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July 24, 2009 at 11:01 AM in reply to: Intentional defaulting, not subprime mortgage is the problem #436170July 24, 2009 at 11:01 AM in reply to: Intentional defaulting, not subprime mortgage is the problem #436377
Rt.66
Participant“lemonade stand” LOL!
Coffee hurts when its coming outta my nose!
July 24, 2009 at 11:01 AM in reply to: Intentional defaulting, not subprime mortgage is the problem #436696Participant“lemonade stand” LOL!
Coffee hurts when its coming outta my nose!
July 24, 2009 at 11:01 AM in reply to: Intentional defaulting, not subprime mortgage is the problem #436768Participant“lemonade stand” LOL!
Coffee hurts when its coming outta my nose!
July 24, 2009 at 11:01 AM in reply to: Intentional defaulting, not subprime mortgage is the problem #436935Participant“lemonade stand” LOL!
Coffee hurts when its coming outta my nose!
Participant[quote=CA renter][quote=AN]
What is it about the Austrian health care system that make it FAR superior to ours? Please explain.[/quote]
One example would be my mom’s best friend who had to have hip replacement surgery. In Austria, she got the surgery and had a longer hospital stay than U.S. counterparts (a good thing, no matter what they try to tell us), then was sent to a rehab facility (again, an in-patient facility) that is more like a spa, with special pools and massage therapies, etc. Essentially, they believe in a more holistic approach; and rather than send someone home the same day or day after a major procedure, they actually try to **heal** the patient, and make sure they are able to take care of themselves at home. We do no such thing here.
Another benefit of socialized medicine is that people can move freely between employers and careers. For example, my husband and I would like to start a business, but can’t because we’d lose the health benefits provided by his current employer. Socialized medicine would allow labor to move where it is most effective, and would enable our employers to be more competitive with foreign employers who do not have the burden of insuring their employees and the related “legacy costs.”
One more thing… A for-profit healthcare system is only profitable when people are sick. There is no incentive to **cure** people, only to “treat” them with expensive medicines and procedures. Ideally, from the perspective of a for-profit healthcare provider, the perfect patient is one who is chronically ill and requires medicine and treatments for an entire lifetime.
A socialized system has an incentive to **cure,** because the entire goal of socialized medicine is to make people healthy, irrespective of any other (profit) considerations.
———————
More general statements about their socialized government:
The Austrians pay about the same amount in taxes that we do, and get 12-18 months **paid** maternity leave (combination of govt/employer-paid, with one year full pay and 6 months half pay, IIRC).
They get very effective healthcare which will not bankrupt them.
They also get a pension when they retire.
They do not have the disparate levels of wealth that we have, and, generally-speaking, everyone is taken care of. Certainly nobody can take issue with the German or Austrian work ethic, either. The whole boogeyman of “everyone will be lazy” is nonsense.[/quote]
Good post! Lot’s of wisdom there.
So far 2.4 million people have lost their health benefits during this depression (http://www.huffingtonpost.com/arianna-huffington/why-visiting-pompeii-has_b_241603.html?). Now the tax payers will pick up the tab for their needs if they become ill (after they are finacially ruined and forced into BK). Sounds like a really dumb version of NHC?
Participant[quote=CA renter][quote=AN]
What is it about the Austrian health care system that make it FAR superior to ours? Please explain.[/quote]
One example would be my mom’s best friend who had to have hip replacement surgery. In Austria, she got the surgery and had a longer hospital stay than U.S. counterparts (a good thing, no matter what they try to tell us), then was sent to a rehab facility (again, an in-patient facility) that is more like a spa, with special pools and massage therapies, etc. Essentially, they believe in a more holistic approach; and rather than send someone home the same day or day after a major procedure, they actually try to **heal** the patient, and make sure they are able to take care of themselves at home. We do no such thing here.
Another benefit of socialized medicine is that people can move freely between employers and careers. For example, my husband and I would like to start a business, but can’t because we’d lose the health benefits provided by his current employer. Socialized medicine would allow labor to move where it is most effective, and would enable our employers to be more competitive with foreign employers who do not have the burden of insuring their employees and the related “legacy costs.”
