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August 23, 2013 at 3:59 PM in reply to: OT: On the killing floor; immigrations impacts on wages #764750
SD Realtor
ParticipantThat is what makes it such a challenge. My issue is not that black people have to live and deal with the racism they face daily. I agree it is omnipresent and needs to be eliminated and dealt with. My issue is that this racism is not an excuse to go beat or kill white people. That black community leaders do not speak out against that when these events occur. That the death of Trayvon sparked a media event, comments from our president and others such as Eric Holder. Yet in this case all we got was a tweet from Jesse Jackson expressing sorrow for the victims family. That is it.
I am not excusing or dismissing the racism that exists against black people or the scar that it leaves on every black person that lives in this country. It is very real.
August 23, 2013 at 12:14 PM in reply to: OT: On the killing floor; immigrations impacts on wages #764734ParticipantSeems like everyone who was reading the thread knew exactly what I was talking about and the point I was making SK. Only you were the one who was confused. Hopefully you now understand and are up to speed.
August 23, 2013 at 12:12 PM in reply to: OT: On the killing floor; immigrations impacts on wages #764733ParticipantYour not having enough for food and medicine is not their fault. For every honest hard working poor person that you are depicting here, there are others who are drug addicts, junkies, and slackers who are in the same boat and enjoying those same government benefits.
The bottom line is that medicare, and food stamps are exactly the situation that you have described. It is not the responsibility of Walmart or McDonalds.
My wife employs people and so do I. We don’t pay them based on their needs. Neither should any corporation.
August 23, 2013 at 11:55 AM in reply to: OT: On the killing floor; immigrations impacts on wages #764728ParticipantThrowing stones? At what? Why?
Tell me, when did Walmart and McDonalds hold a gun to peoples heads to work there?
What about the 7 Elevens? What about every employer who pays a salary in that range?
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So you are saying people should get paid on what their bills are and not what the employer offers as a salary?
That is quite a concept.
*********************************************************SK the thread has nothing to do with fulfilling a contract (ie – the employer paying the wage that he/she is obligated under an employment contract) It has to do with an employer paying low wages and the poster pointed out that paying higher wages may help this particular employer due to longer retention.
Yes I, and anyone else who enters into a contract is entitled to receive compensation under the terms of the contract. However the terms of the contract are not set by the needs of the employee. Sorry you were confused by the point of the thread.
August 23, 2013 at 11:23 AM in reply to: OT: On the killing floor; immigrations impacts on wages #764723ParticipantNobody is entitled to anything. Payment for services is set by the marketplace. At least for the most part in free markets. Consumers shop the marketplace for the goods and services. They make the purchase based on the quality/price of the product, it is a sliding scale. Similarly employees are free to shop the marketplace to find employment. The salary they receive is set by the employer. The salary is not arbitrary. It is determined by the skills needed for the job, the cost of that labor to the employer, and other factors that the employer takes into account.
The salary has NOTHING to do with the employee being able to provide for his family. The employee is not ENTITLED to receive a salary that can support his family. He is ENTITLED to search for a job that can do that.
It should not be an encumbrance upon the employer.
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In fact, the standard listing agreement for the state of California states that the brokerage is under the employ of the principle. The rate of payment is negotiable. It has nothing to do with whether that will be enough to support my family.
My gosh….
August 23, 2013 at 11:03 AM in reply to: OT: On the killing floor; immigrations impacts on wages #764721ParticipantNo I am not entitled to anything. Commissions are negotiable in the state of California. People employ me at the rate I promise to them. They are free to choose whoever they want to work with.
Funny how that works isn’t it? Just like someone is free to work for McDonalds or not.
Sorry about your snarky comment not working out.
August 23, 2013 at 10:17 AM in reply to: OT: On the killing floor; immigrations impacts on wages #764718ParticipantI believe the point of the article is that McDonalds or any other corporate entity will strive to keep labor costs a constant regardless of the wage scale in one way or another.
It is quite likely that a place like McDonalds could have already automated easily but chose not to because the cost may not make sense. Give them a nudge and they might.
It is all about net profit. McDonalds is an example that looses the wage scale battle. As NSR pointed out in his argument about the place in Colorado, paying those employees more makes sense because it saves the company money in the long run due to retention and employee training costs. Thus the company becomes more profitable by doing so. This is a valid argument and makes alot of sense.
