[bubba99]

I don’t think the impact will really be much for the borrower, and even if it is we are looking at 400k out of 2 or 3 million foreclosures – say 15%. I don’t think 15% will help the market much, and I think the new loans all become recourse. If you convert into the new loan, you lose the right to walk away – no longer purchase money – and the government may become the new collector. With prices still falling, the second round of foreclosures may all be recourse.

The big impact will be on the Fannie and Freddie bonds sold to the Chineese and Koreans, and Japaneese et. al.(the lenders) Much of this type of crap is being sold at 20 or 30 cents on the dollar right now, and there is 3 Trillion of it at risk between Freddie and Fannie. And this bill just guaranteed payment to the bond holder.

The great improvement at Lehman where they “sold 6 billion in crap at less than 30 cents on the dollar was not even a real sale. They lent the buyer 5 billion plus of the sale price and must buy it back if the losses are greater than the 1 billion invested by the buyer.

Now we are on the hook for 3 trillion of this toxic waste. No hope for the housing market, nor the US dollar.

[bubba99]

I don’t think the impact will really be much for the borrower, and even if it is we are looking at 400k out of 2 or 3 million foreclosures – say 15%. I don’t think 15% will help the market much, and I think the new loans all become recourse. If you convert into the new loan, you lose the right to walk away – no longer purchase money – and the government may become the new collector. With prices still falling, the second round of foreclosures may all be recourse.

The big impact will be on the Fannie and Freddie bonds sold to the Chineese and Koreans, and Japaneese et. al.(the lenders) Much of this type of crap is being sold at 20 or 30 cents on the dollar right now, and there is 3 Trillion of it at risk between Freddie and Fannie. And this bill just guaranteed payment to the bond holder.

The great improvement at Lehman where they “sold 6 billion in crap at less than 30 cents on the dollar was not even a real sale. They lent the buyer 5 billion plus of the sale price and must buy it back if the losses are greater than the 1 billion invested by the buyer.

Now we are on the hook for 3 trillion of this toxic waste. No hope for the housing market, nor the US dollar.

[bubba99]

I don’t think the impact will really be much for the borrower, and even if it is we are looking at 400k out of 2 or 3 million foreclosures – say 15%. I don’t think 15% will help the market much, and I think the new loans all become recourse. If you convert into the new loan, you lose the right to walk away – no longer purchase money – and the government may become the new collector. With prices still falling, the second round of foreclosures may all be recourse.

The big impact will be on the Fannie and Freddie bonds sold to the Chineese and Koreans, and Japaneese et. al.(the lenders) Much of this type of crap is being sold at 20 or 30 cents on the dollar right now, and there is 3 Trillion of it at risk between Freddie and Fannie. And this bill just guaranteed payment to the bond holder.

The great improvement at Lehman where they “sold 6 billion in crap at less than 30 cents on the dollar was not even a real sale. They lent the buyer 5 billion plus of the sale price and must buy it back if the losses are greater than the 1 billion invested by the buyer.

Now we are on the hook for 3 trillion of this toxic waste. No hope for the housing market, nor the US dollar.

[bubba99]

The new bill has little to do with housing at the individual borrower level, and everything to do with guaranteeing Fannie and Freddie’s 6 Trillion in bonds and second party guarantees.

Our lenders – China, France, Germany, Singapore et.al. hold in the neighborhood of 2 Trillion in bad Fannie/Freddie paper. As the underlying mortgages go bad, the mess becomes international in a big way – remember these two GSE’s are leveraged about 40 times – each dollar loss on a mortgage loses 40 dollars in bond equity. The bill just gave a blank check from the fed to inject whatever capital the GSE’s need to stay solvent. In fact, the treasury can buy common or preferred stock at their descretion to prop up these two boat anchors.

Congress just put you and me – the tax payers on the hook for potentially 5 trillion in bond guarantees. For a group that claims to be capitalists, they sure look like Lennon style socialists.

These idiots cannot really believe that this will maintain housing prices at double their economic value and save the bad mortgages from going under while america spirals down into a serious recession. God help us all

[bubba99]

The new bill has little to do with housing at the individual borrower level, and everything to do with guaranteeing Fannie and Freddie’s 6 Trillion in bonds and second party guarantees.

Our lenders – China, France, Germany, Singapore et.al. hold in the neighborhood of 2 Trillion in bad Fannie/Freddie paper. As the underlying mortgages go bad, the mess becomes international in a big way – remember these two GSE’s are leveraged about 40 times – each dollar loss on a mortgage loses 40 dollars in bond equity. The bill just gave a blank check from the fed to inject whatever capital the GSE’s need to stay solvent. In fact, the treasury can buy common or preferred stock at their descretion to prop up these two boat anchors.

Congress just put you and me – the tax payers on the hook for potentially 5 trillion in bond guarantees. For a group that claims to be capitalists, they sure look like Lennon style socialists.