One more thing… A for-profit healthcare system is only profitable when people are sick. There is no incentive to **cure** people, only to “treat” them with expensive medicines and procedures. Ideally, from the perspective of a for-profit healthcare provider, the perfect patient is one who is chronically ill and requires medicine and treatments for an entire lifetime.
A socialized system has an incentive to **cure,** because the entire goal of socialized medicine is to make people healthy, irrespective of any other (profit) considerations.
———————
More general statements about their socialized government:
The Austrians pay about the same amount in taxes that we do, and get 12-18 months **paid** maternity leave (combination of govt/employer-paid, with one year full pay and 6 months half pay, IIRC).
They get very effective healthcare which will not bankrupt them.
They also get a pension when they retire.
They do not have the disparate levels of wealth that we have, and, generally-speaking, everyone is taken care of. Certainly nobody can take issue with the German or Austrian work ethic, either. The whole boogeyman of “everyone will be lazy” is nonsense.[/quote]
Good post! Lot’s of wisdom there.
So far 2.4 million people have lost their health benefits during this depression (http://www.huffingtonpost.com/arianna-huffington/why-visiting-pompeii-has_b_241603.html?). Now the tax payers will pick up the tab for their needs if they become ill (after they are finacially ruined and forced into BK). Sounds like a really dumb version of NHC?
Participant[quote=CA renter][quote=AN]
What is it about the Austrian health care system that make it FAR superior to ours? Please explain.[/quote]
One example would be my mom’s best friend who had to have hip replacement surgery. In Austria, she got the surgery and had a longer hospital stay than U.S. counterparts (a good thing, no matter what they try to tell us), then was sent to a rehab facility (again, an in-patient facility) that is more like a spa, with special pools and massage therapies, etc. Essentially, they believe in a more holistic approach; and rather than send someone home the same day or day after a major procedure, they actually try to **heal** the patient, and make sure they are able to take care of themselves at home. We do no such thing here.
Another benefit of socialized medicine is that people can move freely between employers and careers. For example, my husband and I would like to start a business, but can’t because we’d lose the health benefits provided by his current employer. Socialized medicine would allow labor to move where it is most effective, and would enable our employers to be more competitive with foreign employers who do not have the burden of insuring their employees and the related “legacy costs.”
One more thing… A for-profit healthcare system is only profitable when people are sick. There is no incentive to **cure** people, only to “treat” them with expensive medicines and procedures. Ideally, from the perspective of a for-profit healthcare provider, the perfect patient is one who is chronically ill and requires medicine and treatments for an entire lifetime.
A socialized system has an incentive to **cure,** because the entire goal of socialized medicine is to make people healthy, irrespective of any other (profit) considerations.
———————
More general statements about their socialized government:
The Austrians pay about the same amount in taxes that we do, and get 12-18 months **paid** maternity leave (combination of govt/employer-paid, with one year full pay and 6 months half pay, IIRC).
They get very effective healthcare which will not bankrupt them.
They also get a pension when they retire.
They do not have the disparate levels of wealth that we have, and, generally-speaking, everyone is taken care of. Certainly nobody can take issue with the German or Austrian work ethic, either. The whole boogeyman of “everyone will be lazy” is nonsense.[/quote]
Good post! Lot’s of wisdom there.
So far 2.4 million people have lost their health benefits during this depression (http://www.huffingtonpost.com/arianna-huffington/why-visiting-pompeii-has_b_241603.html?). Now the tax payers will pick up the tab for their needs if they become ill (after they are finacially ruined and forced into BK). Sounds like a really dumb version of NHC?
Participant[quote=CA renter][quote=AN]
What is it about the Austrian health care system that make it FAR superior to ours? Please explain.[/quote]
One example would be my mom’s best friend who had to have hip replacement surgery. In Austria, she got the surgery and had a longer hospital stay than U.S. counterparts (a good thing, no matter what they try to tell us), then was sent to a rehab facility (again, an in-patient facility) that is more like a spa, with special pools and massage therapies, etc. Essentially, they believe in a more holistic approach; and rather than send someone home the same day or day after a major procedure, they actually try to **heal** the patient, and make sure they are able to take care of themselves at home. We do no such thing here.
