[drboom]

[quote=bearishgurl]drboom, no one is accusing anyone here of “unethical business practices.” You’re not even an agent![/quote]

Screwing people in business deals is unethical, period. My standards are considerably higher than those mandated in codes of conduct.

[quote]I now understand almost everything, except these two things:

If this agent, referred to below, didn’t represent you in the failed short-sale transaction, did he represent you in transactions before that? If so, what was the outcome of that representation? i.e. rejected offer(s), failed escrow, etc.[/quote]

Never met him before.

[quote]And, when you represented yourself on the failed short-sale transaction, did the listing agent ever offer to give up any of his commission to entice the bank to accept your (short) offer to purchase? After all, wasn’t he/his broker going to be paid 100% of the commission since you were unrepresented and thus they didn’t have to split any with you?[/quote]

Fair question. We had a buyer’s agent–a former colleague of the listing agent–at a different brokerage lined up for the sole purpose of representing us during escrow–a fig leaf, if you will. We would have split the commission with that buyer’s agent. I never met that agent, let alone signed anything with him, since the deal never went into escrow.

[quote]Thank you for your patience ;=)[/quote]

I hope all this is of some value to the OP who is trying to figure out whether to go it alone. 😛

Perhaps he will note the disbelief coming from even enlightened Piggie RE agents when someone like me talks about how he didn’t follow the rules and still prospered.

FWIW, the residential real estate biz is a congregation of highly regulated smalltime saints compared to the commercial property leasing world. Those guys assume you know what you’re doing and pull no punches. I’ve handled a couple of commercial space deals for a company I worked for, and you absolutely must have a lawyer look at every single piece of paper before signing.

[drboom]

[quote=bearishgurl]drboom, no one is accusing anyone here of “unethical business practices.” You’re not even an agent![/quote]

Screwing people in business deals is unethical, period. My standards are considerably higher than those mandated in codes of conduct.

[quote]I now understand almost everything, except these two things:

If this agent, referred to below, didn’t represent you in the failed short-sale transaction, did he represent you in transactions before that? If so, what was the outcome of that representation? i.e. rejected offer(s), failed escrow, etc.[/quote]

Never met him before.

[quote]And, when you represented yourself on the failed short-sale transaction, did the listing agent ever offer to give up any of his commission to entice the bank to accept your (short) offer to purchase? After all, wasn’t he/his broker going to be paid 100% of the commission since you were unrepresented and thus they didn’t have to split any with you?[/quote]

Fair question. We had a buyer’s agent–a former colleague of the listing agent–at a different brokerage lined up for the sole purpose of representing us during escrow–a fig leaf, if you will. We would have split the commission with that buyer’s agent. I never met that agent, let alone signed anything with him, since the deal never went into escrow.

[quote]Thank you for your patience ;=)[/quote]

I hope all this is of some value to the OP who is trying to figure out whether to go it alone. 😛

Perhaps he will note the disbelief coming from even enlightened Piggie RE agents when someone like me talks about how he didn’t follow the rules and still prospered.

FWIW, the residential real estate biz is a congregation of highly regulated smalltime saints compared to the commercial property leasing world. Those guys assume you know what you’re doing and pull no punches. I’ve handled a couple of commercial space deals for a company I worked for, and you absolutely must have a lawyer look at every single piece of paper before signing.

[drboom]

Oboy.

[quote=bearishgurl]drboom, Is the agent you’re referring to in the passage below your wife’s relative?[/quote]

No.

[quote]Is the emphasized agent (below) the same person as above? Did he ever show you any properties or present any offers for you?[/quote]

No, and no. The years of experience are purely coincidental.

[quote]Was the procuring agent on this short sale (referenced below) your wife’s relative, a different agent (perhaps referred to at the top of this post), or did you represent yourself in the original short-sale transaction?[/quote]

I represented myself, as I have said repeatedly.

I see the source of confusion:

[quote][quote]Just wondering though . . . How does your wife’s relative feel about you both now after he was cut out of the commission on that deal?[/quote]
He was pissed, and so were a couple of other family members…
[/quote]

This meant different things to each of us. The family RE person felt entitled to our business so she felt she was “cut out”, and that’s what I was answering. This person was never part of any deal and we never gave her any reason to expect our business.

I only explain myself because I don’t like being accused of unethical business practices–even when I’m an anonymous poster in a forum.

Are we done here?

[drboom]

Oboy.

[quote=bearishgurl]drboom, Is the agent you’re referring to in the passage below your wife’s relative?[/quote]

No.

[quote]Is the emphasized agent (below) the same person as above? Did he ever show you any properties or present any offers for you?[/quote]

No, and no. The years of experience are purely coincidental.

[quote]Was the procuring agent on this short sale (referenced below) your wife’s relative, a different agent (perhaps referred to at the top of this post), or did you represent yourself in the original short-sale transaction?[/quote]

I represented myself, as I have said repeatedly.

I see the source of confusion:

[quote][quote]Just wondering though . . . How does your wife’s relative feel about you both now after he was cut out of the commission on that deal?[/quote]
He was pissed, and so were a couple of other family members…
[/quote]

This meant different things to each of us. The family RE person felt entitled to our business so she felt she was “cut out”, and that’s what I was answering. This person was never part of any deal and we never gave her any reason to expect our business.

I only explain myself because I don’t like being accused of unethical business practices–even when I’m an anonymous poster in a forum.

Are we done here?

[drboom]

Oboy.

