[NotCranky]

Hey Cy ,
I think this one is going to fizzle out for me. Look religion is too entrenched in our society and our debating counter parts have dug their heels in as well.At least they don’t deny that dinosaurs existed anymore and they can tolerate the word evolution. Maybe in 25 more years they will admit we are primates at least animals. We will be long dead before any real progress is made on this. I don’t think I want to push JG into a discussion about homosexuality.He will probably bash for a page or two of posts and then say his best friend is homosexual,can and does practice christianity just fine but will never get to heaven. Hopefully this whole religious thing backfires on them some day. Not so that they get hurt but so that the insanity unwinds a little bit. This conversation has made me want to do a new survey on Christians, who are they and what do they believe, I think I have made too many assumptions based on mostly having had these conversation with blue collar Christians who mainly seemed to be that way by default or “born again” types. Just a nice ace in the hole to be Christian, something to fall back on after years of careless, ignorant living. I have met some good living “progressive” christians who were still kind of establishement types. My wife’s childhood friend is one . She is a professor of theology.I am looking forward to meeting her soon for the first time.Having had my chat with ST.Thomas Aquinas ( progressive catholic in his day)here on the blog(JG in modern times), has opened my eyes a bit.I also want to study the seperation of church and state history further. I don’t accept JG’s answer that it is practically an accident that it was ever mentioned.I think it had something to do with ridding the new world of the Anglican church’s power. I also think many of the founding fathers were Deists. I don’t really have much hope we can change anything on a large scale CY. Like I said in a much earlier post, people above 30 don’t change much and those people are brain washing the children.I ahve already told my kids they can choose to believe what they want( They will likely be great philosophers like their dad). I think it is a good idea not to be a strong Atheist or promote it. It causes too big of a knee jerk reaction in many Christians. I am not an atheist,deist or agnostic anyway. My take on it is that it is not my problem to define myself in terms of a response to the possiblity of the supernatural, especially to people who have decided that they know that some passed down mythology is closer to the truth than saying I don’t know is. My problem is to live that is all. I think the human race has less to fear and more hope of peace without the quazi- government branch called religion. I just can’t imagine JG or pretty much anyone in his shoes going home and saying. “Hey family, I have had a different kind of enlightenment and we are not going to be Catholics anymore.” Or “I am going to help Russ and CY with their goal of seperating church and state because the whole thing is blasphemous to my wonderful “GOD” who is personal to me and some of my friends but not for every body.” He knows the value of being religious and the government and his many of his peers being affected by it. Changing ones religious views does happen of course in young people, but it is pretty rare later, unless some other trigger is involved like Alcoholism recovery, a mistress,a divorice ,a mid life crisis, coming out of the closet or something like that.
Anyway he has been a pretty good sport as always.
Best wishes

[NotCranky]

I moved here from Ventura County in 1980(18 years old). I don’t enjoy the crowds that are everywhere compared to then. Traffic and parking was fantastic. I think the only place that had traffic Jams was the 8 near San Diego State. Tiny little ones really.You could still park on some of the beaches
I think some portions of the 15 were surface streets still.I used to ride my bike comfortably 30-60 miles on weekends around the county. It felt safe until about 95′ People still ride obviously. It is too crazy out there for me. I do enjoy the effects of San Diego becoming more cosmopolitan.Downtown has changed form a creepy denizen of filth to a pretty cool place IMO. I love the ammenities of the city/coast but moved to the hills to get out of the feeling that living in San Diego was becoming a little bit of a grind and perhaps a little unhealthy for risk of crime and pollution. Thoughts of leaving the state were considered.We live in Jamul now. We think about moving our growing family back to the city to be close to activities for them as that is the biggest drawback of semi-rural living. Schools are a big concern since we are in the public school camp. The decent schools are in areas that exceed our price for housing or are in suburbs. My wife would move to one of the nicer houses in San Carlos in a heart beat and that is about our price range at current prices. I am pretty much in the 40% drop camp, across the board,except my house,it is different here.

[NotCranky]

I moved here from Ventura County in 1980(18 years old). I don’t enjoy the crowds that are everywhere compared to then. Traffic and parking was fantastic. I think the only place that had traffic Jams was the 8 near San Diego State. Tiny little ones really.You could still park on some of the beaches
I think some portions of the 15 were surface streets still.I used to ride my bike comfortably 30-60 miles on weekends around the county. It felt safe until about 95′ People still ride obviously. It is too crazy out there for me. I do enjoy the effects of San Diego becoming more cosmopolitan.Downtown has changed form a creepy denizen of filth to a pretty cool place IMO. I love the ammenities of the city/coast but moved to the hills to get out of the feeling that living in San Diego was becoming a little bit of a grind and perhaps a little unhealthy for risk of crime and pollution. Thoughts of leaving the state were considered.We live in Jamul now. We think about moving our growing family back to the city to be close to activities for them as that is the biggest drawback of semi-rural living. Schools are a big concern since we are in the public school camp. The decent schools are in areas that exceed our price for housing or are in suburbs. My wife would move to one of the nicer houses in San Carlos in a heart beat and that is about our price range at current prices. I am pretty much in the 40% drop camp, across the board,except my house,it is different here.