Another benefit of socialized medicine is that people can move freely between employers and careers. For example, my husband and I would like to start a business, but can’t because we’d lose the health benefits provided by his current employer. Socialized medicine would allow labor to move where it is most effective, and would enable our employers to be more competitive with foreign employers who do not have the burden of insuring their employees and the related “legacy costs.”
One more thing… A for-profit healthcare system is only profitable when people are sick. There is no incentive to **cure** people, only to “treat” them with expensive medicines and procedures. Ideally, from the perspective of a for-profit healthcare provider, the perfect patient is one who is chronically ill and requires medicine and treatments for an entire lifetime.
A socialized system has an incentive to **cure,** because the entire goal of socialized medicine is to make people healthy, irrespective of any other (profit) considerations.
———————
More general statements about their socialized government:
The Austrians pay about the same amount in taxes that we do, and get 12-18 months **paid** maternity leave (combination of govt/employer-paid, with one year full pay and 6 months half pay, IIRC).
They get very effective healthcare which will not bankrupt them.
They also get a pension when they retire.
They do not have the disparate levels of wealth that we have, and, generally-speaking, everyone is taken care of. Certainly nobody can take issue with the German or Austrian work ethic, either. The whole boogeyman of “everyone will be lazy” is nonsense.[/quote]
Good post! Lot’s of wisdom there.
So far 2.4 million people have lost their health benefits during this depression (http://www.huffingtonpost.com/arianna-huffington/why-visiting-pompeii-has_b_241603.html?). Now the tax payers will pick up the tab for their needs if they become ill (after they are finacially ruined and forced into BK). Sounds like a really dumb version of NHC?
Participant[quote=CA renter][quote=AN]
What is it about the Austrian health care system that make it FAR superior to ours? Please explain.[/quote]
One example would be my mom’s best friend who had to have hip replacement surgery. In Austria, she got the surgery and had a longer hospital stay than U.S. counterparts (a good thing, no matter what they try to tell us), then was sent to a rehab facility (again, an in-patient facility) that is more like a spa, with special pools and massage therapies, etc. Essentially, they believe in a more holistic approach; and rather than send someone home the same day or day after a major procedure, they actually try to **heal** the patient, and make sure they are able to take care of themselves at home. We do no such thing here.
Another benefit of socialized medicine is that people can move freely between employers and careers. For example, my husband and I would like to start a business, but can’t because we’d lose the health benefits provided by his current employer. Socialized medicine would allow labor to move where it is most effective, and would enable our employers to be more competitive with foreign employers who do not have the burden of insuring their employees and the related “legacy costs.”
One more thing… A for-profit healthcare system is only profitable when people are sick. There is no incentive to **cure** people, only to “treat” them with expensive medicines and procedures. Ideally, from the perspective of a for-profit healthcare provider, the perfect patient is one who is chronically ill and requires medicine and treatments for an entire lifetime.
A socialized system has an incentive to **cure,** because the entire goal of socialized medicine is to make people healthy, irrespective of any other (profit) considerations.
———————
More general statements about their socialized government:
The Austrians pay about the same amount in taxes that we do, and get 12-18 months **paid** maternity leave (combination of govt/employer-paid, with one year full pay and 6 months half pay, IIRC).
They get very effective healthcare which will not bankrupt them.
They also get a pension when they retire.
They do not have the disparate levels of wealth that we have, and, generally-speaking, everyone is taken care of. Certainly nobody can take issue with the German or Austrian work ethic, either. The whole boogeyman of “everyone will be lazy” is nonsense.[/quote]
Good post! Lot’s of wisdom there.
So far 2.4 million people have lost their health benefits during this depression (http://www.huffingtonpost.com/arianna-huffington/why-visiting-pompeii-has_b_241603.html?). Now the tax payers will pick up the tab for their needs if they become ill (after they are finacially ruined and forced into BK). Sounds like a really dumb version of NHC?
