Forum Replies Created
-
AuthorPosts
-
Allan from Fallbrook
ParticipantXBoxBoy: Fair enough. Let me clarify what I meant. I do NOT believe that Carter and the CIA had a master plan to draw the Soviets into Afghanistan. I DO believe that once the Russians were there, we did our utmost to bleed them white. Having worked with SOF guys who supplied the Muj fighters with Stinger missiles (and gave them the know-how to use them) I know that we were heavily involved in the area and the effort.
Do I think we bailed out after the Russians did? Sadly, yes I do.
I don’t give Carter any credit, because he deserves none. I think Charlie Wilson is a stud, as I believe many of the individual field officers (CIA) and SOF guys were as well. I think the situation was driven by the expedient issues at the time and, once the objective was achieved, we took off.
I get irritated whenever I hear the mantra start about an “unwarranted war”, and the presumption of some perfidious neocon plot to rule the world. In that part of the world, at that time, it was basically a continuation of “The Great Game” started by the British 150 years earlier. We were seeking to head off Soviet influence, maintain an acceptable balance of power, and protect the free flow of oil.
I think Carter did us irreparable harm in both that part of the world, and in dealing with the Soviet threat, specifically the various wars by proxy that the Russians were waging at the time.
ParticipantXBoxBoy: Fair enough. Let me clarify what I meant. I do NOT believe that Carter and the CIA had a master plan to draw the Soviets into Afghanistan. I DO believe that once the Russians were there, we did our utmost to bleed them white. Having worked with SOF guys who supplied the Muj fighters with Stinger missiles (and gave them the know-how to use them) I know that we were heavily involved in the area and the effort.
Do I think we bailed out after the Russians did? Sadly, yes I do.
I don’t give Carter any credit, because he deserves none. I think Charlie Wilson is a stud, as I believe many of the individual field officers (CIA) and SOF guys were as well. I think the situation was driven by the expedient issues at the time and, once the objective was achieved, we took off.
I get irritated whenever I hear the mantra start about an “unwarranted war”, and the presumption of some perfidious neocon plot to rule the world. In that part of the world, at that time, it was basically a continuation of “The Great Game” started by the British 150 years earlier. We were seeking to head off Soviet influence, maintain an acceptable balance of power, and protect the free flow of oil.
I think Carter did us irreparable harm in both that part of the world, and in dealing with the Soviet threat, specifically the various wars by proxy that the Russians were waging at the time.
ParticipantXBoxBoy: Fair enough. Let me clarify what I meant. I do NOT believe that Carter and the CIA had a master plan to draw the Soviets into Afghanistan. I DO believe that once the Russians were there, we did our utmost to bleed them white. Having worked with SOF guys who supplied the Muj fighters with Stinger missiles (and gave them the know-how to use them) I know that we were heavily involved in the area and the effort.
Do I think we bailed out after the Russians did? Sadly, yes I do.
I don’t give Carter any credit, because he deserves none. I think Charlie Wilson is a stud, as I believe many of the individual field officers (CIA) and SOF guys were as well. I think the situation was driven by the expedient issues at the time and, once the objective was achieved, we took off.
I get irritated whenever I hear the mantra start about an “unwarranted war”, and the presumption of some perfidious neocon plot to rule the world. In that part of the world, at that time, it was basically a continuation of “The Great Game” started by the British 150 years earlier. We were seeking to head off Soviet influence, maintain an acceptable balance of power, and protect the free flow of oil.
I think Carter did us irreparable harm in both that part of the world, and in dealing with the Soviet threat, specifically the various wars by proxy that the Russians were waging at the time.
ParticipantNost: I spent a lot of time (3+ yrs) in Central America, specifically Salvador, Honduras and Guatemala. An interesting connection point exists between Guatemala and Israel, in that Guatemala is crawling with ex-Mossad types and ex-IDF.
The Guatemalan Army uses Galil rifles (your aforementioned excellent Israeli weapon), and internal security is provided by ex-Mossad, including a real “Big Brother” system at the airport in Guat City. As bad as Salvador was during the Wild West days of the ’80s, Guatemala was even worse (we called it “The Land of Very Bad Things”). And the Israelis were right in the thick of it. The handful of ex-Mossad guys I knew were really twitchy (think Doberman) and armed to the frickin’ teeth.
