles1/ojjdp/fs200203.pdf
————————-

We can keep pretending that it’s not a problem, though. Wouldn’t want to offend anyone or seem “politically incorrect,” now would we? Perhaps if we bury our heads in the sand, these issues will all fix themselves.

[Author]

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