July 24, 2009 at 10:41 AM in reply to: Intentional defaulting, not subprime mortgage is the problem #436140ParticipantHere’s how I see it:
On one hand I’m pissed at the economic retards who thought “housing only goes up” and caused housing to become ridiculously unaffordable PLUS they were almost single handedly responsible for bringing down the financial system (when they stopped paying).
But we can’t help that now. So I try and see if anything good can come out of this. One only has to look at our Gov. and Goldman Sachs etc., today to see that it is us versus them. If they make a losing play they will simply confiscate tax dollars to make up for it and keep the multi-million dollar bonus train chugging. Yes, our tax dollars will pay for the walk-away’s ignorance of basic economics, but that’s a lesser of two evils compared with seeing my tax dollars line banker’s pockets. I am less fond of money changers than bubble-nuts.
What good can come out of this? A total reset of the debt servitude condition the bankers feed off of. Under water home owners can simply walk away, but the banks will have to come back for more money and after this next round of grossly inappropriate bonuses, their next visit to the tax payer trough won’t be so easy.
Hey, instead of paying a 30 year $3000 per month mortgage to bankers, wouldn’t it be nice to have a $1000 10 year note and have extra money to help family and friends, maybe support and few charities and consume, so our economic engine can rev-up again? There’s your recovery. Consumer spending needs to be around 70%, without bubbles the only way to achieve that is through disposable income, on real income.
The people have some power here. You people thinking now is a good time to buy are ruining it 🙂
Good story on bankers:
http://www.stuff.co.nz/national/2667215/190-000-withdrawn-in-20-billsJuly 24, 2009 at 10:41 AM in reply to: Intentional defaulting, not subprime mortgage is the problem #436347ParticipantHere’s how I see it:
On one hand I’m pissed at the economic retards who thought “housing only goes up” and caused housing to become ridiculously unaffordable PLUS they were almost single handedly responsible for bringing down the financial system (when they stopped paying).
But we can’t help that now. So I try and see if anything good can come out of this. One only has to look at our Gov. and Goldman Sachs etc., today to see that it is us versus them. If they make a losing play they will simply confiscate tax dollars to make up for it and keep the multi-million dollar bonus train chugging. Yes, our tax dollars will pay for the walk-away’s ignorance of basic economics, but that’s a lesser of two evils compared with seeing my tax dollars line banker’s pockets. I am less fond of money changers than bubble-nuts.
What good can come out of this? A total reset of the debt servitude condition the bankers feed off of. Under water home owners can simply walk away, but the banks will have to come back for more money and after this next round of grossly inappropriate bonuses, their next visit to the tax payer trough won’t be so easy.
Hey, instead of paying a 30 year $3000 per month mortgage to bankers, wouldn’t it be nice to have a $1000 10 year note and have extra money to help family and friends, maybe support and few charities and consume, so our economic engine can rev-up again? There’s your recovery. Consumer spending needs to be around 70%, without bubbles the only way to achieve that is through disposable income, on real income.
The people have some power here. You people thinking now is a good time to buy are ruining it 🙂
Good story on bankers:
http://www.stuff.co.nz/national/2667215/190-000-withdrawn-in-20-billsJuly 24, 2009 at 10:41 AM in reply to: Intentional defaulting, not subprime mortgage is the problem #436666ParticipantHere’s how I see it:
On one hand I’m pissed at the economic retards who thought “housing only goes up” and caused housing to become ridiculously unaffordable PLUS they were almost single handedly responsible for bringing down the financial system (when they stopped paying).
But we can’t help that now. So I try and see if anything good can come out of this. One only has to look at our Gov. and Goldman Sachs etc., today to see that it is us versus them. If they make a losing play they will simply confiscate tax dollars to make up for it and keep the multi-million dollar bonus train chugging. Yes, our tax dollars will pay for the walk-away’s ignorance of basic economics, but that’s a lesser of two evils compared with seeing my tax dollars line banker’s pockets. I am less fond of money changers than bubble-nuts.