[NotCranky]

Hey Concho, I new someone would jump on that one. LOL.
I have been off the beaten path and further off than you could ever imagine. I dislike Cancun and places like it after a few hours. Don’t laugh but the Americans I traveled with were sailors. Other than that when I have been to foriegn countries I try to make contacts in advance and tour with locals, many times I have lived with relatives of friends here, until I hooked up with some kind woman usually, well, in a few instances.LOL.(That was before I got married JG). I had an architect in urban planning take me out in Buenos Aires for two weeks. Anyway I concede. There are Schmucks everywhere and we can all indulge in a little schmuckery sometimes.
Best wishes

[NotCranky]

Hey Concho, I new someone would jump on that one. LOL.
I have been off the beaten path and further off than you could ever imagine. I dislike Cancun and places like it after a few hours. Don’t laugh but the Americans I traveled with were sailors. Other than that when I have been to foriegn countries I try to make contacts in advance and tour with locals, many times I have lived with relatives of friends here, until I hooked up with some kind woman usually, well, in a few instances.LOL.(That was before I got married JG). I had an architect in urban planning take me out in Buenos Aires for two weeks. Anyway I concede. There are Schmucks everywhere and we can all indulge in a little schmuckery sometimes.
Best wishes

[NotCranky]

sdr. I represent my self but would certainly have not had near the success without my broker in my corner. The guy has made me big bucks,relative to my standard of poverty, and provided for many more restful nights of sleep than I would have otherwise had.It will get real tough for a lot of people going it alone,period.He only takes 10% of commission as well on my deals. For clients he only takes 20% and that is after any rebates.He also accepts my philosophy which is super important.If someone is qualified to work with us on a flat fee basis we do it.Usually sellers who find their own buyer. I recommend that my clients try “for sale by owner” if they are qualified and have time ,instead of giving me the work. I always recommend that people get a license.I would help anyone who wanted to do it.If you are going to try to make us disposable, do it right. People should choose agents that reflect their philosophy or force them to or dump them or go it alone if need be.
Disclaimer: Philosophy must not include that we work for free,take shit, grovel or dress fancy when it is not necessary, I do pay for lunch sometimes :).

[NotCranky]

sdr. I represent my self but would certainly have not had near the success without my broker in my corner. The guy has made me big bucks,relative to my standard of poverty, and provided for many more restful nights of sleep than I would have otherwise had.It will get real tough for a lot of people going it alone,period.He only takes 10% of commission as well on my deals. For clients he only takes 20% and that is after any rebates.He also accepts my philosophy which is super important.If someone is qualified to work with us on a flat fee basis we do it.Usually sellers who find their own buyer. I recommend that my clients try “for sale by owner” if they are qualified and have time ,instead of giving me the work. I always recommend that people get a license.I would help anyone who wanted to do it.If you are going to try to make us disposable, do it right. People should choose agents that reflect their philosophy or force them to or dump them or go it alone if need be.
Disclaimer: Philosophy must not include that we work for free,take shit, grovel or dress fancy when it is not necessary, I do pay for lunch sometimes :).

[NotCranky]

Perry,
Like you,I have traveled extensively. The middle and lower classes(not peasants),everywhere I have been, make ours look like dolts, for the most part, even in Mexico, Africa, and the Phillipines. I am sure you have observed the same. I have to admit, my travels, sometimes undertaken with large numbers of Americans, have inspired me not to be the best dipshit I can be.
I have wondered,Perry, have you ever read Gabriel Garcia Marquez? I bet you would like his books.

[NotCranky]

Perry,
Like you,I have traveled extensively. The middle and lower classes(not peasants),everywhere I have been, make ours look like dolts, for the most part, even in Mexico, Africa, and the Phillipines. I am sure you have observed the same. I have to admit, my travels, sometimes undertaken with large numbers of Americans, have inspired me not to be the best dipshit I can be.
I have wondered,Perry, have you ever read Gabriel Garcia Marquez? I bet you would like his books.

