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[quote=bearishgurl]The CA DMV has been cracking down Big Time on older vehicles for a few years now (except those vehicles legally considered “Antiques”) and have stepped up their “inspection criteria” of what constitutes a biennial “smog check.” The state is obviously attempting to make it really hard for Joe and Suzy 6pack to keep driving their $2-$6K vehicles to work and back.[/quote]I’ve noticed that. It seems that they are more interested in forcing people to buy new cars than reducing smog. The most recent change in testing actually bans catalytic converters on cars that were not originally built with them. They also make it nearly impossible to convert an open loop carburetor system to closed loop fuel injection system.

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[quote=UCGal]I’m on the fence whether it’s justifiable to run over people. I go back and firth on that. Mostly I understand the panic Lien felt. But it’s not clearcut to me whether he broke a law in his panic… He might have… Justifiable/understandable as it is.[/quote]For me, it depends if he was in reasonable fear of his life. Considering what was happening when he was stopped, how he was stopped, how they behaved, and that none of the bikers called 911, while Lien was ringing it off the hook.. I think it was reasonable. If you want to kill someone, using a biker gang with blacked out visors and no plates is a good way to accomplish it. How are you going to describe who did it? No plate number, nothing unique on the jackets, no visual of the driver because the visors are blacked out..

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[quote=no_such_reality][quote=ucodegen][quote=FlyerInHi]In the NYC incident, what if a biker had a gun and shot the driver because he “feared for his life” after then driver ran over the other guy?

Btw, I have several guns.[/quote]BTW, I drive a big freakin truck powered by a drag boat engine (big block). All the biker had to do is call it in. Put some throttle to the bike and the Range Rover couldn’t catch them. It would be harder to outrun my truck. Look up ‘Farm Truck’ on youtube. That is what old bigblocks are like when unleashed or tuned. That old red truck is his daily driver, his dog runs shotgun.

By the way, if you instigate a conflict, you can’t then kill claiming you feared for your life. And again, the biker has the option of applying throttle. The defense/fear for ones life needs to be plausible.[/quote]

Mease, the crippled biker, wasn’t breaking any laws and didn’t start any conflict. There is no law against bikes riding together. The police only denied them a permit for Times Square.[/quote]Associating with those committing a criminal act, while committing a criminal act is illegal. There is no law against bikes riding together. Standing in front of a vehicle, preventing it from moving on the highway is illegal.. and you better have a very good reason to do it, ie. the driver was drunk (I wouldn’t stand in front of a drunk drivers car). There are a lot of anti-gang laws that can be applied. Add to it, lack of license, blocked from getting a license till 2017, never had motorcycle license, no license plate on motorcycle.. he is pretty well done.

[quote=no_such_reality]Mease did confront Lein, while riding, Mease stopped after any after an accident to render assistance to a downed and injured motorcyclist. Obviously Mease was thinking appropriate, because there were off duty police officers in the group and they weren’t reporting anything.[/quote]He claims.. problem is that he has a habit of not telling the truth. The problem is that the group he was with was committing a illegal if not criminal act. The other problem is that the lookback on the video shows that the biker in white with black jacked was not hit – the Range Rover had hit its brakes hard. I suspect you have never had a vehicle ride up on your rear tire when riding a motorcycle. You stop instantly because on a high clearance vehicle, the vehicle can ride up on top of the motorcycle tire. The tire is now pinched between the road and SUV. It wants to stop turning at that point (back of motorcycle tire travels up and top of tire travels uproad, helping the SUV bumper ride up on top of the tire).

NOTE: Note bumper height on a high clearance vehicle is not the same as on a car.

No such ka-ching.

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[quote=6packscaredy]If the shutdown is the solution there will be no more governance by majority.[/quote]No, it demonstrates that what was once the majority, is no longer. Don’t forget the effects of swing voters. The House changes faster than the Senate due to the length of term in office and how often we vote for them.
[quote=NicMM]Back to the health care cost. In Bay Area, I found there are some for profit doctor groups which don’t take insurance at all. But their charges are very reasonable. I took my foreign visiting family members there, the visit is $90 each. Lab work is a little over $100. Medicines like antibiotics, blood pressure medicine or Lipitor is $10 ~ $15 a bottle. It is totally affordable to go there.[/quote]I found something similar when I told places that I would pay cash.. that they did not have to deal with insurance.

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[quote=zk]
I think you could also say, “no politician ever lost a race underestimating the intelligence of the American public.”[/quote]
That one can bite both ways w/ respect to Obama, Obamacare, GOP.. you name it.

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[quote=SK in CV]See §3025 regarding hospital readmission penalties.

