[an]

[quote=jpinpb]Agreed. But they all have their stand on it and divide voters. If they are taking a position on it, I will make my decision based on it as well, as others will also. Good way to alienate and/or win votes.

But at this point, I honestly think they need to lay it to rest. We have universal healthcare. We have people w/money having medical surgery to enhance their body. Yet there are people still wanting to make it illegal for a woman to terminate a pregnancy, claiming there are no health issues that can arise to justify aborting. Beyond my comprehension.[/quote]
Maybe you should read the reason why he’s anti-abortion: http://www.ronpaul.com/on-the-issues/abortion/.

Let me start off by saying, before I have kids, I was 100% pro choice and can’t understand why anyone would be pro life. What opened my eyes was going to the very first ultrasound and hearing the heart beat after 8 weeks. I now understand why many people are pro life. Although I’m still pro choice when it come to situation where the mother’s life is in danger, I’m now leaning toward pro life for your average abortion. The reason people are pro life is because they want to be the voice for those babies who are being killed.

Do you know Planned Parenthood don’t let the mother see the ultrasound screen and they turn off the volume? I know a NP who works there and she said if they let them see the screen and hear the heart beat, many would probably back out. I know I did when I saw the first ultrasound and hear the 1st heart beat. I still support Roe v Wade, but only for cases where it would kill the mother if the abortion wasn’t done. Ron Paul’s point is, Life > Liberty, which is why he’s against Roe v Wade.

My questions to Navydoc is, how many tomb stones can you point to of mothers that died because they didn’t have an abortion vs how many tomb stones you can point to of babies who were aborted who would have grown up to be healthy adults?

I always find it funny that those who are pro choice tend to be anti death penalty and those who are pro life tend to be pro death penalty.

[an]

[quote=jpinpb]Agreed. But they all have their stand on it and divide voters. If they are taking a position on it, I will make my decision based on it as well, as others will also. Good way to alienate and/or win votes.

But at this point, I honestly think they need to lay it to rest. We have universal healthcare. We have people w/money having medical surgery to enhance their body. Yet there are people still wanting to make it illegal for a woman to terminate a pregnancy, claiming there are no health issues that can arise to justify aborting. Beyond my comprehension.[/quote]
Maybe you should read the reason why he’s anti-abortion: http://www.ronpaul.com/on-the-issues/abortion/.

Let me start off by saying, before I have kids, I was 100% pro choice and can’t understand why anyone would be pro life. What opened my eyes was going to the very first ultrasound and hearing the heart beat after 8 weeks. I now understand why many people are pro life. Although I’m still pro choice when it come to situation where the mother’s life is in danger, I’m now leaning toward pro life for your average abortion. The reason people are pro life is because they want to be the voice for those babies who are being killed.

Do you know Planned Parenthood don’t let the mother see the ultrasound screen and they turn off the volume? I know a NP who works there and she said if they let them see the screen and hear the heart beat, many would probably back out. I know I did when I saw the first ultrasound and hear the 1st heart beat. I still support Roe v Wade, but only for cases where it would kill the mother if the abortion wasn’t done. Ron Paul’s point is, Life > Liberty, which is why he’s against Roe v Wade.

My questions to Navydoc is, how many tomb stones can you point to of mothers that died because they didn’t have an abortion vs how many tomb stones you can point to of babies who were aborted who would have grown up to be healthy adults?

I always find it funny that those who are pro choice tend to be anti death penalty and those who are pro life tend to be pro death penalty.

[an]

[quote=briansd1]Eugene, you forget to check back in a year.
With the riots in Britain and all, you were right![/quote]
UK’s June’s unemployment is 7.7% while US’s June’s unemployment is 9.1%. Both are basically flat since June 2010. 1 GBP = 1.44 USD in June 2010 and 1 GBP = 1.65 USD today. Draw your own conclusion.

[an]

[quote=briansd1]Eugene, you forget to check back in a year.
With the riots in Britain and all, you were right![/quote]
UK’s June’s unemployment is 7.7% while US’s June’s unemployment is 9.1%. Both are basically flat since June 2010. 1 GBP = 1.44 USD in June 2010 and 1 GBP = 1.65 USD today. Draw your own conclusion.

