[Rt.66]

[quote=patientrenter]Rt 66, all you’re seeing on credit is some retrenchment toward historical norms. On housing, the biggest user of credit in our economy, the govt continues to allow vast amounts of truly incredibly easy and cheap money.

Check this story from the Housing Wire:

http://www.housingwire.com/2009/05/29/hud-details-use-of-tax-credit-toward-closing-costs/

Apparently 3.5% downpayments were too high. I think downpayments of less than 30% or so in an environment of severe price drops in RE are ludicrously small. And 20% is an historical minimum standard for most people.[/quote]

“Consumer Credit Dries Up At Record Pace:

If you think that credit to consumers (and by consumers) was being cut, you will see was an understatement. Consumer credit for the month of March was just released and it is the largest percentage drop in almost two decades. The March consumer credit report came in down $11.1 billion. Bloomberg had estimates of -$4 billion and Dow Jones had forecast a -$3.5 billion drop. It looks like this is actually a record drop measured by dollar terms”
—————–

I don’t know…an $11 billion reduction for one month seems pretty drastic. Worst % going back over a few recesions and worst ever in dollar terms.

Agreed on the home loans. Although they are harder (in line with historical requirments) to get, they are being made by the Gov. not banks. So it has no relevance to real free market credit drying up.

[Rt.66]

[quote=patientrenter]Rt 66, all you’re seeing on credit is some retrenchment toward historical norms. On housing, the biggest user of credit in our economy, the govt continues to allow vast amounts of truly incredibly easy and cheap money.

Check this story from the Housing Wire:

http://www.housingwire.com/2009/05/29/hud-details-use-of-tax-credit-toward-closing-costs/

Apparently 3.5% downpayments were too high. I think downpayments of less than 30% or so in an environment of severe price drops in RE are ludicrously small. And 20% is an historical minimum standard for most people.[/quote]

“Consumer Credit Dries Up At Record Pace:

If you think that credit to consumers (and by consumers) was being cut, you will see was an understatement. Consumer credit for the month of March was just released and it is the largest percentage drop in almost two decades. The March consumer credit report came in down $11.1 billion. Bloomberg had estimates of -$4 billion and Dow Jones had forecast a -$3.5 billion drop. It looks like this is actually a record drop measured by dollar terms”
—————–

I don’t know…an $11 billion reduction for one month seems pretty drastic. Worst % going back over a few recesions and worst ever in dollar terms.

Agreed on the home loans. Although they are harder (in line with historical requirments) to get, they are being made by the Gov. not banks. So it has no relevance to real free market credit drying up.

[Rt.66]

[quote=patientrenter]Rt 66, all you’re seeing on credit is some retrenchment toward historical norms. On housing, the biggest user of credit in our economy, the govt continues to allow vast amounts of truly incredibly easy and cheap money.

Check this story from the Housing Wire:

http://www.housingwire.com/2009/05/29/hud-details-use-of-tax-credit-toward-closing-costs/

Apparently 3.5% downpayments were too high. I think downpayments of less than 30% or so in an environment of severe price drops in RE are ludicrously small. And 20% is an historical minimum standard for most people.[/quote]

“Consumer Credit Dries Up At Record Pace:

If you think that credit to consumers (and by consumers) was being cut, you will see was an understatement. Consumer credit for the month of March was just released and it is the largest percentage drop in almost two decades. The March consumer credit report came in down $11.1 billion. Bloomberg had estimates of -$4 billion and Dow Jones had forecast a -$3.5 billion drop. It looks like this is actually a record drop measured by dollar terms”
—————–

I don’t know…an $11 billion reduction for one month seems pretty drastic. Worst % going back over a few recesions and worst ever in dollar terms.

Agreed on the home loans. Although they are harder (in line with historical requirments) to get, they are being made by the Gov. not banks. So it has no relevance to real free market credit drying up.

