[hipmatt]

Ya, but Sec. Paulson says we are AT or NEAR the housing bottom..

LOL!!! How can you say the bottom is here with the growing inventory, increasing rates, tighter lending standards, and massive foreclosures and even more are predicted.

http://money.cnn.com/2007/07/02/news/economy/paulson_housing.reut/

Paulson: Housing ‘at or near bottom’
But Treasury secretary gives no timetable for recovery; says financial markets remain healthy despite subprime mortgage mess.
July 2 2007: 4:40 PM EDT

WASHINGTON (Reuters) — Treasury Secretary Henry Paulson said Monday the U.S. housing market correction was “at or near the bottom,” although it could be some time before an upturn.

“In terms of looking at housing, most of us believe that it’s at or near the bottom,” he told Reuters. “It’s had a significant impact on the economy. No one is forecasting when, with any degree of clarity, that the upturn is going to come other than it’s at or near the bottom.”
ECONOMY

Paulson added that global economic growth remains solid, and a resilient U.S. consumer and strong labor markets are underpinning the domestic economy.
Paulson: China must push for reform

“We are making this transition successfully (from) a growth rate that wasn’t sustainable to one that is sustainable,” Paulson said.

Asked about any spillover from the well-publicized problems in the subprime mortgage sector, Paulson acknowledged that excesses can build in benign economic periods with ample liquidity, which can lead to an erosion of standards.

“We’ve certainly seen it in a number of areas. Borrowers need to be wary of the risks they’re taking on in times of low interest rates, particularly if they haven’t fixed their rates. Lenders need to be wary,” he said.

Recent jitters in financial markets stemming from troubles in the subprime sector of the mortgage market underscored the risks and can serve as a “call for vigilance,” he added. Markets have been unsettled as two hedge funds at Bear Stearns (Charts, Fortune 500) ran into trouble with subprime bets that went bad.

Paulson, who was chairman of Goldman Sachs Group Inc. (Charts, Fortune 500) before taking the top Treasury post last year, said he monitors financial markets closely, and aside from the subprime situation, they remain healthy.

“Markets are volatile,” he said. “I haven’t seen a single thing that surprises me – it’s hard to surprise me.”

[hipmatt]

The take that anyone who is buying is an idiot just cracks me up. Someone who cannot even generate enough income to buy a 600k house is supposedly smarter than someone who has made millions due to their intelligence or skill in something ( inheritance aside ). There may be some exceptions to this, but in general I doubt very seriously that median income people have more intelligence than above median income folks do. I will say this, I would rather be a millionaire and be an "idiot", than be a genuis and be poor.

Chris… maybe you can explain a few things to us…

You make it sound as if anyone "who can't even generate enough income to buy a 600k house", they are a brainless bottom feeding peon.  

There are plenty of highly educated and intelligent people out there who can't afford a $600k home.  In fact, the intelligent ones are buying with responsible loans and will eventually paid off their loans, the unintelligent ones are buying with toxic loans and are now likely in foreclosure.  Actually the real intelligent ones are renting right now, and watching home prices drop, as opposed to the so called smart upperclassmen who just purchased watch his equity dwindle.

They say you could not really tell who is a true millionaire, they usually don't promote themselves that way, but you can tell who is broke, they are the ones trying to look like a millionaire, I find it true very often.

Chris you left off with a shallow, materialistic quote, I shall leave you with a few quotes as well, take them as you may…

"Wealth after all is a relative thing since he that has little and wants less is richer than he that has much and wants more."

"The first wealth is health."

"We all need money, but there are degrees of desperation."

"Without a rich heart, wealth is an ugly beggar."

"It is sheer madness to live in want, in order to be wealthy when you die."

"You may have tangible wealth untold, caskets of jewels and coffers of gold. Richer than I you could never be; I know someone who told stories to me."

"A man's true wealth is the good he does in the world."

"What right have you to take the word wealth, which originally meant ''well-being,'' and degrade and narrow it by confining it to certain sorts of material objects measured by money."

"What difference does it make how much you have? What you do not have amounts to much more."

"Rich people without wisdom and learning are but sheep with golden fleeces."

"He that is proud of riches is a fool. For if he is exalted above his neighbors because he has more gold, how much inferior is he to a gold mine."

"Superfluous wealth can buy superfluities only. Money is not required to buy one necessary of the soul."

"The Lord commonly gives riches to foolish people, to whom he gives nothing else."

"Intellect annuls fate. So far as a man thinks, he is free."

 

If you really would rather be a rich idiot than a poor genius, then I do feel bad for you. 

