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Arraya
Participant[quote=svelte][quote=briansd1]I’m all for the Republicans if they promote atheism as Ayn Rand did.[/quote]
Not only did she promote it, but so did the Objectivism pilosophy she developed and the book “Atlas Shrugged”. In fact, “Atlas Shrugged” rejects faith as a short-cut to knowledge that is really a short cut destroying knowledge.
Glad to know that threadkiller, DJShakes, treehugger and markmax have found atheism too![/quote]
When your god is “the market” that operates with an “invisible hand” then you are not an atheist
ParticipantWell, this has to make you scratch your head at a time of economic turmoil and civil disobedience.
This is pecking order preservation legislation. Or to protect from what James Madison called the “leveling impulses” of the masses.
I IMPLORE every single Occupier in the this nation to watch and share this video. The legislation that this fascist government and administration is worthy of Nazi Germany. And, that is NOT an exaggeration. It is a fact. I can not do justice to the implications of this bill, please watch the video.
Again and again and again, Obama has betrayed the American citizenry and governed for expansion of corporate & military power and profit. And, again and again and again, many of his supporters have rationalized/justified/or even championed policy and appointments from the Obama administration that would have drawn near universal protest and outrage if implemented by Republicans or the Bush administration.
This must end. It is time for Occupy to not only challenge the corporate power structure, but unflinchingly challenge ANY politician or political party that governs against the people for the expansion of corporate/military profit.
I do not know how a single American, democrat/republican/independent/green or otherwise can support ANY politician that would codify indefinite detention without charges or trial against American citizens. It is insanity. Yet, if we march forward and move along with the circus act that is the two party stage corporate election circus of 2012, we are all enablers of the destruction of our constitution and unraveling the last tattered remnants of our democracy.
There is no lesser of two evils. There is now only evil. And, it is up to us to stand with courage to create a different alternative and dialogue to solve this crisis.
Obama can’t be the Occupy movement’s nominee. Neither can any of the Republicans. They do not and WILL NOT represent us. This bill proves that fact beyond a shadow of any doubt.
We must move forward with courage.
ABSOLUTE MUST READ: http://www.salon.com/…
Participant[quote=pri_dk]The Ponzi scheme analogy is worthless.[/quote]
Until it collapses – which admittedly could be a several decade process – in the case of old empires, was centuries.
[quote=pri_dk]
All long-term economic plans assume perpetual growth.All of them.
[/quote]
Well, no. You mean All market based economics. There has been plenty of work done on the idea of steady state economics for 100 years (it really ramped up in the 30s and 70s)- in many different forms – because rationality dictates it will be a multi-faceted problem if you get past market mythology with all it’s false assumptions and blindnesses. It’s built on false assumptions, overly simplistic ideas on human behavior and an inherent blindness to the earth.
Every empire in the past operated like a ponzi-scheme. Which is why they all collapse. There is plenty of academic work on this as well. Capitalism just took the ponzi-dynamic of empire and made it global. Economic competition is just war by other means.
ParticipantTons of human need in the world but not enough money demand to keep the economy from springing a gasket and going into a tailspin. Something’s wrong with that picture?
All that debt in the world is predicated on consistent “growth” to pay back. Economists like 3% a year to avoid problems. We are at the point where there is too much debt in the system, while, paradoxically, more is needed to expand the money supply and service existing debt. Juxtaposed with an energy situation that restricts growth as well, doesn’t paint a nice picture. And top it off with increasing global unrest and a blossoming anti-consumerist counter-culture in the imperial center.
It’s not looking good for our old friend growth to save the day…. And boy is this going to drive us crazy! Something that needs never ending growth to sustain is a ponzi-scheme. Not to mention the ideology of cancer.
Yeah and mass saving is not good for our economy. A sudden streak of frugality could be devastating.
Cheers!
ParticipantWhy can’t people talk about jewish power without being racial profiled as a racist, genocidal maniac. Racial profiling is racist.
cognitive dissonance on Jewish power
http://mondoweiss.net/2010/07/cognitive-dissonance-on-jewish-power.htmlIs the board able to have a serious discussion about it without all the conditioned responses? It’s very very noticeable because it is 100% to do with protecting Israel. Yeah, the US media has very very obvious bias towards pushing certain narratives with ZERO about the Palestinian perspective. Now, serious people that talk about this obvious bias differ on the reason. However, it’s not in debate.
