[Coronita]

[quote=Hobie]I did forget about how competitive the parents become with bragging rights. They peacock when kid is accepted to a private and hold there head low when kid is going to a community college. Well, some of them..[/quote]

Funny you should say that. I got a different version of that story among some Asian parents.

Some Asian parents peacock when their kids gets into a prestigeous college to for pre med studies. Some Asian parents hold their head low when their kids go to a community college.

4 years later, some of the Asian parent peacocks quickly lose their feathers after spending close to $300k for that prestigeous college only for the kid to transfer out of a medical program into a law program and than into some art history program and graduate with a BA degree in some far off degree that lands them a job at Starbucks in some metro city and have to help subsidize their rent living there.

Meanwhile, those low head hanging parents who sent their kids to a JC start to peek up their heads because for the first 2 years, they saved a shitload of money while their kid got their act together and figured out what they wanted to do, applied for and transferred to a good state school, and completed their technical degree in engineering, software or nursing, or some other high demand profession that pays well, saved their kids a boatload of money so kids weren’t saddled with a boatload of debt, and were financially self sufficient much more earlier than those directionless kid that went to a prestigeous 4 year private school on the east coast.

I had a niece that did just that. 4 years of prestigeous school, 2 years into a medical program, and then one day “I really don’t want to do this….$400-500k later” and she isn’t alone.

[Coronita]

[quote=scaredyclassic][quote=Coronita]its weird though because the kids in question has a 3.2 and 1050 sat when SATs were still being used at UC schools.

that just seems unusually low for a sought after premed major at UCI. unless it’s really easy to get into UCI premed programs (I doubt it)

Or unless his parents are lying and he didn’t get into a premed program.

Just really trying to understand this huge discrepancy that some people are saying happens with higher achievments.[/quote]

I dont think uci has a premed program. Judt individ. Majors. I just checked website, theres a post bacc premed program, but i dont see a “pre med” major

My kid did get into uci. We visited. He did not like it. Prob. Cause no friends going there?

I have a feeling sdsu is going to be the elite school now,

Due to being half price and in gorgeous location.

Cal state says its just numbers…i dont think the calstate app has an essay. Just uc.[/quote]

Gotcha…. ok,.maybe then his parents were full of shit then. I feel better. it’s not that I didn’t think his kid should be allowed to go, it’s just I was getting a little concerned about people saying 4.0 gpa and high gpa and a lot of extracurricular actvity still wasn’t enough to get into any UC or CalState or SDSU school. And then hearing a parent talk about their kid get in with bunch lower credentials that the parents didn’t want to mention but the kid told to my kid made me a bit puzzled and questioned whether the parent was doing something under the table. I think the dad is a big shot doctor.

[Coronita]

[quote=Hobie]Personal essays can make a difference. You hear lots of story’s about admissions. Who know’s how true they ar. Here is one based on a formula: sat+gpa+random multplier= floor to making the min base cut. This number changes each year. Then they look at your writing.

If demographic’s wasn’t a factor in admissions like they say, then why collect it during this phase? Collect it after acceptance.

One AdCom ( admissions counselor ) at a different school told me they could fill the freshman class with all valedictorians. But they want a diverse and ‘interesting’ class.

They have a good point and it would seem you get that data from the extra curriculars and creative writing.

I would suggest having you kid get good at writing 500 word essays. That is a paragraph. They are not taught how to get right to the point in a few words.[/quote]

maybe times have changed but when I applied for UC schools they didn’t really look at the essay unless you were borderline before the criteria of entrance all else being equal.

I think it’s pretty stupid to put that much emphasis on an essay especially for a lot of programs that are more STEM focused because what matters more is technical writing, not necessarily the fluffy writing one would need to do as expected for college admissions.

I guess this is why some parents spend an a lot of money for a college admissions coach? Once again, just feels like an arms race.

[Coronita]

its weird though because the kids in question has a 3.2 and 1050 sat when SATs were still being used at UC schools.

that just seems unusually low for a sought after premed major at UCI. unless it’s really easy to get into UCI premed programs (I doubt it)

Or unless his parents are lying and he didn’t get into a premed program.

Just really trying to understand this huge discrepancy that some people are saying happens with higher achievments.