 

[hipmatt]

The take that anyone who is buying is an idiot just cracks me up. Someone who cannot even generate enough income to buy a 600k house is supposedly smarter than someone who has made millions due to their intelligence or skill in something ( inheritance aside ). There may be some exceptions to this, but in general I doubt very seriously that median income people have more intelligence than above median income folks do. I will say this, I would rather be a millionaire and be an "idiot", than be a genuis and be poor.

Chris… maybe you can explain a few things to us…

You make it sound as if anyone "who can't even generate enough income to buy a 600k house", they are a brainless bottom feeding peon.  

There are plenty of highly educated and intelligent people out there who can't afford a $600k home.  In fact, the intelligent ones are buying with responsible loans and will eventually paid off their loans, the unintelligent ones are buying with toxic loans and are now likely in foreclosure.  Actually the real intelligent ones are renting right now, and watching home prices drop, as opposed to the so called smart upperclassmen who just purchased watch his equity dwindle.

They say you could not really tell who is a true millionaire, they usually don't promote themselves that way, but you can tell who is broke, they are the ones trying to look like a millionaire, I find it true very often.

Chris you left off with a shallow, materialistic quote, I shall leave you with a few quotes as well, take them as you may…

"Wealth after all is a relative thing since he that has little and wants less is richer than he that has much and wants more."

"The first wealth is health."

"We all need money, but there are degrees of desperation."

"Without a rich heart, wealth is an ugly beggar."

"It is sheer madness to live in want, in order to be wealthy when you die."

"You may have tangible wealth untold, caskets of jewels and coffers of gold. Richer than I you could never be; I know someone who told stories to me."

"A man's true wealth is the good he does in the world."

"What right have you to take the word wealth, which originally meant ''well-being,'' and degrade and narrow it by confining it to certain sorts of material objects measured by money."

"What difference does it make how much you have? What you do not have amounts to much more."

"Rich people without wisdom and learning are but sheep with golden fleeces."

"He that is proud of riches is a fool. For if he is exalted above his neighbors because he has more gold, how much inferior is he to a gold mine."

"Superfluous wealth can buy superfluities only. Money is not required to buy one necessary of the soul."

"The Lord commonly gives riches to foolish people, to whom he gives nothing else."

"Intellect annuls fate. So far as a man thinks, he is free."

 

If you really would rather be a rich idiot than a poor genius, then I do feel bad for you. 

 

[hipmatt]

I have to agree with PC, jan. Your logic seems a bit hypocritical. Chances are great that your new home will drop to below what you paid for it, and so will the Corona resales and foreclosures. Hopefully the increased taxes and energy costs don’t kill you. Just one year into the decline, we have a long ways to go to hit bottom, let alone appreciate into anything resembling a decent investment.

The same thing is going on here in Temecula. I had a chance last week to buy a brand new 2800sqft single story, fully upgraded granite, stainless built-ins, home theater speakers installed, for $360k. Two weeks earlier they were trying to sell for $450k. 6 months ago, they were $550k. The sales women kept calling me, and then offered 10k towards closing costs. After talking it over, we decided to pass, they (and everyone else) still have a ton of homes to sell. This is just the beginning, I can only imagine the deals that they will be offering next summer.

[hipmatt]

I have to agree with PC, jan. Your logic seems a bit hypocritical. Chances are great that your new home will drop to below what you paid for it, and so will the Corona resales and foreclosures. Hopefully the increased taxes and energy costs don’t kill you. Just one year into the decline, we have a long ways to go to hit bottom, let alone appreciate into anything resembling a decent investment.

The same thing is going on here in Temecula. I had a chance last week to buy a brand new 2800sqft single story, fully upgraded granite, stainless built-ins, home theater speakers installed, for $360k. Two weeks earlier they were trying to sell for $450k. 6 months ago, they were $550k. The sales women kept calling me, and then offered 10k towards closing costs. After talking it over, we decided to pass, they (and everyone else) still have a ton of homes to sell. This is just the beginning, I can only imagine the deals that they will be offering next summer.

[hipmatt]

I wonder how Lennar’s huge new community in French Valley will fare? It’s called Spencers Crossing. http://www.spencerscrossing.com/
There is a lot of inventory in French Valley, from resales to new homes. They are planning quite a few homes in this community.

[hipmatt]

I wonder how Lennar’s huge new community in French Valley will fare? It’s called Spencers Crossing. http://www.spencerscrossing.com/
There is a lot of inventory in French Valley, from resales to new homes. They are planning quite a few homes in this community.

[hipmatt]

I have to agree with stansd on this. I am really shocked by those who are telling SDHH to ditch the tithing, and that it is stupid or silly. I also find it rude to tell him to move out of SD, or to move to Utah.

Be respectful of his choice to tithe. If you don’t get it or personally don’t agree with that, thats OK, but insulting a him is crossing the line, especially considering this is a RE related site. If you are representing the ethically divers and tolerant society that you call San Diego, I doubt you would bash a man for tithing.