These idiots cannot really believe that this will maintain housing prices at double their economic value and save the bad mortgages from going under while america spirals down into a serious recession. God help us all

[bubba99]

The new bill has little to do with housing at the individual borrower level, and everything to do with guaranteeing Fannie and Freddie’s 6 Trillion in bonds and second party guarantees.

Our lenders – China, France, Germany, Singapore et.al. hold in the neighborhood of 2 Trillion in bad Fannie/Freddie paper. As the underlying mortgages go bad, the mess becomes international in a big way – remember these two GSE’s are leveraged about 40 times – each dollar loss on a mortgage loses 40 dollars in bond equity. The bill just gave a blank check from the fed to inject whatever capital the GSE’s need to stay solvent. In fact, the treasury can buy common or preferred stock at their descretion to prop up these two boat anchors.

Congress just put you and me – the tax payers on the hook for potentially 5 trillion in bond guarantees. For a group that claims to be capitalists, they sure look like Lennon style socialists.

These idiots cannot really believe that this will maintain housing prices at double their economic value and save the bad mortgages from going under while america spirals down into a serious recession. God help us all

[bubba99]

The new bill has little to do with housing at the individual borrower level, and everything to do with guaranteeing Fannie and Freddie’s 6 Trillion in bonds and second party guarantees.

Our lenders – China, France, Germany, Singapore et.al. hold in the neighborhood of 2 Trillion in bad Fannie/Freddie paper. As the underlying mortgages go bad, the mess becomes international in a big way – remember these two GSE’s are leveraged about 40 times – each dollar loss on a mortgage loses 40 dollars in bond equity. The bill just gave a blank check from the fed to inject whatever capital the GSE’s need to stay solvent. In fact, the treasury can buy common or preferred stock at their descretion to prop up these two boat anchors.

Congress just put you and me – the tax payers on the hook for potentially 5 trillion in bond guarantees. For a group that claims to be capitalists, they sure look like Lennon style socialists.

These idiots cannot really believe that this will maintain housing prices at double their economic value and save the bad mortgages from going under while america spirals down into a serious recession. God help us all

[bubba99]

The new bill has little to do with housing at the individual borrower level, and everything to do with guaranteeing Fannie and Freddie’s 6 Trillion in bonds and second party guarantees.

Our lenders – China, France, Germany, Singapore et.al. hold in the neighborhood of 2 Trillion in bad Fannie/Freddie paper. As the underlying mortgages go bad, the mess becomes international in a big way – remember these two GSE’s are leveraged about 40 times – each dollar loss on a mortgage loses 40 dollars in bond equity. The bill just gave a blank check from the fed to inject whatever capital the GSE’s need to stay solvent. In fact, the treasury can buy common or preferred stock at their descretion to prop up these two boat anchors.

Congress just put you and me – the tax payers on the hook for potentially 5 trillion in bond guarantees. For a group that claims to be capitalists, they sure look like Lennon style socialists.

These idiots cannot really believe that this will maintain housing prices at double their economic value and save the bad mortgages from going under while america spirals down into a serious recession. God help us all

[bubba99]

The numbers are misleading. They are for “adjusted gross income”, not total income. Most wealth accumulation is not included in “adjusted gross income” until a taxable event occurs – like the sale of a stock.

The Top 5 percent of the earners accumulate 90 percent of all the wealth increase each year. For example, Bill Gates who makes a gizillion dollars each year, only pays taxes on the Microsoft Shares he sells, not the ones he has been granted, nor on their appreciation. He also takes advantage of considerable deductions for his charitable foundation.

I am surprised at how little the supposedly smart posters on this forum actually know about taxes, income, and income distribution across american earning classes. The wage earners in California (marginal rates)pays about 23% fed tax, 9% state tax, and 8.5% social security tax plus another 8.5% ssn by the employeer (payroll tax). That is about 47% depending on how you calculate in the payroll tax.

I guarantee, that the top 1% earners pay nowhere close to that on their wealth appreciation each year. And none of this includes property tax, sales tax, et. al.

[bubba99]

The numbers are misleading. They are for “adjusted gross income”, not total income. Most wealth accumulation is not included in “adjusted gross income” until a taxable event occurs – like the sale of a stock.

The Top 5 percent of the earners accumulate 90 percent of all the wealth increase each year. For example, Bill Gates who makes a gizillion dollars each year, only pays taxes on the Microsoft Shares he sells, not the ones he has been granted, nor on their appreciation. He also takes advantage of considerable deductions for his charitable foundation.

I am surprised at how little the supposedly smart posters on this forum actually know about taxes, income, and income distribution across american earning classes. The wage earners in California (marginal rates)pays about 23% fed tax, 9% state tax, and 8.5% social security tax plus another 8.5% ssn by the employeer (payroll tax). That is about 47% depending on how you calculate in the payroll tax.

I guarantee, that the top 1% earners pay nowhere close to that on their wealth appreciation each year. And none of this includes property tax, sales tax, et. al.