[Coronita]

Dont feel bad. I bought carnival cruises a few weeks ago at $12-13 I think, I forget exactly, but it was the low teens. Then sold it at $16… It’s $22 today.

Yup, can’t win them all.

I think that is why my dad makes a killing. Never sold a share Intel, Qualcomm, Microsoft since 80ies and 90ies. Lucky dude

Good news is that Moderna is at $57, heh heh

Please don’t get a crazy idea to short Tesla

[Coronita]

[quote=ltsddd]sheesh…that’s good timing on me…looks like small caps is up another 3-4% today. That’s almost +10% since I got out.[/quote]

You know I use to feel bad about it when things like this happen… But a wise friend keeps reminding me… You cannot lose money by always taking your profit early .

The unexpected job hiring definitely caught people by surprise. I sold some not all S&P yesterday. it’s ok. you made some money, who cares if you got that last leg or not.

You bought when things were discounted during the covid scare, you sold after booking a profit. Keep in mind some people took no action. I’m sure you are doing well, Good job.

Happy Furlow Friday!

[Coronita]

Up to $18.4k donations.

Keep it up people!

[Coronita]

[quote=scaredyclassic]
i guess im getting pretty cheap, but every 18 to 22 year old is broke.

why does society expect me to pay for my adult kids? seriously. These arent kids. these are adults.

it was different when the numbers werent so large, maybe, like if I had to cough up a few extra bucks.

i could earn a years tuition at a state univ over the summer in 1981

now…

it’s not like a little extra help. 100-300k is actual money.

[/quote]

College tuition is one of the few things that has consistently increased by 4% every year. Think about that one.

[quote]
so you see bumperstickers like, my kid and all my money go to stanford univ.
[/quote]

Funny you should say that because the first week I got into college, I bought a sticker and gave it to my dad that says exactly that….I got a full ride from Bank of Parents who paid for it because of his speculation in the 80ies into then unknown semiconductor company called “Intel”

[quote]
in general, we tell people, your parents money is not your money. dont count on it, dont expect anything, if they want to help you they will, but it’s theirs not yours.
[/quote]

Many parents only tell our kids that so they don’t turn out to be entitled spoiled brats. And that’s the reality. But it’s a systemic problem we have here in the U.S. even well before college..

Money in some cases does make a non-trival difference in someone’s education here in the US. And that’s fucked up.

Take something as simple as the SAT/ACT . Parents that can afford to send kids to take the SAT/ACT multiple times at $100 a pop, and the more times one takes it, the better the score is. we can sign them up for a multiple prep classes so they can score higher. And parents know that now. That’s why getting a kid into a top rank school or even a UC school these days is almost like an arm’s race, where the parent that spends the most money arming their kid with the best tutors, extracuricular activities in name only, recommendation, essay writing, etc wins….I have a huge problem with these “college specialists” these days that pretty much offer strategic ways for kids to apply, how to write their essays (even possibly doing it for them), etc. It wasn’t nearly this bad when I was applying for colleges….But admittedly, since this is the game that it has come to, and for a family that can play this game, of course they are going to pay up and play this game. It frankly makes me sick. and totally turned off I hate this game.

That ain’t right. Anytime you put a huge dollar on whether someone gets into a a reputable college program, that immediately means you aren’t always going to get the best and brightest students, because there is a good percentage of the population that would have been good but couldn’t afford to go. That’s fucked up. In most Asian countries, people test to get into the best schools, and the best schools are almost free to anyone who test in and meet the stringent requirements, regardless of economic background they are from. Private schools are tier 2,3,4 level schools for students who don’t do as well. In a lot of way, this makes sense because this gives people from poor(er) backgrounds an opportunity to get out of their financial state simply by being academically talented/capable. And those that aren’t as talented but are from families with reasonable amount of money can afford to send their kids to a decent private school and still turn out pretty good

We don’t do it here. Everything a kid needs to do to get into a top rank college, the kid has a better change when their parents have money.

