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[quote=squat300]Ever hear the Johnny cash anti gun song in which a mother teaches her child not to play with guns but then he shoots a man in Reno just to watch him die?

Folsom prison blues. I wonder if the guy he shot was armed?[/quote]Probably not, otherwise there might have been a line in the song mentioning that the guy tried to draw his gun in defense but was too slow…

BTW: Folsom Prison Blues is not an anti-gun song. It is a song about taking responsibility for ones actions.

Cash recounted how he came up with the line “I shot a man in Reno, just to watch him die”: “I sat with my pen in my hand, trying to think up the worst reason a person could have for killing another person, and that’s what came to mind.”

The more complete quote for that song is:

When I was just a baby,
My Mama told me, “Son,
Always be a good boy,
Don’t ever play with guns,”
But I shot a man in Reno,
Just to watch him die,
When I hear that whistle blowin’,
I hang my head and cry.

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[quote=squat300]Then I suppose the 30000 or so people shot this year including the new town kids are actually heroes whose deaths are worthwhile and in furtherance of the cause of liberty.[/quote]Did you subtract the number of people killed by people who were already not supposed to have a gun? The very same people who if pulled over with a gun, go straight to jail? People for whom illegal ownership of a gun is no problem?

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[quote=craptcha]In this particular case (NY firefighters killed by a guy unable to purchase guns legally) the gun(s) were purchased by a neighbor for her own protection.

http://gothamist.com/2012/12/29/feds_woman_bought_rifle_for_upstate.php%5B/quote%5DTry reading the article again. She did not buy the guns for herself… she bought them for him, so that he could get past the ban on felons owning guns. This is why it states that she was acting as a “straw purchaser” or “straw buyer”.. See quote.. particularly last sentence:

“When the police asked her about the purchase after the shooting, she claimed the guns were for her own protection. She also said they had been stolen from her car, although the police said no report had been filed to support that claim.”

Also:

However, Spengler apparently wrote in his suicide note that a neighbor’s daughter helped him buy the guns.

And

But Nguyen apparently texted messaged with a friend—who is a deputy—and told him that she bought Spengler the guns. Nguyen was released on her own recognizance.

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[quote=squat300]QUESTION:

to all the people who argue we need guns to protect againsta tyrannical govt.

Don’t the arguments that crazy nutjob killers don’t need guns to kill, and they would kill with other forms of mass death (ricin, fertilizer explosives) equally apply to citizens rising up against the govt?[/quote] Except for one little tiny problem.. well maybe not so tiny. Bombs, ricin are not targeted, they are by nature indiscriminate. They kill everyone in the vicinity and are useless in defense. They can only be used in retaliation, and not very well without a delivery system (ie. missile). Guns are targeted, and selective by nature (you have to aim them) — so I would have to say that your ‘equivalency’ is reaching a bit.[/quote]

[quote=squat300]the armed masses revolting against the govt frankly sounds kind of unlikely to me.[/quote]Except that is happened before, and I think the King of England felt that it was equally unlikely at the time. After all, England had a professional army with considerable experience… against what? Back country ‘hick’ colonialists?

“Those who cannot remember the past are condemned to repeat it.” – George Santayana

PS: Take a look at the costs of defending against Guerrilla tactics. While Guerrilla tactics may now outright win, they make it expensive for the opposing force to continue. Just remember Russia and Afghanistan…

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[quote=squat300]QUESTION:

to all the people who argue we need guns to protect againsta tyrannical govt.

Don’t the arguments that crazy nutjob killers don’t need guns to kill, and they would kill with other forms of mass death (ricin, fertilizer explosives) equally apply to citizens rising up against the govt?[/quote] Except for one little tiny problem.. well maybe not so tiny. Bombs, ricin are not targeted, they are by nature indiscriminate. They kill everyone in the vicinity and are useless in defense. They can only be used in retaliation, and not very well without a delivery system (ie. missile). Guns are targeted, and selective by nature (you have to aim them) — so I would have to say that your ‘equivalency’ is reaching a bit.