[NotCranky]

I am sure we can agree to disagree 4runner. I certainly like your style. Just because something has not happened does not mean that it can not.It means that we haven’t seen the will for it in a long time. Most other animals do not kill their own kind ,although they do compete relentlessly, just as we human animals do. I have no desire to stop religion and it can be a fine contribution to our society without leaving it vulnerable to the likes of Bush to abuse as it has been abused and has been used to abuse humans from its inception. Thanks for considering my needs but the only peril for me regarding religion is that I am still at risk of being a heretic worthy of slaughter,and so are a lot more potentially valuable persons than myself, perhaps even in the eyes of my goverment again some day. Also, I am prejudiced against if I share my beliefs more than you are for sharing yours. Separation of church and state could ameleriorate that without harming you.

If you ever get to Spain I recommend going to the wax museum in Madrid. It is a bit embarrassing to say that in a city of cultural and historical gems that I went to the wax museum, however, the inquisition exhibit as gruesome as it was ,made a very strong contrary impression as to how religion makes people behave gently towards other humans.So does Guantanamo and the Bushes version of almost all government agencies. So does the invoking of GOD for each and every war by (both sides). In my opinion 4runner it is not just a little twisted its sick or evil.
Best wishes

[NotCranky]

I am sure we can agree to disagree 4runner. I certainly like your style. Just because something has not happened does not mean that it can not.It means that we haven’t seen the will for it in a long time. Most other animals do not kill their own kind ,although they do compete relentlessly, just as we human animals do. I have no desire to stop religion and it can be a fine contribution to our society without leaving it vulnerable to the likes of Bush to abuse as it has been abused and has been used to abuse humans from its inception. Thanks for considering my needs but the only peril for me regarding religion is that I am still at risk of being a heretic worthy of slaughter,and so are a lot more potentially valuable persons than myself, perhaps even in the eyes of my goverment again some day. Also, I am prejudiced against if I share my beliefs more than you are for sharing yours. Separation of church and state could ameleriorate that without harming you.

If you ever get to Spain I recommend going to the wax museum in Madrid. It is a bit embarrassing to say that in a city of cultural and historical gems that I went to the wax museum, however, the inquisition exhibit as gruesome as it was ,made a very strong contrary impression as to how religion makes people behave gently towards other humans.So does Guantanamo and the Bushes version of almost all government agencies. So does the invoking of GOD for each and every war by (both sides). In my opinion 4runner it is not just a little twisted its sick or evil.
Best wishes

[NotCranky]

Don’t forget “attention getting behavior”. Poor guy :(.

[NotCranky]

Don’t forget “attention getting behavior”. Poor guy :(.

[NotCranky]

Thanks for the answer. Well, in My opinion it is about time How much further remains to be seen. I admire your knowlege of history.Perhaps we need the checks and balances of religious views? I doubt it. It is just a status quo lazy lie at best. Do you remember Kerry saying that he could never see it just to legislate his faith? I really appreciated him for saying that(whatever his motivations might have been,probably votes,duh).Yeah come to think about it he was probably just trying ot minimze the chaffing effect his being religious had on his “LIB” constituents.Whore. I think he is Catholic too.

I might have adopted religion like you have, even without buying into it hook line and sinker. I have an extreme intolerance for ritual, herd behavior and hypocrisy. The thing about “GOD” being on our side during war and loving “freedom” loving nations and all that is sickening too. I would protest like hell if my GOD were being hijacked for such puposes and also being pimped and pandered for votes. Those people should go to hell. Maybe we could make a case for “odd bed fellows” again. Shall we get back to impeaching Bush?

Our motto: ” Sinners and saints for seperation of church and state” Freedom of religion stays in tact where religion doesn’t interfere with basic human needs.

[NotCranky]

Thanks for the answer. Well, in My opinion it is about time How much further remains to be seen. I admire your knowlege of history.Perhaps we need the checks and balances of religious views? I doubt it. It is just a status quo lazy lie at best. Do you remember Kerry saying that he could never see it just to legislate his faith? I really appreciated him for saying that(whatever his motivations might have been,probably votes,duh).Yeah come to think about it he was probably just trying ot minimze the chaffing effect his being religious had on his “LIB” constituents.Whore. I think he is Catholic too.

I might have adopted religion like you have, even without buying into it hook line and sinker. I have an extreme intolerance for ritual, herd behavior and hypocrisy. The thing about “GOD” being on our side during war and loving “freedom” loving nations and all that is sickening too. I would protest like hell if my GOD were being hijacked for such puposes and also being pimped and pandered for votes. Those people should go to hell. Maybe we could make a case for “odd bed fellows” again. Shall we get back to impeaching Bush?

Our motto: ” Sinners and saints for seperation of church and state” Freedom of religion stays in tact where religion doesn’t interfere with basic human needs.

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