[Rt.66]

[quote=patientrenter]Rt 66, all you’re seeing on credit is some retrenchment toward historical norms. On housing, the biggest user of credit in our economy, the govt continues to allow vast amounts of truly incredibly easy and cheap money.

Check this story from the Housing Wire:

http://www.housingwire.com/2009/05/29/hud-details-use-of-tax-credit-toward-closing-costs/

Apparently 3.5% downpayments were too high. I think downpayments of less than 30% or so in an environment of severe price drops in RE are ludicrously small. And 20% is an historical minimum standard for most people.[/quote]

“Consumer Credit Dries Up At Record Pace:

If you think that credit to consumers (and by consumers) was being cut, you will see was an understatement. Consumer credit for the month of March was just released and it is the largest percentage drop in almost two decades. The March consumer credit report came in down $11.1 billion. Bloomberg had estimates of -$4 billion and Dow Jones had forecast a -$3.5 billion drop. It looks like this is actually a record drop measured by dollar terms”
—————–

I don’t know…an $11 billion reduction for one month seems pretty drastic. Worst % going back over a few recesions and worst ever in dollar terms.

Agreed on the home loans. Although they are harder (in line with historical requirments) to get, they are being made by the Gov. not banks. So it has no relevance to real free market credit drying up.

[Rt.66]

[quote=patientrenter]Rt 66, all you’re seeing on credit is some retrenchment toward historical norms. On housing, the biggest user of credit in our economy, the govt continues to allow vast amounts of truly incredibly easy and cheap money.

Check this story from the Housing Wire:

http://www.housingwire.com/2009/05/29/hud-details-use-of-tax-credit-toward-closing-costs/

Apparently 3.5% downpayments were too high. I think downpayments of less than 30% or so in an environment of severe price drops in RE are ludicrously small. And 20% is an historical minimum standard for most people.[/quote]

“Consumer Credit Dries Up At Record Pace:

If you think that credit to consumers (and by consumers) was being cut, you will see was an understatement. Consumer credit for the month of March was just released and it is the largest percentage drop in almost two decades. The March consumer credit report came in down $11.1 billion. Bloomberg had estimates of -$4 billion and Dow Jones had forecast a -$3.5 billion drop. It looks like this is actually a record drop measured by dollar terms”
—————–

I don’t know…an $11 billion reduction for one month seems pretty drastic. Worst % going back over a few recesions and worst ever in dollar terms.

Agreed on the home loans. Although they are harder (in line with historical requirments) to get, they are being made by the Gov. not banks. So it has no relevance to real free market credit drying up.

[Rt.66]

[quote=patientrenter]Rt 66, do you think American borrowers will vote to pay off their personal debts in full, or vote to pay back less than they personally borrowed (and have the rest of the real burden of debt reduction covered by the general taxpayer and by domestic/foreign savers through inflation/currency devaluation)?

I have an idea myself, but I am curious what you think the voters at large will choose to do.
[/quote]

We won’t get to vote on it.

More and more people are chosing to default on all kinds of loans, so I guess that’s a form of voting with your wallet.

If we could vote I’d bet F@cked Borrowers would chose inflation, allthough any dollars they have outside of their house will lose value. Another example of how the FB crowd’s wants and needs evolve around their bad decision and turn out bad for the rest of us.

For me, I want deflation, so my dollars buy more. We’ve have enough inflation, time for some sanity to return.

[Rt.66]

[quote=patientrenter]Rt 66, do you think American borrowers will vote to pay off their personal debts in full, or vote to pay back less than they personally borrowed (and have the rest of the real burden of debt reduction covered by the general taxpayer and by domestic/foreign savers through inflation/currency devaluation)?

I have an idea myself, but I am curious what you think the voters at large will choose to do.
[/quote]

We won’t get to vote on it.

More and more people are chosing to default on all kinds of loans, so I guess that’s a form of voting with your wallet.

If we could vote I’d bet F@cked Borrowers would chose inflation, allthough any dollars they have outside of their house will lose value. Another example of how the FB crowd’s wants and needs evolve around their bad decision and turn out bad for the rest of us.