The MLR floors cap the insurance premiums, thereby reducing overall cost of medical insurance. Medical insurance is an element of total medical costs.[/quote]I’ll look at the section later.. tis late. on the MLR, it only caps the ‘skim’ of the insurance companies.

Dealing with Hospital Readmission could bite both ways. By the title/description, doesn’t deal much with direct costs.. but will take a look.

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[quote=FlyerInHi]The guy who slammed his brakes is not the guy who was run over.
That’s why Gloria will likely get a big settlement.

If Alexian is a business executive he should have good insurance. But wait… He’s Chinese, so maybe he just has the minimum (pardon the joke, flu).[/quote]From who? He was engaged in illegal activities and can not profit from said activities. He was part of the group blocking, and was himself blocking the Range Rover during the first part of the attack. He is complicit.

I think Allred jumped in w/o doing all the DD.

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[quote=no_such_reality]Did you hear that? That was Gloria cash register clocking up another major payday.

Why? Well, the PD was present. An off duty cop was part of the bike group, did nothing and failed to report the incident until Wednesday! Chaching![/quote]That sounds like Allred. Blame the police for not protecting criminals from the consequences of their own bad behavior.

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[quote=FlyerInHi]In the NYC incident, what if a biker had a gun and shot the driver because he “feared for his life” after then driver ran over the other guy?

Btw, I have several guns.[/quote]BTW, I drive a big freakin truck powered by a drag boat engine (big block). All the biker had to do is call it in. Put some throttle to the bike and the Range Rover couldn’t catch them. It would be harder to outrun my truck. Look up ‘Farm Truck’ on youtube. That is what old bigblocks are like when unleashed or tuned. That old red truck is his daily driver, his dog runs shotgun.

By the way, if you instigate a conflict, you can’t then kill claiming you feared for your life. And again, the biker has the option of applying throttle. The defense/fear for ones life needs to be plausible.

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[quote=Jazzman]The SUV looks to be too close to a motorcycle in front. The biker in the white shirt seems to be remonstrating with him about it and then stupidly pulls on his brakes too hard probably not giving enough space and time for the SUV to avoid a collision.[/quote]Do you want to be added to the list of idiots? Take a full look at the video. I captured/downloaded it and used a viewer that allowed me to single frame. The guy in white with black vest moved into the SUV drivers lane from the left while parallel and next to the SUV. I even gave the timestamp. Do you want me to go and even get the video frame number of when the guy in white with black vest made the illegal lane change? This is why that guy is currently arrested. Turns out that the charges are very similar to the ones I mentioned.
[quote=Jazzman]The SUV wasn’t the only car on the road so it wasn’t his mere presence. A white van pulls passed just after the altercation.[/quote] No joke.. that is why, combined with the lack of license plates on the bikes and blacked out visors.. that it starts getting suspicious for a likely ‘shakedown’.
[quote=Jazzman]I am a biker and there has always been tension between bikes and cars. 90% of bike accidents are caused by cars (according to the DMV).[/quote]Not from what I have seen. This is piggington.. show data.
What I have seen so far from DMV would seem to indicate otherwise. Still looking for actual statistics, but this does not look good for motorcycle drivers.

Motorcycle drivers had approximately twice as many accidents and convictions as passenger car drivers. The data also revealed motorcycle drivers have a higher accident and conviction rate (per unit of exposure) while driving a motorcycle than a passenger car.

http://apps.dmv.ca.gov/about/profile/rd/r_d_report/Section_4/S4-28.1.pdf

Definitely not good:

In 2010, 79 percent of motorcycle operators involved in fatal collisions were at fault and 57 percent of motorcycle operators involved in injury collisions were at fault.

http://www.ots.ca.gov/OTS_and_Traffic_Safety/Report_Card.asp
Search for part of quote above on page – you’ll find it.

Now you REALLY understand the animosity. Take the rose colored glasses off. You may not be a problem biker, but many of your ‘brothers’ are.

[quote=Jazzman]The question is: as the media circus and litigation hucksters twist and distort will the truth ever emerge?[/quote]It already has.. but you don’t want to accept it.

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[quote=ocrenter]2. Actual intent of the break check to draw contact is not known. Two possibilities, one is simply they were annoyed he did not move to the side of the road and allow the “Hollywood Stuntz” crew to own the entire highway, the other possibility was they targeted him for a shake down fee because of the luxury SUV.[/quote]I suspect that it was a shakedown.. but really can’t prove it. They made effort to conceal their identities (missing plates, dark visors), and didn’t target the white panel van that was to the right of Lien’s Range Rover. Guy in White Panel van not rich, asian in black Range Rover – he rich and timid eh? You can see the panel van leaving the scene unmolested.