[bubba99]

The numbers are misleading. They are for “adjusted gross income”, not total income. Most wealth accumulation is not included in “adjusted gross income” until a taxable event occurs – like the sale of a stock.

The Top 5 percent of the earners accumulate 90 percent of all the wealth increase each year. For example, Bill Gates who makes a gizillion dollars each year, only pays taxes on the Microsoft Shares he sells, not the ones he has been granted, nor on their appreciation. He also takes advantage of considerable deductions for his charitable foundation.

I am surprised at how little the supposedly smart posters on this forum actually know about taxes, income, and income distribution across american earning classes. The wage earners in California (marginal rates)pays about 23% fed tax, 9% state tax, and 8.5% social security tax plus another 8.5% ssn by the employeer (payroll tax). That is about 47% depending on how you calculate in the payroll tax.

I guarantee, that the top 1% earners pay nowhere close to that on their wealth appreciation each year. And none of this includes property tax, sales tax, et. al.

[bubba99]

The numbers are misleading. They are for “adjusted gross income”, not total income. Most wealth accumulation is not included in “adjusted gross income” until a taxable event occurs – like the sale of a stock.

The Top 5 percent of the earners accumulate 90 percent of all the wealth increase each year. For example, Bill Gates who makes a gizillion dollars each year, only pays taxes on the Microsoft Shares he sells, not the ones he has been granted, nor on their appreciation. He also takes advantage of considerable deductions for his charitable foundation.

I am surprised at how little the supposedly smart posters on this forum actually know about taxes, income, and income distribution across american earning classes. The wage earners in California (marginal rates)pays about 23% fed tax, 9% state tax, and 8.5% social security tax plus another 8.5% ssn by the employeer (payroll tax). That is about 47% depending on how you calculate in the payroll tax.

I guarantee, that the top 1% earners pay nowhere close to that on their wealth appreciation each year. And none of this includes property tax, sales tax, et. al.

[bubba99]

The numbers are misleading. They are for “adjusted gross income”, not total income. Most wealth accumulation is not included in “adjusted gross income” until a taxable event occurs – like the sale of a stock.

The Top 5 percent of the earners accumulate 90 percent of all the wealth increase each year. For example, Bill Gates who makes a gizillion dollars each year, only pays taxes on the Microsoft Shares he sells, not the ones he has been granted, nor on their appreciation. He also takes advantage of considerable deductions for his charitable foundation.

I am surprised at how little the supposedly smart posters on this forum actually know about taxes, income, and income distribution across american earning classes. The wage earners in California (marginal rates)pays about 23% fed tax, 9% state tax, and 8.5% social security tax plus another 8.5% ssn by the employeer (payroll tax). That is about 47% depending on how you calculate in the payroll tax.

I guarantee, that the top 1% earners pay nowhere close to that on their wealth appreciation each year. And none of this includes property tax, sales tax, et. al.

[bubba99]

At this point I do not think converting to euros will help – dollar is 1.59 to the euro – almost the lowest ever. Plus, I think the new phrase “too big to fair” works with the dollar and the US economy.

The world cannot afford for the US dollar or economy to fail. The FED has created another bubble in commodities deliberately to take some of the pressure off of the real estate calapse. Two percent interest rates in a 6 percent inflation environment is deliberate. The FED probably wanted a stock market bubble, but un-intended consequences made it a commodities bubble.

The FED is counting on the ECB to keep inflation in reasonable limits with 4.5 percent interest rates while allowing the US to try and bubble its way out of a depression. The ECB is allowing this because the world cannot afford for the US to fail. Inspite of globalization, the US is too much of the worlds economic engine and a US failure would spin the world into decades of economic disaster. But knowing this helps me not, because I still have no place to put my money.

The stock market is headed down, inverse funds like SDS and SKF are very volitile, the FXE and FXF the currency exchange funds are up and down like an elevator.

[bubba99]

At this point I do not think converting to euros will help – dollar is 1.59 to the euro – almost the lowest ever. Plus, I think the new phrase “too big to fair” works with the dollar and the US economy.

The world cannot afford for the US dollar or economy to fail. The FED has created another bubble in commodities deliberately to take some of the pressure off of the real estate calapse. Two percent interest rates in a 6 percent inflation environment is deliberate. The FED probably wanted a stock market bubble, but un-intended consequences made it a commodities bubble.

The FED is counting on the ECB to keep inflation in reasonable limits with 4.5 percent interest rates while allowing the US to try and bubble its way out of a depression. The ECB is allowing this because the world cannot afford for the US to fail. Inspite of globalization, the US is too much of the worlds economic engine and a US failure would spin the world into decades of economic disaster. But knowing this helps me not, because I still have no place to put my money.

The stock market is headed down, inverse funds like SDS and SKF are very volitile, the FXE and FXF the currency exchange funds are up and down like an elevator.

[Author]

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