[quote]
yeah, if college were free, the middle class kid will be richer if he got free college in a strictly accounting way.
[/quote]

College into a top rank school, one could consider, is a limited resource. Not everyone should be able to get in for “free”. There should be some weeding out process, so that “free” applies to top talent irrespective of financial background. I don’t have a problem if tax dollars are used to groom the best and brightest here in the U.S. I also don’t think these top rank schools should be free foreign students. We’re not responsible for raising top foreign talent. And most of the time, top talent from foreign countries have a free ride from their respective governments that end up paying for their tuition. In fact, imho, we should be charging much more for foreign students since most likely countries will end up paying, if their eventual purpose is to repatriate the students the send overseas here to the U.S.

[quote]
but i think it’s just that everyone at least start at zero. that seems reasonable. debt feels awful.

[/quote]

Yup.

[quote]

having been hobbled with 6 figure debt, with a supposedly lucrative degree, i still found it difficult to make it, i dont want my kdis in debt, i dont want to pay, i dont like the system, and it doesnt seem very fair overall.

[/quote]

I think I mentioned this before but there are a lot of doctors and dentists that are part time employees for other doctors and dentists and won’t be having their practices for a long time….Why? Because when they graduated from medical school and dental school, they were in a hole for $500-600k.

On top of that, if they wanted to start their own practice, who’s going to loan them the money?

The ones that are able to start their own practice right away tend to be financed by Bank of Parents who were also doctors and dentists…

But good news. For most careers, eventually, the degree from a specific college really doesn’t matter. I have yet to work with many people from an Ivy League school. My expensive paper, however, looks very nice..Might double up as spare toilet paper. That’s about it.

Also, we have a few programs that other countries dont have. For instance, serving in the armed forces is a great way also pay for higher education.

[Coronita]

Well this opens up an interesting situation.

Being the over prepared parent as I am, I had budgeted a 529 But I wonder how this would work if I take out a student loan for my kid. Could the 529 be used to pay for a student loan?

[Coronita]

[quote=Rich Toscano][quote=svelte][quote=Rich Toscano]

Where we might part ways is in other risk assets. There are areas of the global stock market that — even after this huge rally — are still priced for positive long-term returns. In specific, developed intl value stocks are priced for returns that are slightly under the average stock returns — not great but ok. Emerging value stocks are priced for substantially higher than normal returns.
[/quote]

So here is where I get confused.

I’m pretty sure I’ve heard you say, Rich, that one shouldn’t try and time the market but should invest for the long term as in decades.

But the above sounds like you’re advocating investing in those areas that, at the present time, give the best chance for above average returns.

Is that not timing the market?[/quote]

No, that is not timing the market!

And also no, the thing above that is not what I am saying. I’ll start with that one. I’m not saying you have to invest for decades. I’m saying that you have to consider that the price for stocks is based on decades’ worth of their expected earnings. So, shorter term changes to that earnings stream should not, in theory, change their fair value all that much. (In practice, of course, it often does, but that’s a whole separate topic). But that’s not the same as saying that an investor necessarily needs to hold them for decades.

OK, onto the fun question. This is one that I have strong opinions on, so apologies in advance for what will probably be a surfeit of exclamation points.

Anyway no, a thousand times no — value investing is NOT market timing!

Let me illustrate with an example to start. Let’s say there is a modest condo that, if you bought it, you could rent out for $1,000/month. It’s for sale for $5 million.

Would you buy it? No, of course not. Why would you buy something for $5 mil when it only rents out for $1k/month? It’s way too expensive.

Is this market timing? Again — of course not. You simply evaluated what the investment is worth, and compared that to the actual price (the key point here being that those 2 things can be different).

It’s no different with stocks or anything else.

Market timing entails making guesses about what the market will do over the short term. It’s path dependent.

The thing I’m talking about here (which I describe as value investing as shorthand) entails having an estimate of likely longer term returns, and investing accordingly. It is not path dependent.

Let’s take US stocks as an example. I mentioned that I’m bearish on the S&P500. Is this because of a necessarily dismal economic outlook? No! It’s due to valuation. The S&P500 is very expensive. It is pricing in an unusually great outcome. If you merely get an average or even above-average outcome… it is likely to do poorly.

So my “claim” here is that the S&P500 is likely to generate poor returns over the coming 7-10 years.

But how will that look? Will there be a crash? Will it just waffle along sideways, without going much of anywhere for many years? Something in between?

I have no idea. To answer that question would be market timing.