Of course, the nut job of all nut jobs was General Rios Montt in Guatemala. You want some interesting bathroom reading, check into that guy. Wow.
ParticipantNost: I spent a lot of time (3+ yrs) in Central America, specifically Salvador, Honduras and Guatemala. An interesting connection point exists between Guatemala and Israel, in that Guatemala is crawling with ex-Mossad types and ex-IDF.
The Guatemalan Army uses Galil rifles (your aforementioned excellent Israeli weapon), and internal security is provided by ex-Mossad, including a real “Big Brother” system at the airport in Guat City. As bad as Salvador was during the Wild West days of the ’80s, Guatemala was even worse (we called it “The Land of Very Bad Things”). And the Israelis were right in the thick of it. The handful of ex-Mossad guys I knew were really twitchy (think Doberman) and armed to the frickin’ teeth.
Of course, the nut job of all nut jobs was General Rios Montt in Guatemala. You want some interesting bathroom reading, check into that guy. Wow.
ParticipantNost: I spent a lot of time (3+ yrs) in Central America, specifically Salvador, Honduras and Guatemala. An interesting connection point exists between Guatemala and Israel, in that Guatemala is crawling with ex-Mossad types and ex-IDF.
The Guatemalan Army uses Galil rifles (your aforementioned excellent Israeli weapon), and internal security is provided by ex-Mossad, including a real “Big Brother” system at the airport in Guat City. As bad as Salvador was during the Wild West days of the ’80s, Guatemala was even worse (we called it “The Land of Very Bad Things”). And the Israelis were right in the thick of it. The handful of ex-Mossad guys I knew were really twitchy (think Doberman) and armed to the frickin’ teeth.
Of course, the nut job of all nut jobs was General Rios Montt in Guatemala. You want some interesting bathroom reading, check into that guy. Wow.
ParticipantNost: I spent a lot of time (3+ yrs) in Central America, specifically Salvador, Honduras and Guatemala. An interesting connection point exists between Guatemala and Israel, in that Guatemala is crawling with ex-Mossad types and ex-IDF.
The Guatemalan Army uses Galil rifles (your aforementioned excellent Israeli weapon), and internal security is provided by ex-Mossad, including a real “Big Brother” system at the airport in Guat City. As bad as Salvador was during the Wild West days of the ’80s, Guatemala was even worse (we called it “The Land of Very Bad Things”). And the Israelis were right in the thick of it. The handful of ex-Mossad guys I knew were really twitchy (think Doberman) and armed to the frickin’ teeth.
Of course, the nut job of all nut jobs was General Rios Montt in Guatemala. You want some interesting bathroom reading, check into that guy. Wow.
ParticipantNost: I spent a lot of time (3+ yrs) in Central America, specifically Salvador, Honduras and Guatemala. An interesting connection point exists between Guatemala and Israel, in that Guatemala is crawling with ex-Mossad types and ex-IDF.
The Guatemalan Army uses Galil rifles (your aforementioned excellent Israeli weapon), and internal security is provided by ex-Mossad, including a real “Big Brother” system at the airport in Guat City. As bad as Salvador was during the Wild West days of the ’80s, Guatemala was even worse (we called it “The Land of Very Bad Things”). And the Israelis were right in the thick of it. The handful of ex-Mossad guys I knew were really twitchy (think Doberman) and armed to the frickin’ teeth.
Of course, the nut job of all nut jobs was General Rios Montt in Guatemala. You want some interesting bathroom reading, check into that guy. Wow.
ParticipantRus: Israel was shooting at everybody at that point (1947). Most people don’t realize it, but the Israelis had their own terrorist organizations during that period; groups like Haganah (“The Revionists”), Irgun (militant offshoot of Haganah) and the Stern Gang. Menachem Begin was a member, and is considered to be the brains behind the bombing of the King David Hotel, which killed a large number of British soldiers and diplomats.
The Stern Gang’s central tenet was the expulsion of the British authorities (the Palestine Government), in order to make way for the formation of a Jewish state. They were responsible for the assassination of Lord Moyne, as well as countless attacks on Arabs in the occupied territories.