For me, I want deflation, so my dollars buy more. We’ve have enough inflation, time for some sanity to return.

[Rt.66]

[quote=patientrenter]Rt 66, do you think American borrowers will vote to pay off their personal debts in full, or vote to pay back less than they personally borrowed (and have the rest of the real burden of debt reduction covered by the general taxpayer and by domestic/foreign savers through inflation/currency devaluation)?

I have an idea myself, but I am curious what you think the voters at large will choose to do.
[/quote]

We won’t get to vote on it.

More and more people are chosing to default on all kinds of loans, so I guess that’s a form of voting with your wallet.

If we could vote I’d bet F@cked Borrowers would chose inflation, allthough any dollars they have outside of their house will lose value. Another example of how the FB crowd’s wants and needs evolve around their bad decision and turn out bad for the rest of us.

For me, I want deflation, so my dollars buy more. We’ve have enough inflation, time for some sanity to return.

[Rt.66]

[quote=patientrenter]Rt 66, do you think American borrowers will vote to pay off their personal debts in full, or vote to pay back less than they personally borrowed (and have the rest of the real burden of debt reduction covered by the general taxpayer and by domestic/foreign savers through inflation/currency devaluation)?

I have an idea myself, but I am curious what you think the voters at large will choose to do.
[/quote]

We won’t get to vote on it.

More and more people are chosing to default on all kinds of loans, so I guess that’s a form of voting with your wallet.

If we could vote I’d bet F@cked Borrowers would chose inflation, allthough any dollars they have outside of their house will lose value. Another example of how the FB crowd’s wants and needs evolve around their bad decision and turn out bad for the rest of us.

For me, I want deflation, so my dollars buy more. We’ve have enough inflation, time for some sanity to return.

[Rt.66]

[quote=patientrenter]Rt 66, do you think American borrowers will vote to pay off their personal debts in full, or vote to pay back less than they personally borrowed (and have the rest of the real burden of debt reduction covered by the general taxpayer and by domestic/foreign savers through inflation/currency devaluation)?

I have an idea myself, but I am curious what you think the voters at large will choose to do.
[/quote]

We won’t get to vote on it.

More and more people are chosing to default on all kinds of loans, so I guess that’s a form of voting with your wallet.

If we could vote I’d bet F@cked Borrowers would chose inflation, allthough any dollars they have outside of their house will lose value. Another example of how the FB crowd’s wants and needs evolve around their bad decision and turn out bad for the rest of us.

For me, I want deflation, so my dollars buy more. We’ve have enough inflation, time for some sanity to return.

[Rt.66]

Ren, I don’t have questionable credit. And like you, up until three days ago had seen no credit contraction, personally.

Mish had posts a month or more back on this subject and I was, like you, wondering what they were talking about.

I think its odd that with all the effort the Gov. has put to ease credit that its slowly drying up (from what I’ve read and now experienced). BofAsses even told me they were tightening up credit and not giving deals. I told them I was just going to pay off the balance and then they would get nothing, that did not help because that is exactly what they want.

Agian I had my card since 1991, ZERO lates, perfect credit, measly $4900 balance, many times over on deposit, and they just want the cash. Mortgages are going bad left and right, now the idea of giving credit must make them nausious and now they really just need to build cash reserves if they have any hope of weathering the next wave of resets (which they don’t w/o Gov. aid).

A friend owned a Cell/Electrical company and even with perfect credit the bank just did a one-eighty and stopped new credit on his revolving account and started harrasing him to pay off everthing outstanding ASAP.

So I agree that there are some out there who still have not felt the contraction, but that does not make it any less real.

[Rt.66]

Ren, I don’t have questionable credit. And like you, up until three days ago had seen no credit contraction, personally.

Mish had posts a month or more back on this subject and I was, like you, wondering what they were talking about.