I have to admit, I am disappointed with the content on these forums lately. piggington.com used to offer interesting stories on RE deals, prices, foreclosures, the latest trends. I came here for that info, and I hope we can still exchange that info. We used to debate RE prices, but lately I have seen us debating religion, personal choices, and politics.

I respect any political, religious, or ethical opinions one may have, but the posts I read are getting more and more personal, and more disrespectful. My biggest beef is that they are off topic.

I can see the occasional political reference, but I see no need to keep a thread going for 7 pages and two months about how Christianity is the root of all evil, or any other religion for that matter.

See:
http://piggington.com/talked_to_thornberg?page=6

[hipmatt]

I have to agree with stansd on this. I am really shocked by those who are telling SDHH to ditch the tithing, and that it is stupid or silly. I also find it rude to tell him to move out of SD, or to move to Utah.

Be respectful of his choice to tithe. If you don’t get it or personally don’t agree with that, thats OK, but insulting a him is crossing the line, especially considering this is a RE related site. If you are representing the ethically divers and tolerant society that you call San Diego, I doubt you would bash a man for tithing.

I have to admit, I am disappointed with the content on these forums lately. piggington.com used to offer interesting stories on RE deals, prices, foreclosures, the latest trends. I came here for that info, and I hope we can still exchange that info. We used to debate RE prices, but lately I have seen us debating religion, personal choices, and politics.

I respect any political, religious, or ethical opinions one may have, but the posts I read are getting more and more personal, and more disrespectful. My biggest beef is that they are off topic.

I can see the occasional political reference, but I see no need to keep a thread going for 7 pages and two months about how Christianity is the root of all evil, or any other religion for that matter.

See:
http://piggington.com/talked_to_thornberg?page=6

[hipmatt]

I don’t think we need RE agents, this is coming from a former agent. Mostly, agents show homes, take listings, and work on their business, the legal and clerical work that you may think they help with is minimal. They basically fill out the purchase contract, the form is pretty straight forward, there are few things that change between the average contract, besides the terms of the deal. Usually they have a transaction coordinator that does most of the work for them anyways. Some agents I worked with could barely fill out the purchase agreement.

Considering the current information age, and the availability of INSTANT access to listings, and inventory, I do think it is possible for the average transaction to exclude the RE agent, or at least RE agents will have a more minor role, and hopefully smaller commission. I would have no problems paying escrow a bit more to help with the clerical and legal side of things.

Remember that the people who protect you when buying/selling a home are: termite inspectors, title companies, home inspectors, escrow, appraisers (supposedly), etc. Chances are that you will use these same services, anyways, with or without a RE agent.

BTW, no offense to the RE agents on this board. We could do with out you, but the real scum is the lender or loan officer. If I could eliminate either one first, I would pick the lowly lenders. We could easily do with out them.

[hipmatt]

I don’t think we need RE agents, this is coming from a former agent. Mostly, agents show homes, take listings, and work on their business, the legal and clerical work that you may think they help with is minimal. They basically fill out the purchase contract, the form is pretty straight forward, there are few things that change between the average contract, besides the terms of the deal. Usually they have a transaction coordinator that does most of the work for them anyways. Some agents I worked with could barely fill out the purchase agreement.

Considering the current information age, and the availability of INSTANT access to listings, and inventory, I do think it is possible for the average transaction to exclude the RE agent, or at least RE agents will have a more minor role, and hopefully smaller commission. I would have no problems paying escrow a bit more to help with the clerical and legal side of things.

Remember that the people who protect you when buying/selling a home are: termite inspectors, title companies, home inspectors, escrow, appraisers (supposedly), etc. Chances are that you will use these same services, anyways, with or without a RE agent.

BTW, no offense to the RE agents on this board. We could do with out you, but the real scum is the lender or loan officer. If I could eliminate either one first, I would pick the lowly lenders. We could easily do with out them.

[hipmatt]

Well, I have to disagree as well about boomers being primarily responsible. In my observations, the boomers I know, are working longer to keep up with the rising costs of living. They are living a lot closer to their means if not below, especially compared to Gen-xrs, like me.

My peers are buying homes with interest only loans, 0% down, and financing everything else in their lives. Last time I checked, it was only until recently that you didn’t need a 20% cash down to buy a home. My parents(boomers) never heard of the 100% financing.

Gen-xers, are financing everything from fake boobs, to BMWs, and even their daily Coffee. We(genX) need to address these issues if we want to make it better. Its gonna take financial responsibility, patience, and people are going to have to sacrifice things. They need to realize that not everyone can live like the Osbourne’s, and even if you can, it won’t make you a better person.