If McDonalds can improve the bottom line by paying a guy 15 bucks to flip a burger then it will.
Employees are not entitled to anything. They don’t like the pay, they can quit and look for another job.
August 23, 2013 at 8:15 AM in reply to: OT: On the killing floor; immigrations impacts on wages #764713ParticipantUmmm Shoveler as Forbes points out, actually, is that the price of the meal may not move at all.
McDonalds would simply find out a way to keep the overall labor costs the same. They would pay the workers 15 bucks an hour and then reduce the workforce by the same amount through automation.
ParticipantGreat posts CAR and livin. I agree 100%. As tragic as the Oklahoma shooting is, it is an opportunity for black leaders to rally and be public about condemnation of this behavior. A believe Jesse Jackson made a statement about his sorry for the victims family. However here is where there should be rallies the size of the Trayvon rallies condemning this behavior and as you both pointed out, trying to figure out a way to change things. I understand it is very much an uphill battle for black leadership. There are lots of white racists around. There is history to deal with. There are huge swaths of poverty through the black community. The thug lifestyle seems to be celebrated through black and white races. It sucks and is hard but being silent on the issue will not help promote change.
Oh and by the way…. another beating… WWII vet as well.
ParticipantAgree 100% CAR.
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I don’t think blacks who make derogatory comments about whites are racist.To me. racism implies some kind of moral superiority.
Fantastic. So I can use the n-word on a black person and if I didn’t imply moral superiority I am not a racist?
Sorry I do not agree. Racism takes many forms that are rooted in fear, ignorance, and hatred among other things. Racism is learned. It is copied from others who you associate with. It is passed on from parents to children. It is embedded in all of our cultures. It is far more about those things then it is about any moral superiority. Moral superiority is simply another by-product of those things above just like racism is.
ParticipantYou are correct all. The third kid who was with them is white. He is being charged as an accessory to murder.
ParticipantYour right there is a big difference.
A young white man was shot in the back while he was jogging by 3 black teens.
No comment from the president. No comment from Eric Holder. No rallies and no riots. No comment from Al Sharpton. No comments from the media.
Two lives lost.
Two very different reactions.
To me that is very sad. I guess not so much to you.
ParticipantWe are bored. Let’s go out and shoot somebody.
Baseball player from Australia visiting here to play ball gets to leave in a coffin. He was out jogging. Probably deserved it. Luckily the police said it wasn’t racially motivated. I feel better now.
ParticipantLook it is kind of the white elephant in the room. (so to speak)
There is racism in this country. It is ugly, it is bad, and I really wish there was a cure for it. The country has a very very ugly history with slavery.
We had lots and lots of responses to this thread when discussing Trayvon the victim. What happened to him was another sad commentary on the country. I personally cannot feel the same as black people who have experienced racism. I do kno I have experienced anti-Semitism and do almost daily. It is a bad feeling man.
What is most discomforting is that it is almost taboo to talk about whites getting beaten by blacks. I am sure I have already been labelled a racist for doing so. For wondering aloud why this is not addressed by the administration, or by Holder. For wondering why activists like Al Sharpton or Jesse Jackson turn a blind eye to this. yet Trayvon Martin brought out plenty of formal responses, investigations, etc.
Your response Cardiff is a decent response. Yes take care of yourself, avoid conflict, be aware. Great that works however that doesn’t address the problem. In fact this more of what we have been doing. Turn a blind eye and don’t talk about it.
Yet if a group of whites beat the hell out of a black kid and put him in a coma how big of a media circus would we have?
Now did that happen? Hell yes it happened regularly in the past. How friggin ugly is that? What a piss poor statement that is about white USA in the past. Plenty of that racial history exists today in what America, it is sad. However that same hatred exists, and boils over regularly in black America as well against whites. It pops up in a story or two in the press but it is summarily ignored by the administration. Why? Is the administration racist? No I don’t think that for a minute. Is it because the administration feels it has a responsibility to black America to respond? Perhaps I don’t really know.
It just is unsettling. To even discuss it rationally portrays me in a bad light however I have no clue how to even bring it up to get people to talk about it.
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