[zk]

[quote=sdnativeson]ZK, your point is moot. It comes down to original or, attempting original thought. So, in your world everything is “true”, “valid”, “proven” upon conception and/or initiation?

Looks like Utopia has an internet connection.
[/quote]

What makes you say that in my world “everything is “true”, “valid”, “proven” upon conception and/or initiation?” I haven’t written anything that would indicate that I think that. I’d be interested to hear how you came up with that.

I’m not saying, “just because people think it’s wrong, it’s wrong.” (BTW, the reason I think it’s wrong because the science behind it isn’t really science; it’s just wishful thinking.) What I’m saying is that equating the concept of irreducible complexity with Einstein’s ideas just because both of them were thought to be wrong doesn’t add any credence to the idea of irreducible complexity. Why would it?

[zk]

[quote=sdnativeson]ZK, your point is moot. It comes down to original or, attempting original thought. So, in your world everything is “true”, “valid”, “proven” upon conception and/or initiation?

Looks like Utopia has an internet connection.
[/quote]

What makes you say that in my world “everything is “true”, “valid”, “proven” upon conception and/or initiation?” I haven’t written anything that would indicate that I think that. I’d be interested to hear how you came up with that.

I’m not saying, “just because people think it’s wrong, it’s wrong.” (BTW, the reason I think it’s wrong because the science behind it isn’t really science; it’s just wishful thinking.) What I’m saying is that equating the concept of irreducible complexity with Einstein’s ideas just because both of them were thought to be wrong doesn’t add any credence to the idea of irreducible complexity. Why would it?

[zk]

[quote=cooprider] There’s actually a new movement in the science world called Irreducible Complexity that discounts evolution as a means of how life came into existence. [/quote]

Irreducible Complexity is not a new movement in science. It’s a new movement that has nothing to do with science. There’s no science involved.

[quote=sdnativeson]

Shrodinger, Planck, Einstein, von Laue etc. all were criticized at one time or another by some of their peers for theories they entertained.
[/quote]

For every Einstein who turned out to be right, there were thousands of crackpots who turned out to be… just crackpots. To argue that because a very select few others who were thought to be crackpots weren’t actually crackpots does nothing to bolster the case for Irreducible Complexity (or any other crackpot idea).

[zk]

[quote=cooprider] There’s actually a new movement in the science world called Irreducible Complexity that discounts evolution as a means of how life came into existence. [/quote]

Irreducible Complexity is not a new movement in science. It’s a new movement that has nothing to do with science. There’s no science involved.

[quote=sdnativeson]

Shrodinger, Planck, Einstein, von Laue etc. all were criticized at one time or another by some of their peers for theories they entertained.
[/quote]

For every Einstein who turned out to be right, there were thousands of crackpots who turned out to be… just crackpots. To argue that because a very select few others who were thought to be crackpots weren’t actually crackpots does nothing to bolster the case for Irreducible Complexity (or any other crackpot idea).

[zk]

[quote=cooprider] There’s actually a new movement in the science world called Irreducible Complexity that discounts evolution as a means of how life came into existence. [/quote]

Irreducible Complexity is not a new movement in science. It’s a new movement that has nothing to do with science. There’s no science involved.

[quote=sdnativeson]

Shrodinger, Planck, Einstein, von Laue etc. all were criticized at one time or another by some of their peers for theories they entertained.
[/quote]

For every Einstein who turned out to be right, there were thousands of crackpots who turned out to be… just crackpots. To argue that because a very select few others who were thought to be crackpots weren’t actually crackpots does nothing to bolster the case for Irreducible Complexity (or any other crackpot idea).

[zk]

[quote=cooprider] There’s actually a new movement in the science world called Irreducible Complexity that discounts evolution as a means of how life came into existence. [/quote]

Irreducible Complexity is not a new movement in science. It’s a new movement that has nothing to do with science. There’s no science involved.

[quote=sdnativeson]

Shrodinger, Planck, Einstein, von Laue etc. all were criticized at one time or another by some of their peers for theories they entertained.
[/quote]

For every Einstein who turned out to be right, there were thousands of crackpots who turned out to be… just crackpots. To argue that because a very select few others who were thought to be crackpots weren’t actually crackpots does nothing to bolster the case for Irreducible Complexity (or any other crackpot idea).

[zk]

[quote=cooprider] There’s actually a new movement in the science world called Irreducible Complexity that discounts evolution as a means of how life came into existence. [/quote]

Irreducible Complexity is not a new movement in science. It’s a new movement that has nothing to do with science. There’s no science involved.

