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August 27, 2006 at 11:01 PM in reply to: Biggest Drops in 2007 and 2008; housing will fall 50% nominal terms #33611
sdduuuude
ParticipantAnother post from Powayseller saying the same thing she has been saying for the last 6 months, with little more insight than any other post. Doesn’t anyone else get tired of hearing the exact same thing from her? I do.
The best thing about this post is it brought out a nice litttle analysis by SD Realtor on the lower bounds of house pricing, based on the rental market, which by the way is not in a bubble condition and thus not prone to collapse.
Powayseller said “Besides, how many people have got 100K to put down on a house?” Well, lets see.
– Everyone who sold in the last two years. Even those who moved out of the state.
– Thousands of people who are ready to buy, can afford to buy, and are waiting for the market to fall. I know several personally.
– Seasoned investors and alot of institutional money waiting to pounce, per SD Realtor’s post.
While many think we are early in the bubble deflation cycle, it may be possible that we are actually well into the third year and have already experienced the first-year flatness AND the subtle price reductios of the second year. This could mean – we ARE IN the free-fall right now, which makes sdrealtor’s observations less surprising. Something to think about.
This and 2007 maybe the big drop years (all those resets coming), with slowing depreciation in 2008 and little depreciation in 2009 and bottomed out flatness in 2010.
sdduuuude
ParticipantPowayseller said “But for those braver and more independent than I, what would be your source of info to know how to write contracts and negotiate?”
Simple experience of having been through it before. When I bought my first house, I needed a realtor, but I made sure that in the process of buying, I learned how to do it myself.
I have confidence that I when I read a legal contract such as an offer to purchase, I will either 1) understand what it means or 2) ask someone.
Those doing it themselves need some kind of help/legal advice, even if not a realtor. Hire a RE attorney and pay them $1000 to read docs and cover your butt as the process moves along.
I mean, I do lots of construction work at my house, but I have contractors come by and give me advice as I go.
Also, just pick up the phone and ask the selling agent – “I am writing an offer on this house and wondered what is the most common number of days for contingencies and what would make it easiest on you?”
sdduuuude
Participantremoved duplicate.
sdduuuude
ParticipantPD – I beg to differ.
Saying “I won’t play with brats.” is not name calling.
Saying “You are a brat.” is.
sdduuuude
ParticipantMonster – I nominate this as the post of the month.
sdduuuude
ParticipantThink of it this way – if you rent now, you can always buy in 1 year. If you buy now and prices drop, you are really, really stuck. You won’t want to hold onto a depreciating asset and you won’t want to sell at a loss.
The key to this decision is flexibility. Renting offers you flexibility to change your mind later. Buying doesn’t. And, if financial hardship strikes, you will be screwed as a homeowner.
So, in your spreadhseets, consider a scenario where prices drop 25% for 7 years, then grow at the rate of inflation, BUT you are forced to sell due to financial hardship in year 7, then rent for the next 5 years while you put your life together.
D
sdduuuude
Participantroooooous,
In your spreadsheets, make sure you have a scenario where you rent for the next 7 years, while prices drop 25%, THEN buy, then go up at the rate of inflation.
Don’t just assume you rent for the next 30 years.
sdduuuude
ParticipantDid you offer 20% below the asking price or 20% below the market price?
If the market price is $200K and it was for sale at $250K and you offered 20% under asking price – you paid the market price and are due for a 20% surprise.
If the market price is $200K and it was for sale at $200K and you offered $160, you aren’t in horrible shape.
sdduuuude
ParticipantMany seem to think they are horrible things, but really, people buy and sell homes with unpermitted additions all the time.
Unpermitted additions are worth what they are worth. Sometimes they are great little additions or extra sheds or garage conversions. Sometimes they are nightmare projects with lots of liability associated with them.
If you are a buyer and refuse to buy anything that has unpermitted space, you may miss out on something useful. If you do buy such a place, make sure you know how to evaluate the quality of the space. Is there anything dangerous in the garage conversion? Bad ventilation? No insulation? Unvented dryers in a living space? etc. Make sure your inspector goes through it thoroughly. Decide if it really adds or detracts from the value.
If you are a seller, just make sure you disclose what space is unpermitted. If you have a nightmare unpermitted space, think about “undoing” it. If you have a nice, safe, usable space, leave it alone. It will add value.
sdduuuude
ParticipantIm a definite NIMBY in this case as I live in Clairemont. The noise would make my place not so nice.
My NIMBY vote, however, will pale incomparison to that of the people with real money who live in UTC and La Jolla – directly under the take-off path.
I think big NIMBY money will stop this effort, unless someone with bigger money sees potential significant financial gain in the move to Miramar, which I don’t see.
Plus, with harder times coming, the funding for such a project may be hard to come by – I hope.
What is it with San Diego and duplicate resources? We have a staduim. We build another. We have an airport. We build another.
sdduuuude
Participant‘ “With many potential buyers on the sidelines right now, we believe there is growing pent-up demand that will come into the market once buyer sentiment improves.” ‘
Translation: “Dead Cat Bounce”
sdduuuude
ParticipantI only skimmed this board and the answers therein. This is a good group to help with this kind of decision.
I just wanted to warn you about this statement:
“i don’t want to net less than 400k”This is a poor decision point. How much you make is irrelevant to the decision at hand. I know, it is hard to grasp this concept, but please try – you’ll be better off.
The question is – are you going to be in a better financial situation if you sell or if you don’t sell? That is the only question to answer.
Put several scenarios into a spredsheet, first assume you don’t sell then put in scenarios for selling now and buy back in 3 years, 5 years, 7 years, etc with varying depreciation figures. Don’t forget the “I don’t sell now, but am forced to sell due to a life change in 3 years.” scenario. Is your busines related to the RE industry? If so, worry.
Consider the cost of your time to facilitate a real estate transaction, the cost of moving, changes in property tax rates, tax breaks on mortgage interest, depreciation, 6% transaction fee for buying/selling, interest on any profits you can make (7% seems high, and don’t forget taxes on those earnings), the cost of renting, etc.
Even if you only make $200K by selling today, if the house price drops by $200K and you didn’t sell, that is $200K you won’t have.
My intuition tells me you are more on the “sell” side than the buy side.
D
sdduuuude
ParticipantI can’t leave San Diego – I’d have to change my username to sfduuuude or poduuuude or autxduuuude.
sdduuuude
Participantanxvariety,
I sort of agree, but mostly don’t.
I suspect most people on this forum don’t have use for a realtor. However, this is the exception, not the rule.
I don’t need one. You don’t need one, but most do so REs will be around for a long time. The HelpUSell model is not so bad. I think they will be fine, but even with them, you have a realtor working for you and they need to be good at what they do.
REs aren’t so helpful for the “do it yourselfer” type but the amount of time a realtor can save a busy professional with limited time is quite significant.
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