I don’t see an end to this trend anytime soon, so its gonna take an economic correction to teach us the lesson. Times will be tough on some people, but over all I think it will be good for the sake of our country.

I agree with bugs, and sdcellar..
Hating the boomers for buying at low prices, come on… WE are the ones who bid the prices up to insane levels with insane loans, and actually continued to BUY the homes. If anything, they deserve the equity from our insane credit bubble, they are going to need it to fight the insane inflation that we have also created for them.

If anything, I wish the boomers could teach the genXers a bit about saving, and responsibility, boomers may not be perfect, but to me, their personal finance is much more logical than ours.

[hipmatt]

Well, I have to disagree as well about boomers being primarily responsible. In my observations, the boomers I know, are working longer to keep up with the rising costs of living. They are living a lot closer to their means if not below, especially compared to Gen-xrs, like me.

My peers are buying homes with interest only loans, 0% down, and financing everything else in their lives. Last time I checked, it was only until recently that you didn’t need a 20% cash down to buy a home. My parents(boomers) never heard of the 100% financing.

Gen-xers, are financing everything from fake boobs, to BMWs, and even their daily Coffee. We(genX) need to address these issues if we want to make it better. Its gonna take financial responsibility, patience, and people are going to have to sacrifice things. They need to realize that not everyone can live like the Osbourne’s, and even if you can, it won’t make you a better person.

I don’t see an end to this trend anytime soon, so its gonna take an economic correction to teach us the lesson. Times will be tough on some people, but over all I think it will be good for the sake of our country.

I agree with bugs, and sdcellar..
Hating the boomers for buying at low prices, come on… WE are the ones who bid the prices up to insane levels with insane loans, and actually continued to BUY the homes. If anything, they deserve the equity from our insane credit bubble, they are going to need it to fight the insane inflation that we have also created for them.

If anything, I wish the boomers could teach the genXers a bit about saving, and responsibility, boomers may not be perfect, but to me, their personal finance is much more logical than ours.

[hipmatt]

Wow, after reading the previous pots, I am surprised by the lunacy I read coming from cyphire’s posts. If anyone has anger, or is picking on anyone, or is neurotic, it is that person..

cyphire, you seem to be confused…
In one post you boast that you are an atheist, but then in the last post, you tell a story of a nice Christian family that lived a “blessed simple life”. Then you go on to state what Jesus would or would not approve of. If you were truly an atheist, you wouldn’t believe a family could be “blessed”, as blessings come from God. And if you were truly an Atheist, you wouldn’t believe that Jesus was the son of God, since there is no God, and therefore He would not have valid judgment on anyone’s behavior.

I didn’t see nearly the amount of insults coming from jg… and then to tell jg that Jesus wouldn’t approve of him… that is out of line.

My advice is to drop the bashing once and for all. It’s great that you hate Bush, and Christians, and that you know the bible better than most Christians, and that you don’t believe the bible. I also see that you feel Christians will ruin your lives and that of your children. Perhaps you can go out and volunteer in your community, and try to make the world a better place. Surely you can do this in a more productive manner than spewing post after post of your hatred for half of the country.

But if you do need to continue the bashing, please, I ask nicely, do this elsewhere on the net, as the things you write are hurtful to others. This is a RE forum, and I feel it should stay that way. There are plenty of other outlets for you to express your hatred for God fearing people.

God Bless You cyphire.

[hipmatt]

Wow, after reading the previous pots, I am surprised by the lunacy I read coming from cyphire’s posts. If anyone has anger, or is picking on anyone, or is neurotic, it is that person..

cyphire, you seem to be confused…
In one post you boast that you are an atheist, but then in the last post, you tell a story of a nice Christian family that lived a “blessed simple life”. Then you go on to state what Jesus would or would not approve of. If you were truly an atheist, you wouldn’t believe a family could be “blessed”, as blessings come from God. And if you were truly an Atheist, you wouldn’t believe that Jesus was the son of God, since there is no God, and therefore He would not have valid judgment on anyone’s behavior.

I didn’t see nearly the amount of insults coming from jg… and then to tell jg that Jesus wouldn’t approve of him… that is out of line.

My advice is to drop the bashing once and for all. It’s great that you hate Bush, and Christians, and that you know the bible better than most Christians, and that you don’t believe the bible. I also see that you feel Christians will ruin your lives and that of your children. Perhaps you can go out and volunteer in your community, and try to make the world a better place. Surely you can do this in a more productive manner than spewing post after post of your hatred for half of the country.

But if you do need to continue the bashing, please, I ask nicely, do this elsewhere on the net, as the things you write are hurtful to others. This is a RE forum, and I feel it should stay that way. There are plenty of other outlets for you to express your hatred for God fearing people.

God Bless You cyphire.

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