What good can come out of this? A total reset of the debt servitude condition the bankers feed off of. Under water home owners can simply walk away, but the banks will have to come back for more money and after this next round of grossly inappropriate bonuses, their next visit to the tax payer trough won’t be so easy.
Hey, instead of paying a 30 year $3000 per month mortgage to bankers, wouldn’t it be nice to have a $1000 10 year note and have extra money to help family and friends, maybe support and few charities and consume, so our economic engine can rev-up again? There’s your recovery. Consumer spending needs to be around 70%, without bubbles the only way to achieve that is through disposable income, on real income.
The people have some power here. You people thinking now is a good time to buy are ruining it 🙂
Good story on bankers:
http://www.stuff.co.nz/national/2667215/190-000-withdrawn-in-20-billsJuly 24, 2009 at 10:41 AM in reply to: Intentional defaulting, not subprime mortgage is the problem #436739ParticipantHere’s how I see it:
On one hand I’m pissed at the economic retards who thought “housing only goes up” and caused housing to become ridiculously unaffordable PLUS they were almost single handedly responsible for bringing down the financial system (when they stopped paying).
But we can’t help that now. So I try and see if anything good can come out of this. One only has to look at our Gov. and Goldman Sachs etc., today to see that it is us versus them. If they make a losing play they will simply confiscate tax dollars to make up for it and keep the multi-million dollar bonus train chugging. Yes, our tax dollars will pay for the walk-away’s ignorance of basic economics, but that’s a lesser of two evils compared with seeing my tax dollars line banker’s pockets. I am less fond of money changers than bubble-nuts.
What good can come out of this? A total reset of the debt servitude condition the bankers feed off of. Under water home owners can simply walk away, but the banks will have to come back for more money and after this next round of grossly inappropriate bonuses, their next visit to the tax payer trough won’t be so easy.
Hey, instead of paying a 30 year $3000 per month mortgage to bankers, wouldn’t it be nice to have a $1000 10 year note and have extra money to help family and friends, maybe support and few charities and consume, so our economic engine can rev-up again? There’s your recovery. Consumer spending needs to be around 70%, without bubbles the only way to achieve that is through disposable income, on real income.
The people have some power here. You people thinking now is a good time to buy are ruining it 🙂
Good story on bankers:
http://www.stuff.co.nz/national/2667215/190-000-withdrawn-in-20-billsJuly 24, 2009 at 10:41 AM in reply to: Intentional defaulting, not subprime mortgage is the problem #436905ParticipantHere’s how I see it:
On one hand I’m pissed at the economic retards who thought “housing only goes up” and caused housing to become ridiculously unaffordable PLUS they were almost single handedly responsible for bringing down the financial system (when they stopped paying).
But we can’t help that now. So I try and see if anything good can come out of this. One only has to look at our Gov. and Goldman Sachs etc., today to see that it is us versus them. If they make a losing play they will simply confiscate tax dollars to make up for it and keep the multi-million dollar bonus train chugging. Yes, our tax dollars will pay for the walk-away’s ignorance of basic economics, but that’s a lesser of two evils compared with seeing my tax dollars line banker’s pockets. I am less fond of money changers than bubble-nuts.
What good can come out of this? A total reset of the debt servitude condition the bankers feed off of. Under water home owners can simply walk away, but the banks will have to come back for more money and after this next round of grossly inappropriate bonuses, their next visit to the tax payer trough won’t be so easy.
Hey, instead of paying a 30 year $3000 per month mortgage to bankers, wouldn’t it be nice to have a $1000 10 year note and have extra money to help family and friends, maybe support and few charities and consume, so our economic engine can rev-up again? There’s your recovery. Consumer spending needs to be around 70%, without bubbles the only way to achieve that is through disposable income, on real income.
The people have some power here. You people thinking now is a good time to buy are ruining it 🙂
Good story on bankers:
http://www.stuff.co.nz/national/2667215/190-000-withdrawn-in-20-bills -
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