[an]

[quote=briansd1]Eugene, you forget to check back in a year.
With the riots in Britain and all, you were right![/quote]
UK’s June’s unemployment is 7.7% while US’s June’s unemployment is 9.1%. Both are basically flat since June 2010. 1 GBP = 1.44 USD in June 2010 and 1 GBP = 1.65 USD today. Draw your own conclusion.

[an]

[quote=briansd1]Eugene, you forget to check back in a year.
With the riots in Britain and all, you were right![/quote]
UK’s June’s unemployment is 7.7% while US’s June’s unemployment is 9.1%. Both are basically flat since June 2010. 1 GBP = 1.44 USD in June 2010 and 1 GBP = 1.65 USD today. Draw your own conclusion.

[an]

[quote=briansd1]Eugene, you forget to check back in a year.
With the riots in Britain and all, you were right![/quote]
UK’s June’s unemployment is 7.7% while US’s June’s unemployment is 9.1%. Both are basically flat since June 2010. 1 GBP = 1.44 USD in June 2010 and 1 GBP = 1.65 USD today. Draw your own conclusion.

[an]

[quote=CA renter]Yes, I get your point, but one might also argue that money is more valuable when you are starting out, so saving that money now — possibly the difference between staying out of debt or taking on loans — might be more valuable than having that 1 year’s worth of extra income later.

Of course, there are so many variables involved.

Correction regarding mom…it was cum laude, not summa cum laude. Still, I probably didn’t give her enough credit, especially since English wasn’t her native language.[/quote]
Remember that I use 1 year on the job salary and not the last year on the job salary. That would make a big difference too. I look at that $4k-$5k in extra up front cost as being a good investment to making anywhere between $20-200k+ (depending on whether you use 1st year or last year salary and which profession you’re in). Also, this is assuming the student doesn’t work or if the parents doesn’t help with school. If the student work, I’m sure they can work an extra shift or two to scrape together ~$1k-$1200/year.

I gave my dad all the credit he deserves, especially after I finish college. He worked, took care of 2 kids, and didn’t even speak a single word of English a few years earlier. Yet, he graduated cum laude as well (or was it magna cum laude, I don’t remember exactly, but regardless, it impresses with his achievements under that circumstances).

[an]

[quote=CA renter]Yes, I get your point, but one might also argue that money is more valuable when you are starting out, so saving that money now — possibly the difference between staying out of debt or taking on loans — might be more valuable than having that 1 year’s worth of extra income later.

Of course, there are so many variables involved.

Correction regarding mom…it was cum laude, not summa cum laude. Still, I probably didn’t give her enough credit, especially since English wasn’t her native language.[/quote]
Remember that I use 1 year on the job salary and not the last year on the job salary. That would make a big difference too. I look at that $4k-$5k in extra up front cost as being a good investment to making anywhere between $20-200k+ (depending on whether you use 1st year or last year salary and which profession you’re in). Also, this is assuming the student doesn’t work or if the parents doesn’t help with school. If the student work, I’m sure they can work an extra shift or two to scrape together ~$1k-$1200/year.

I gave my dad all the credit he deserves, especially after I finish college. He worked, took care of 2 kids, and didn’t even speak a single word of English a few years earlier. Yet, he graduated cum laude as well (or was it magna cum laude, I don’t remember exactly, but regardless, it impresses with his achievements under that circumstances).

[an]

[quote=CA renter]Yes, I get your point, but one might also argue that money is more valuable when you are starting out, so saving that money now — possibly the difference between staying out of debt or taking on loans — might be more valuable than having that 1 year’s worth of extra income later.

Of course, there are so many variables involved.

Correction regarding mom…it was cum laude, not summa cum laude. Still, I probably didn’t give her enough credit, especially since English wasn’t her native language.[/quote]
Remember that I use 1 year on the job salary and not the last year on the job salary. That would make a big difference too. I look at that $4k-$5k in extra up front cost as being a good investment to making anywhere between $20-200k+ (depending on whether you use 1st year or last year salary and which profession you’re in). Also, this is assuming the student doesn’t work or if the parents doesn’t help with school. If the student work, I’m sure they can work an extra shift or two to scrape together ~$1k-$1200/year.

I gave my dad all the credit he deserves, especially after I finish college. He worked, took care of 2 kids, and didn’t even speak a single word of English a few years earlier. Yet, he graduated cum laude as well (or was it magna cum laude, I don’t remember exactly, but regardless, it impresses with his achievements under that circumstances).