[quote=sdnativeson]

Shrodinger, Planck, Einstein, von Laue etc. all were criticized at one time or another by some of their peers for theories they entertained.
[/quote]

For every Einstein who turned out to be right, there were thousands of crackpots who turned out to be… just crackpots. To argue that because a very select few others who were thought to be crackpots weren’t actually crackpots does nothing to bolster the case for Irreducible Complexity (or any other crackpot idea).

[zk]

[quote=sdrealtor]Actually jenae’s sales were nopt used as comps for all other sales. All the agent sin the area knew there was something wrong with the sales [/quote]

OK, but did the appraisers know (and care)? If I remember, when stuff was going straight up, a lot of times appraisers really had to stretch to get an appraisal to come in where they needed it to. If they were bending the rules already, why would they pass up an opportunity to use one of those sales – which would legally pass for their purposes as a legitmate sale – as a comp?

[zk]

[quote=sdrealtor]Actually jenae’s sales were nopt used as comps for all other sales. All the agent sin the area knew there was something wrong with the sales [/quote]

OK, but did the appraisers know (and care)? If I remember, when stuff was going straight up, a lot of times appraisers really had to stretch to get an appraisal to come in where they needed it to. If they were bending the rules already, why would they pass up an opportunity to use one of those sales – which would legally pass for their purposes as a legitmate sale – as a comp?

[zk]

[quote=sdrealtor]Actually jenae’s sales were nopt used as comps for all other sales. All the agent sin the area knew there was something wrong with the sales [/quote]

OK, but did the appraisers know (and care)? If I remember, when stuff was going straight up, a lot of times appraisers really had to stretch to get an appraisal to come in where they needed it to. If they were bending the rules already, why would they pass up an opportunity to use one of those sales – which would legally pass for their purposes as a legitmate sale – as a comp?

[zk]

[quote=sdrealtor]Actually jenae’s sales were nopt used as comps for all other sales. All the agent sin the area knew there was something wrong with the sales [/quote]

OK, but did the appraisers know (and care)? If I remember, when stuff was going straight up, a lot of times appraisers really had to stretch to get an appraisal to come in where they needed it to. If they were bending the rules already, why would they pass up an opportunity to use one of those sales – which would legally pass for their purposes as a legitmate sale – as a comp?

[zk]

[quote=sdrealtor]Actually jenae’s sales were nopt used as comps for all other sales. All the agent sin the area knew there was something wrong with the sales [/quote]

OK, but did the appraisers know (and care)? If I remember, when stuff was going straight up, a lot of times appraisers really had to stretch to get an appraisal to come in where they needed it to. If they were bending the rules already, why would they pass up an opportunity to use one of those sales – which would legally pass for their purposes as a legitmate sale – as a comp?

[zk]

[quote=SD Realtor]
zk – regarding trustee sales. Most of the people involved with them are professionals. Market value is an easy determination. Obviously lenders are starting initial bids below default amounts because of depreciating market values. Trickier aspects to the trustee sales involve issues with title. Here is where you need to do most of your homework and it pays for you to work with a title officer to dig up all the information you can with regards to title. Other risks may be mitigated with alot of legwork. Issues such as physical condition of the home, termites, getting all of your due diligence done will depend on your own persistence. Never be afraid to go to the home you are interested and knock on the door to try to make contact with the owner. If they are still there you may want to offer them a small fee in order to procure some time to set up some inspections. Maybe it happens, maybe it does not. If they are not there, then trying to have your title officer help you get in touch with the lender or contact who can get you in is something to try as well. Again, no rush here, you have a few years to polish your skills. Alot of diligence and legwork can score you a good deal. [/quote]

SDR and ur, I appreciate the suggestions regarding trustee sales. I like the suggestion about contacting the owner. A couple questions regarding title issues:

So, trustees have the option of selling at the trustee sale for less than the amount of the first? Is that right? I thought the opening bid had to be “a penny over” the amount of the debt (on the first). Is it just the opening bid that must be exceeded? Do they set an opening bid amount of their choosing based on their desire to get rid of the property?

Second question: I can’t imagine plunking down six figures for something without some assurance that I’m aware of all liens and title issues. One would obviously hate to get an expensive surprise in that situation. I’m sure I’ll learn all about checking for any liens or title issues that might exist. I guess my question is, why am I working with a title officer? Do they have access to something I don’t, or just the experience to catch something I might miss? I have two issues with this, either or both of which I could be completely amiss about. First, I’m having a hard time seeing that it might be so complicated that it’s something I won’t be able to do myself. I’m fairly not unbright (and modest) and I work very hard. Of course, at the beginning, I’ll have no experience, so there is that. Second, if I can’t get title insurance, I might have a hard time trusting somebody else to ensure that I’m not going to get a very large surprise at a very bad time. I don’t know if I’d be able to sleep unless I did it myself.