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[quote=craptcha]What about making it harder to obtain a gun? The guy had it, so unless he made it he had to get it from someone.[/quote]The problem there is that it is too easy to get a gun or make a ‘gun’.. from the crude zip-guns, to Saturday Night Specials, to specialty guns like Barrett 50cal. While the ‘printed’ guns ie: MakerBot look to make it much easier, the plastic of these is way too fragile. In general, the barrel of a gun needs to be forged and tempered for strength. It is currently not feasible for a printed gun to function reliably.. though this may not be the case in the future. It is also possible to build a gun using a steel laser sintering printing process and use a lower cartridge charge.. and have it work reliably. There are other ‘interesting’ characteristics that I am not going to get into..

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[quote=KIBU]1 police dead, 1 bystander dead. One ir”responsible” gunman killed again, Christmas Eve shooting:

http://news.yahoo.com/police-officer-among-2-fatally-shot-houston-174608152.html%5B/quote%5DThis proves what? There is not enough info to know if gun control would have made any difference. Considering that the guy responded to being pulled over by firing a gun and killing someone, it would be safe to assume that the suspect had a felony record. If a felon gets caught w/ a gun on his possession or car.. straight to jail. BTW, if you are on probation, it is legal for your car to be searched w/o a warrant.

If he was a felon, gun control would not have changed anything because it was already illegal for him to possess a firearm.

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[quote=zk]I know that a lot of right wingers (men and women) consider themselves manly and badass. The right-wing noise machine has been playing to their perceptions of themselves for a long time. Successfully. They love to talk about liberals as pussies and themselves as powerful. This article plays right along. Enjoy it. Jack off to it, even. Doesn’t change the fact that it’s only your perception of yourself and of others, not reality.

It’s easy to paint the opposition with a broad brush and to resort to emotional bluster. Any retard can do that.[/quote]Pot, meet kettle.. because you just accomplished what you accuse others of doing.

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[quote=squat300]Also i can prove former vp Cheney wouldn’t have shot his pal in the ass w a gun ban.[/quote]No you can’t. All ‘high and mighty people’ always write exception for themselves in any prohibition. It is the nature of a politician or anyone in some form of power.

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[quote=KIBU]Today’s shooting: 2 firefighters dead + 1 more ir”responsible” gun user killed.

http://www.cnn.com/2012/12/24/us/new-york-firefighters-shooting/index.html?hpt=hp_t2.%5B/quote%5D The shooter was a felon. He was not legally able to own a gun (used ‘was’ because he no longer is). Any change in gun laws would have done absolutely nothing. In many ways, this shooting shows what is wrong with assuming that gun laws will prevent it. His gun ownership was already illegal and against existing laws. Felons, particularly those currently on probation, can NOT own any firearm.

The shooter was not afraid of dying to pull off his shooting. That means that even a penalty of death for possessing a firearm would not have stopped him. How much more strict a ‘gun law’ can you make than the death penalty?

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[quote=mike92104]to add to the circus environment of the case, the plaintiffs lawyer was a midget who had to pull the lectern mic down to him while standing next to it while speaking to us.[/quote]Midget is no longer the politically correct word. They are called height challenged, or vertically challenged.☺

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[quote=Aecetia]Here is a list of school violence related to psych. meds:

http://ssristories.com/index.php?p=school%5B/quote%5DAnother drug may start appearing on the list.. it is starting to be used off-label for things including PTSD. It is Olanzapine. It has some pretty nasty side effects. It also tends to make the patient ‘disassociative’ and zombie like, as well as irritable. The reason why pharma is pushing it can be seen in the price. Generic Olanzapine goes for about $1000/month.

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[quote=Blogstar]When the government wants the guns the government will take most of them. What makes YOU think it will be different?[/quote]This is the whole purpose of gun registration.

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So we limit our rights to bear arms because some mad-man or psychopath might get a hold of one, but ignore the consequences when the a mad-man or psychopath obtains political power either through force or election. It has happened before and will happen again.

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[quote=Blogstar]Fertilizer, Now there is something you guys can fight the government with. It’s no longer easy to get bomb grade fertilizer. Where’s the pro liberty lobby on that one? I am sure some of our freedom fighters can answer that.[/quote]Ammonium Nitrate is easy to get. What was limited is the quantity. You used to be able to get it in 50lb bags in the non-farm states, non-farm areas. When I was growing up, we had a 50lb bag we used on our trees. Ammonium Nitrate is not the same as compost from manure (one is white, the other is brown). Nitrates help plants grow, and Ammonia is a base, which helps de-acidify soil. Soil that has compost in it tends to be slightly acidic. Good for some plants, bad for others.

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