[an]

[quote=CA renter]Yes, I get your point, but one might also argue that money is more valuable when you are starting out, so saving that money now — possibly the difference between staying out of debt or taking on loans — might be more valuable than having that 1 year’s worth of extra income later.

Of course, there are so many variables involved.

Correction regarding mom…it was cum laude, not summa cum laude. Still, I probably didn’t give her enough credit, especially since English wasn’t her native language.[/quote]
Remember that I use 1 year on the job salary and not the last year on the job salary. That would make a big difference too. I look at that $4k-$5k in extra up front cost as being a good investment to making anywhere between $20-200k+ (depending on whether you use 1st year or last year salary and which profession you’re in). Also, this is assuming the student doesn’t work or if the parents doesn’t help with school. If the student work, I’m sure they can work an extra shift or two to scrape together ~$1k-$1200/year.

I gave my dad all the credit he deserves, especially after I finish college. He worked, took care of 2 kids, and didn’t even speak a single word of English a few years earlier. Yet, he graduated cum laude as well (or was it magna cum laude, I don’t remember exactly, but regardless, it impresses with his achievements under that circumstances).

[an]

[quote=CA renter]Yes, I get your point, but one might also argue that money is more valuable when you are starting out, so saving that money now — possibly the difference between staying out of debt or taking on loans — might be more valuable than having that 1 year’s worth of extra income later.

Of course, there are so many variables involved.

Correction regarding mom…it was cum laude, not summa cum laude. Still, I probably didn’t give her enough credit, especially since English wasn’t her native language.[/quote]
Remember that I use 1 year on the job salary and not the last year on the job salary. That would make a big difference too. I look at that $4k-$5k in extra up front cost as being a good investment to making anywhere between $20-200k+ (depending on whether you use 1st year or last year salary and which profession you’re in). Also, this is assuming the student doesn’t work or if the parents doesn’t help with school. If the student work, I’m sure they can work an extra shift or two to scrape together ~$1k-$1200/year.

I gave my dad all the credit he deserves, especially after I finish college. He worked, took care of 2 kids, and didn’t even speak a single word of English a few years earlier. Yet, he graduated cum laude as well (or was it magna cum laude, I don’t remember exactly, but regardless, it impresses with his achievements under that circumstances).

[an]

[quote=CA renter][quote=AN][quote=CA renter]$5,000/year…yes, it’s worth it. As a matter of fact, CC students get priority over continuing students when they transfer for their junior year. IMHO, CC is a winner, all around.[/quote]
$4k/year, not $5k/year. $4k is not worth it if you lose a year from your professional career.[/quote]

Going from your quote:

If you want to compete CSU vs CC WRT cost, CSU tuition is $6,562. Tuition for SD CC is ~$1500/year. That’s a cost difference of $4k/year.

The difference between $6,562 and $1,500 is $5, 062, not $4,000. [CC graduate! 🙂 ]

Still, not sure if you’d actually lose a year from your professional career…some might, but others won’t. Even if you did, you can always work that “extra year” at the end of your career, if you’re worried about not having that one extra year’s worth of income (not sure if that’s what you’re arguing).[/quote]
Assuming tuition won’t change for either CC and CSU for the next 5 years and assuming it takes 5 years to for a typical student to graduate CC and CSU vs 4 year for a typical student who enter CSU. At ~$6500/year for SDSU, 4 year college will cost $26k. For someone who did 2 years of CC and 3 years of SDSU, the cost would be ~$3k for CC and $19.5k for SDSU. That’s a total of $22.5k. That’s where I get $4k from. But we’re splitting hair at the point. Even if we’re talking about $5k instead of $4k.

Is that $5k worth having to work an extra year? That’s exactly what I’m talking about. Time = $ and I’m pretty sure it takes more time to graduate from a CC and a CSU/UC. That’s my main point, typically, it take at least an extra year to graduate from CC->CSU/UC vs going straight to CSU/UC. The reason I pick $40k number (just an arbitrary starting salary for a typical BS degree). It could be more it could be less. If you’re talking about adding one “extra year”, then the person who went straight to CSU/UC can work an extra year too.

Another way to look at it is, you have 47 years of your life for secondary school and work. Lets say you spend 5 years in college and 42 years of work and you save $5k-12k in school. But if you go straight to CSU/UC and graduate in 4 years. You’d spend 4 years in college and 43 years in working. You spend $5-12k more in school, but you’ll be making 1 extra year of salary.