I think its odd that with all the effort the Gov. has put to ease credit that its slowly drying up (from what I’ve read and now experienced). BofAsses even told me they were tightening up credit and not giving deals. I told them I was just going to pay off the balance and then they would get nothing, that did not help because that is exactly what they want.

Agian I had my card since 1991, ZERO lates, perfect credit, measly $4900 balance, many times over on deposit, and they just want the cash. Mortgages are going bad left and right, now the idea of giving credit must make them nausious and now they really just need to build cash reserves if they have any hope of weathering the next wave of resets (which they don’t w/o Gov. aid).

A friend owned a Cell/Electrical company and even with perfect credit the bank just did a one-eighty and stopped new credit on his revolving account and started harrasing him to pay off everthing outstanding ASAP.

So I agree that there are some out there who still have not felt the contraction, but that does not make it any less real.

[Rt.66]

Ren, I don’t have questionable credit. And like you, up until three days ago had seen no credit contraction, personally.

Mish had posts a month or more back on this subject and I was, like you, wondering what they were talking about.

I think its odd that with all the effort the Gov. has put to ease credit that its slowly drying up (from what I’ve read and now experienced). BofAsses even told me they were tightening up credit and not giving deals. I told them I was just going to pay off the balance and then they would get nothing, that did not help because that is exactly what they want.

Agian I had my card since 1991, ZERO lates, perfect credit, measly $4900 balance, many times over on deposit, and they just want the cash. Mortgages are going bad left and right, now the idea of giving credit must make them nausious and now they really just need to build cash reserves if they have any hope of weathering the next wave of resets (which they don’t w/o Gov. aid).

A friend owned a Cell/Electrical company and even with perfect credit the bank just did a one-eighty and stopped new credit on his revolving account and started harrasing him to pay off everthing outstanding ASAP.

So I agree that there are some out there who still have not felt the contraction, but that does not make it any less real.

[Rt.66]

Ren, I don’t have questionable credit. And like you, up until three days ago had seen no credit contraction, personally.

Mish had posts a month or more back on this subject and I was, like you, wondering what they were talking about.

I think its odd that with all the effort the Gov. has put to ease credit that its slowly drying up (from what I’ve read and now experienced). BofAsses even told me they were tightening up credit and not giving deals. I told them I was just going to pay off the balance and then they would get nothing, that did not help because that is exactly what they want.

Agian I had my card since 1991, ZERO lates, perfect credit, measly $4900 balance, many times over on deposit, and they just want the cash. Mortgages are going bad left and right, now the idea of giving credit must make them nausious and now they really just need to build cash reserves if they have any hope of weathering the next wave of resets (which they don’t w/o Gov. aid).

A friend owned a Cell/Electrical company and even with perfect credit the bank just did a one-eighty and stopped new credit on his revolving account and started harrasing him to pay off everthing outstanding ASAP.

So I agree that there are some out there who still have not felt the contraction, but that does not make it any less real.

[Rt.66]

Ren, I don’t have questionable credit. And like you, up until three days ago had seen no credit contraction, personally.

Mish had posts a month or more back on this subject and I was, like you, wondering what they were talking about.

I think its odd that with all the effort the Gov. has put to ease credit that its slowly drying up (from what I’ve read and now experienced). BofAsses even told me they were tightening up credit and not giving deals. I told them I was just going to pay off the balance and then they would get nothing, that did not help because that is exactly what they want.

Agian I had my card since 1991, ZERO lates, perfect credit, measly $4900 balance, many times over on deposit, and they just want the cash. Mortgages are going bad left and right, now the idea of giving credit must make them nausious and now they really just need to build cash reserves if they have any hope of weathering the next wave of resets (which they don’t w/o Gov. aid).

A friend owned a Cell/Electrical company and even with perfect credit the bank just did a one-eighty and stopped new credit on his revolving account and started harrasing him to pay off everthing outstanding ASAP.

So I agree that there are some out there who still have not felt the contraction, but that does not make it any less real.

[Author]

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