Peace, Propaganda & the Promised Land: Israel & Palestine
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Israel_lobby_in_the_United_States
The Israel lobby (at times called the Zionist lobby or sometimes the Jewish lobby) is a term used to describe the diverse coalition of those who, as individuals and as groups, seek and have sought to influence the foreign policy of the United States in support of Zionism, Israel or the specific policies of its government.[1] The lobby consists of both Christian-American and Jewish-American secular and religious groups.The Israel lobby
Israel is a 19th century, ethno-supremacist colonial project creating an apartheid. It’s an anachronism and it’s very own actions are going to make itself self-destruct.
Reality on the ground in occupied territories is a million miles from common US perception. The internet, now, pierces that bubble and the sands are shifting under Israel’s feet.
Silence of a nation
Does this obvious systemic manifestation represent “The Jews”? Of course not – but it is real and if you want to have serious, clear headed discussions about powerful social forces influencing the direction of the country it needs to be discussed.
Now it could be argued that the military-security-fossil fuel complex is the main beneficiary of the stress Israel causes as Chomsky does because it advances US imperial interests. Which is an argument that has merit.
As far as Ron Paul goes. Yes, Israeli apologists hate him.
Look at Ben Stein call RP an antisemite for questioning terrorist motivation. Now, why would he do that?
Participant[quote=Jacarandoso]This thread needs more pathetic jokes.[/quote]
Why are proctologists so gloomy?
They always have the end in sight.ParticipantOn topic:
http://theautomaticearth.blogspot.com/
However, concern about the inflationary trend continuing into the future is misplaced. That is where we have come from, but it is not where we are going. Simply extrapolating past trends forward is tempting, but does not constitute meaningful analysis and has no genuine predictive value. It is far more important to be able to identify coming trend changes and to understand where these will lead.
Decades of inflation lie behind us. It is deflation – the contraction of the supply of money plus credit relative to available goods and services – that lies ahead. The threat we are facing is the rapid and chaotic extinguishing of the myriad excess claims to underlying real wealth created during our thirty years of credit hyper-expansion.
Here is another illustrative parable of financialization run amok, looking this time at the real world consequences that follow. Whereas credit expansion pushed up both demand and prices, creating the perception of great wealth in the process, the inevitable bust crashes prices and ruins businesses. The artificial demand boost disappears, but rather than return to its previous level, demand crashes and remains depressed for a long period of time.
snip
As we have said many times, rallies are kind to central authorities, because the supportive psychology of a rally, complete with suspension of disbelief, allows their actions to appear effective, temporarily. Stimulus packages seemed to achieve the desired ends, at least in terms of elevating the markets, suggesting that we were facing a relatively simple problem with a straightforward solution.
A dangerous perception has developed that central bankers are so much wiser and better informed than their predecessors in other times and places, that the lessons of the past have been learned and the pitfalls of the past avoided. This is of course the height of hubris. If a predicament such as this could be so easily resolved, then there would be no similar crises in the historical record. We cannot simply assume that previous central authorities were blind, ignorant, unimaginative or disinterested in self-preservation.
Now that the downtrend has reasserted itself with a vengeance, the supportive psychology of a rally no longer exists. Confidence is ebbing again, and fear is sharply in the ascendancy. We can already see how ineffectual the actions of central authorities are under such circumstances. Everything they do is too little, too late, and every failed attempt to stem staunch the financial hemorrhage only makes them look more desperate, which undermines confidence further in a vicious circle.Over the next year and beyond, we will discover what credit crunch really means. It is an economic seizure, and its effect is devastating. Credit in its myriad forms represents the vast majority of the money supply, and it is about to lose its money equivalency. This will leave only cash, and that cash will be extremely scarce.
Aggravating the effect of crashing the money supply will be a substantial fall in the velocity of money, meaning that money will largely cease to circulate in the economy as people hang on to every penny they can get their hands on.
Money is the lubricant in the engine of the economy in the way that motor oil is the lubricant in a vehicle engine. Attempting to run any kind of engine with insufficient lubricant will result in that engine seizing up.
Without the monetary exchange that we have built into our system at every level, it will not be possible to connect buyers and sellers, producers and consumers.
Nothing moves in an economic depression. This is the polar opposite of the frenetic activity of the inflationary boom years. Instead of the orgy of consumption to which we have become accustomed, we will experience austerity on a scale we cannot yet imagine.