[an]

[quote=CA renter][quote=AN][quote=CA renter]$5,000/year…yes, it’s worth it. As a matter of fact, CC students get priority over continuing students when they transfer for their junior year. IMHO, CC is a winner, all around.[/quote]
$4k/year, not $5k/year. $4k is not worth it if you lose a year from your professional career.[/quote]

Going from your quote:

If you want to compete CSU vs CC WRT cost, CSU tuition is $6,562. Tuition for SD CC is ~$1500/year. That’s a cost difference of $4k/year.

The difference between $6,562 and $1,500 is $5, 062, not $4,000. [CC graduate! 🙂 ]

Still, not sure if you’d actually lose a year from your professional career…some might, but others won’t. Even if you did, you can always work that “extra year” at the end of your career, if you’re worried about not having that one extra year’s worth of income (not sure if that’s what you’re arguing).[/quote]
Assuming tuition won’t change for either CC and CSU for the next 5 years and assuming it takes 5 years to for a typical student to graduate CC and CSU vs 4 year for a typical student who enter CSU. At ~$6500/year for SDSU, 4 year college will cost $26k. For someone who did 2 years of CC and 3 years of SDSU, the cost would be ~$3k for CC and $19.5k for SDSU. That’s a total of $22.5k. That’s where I get $4k from. But we’re splitting hair at the point. Even if we’re talking about $5k instead of $4k.

Is that $5k worth having to work an extra year? That’s exactly what I’m talking about. Time = $ and I’m pretty sure it takes more time to graduate from a CC and a CSU/UC. That’s my main point, typically, it take at least an extra year to graduate from CC->CSU/UC vs going straight to CSU/UC. The reason I pick $40k number (just an arbitrary starting salary for a typical BS degree). It could be more it could be less. If you’re talking about adding one “extra year”, then the person who went straight to CSU/UC can work an extra year too.

Another way to look at it is, you have 47 years of your life for secondary school and work. Lets say you spend 5 years in college and 42 years of work and you save $5k-12k in school. But if you go straight to CSU/UC and graduate in 4 years. You’d spend 4 years in college and 43 years in working. You spend $5-12k more in school, but you’ll be making 1 extra year of salary.

[an]

[quote=CA renter][quote=AN][quote=CA renter]$5,000/year…yes, it’s worth it. As a matter of fact, CC students get priority over continuing students when they transfer for their junior year. IMHO, CC is a winner, all around.[/quote]
$4k/year, not $5k/year. $4k is not worth it if you lose a year from your professional career.[/quote]

Going from your quote:

If you want to compete CSU vs CC WRT cost, CSU tuition is $6,562. Tuition for SD CC is ~$1500/year. That’s a cost difference of $4k/year.

The difference between $6,562 and $1,500 is $5, 062, not $4,000. [CC graduate! 🙂 ]

Still, not sure if you’d actually lose a year from your professional career…some might, but others won’t. Even if you did, you can always work that “extra year” at the end of your career, if you’re worried about not having that one extra year’s worth of income (not sure if that’s what you’re arguing).[/quote]
Assuming tuition won’t change for either CC and CSU for the next 5 years and assuming it takes 5 years to for a typical student to graduate CC and CSU vs 4 year for a typical student who enter CSU. At ~$6500/year for SDSU, 4 year college will cost $26k. For someone who did 2 years of CC and 3 years of SDSU, the cost would be ~$3k for CC and $19.5k for SDSU. That’s a total of $22.5k. That’s where I get $4k from. But we’re splitting hair at the point. Even if we’re talking about $5k instead of $4k.

Is that $5k worth having to work an extra year? That’s exactly what I’m talking about. Time = $ and I’m pretty sure it takes more time to graduate from a CC and a CSU/UC. That’s my main point, typically, it take at least an extra year to graduate from CC->CSU/UC vs going straight to CSU/UC. The reason I pick $40k number (just an arbitrary starting salary for a typical BS degree). It could be more it could be less. If you’re talking about adding one “extra year”, then the person who went straight to CSU/UC can work an extra year too.

Another way to look at it is, you have 47 years of your life for secondary school and work. Lets say you spend 5 years in college and 42 years of work and you save $5k-12k in school. But if you go straight to CSU/UC and graduate in 4 years. You’d spend 4 years in college and 43 years in working. You spend $5-12k more in school, but you’ll be making 1 extra year of salary.

[Author]

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