But what I’m saying here is: I don’t know the path it will take, but I think it’s likely that when we look back a decade from now, this thing will have done pretty poorly. That’s not market timing. It’s simply having an awareness of what something is worth, and thus the likely returns, before you invest in it.

Does this distinction make sense?[/quote]

Yes, make sense. Thank you.

[Coronita]

[quote=scaredyclassic][quote=Coronita]So there you go scardey…

(You’re welcome…)

I’m really disappointed she disconnected before I had a chance to send her the link to this thread. Damnit!

I know, I know… Such an ahole FLU thing to do…

But someone’s got to do it![/quote]

thanks

this is probably illegal for everyone but Sallie Mae to do.

I hate student loans. hate them with a seething passion. I recently paid mine off after 25 years. that includes a few very shaky bad years toward the beginning of the loan period. I mean, being a responsible fellow, it actually took a toll on my health.

But i didnt want to let my prejudice stand in the way of a screaming deal, if that’s what this was.

my hatred continues to burn unabated. motherfuckers! if there were a way to riot and loot against student loans, i might. but it’s like railing against capitalism, or the sun. it’s justa fixture of reality.

curse you, sun, we need more moon![/quote]

You know….After just painfully enduring a 20 minute conversation with this legalized gangster of an organization Sallie Mae, of which I really want my 20 minutes of my life back… I have to say. Now I understand why there’s so many people demanding financial reform for student loans.

This really is bad. I mean, if they want to try to pull this shit off to someone like me, who although I’m not the most financially smart, but at least financially competent, I can imagine how the majority of people in this country who are financially illiterate would get screwed over by a student loan. I mean, in so many ways, this is 10x worse than trying to get a used car loan or the interest rate terms of a credit card, because at least you can get a document that describes exactly how you’re going to get screwed over for those two types of loans.

Add me to the camp of people who hate student loans (even though I never got one).

Really really fucked up.

If you really want your kid to pay his/her own way, maybe the way to do it is to cash out refinance a property at the current 2.5%-3%, and then loan the money to your kid, where he/she can make payments. At least then, you know the kid gets a fair loan rate.

Still a bit shocked at what just happened.

[Coronita]

So there you go scardey…

(You’re welcome…)

I’m really disappointed she disconnected before I had a chance to send her the link to this thread. Damnit!

I know, I know… Such an ahole FLU thing to do…

But someone’s got to do it!

[Coronita]

Danielle at 12:38, Jun 4:
We would not have that information available. Once an application is submitted, if approved, you will receive an interest rate offer. If you choose variable, it can increase or decrease over the life of the loan. I cannot say every factor that may contribute to a change. Your specific rate will vary based on the loan product selected. If your loan offers rate and repayment options, your rate may also vary based on your selection.
If your loan has a variable rate, the maximum interest rate your loan could adjust to is 25%.
frank at 12:41, Jun 4:
Wow… So let me summarize how this loan works. You want me to apply for a variable loan that starts at 1.25% and is capped at 25% (credit card bend over rate), without any detailed description on how that variable rate could rise from 1.25% to somewhere 25%, even if nothing in my credit/financial situation changes, nor if libor changes, and if I always pay on time…..
frank at 12:41, Jun 4:
I’m sorry to say this, this is absolutely the worst loan idea ever. Probably worse than any used car loan or credit card offer, because at lease with those loans, if I’m going to bend over, at least I’m told up front.
frank at 12:42, Jun 4:
Thank you.
frank at 12:42, Jun 4:
But no thank you.

(agent disconnected before I could finish)

Danielle at 12:42, Jun 4:
Thank you for choosing Sallie Mae. To start an application, click here. To complete a brief survey about your chat experience, click here.

[Coronita]

Danielle at 12:38, Jun 4:
We would not have that information available. Once an application is submitted, if approved, you will receive an interest rate offer. If you choose variable, it can increase or decrease over the life of the loan. I cannot say every factor that may contribute to a change. Your specific rate will vary based on the loan product selected. If your loan offers rate and repayment options, your rate may also vary based on your selection.
If your loan has a variable rate, the maximum interest rate your loan could adjust to is 25%.

[Coronita]

God damnit they seem to be dancing around the same damn question for a long time… I’m still on the chat channel with them…

[Author]

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