Thanks for your expertise.

[zk]

[quote=SD Realtor]
zk – regarding trustee sales. Most of the people involved with them are professionals. Market value is an easy determination. Obviously lenders are starting initial bids below default amounts because of depreciating market values. Trickier aspects to the trustee sales involve issues with title. Here is where you need to do most of your homework and it pays for you to work with a title officer to dig up all the information you can with regards to title. Other risks may be mitigated with alot of legwork. Issues such as physical condition of the home, termites, getting all of your due diligence done will depend on your own persistence. Never be afraid to go to the home you are interested and knock on the door to try to make contact with the owner. If they are still there you may want to offer them a small fee in order to procure some time to set up some inspections. Maybe it happens, maybe it does not. If they are not there, then trying to have your title officer help you get in touch with the lender or contact who can get you in is something to try as well. Again, no rush here, you have a few years to polish your skills. Alot of diligence and legwork can score you a good deal. [/quote]

SDR and ur, I appreciate the suggestions regarding trustee sales. I like the suggestion about contacting the owner. A couple questions regarding title issues:

So, trustees have the option of selling at the trustee sale for less than the amount of the first? Is that right? I thought the opening bid had to be “a penny over” the amount of the debt (on the first). Is it just the opening bid that must be exceeded? Do they set an opening bid amount of their choosing based on their desire to get rid of the property?

Second question: I can’t imagine plunking down six figures for something without some assurance that I’m aware of all liens and title issues. One would obviously hate to get an expensive surprise in that situation. I’m sure I’ll learn all about checking for any liens or title issues that might exist. I guess my question is, why am I working with a title officer? Do they have access to something I don’t, or just the experience to catch something I might miss? I have two issues with this, either or both of which I could be completely amiss about. First, I’m having a hard time seeing that it might be so complicated that it’s something I won’t be able to do myself. I’m fairly not unbright (and modest) and I work very hard. Of course, at the beginning, I’ll have no experience, so there is that. Second, if I can’t get title insurance, I might have a hard time trusting somebody else to ensure that I’m not going to get a very large surprise at a very bad time. I don’t know if I’d be able to sleep unless I did it myself.

Thanks for your expertise.

[zk]

[quote=SD Realtor]
zk – regarding trustee sales. Most of the people involved with them are professionals. Market value is an easy determination. Obviously lenders are starting initial bids below default amounts because of depreciating market values. Trickier aspects to the trustee sales involve issues with title. Here is where you need to do most of your homework and it pays for you to work with a title officer to dig up all the information you can with regards to title. Other risks may be mitigated with alot of legwork. Issues such as physical condition of the home, termites, getting all of your due diligence done will depend on your own persistence. Never be afraid to go to the home you are interested and knock on the door to try to make contact with the owner. If they are still there you may want to offer them a small fee in order to procure some time to set up some inspections. Maybe it happens, maybe it does not. If they are not there, then trying to have your title officer help you get in touch with the lender or contact who can get you in is something to try as well. Again, no rush here, you have a few years to polish your skills. Alot of diligence and legwork can score you a good deal. [/quote]

SDR and ur, I appreciate the suggestions regarding trustee sales. I like the suggestion about contacting the owner. A couple questions regarding title issues:

So, trustees have the option of selling at the trustee sale for less than the amount of the first? Is that right? I thought the opening bid had to be “a penny over” the amount of the debt (on the first). Is it just the opening bid that must be exceeded? Do they set an opening bid amount of their choosing based on their desire to get rid of the property?

Second question: I can’t imagine plunking down six figures for something without some assurance that I’m aware of all liens and title issues. One would obviously hate to get an expensive surprise in that situation. I’m sure I’ll learn all about checking for any liens or title issues that might exist. I guess my question is, why am I working with a title officer? Do they have access to something I don’t, or just the experience to catch something I might miss? I have two issues with this, either or both of which I could be completely amiss about. First, I’m having a hard time seeing that it might be so complicated that it’s something I won’t be able to do myself. I’m fairly not unbright (and modest) and I work very hard. Of course, at the beginning, I’ll have no experience, so there is that. Second, if I can’t get title insurance, I might have a hard time trusting somebody else to ensure that I’m not going to get a very large surprise at a very bad time. I don’t know if I’d be able to sleep unless I did it myself.

Thanks for your expertise.

[Author]

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