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[quote=FlyerInHi]uco, I don’t dispute that the bikers chased the SUV. Some bikers chased and others just followed.[/quote]Why did they follow what is a bad situation going worse? Just break off and report it.
[quote=FlyerInHi]But what caused them to so so (before the video)? We can only presume. The Facebook entry flu posted suggests some biker gangs chase and stop expensive cars to extort money. The facts don’t prove that. [/quote]
I didn’t bring this up.. you did. I made no mention of it. I just very clearly pointed out VC violations in the driving of the motorcycle group. If Lien was driving wildly, hit the throttle and leave him in the dust! You don’t ‘cluster around’ an SUV driver if you are driving a motorcycle. It is simply not safe given the weight difference. The fact that they were clustering around him told me that they figured that Lien was intimidated and not a risk, also probably not a ‘crazy driver’. You don’t drive a motorcycle next to a crazy SUV driver unless you have a death wish. One collision and the motorcycle loses. Your statement is inane! The bikers made a decision to mass around the Range Rover. Remember – if someone gets injured in what is a group activity, particularly an illegal activity: all of the participants can be charged! If Mieses dies, all of the bikers can be charged in Murder or Manslaughter.
[quote=FlyerInHi]There maybe more to it. But I don’t think flu’s conclusions are based on facts. Flu might be right but he’s presuming a lot. Plus his rants make him seem a little wacko.[/quote]No, he is probably a bit pissed off because he could see being in that position. You also seem to be ignoring the video and the activity. The biker in white with black vest never got hit.. he was still on his bike. He also instigated it. There is no justification. Since many of the bikers had running cameras, all they had to do is report it and show the video – done deal – if the Range Rover was truely driving erratically.. but the bikers want to ‘review’ their videos – WRONG! you don’t get to selectively edit evidence.

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[quote=FlyerInHi]Flu, I don’t think the MSM is liberal. They are mainstream and they represent mainstream opinion of justice and decency. Neither liberal not conservative.[/quote] Not to cause a flame, but it has been shown to have a slightly liberal bent in the US. Fox is the counter to it.. with a conservative bent. Of course the perceived tendency of the media to go liberal or conservative depends upon the tendency of the viewer. A liberal will view mainstream media as middle of the road, and Fox as extreme right. Somewhat visa-versa for conservatives.
[quote=FlyerInHi]
After all, they have businesses to run and they would have competition if they didn’t represent the mainstream. Same goes for Hollywood. [/quote]Why? because of who the viewers are. My S.O. is liberal.. and watches MSM. I tend conservative, I read WSJ, some NYT, a little BBC. It is most profitable for them to tilt the news a little in the liberal direction.
[quote=FlyerInHi]I don’t see why you get all pissed off. Gloria Alred represents the guy in the hospital. He is not the guy who did the beating. Nor is he the guy who brake checked Lien. You go on a rant about Mieses and his father. Did he do anything wrong other than ride with the wrong crowd? Gloria has a job to do. She’s neither liberal nor conservative. [/quote]Not pissed off here. Gloria Alred is known to be liberal – do a search. She also seems to seek out controversial cases. In this case I think she may have bit off something that she should have stayed away from. As for what the guy did.. he stood in front of Liens vehicle, preventing him from leaving. He could of stood to the side, asking everyone else to do likewise.
[quote=FlyerInHi]Btw, Mieses’ rap sheet is not relevant to his being run over.[/quote] Gloria will try to prevent it from coming up in court, but it goes to character and determining intent. – take a look at the rap sheet. I think you will see at least one assault plus somewhere around 21 arrests.

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[quote=CDMA ENG]I came from a lower middle class broken home. I worked construction roofing houses three stories in the air. I worked for AD Scenery (if you want validation of my story). I have done all of those Dirty fucking jobs to get to where I am today as a degree’d engineer and I know a lot of ppl here went to the school of hard knock as well.[/quote]Cool. I put myself through college (EECE – UCSD) building houses (framing, forms for foundations, clearing bottom of forms before foundation pour-aka ditch digging), as well as doing work as a finish carpenter.

Was interesting, but knew that custom work was going by the wayside with large ‘contractor’ companies tying up the land.

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[quote=SK in CV]It does mandate cost controls. Many policy holders have already got their second refund due to the MLR limits. In exchange for that MLR floor, the insurance companies got mandatory coverage. They’ll end up ahead in the deal.[/quote]
I didn’t see anything in terms of cost controls.. and I am reading through the text to make sure ..bleh.. where is it? MLR only controls the loss ratio on the insurance companies. It does not control actual medical costs.

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