The Israelis have a tendency to gloss over this part of their history (for obvious reasons).
My personal feeling is that the British felt some measure of guilt over what happened to European Jews during the Holocaust and, in concert with the other Western powers (including the US) implemented the Balfour Doctrine, and then got the hell out of there.
ParticipantRus: Israel was shooting at everybody at that point (1947). Most people don’t realize it, but the Israelis had their own terrorist organizations during that period; groups like Haganah (“The Revionists”), Irgun (militant offshoot of Haganah) and the Stern Gang. Menachem Begin was a member, and is considered to be the brains behind the bombing of the King David Hotel, which killed a large number of British soldiers and diplomats.
The Stern Gang’s central tenet was the expulsion of the British authorities (the Palestine Government), in order to make way for the formation of a Jewish state. They were responsible for the assassination of Lord Moyne, as well as countless attacks on Arabs in the occupied territories.
The Israelis have a tendency to gloss over this part of their history (for obvious reasons).
My personal feeling is that the British felt some measure of guilt over what happened to European Jews during the Holocaust and, in concert with the other Western powers (including the US) implemented the Balfour Doctrine, and then got the hell out of there.
ParticipantRus: Israel was shooting at everybody at that point (1947). Most people don’t realize it, but the Israelis had their own terrorist organizations during that period; groups like Haganah (“The Revionists”), Irgun (militant offshoot of Haganah) and the Stern Gang. Menachem Begin was a member, and is considered to be the brains behind the bombing of the King David Hotel, which killed a large number of British soldiers and diplomats.
The Stern Gang’s central tenet was the expulsion of the British authorities (the Palestine Government), in order to make way for the formation of a Jewish state. They were responsible for the assassination of Lord Moyne, as well as countless attacks on Arabs in the occupied territories.
The Israelis have a tendency to gloss over this part of their history (for obvious reasons).
My personal feeling is that the British felt some measure of guilt over what happened to European Jews during the Holocaust and, in concert with the other Western powers (including the US) implemented the Balfour Doctrine, and then got the hell out of there.
ParticipantRus: Israel was shooting at everybody at that point (1947). Most people don’t realize it, but the Israelis had their own terrorist organizations during that period; groups like Haganah (“The Revionists”), Irgun (militant offshoot of Haganah) and the Stern Gang. Menachem Begin was a member, and is considered to be the brains behind the bombing of the King David Hotel, which killed a large number of British soldiers and diplomats.
The Stern Gang’s central tenet was the expulsion of the British authorities (the Palestine Government), in order to make way for the formation of a Jewish state. They were responsible for the assassination of Lord Moyne, as well as countless attacks on Arabs in the occupied territories.
The Israelis have a tendency to gloss over this part of their history (for obvious reasons).
My personal feeling is that the British felt some measure of guilt over what happened to European Jews during the Holocaust and, in concert with the other Western powers (including the US) implemented the Balfour Doctrine, and then got the hell out of there.
ParticipantRus: Israel was shooting at everybody at that point (1947). Most people don’t realize it, but the Israelis had their own terrorist organizations during that period; groups like Haganah (“The Revionists”), Irgun (militant offshoot of Haganah) and the Stern Gang. Menachem Begin was a member, and is considered to be the brains behind the bombing of the King David Hotel, which killed a large number of British soldiers and diplomats.
The Stern Gang’s central tenet was the expulsion of the British authorities (the Palestine Government), in order to make way for the formation of a Jewish state. They were responsible for the assassination of Lord Moyne, as well as countless attacks on Arabs in the occupied territories.
The Israelis have a tendency to gloss over this part of their history (for obvious reasons).
My personal feeling is that the British felt some measure of guilt over what happened to European Jews during the Holocaust and, in concert with the other Western powers (including the US) implemented the Balfour Doctrine, and then got the hell out of there.
ParticipantThis photo was taken during the waning days of WWII (February 1945). It shows FDR and ibn Saud (later King Abdul Aziz) meeting aboard a US Navy destroyer (USS Quincy) on the Great Bitter Lake. [img_assist|nid=6027|title=FDR and ibn Saud|desc=|link=node|align=left|width=466|height=466]
-
AuthorPosts