Demand will evaporate, not because people do not have wants, but because they will lack the purchasing power to turn those wants and needs into consumption. Demand is not what we want, but what we can pay for.
We will be looking at falling prices as lack of demand undercuts price support, but because purchasing power will be falling much more quickly than prices, everything will become far less affordable, even as prices fall. As a much larger percentage of the much smaller money supply begins to chase essentials, those will receive relative price support, and will be the least affordable of all.
We must prepare right now for the onset of a long period of deflation and depression. Many people are reluctant to make preparations until they see the roof on fire, but by then it will be too late to take action.
To reiterate the advice TAE has been offering since its inception – hold no debt, hold liquidity in order to maintain freedom of action, gain some control over the essentials of your own existence, and build social capital in your own communities.
There is no time to waste in securing what you have, under your own control to the greatest extent you can manage. The future is at our doorstep, and it does not look like the past as we have known it.
Participant[quote=SK in CV]
I don’t know where those maps came from, but in 1946 the Palestinians had no land. From 1949 until 1967, there were no changes. And yet, they had no country. They still don’t. Over 70% of the inhabited land that would have been Israel under the UN partition plan was not owned or inhabited by Palestinians. So they couldn’t possibly have lost it. And the final map is totally bogus. None of the land outside the green line is within Israeli borders. (And you did say borders.) Settlements are a whole different story. You’ll get no argument from me on the settlements. The worst idea ever.[/quote]eh, I should not have opened this can of worms. They’ve forcibly relocating a population due to their religion for 60s+ years with very little breaks. I guess, to define it as “expanding boarders” is contingent on how you define what is going on with the settlements, besides that land seizure of 67. Yes, technically you are correct the settlement expansion does not constitute boarder expansion -but it does in spirit, since people are still being moved.
I disagree with a few other things but well save that for another thread that is at least tangentially related to the topic.
Participant[quote=walterwhite]And I commend you for not bringing up greenspans religion.[/quote]
liberatarianism?
Participant[quote=SK in CV][quote=Arraya]We don’t tell Israel anything about her borders – they have been breaking international law and expanding since inception, with every president since Ford(and all world leaders) asking them to stop. [/quote]
I really want to take this off topic, but you’ve bought into a narrative that isn’t quite consistent with facts. Israel’s borders haven’t changed for over 60 years since it declared it’s independence after it accepted a UN partition plan which was rejected by every surrounding political body and war on Israel was declared by each of them.[/quote]
They’ve been expanding settlements since the 70s. [img_assist|nid=14216|title=..|desc=|link=node|align=left|width=376|height=250]
The UN partition plan was not a good deal for the indigenous.
Participant[quote=markmax33]
Did you know that we give 8X the money to Israel’s enemies in foreign aid as we give Israel? [/quote]
Which countriesParticipantWe don’t tell Israel anything about her borders – they have been breaking international law and expanding since inception, with every president since Ford(and all world leaders) asking them to stop. Obama just motioned in the direction of asking Israel to abide by international law and AIPAC spit venom all over the idea and shit money all over congress. Cairo speech Obama was quickly killed by Israel.
Though, Israel is probably the reason RP gets no airtime.
ParticipantAlso, they are printing credit(mostly). Which is not unlike lots of people taking out loans or using their credit cards. We’ve been inflating for many decades under most definitions(price and money/credit supply).
Personally, I don’t like the definition”broad based price increase”. I’d say broad based prices moves are a lagging indicator of the supply of money and CREDIT. Because credit contractions, like we had at the end of 2008 – spring 09, which could happen again – cause prices to COLLAPSE.
Participant[quote=urbanrealtor]IMHO discussion of an apocalypse without zombies is just a waste of pixels.[/quote]
This is the debtocalypse and we have zombie-capitalism eating the world.
Our system of consumption-based economic growth, of ineffectual democracy, of over loading the earth resource capacity, of unfettered corporate greed plus a trillion dollar advertising industry urging us to consume ever more – this system, OUR system – is in the process of eating itself alive.
If we, the youth of the world, do not come alive and start fighting for a different kind of future, then we will not have one
-From adbusters(a dirty hippie anti-capitalist magazine) this month, and on the money.
Yes, less government regulation, budget cuts and the gold standard should straighten us right out. Nothing the free market can’t fix.
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