[quote=bearishgurl]drboom, Is the agent you’re referring to in the passage below your wife’s relative?[/quote]

No.

[quote]Is the emphasized agent (below) the same person as above? Did he ever show you any properties or present any offers for you?[/quote]

No, and no. The years of experience are purely coincidental.

[quote]Was the procuring agent on this short sale (referenced below) your wife’s relative, a different agent (perhaps referred to at the top of this post), or did you represent yourself in the original short-sale transaction?[/quote]

I represented myself, as I have said repeatedly.

I see the source of confusion:

[quote][quote]Just wondering though . . . How does your wife’s relative feel about you both now after he was cut out of the commission on that deal?[/quote]
He was pissed, and so were a couple of other family members…
[/quote]

This meant different things to each of us. The family RE person felt entitled to our business so she felt she was “cut out”, and that’s what I was answering. This person was never part of any deal and we never gave her any reason to expect our business.

I only explain myself because I don’t like being accused of unethical business practices–even when I’m an anonymous poster in a forum.

Are we done here?

[drboom]

Oboy.

[quote=bearishgurl]drboom, Is the agent you’re referring to in the passage below your wife’s relative?[/quote]

No.

[quote]Is the emphasized agent (below) the same person as above? Did he ever show you any properties or present any offers for you?[/quote]

No, and no. The years of experience are purely coincidental.

[quote]Was the procuring agent on this short sale (referenced below) your wife’s relative, a different agent (perhaps referred to at the top of this post), or did you represent yourself in the original short-sale transaction?[/quote]

I represented myself, as I have said repeatedly.

I see the source of confusion:

[quote][quote]Just wondering though . . . How does your wife’s relative feel about you both now after he was cut out of the commission on that deal?[/quote]
He was pissed, and so were a couple of other family members…
[/quote]

This meant different things to each of us. The family RE person felt entitled to our business so she felt she was “cut out”, and that’s what I was answering. This person was never part of any deal and we never gave her any reason to expect our business.

I only explain myself because I don’t like being accused of unethical business practices–even when I’m an anonymous poster in a forum.

Are we done here?

[drboom]

Oboy.

[quote=bearishgurl]drboom, Is the agent you’re referring to in the passage below your wife’s relative?[/quote]

No.

[quote]Is the emphasized agent (below) the same person as above? Did he ever show you any properties or present any offers for you?[/quote]

No, and no. The years of experience are purely coincidental.

[quote]Was the procuring agent on this short sale (referenced below) your wife’s relative, a different agent (perhaps referred to at the top of this post), or did you represent yourself in the original short-sale transaction?[/quote]

I represented myself, as I have said repeatedly.

I see the source of confusion:

[quote][quote]Just wondering though . . . How does your wife’s relative feel about you both now after he was cut out of the commission on that deal?[/quote]
He was pissed, and so were a couple of other family members…
[/quote]

This meant different things to each of us. The family RE person felt entitled to our business so she felt she was “cut out”, and that’s what I was answering. This person was never part of any deal and we never gave her any reason to expect our business.

I only explain myself because I don’t like being accused of unethical business practices–even when I’m an anonymous poster in a forum.

Are we done here?

[drboom]

[quote=bearishgurl]Your answers are neither positive or negative here, drboom, but I’m just trying to explore a buyer’s reasons for “agent defecting.”[/quote]

I didn’t, and I never said or implied I did. Get some new glasses and re-read what I actually wrote. 🙂

Edit: “bidding fair to do” relates to some (years) earlier overtures he made to us. If you read what I wrote, I said I represented myself for our first six months of shopping. That’s fairly unambiguous.

[drboom]

[quote=bearishgurl]Your answers are neither positive or negative here, drboom, but I’m just trying to explore a buyer’s reasons for “agent defecting.”[/quote]

I didn’t, and I never said or implied I did. Get some new glasses and re-read what I actually wrote. 🙂

Edit: “bidding fair to do” relates to some (years) earlier overtures he made to us. If you read what I wrote, I said I represented myself for our first six months of shopping. That’s fairly unambiguous.

[drboom]

[quote=bearishgurl]Your answers are neither positive or negative here, drboom, but I’m just trying to explore a buyer’s reasons for “agent defecting.”[/quote]

I didn’t, and I never said or implied I did. Get some new glasses and re-read what I actually wrote. 🙂

Edit: “bidding fair to do” relates to some (years) earlier overtures he made to us. If you read what I wrote, I said I represented myself for our first six months of shopping. That’s fairly unambiguous.

[drboom]

[quote=bearishgurl]Your answers are neither positive or negative here, drboom, but I’m just trying to explore a buyer’s reasons for “agent defecting.”[/quote]

I didn’t, and I never said or implied I did. Get some new glasses and re-read what I actually wrote. 🙂

Edit: “bidding fair to do” relates to some (years) earlier overtures he made to us. If you read what I wrote, I said I represented myself for our first six months of shopping. That’s fairly unambiguous.

[drboom]

[quote=bearishgurl]Your answers are neither positive or negative here, drboom, but I’m just trying to explore a buyer’s reasons for “agent defecting.”[/quote]

I didn’t, and I never said or implied I did. Get some new glasses and re-read what I actually wrote. 🙂

Edit: “bidding fair to do” relates to some (years) earlier overtures he made to us. If you read what I wrote, I said I represented myself for our first six months of shopping. That’s fairly unambiguous.

[drboom]

[quote=bearishgurl][quote=drboom]You can argue semantics all you want, but I did in fact pay 1% less than I would have if I had been a good boy and followed the rules. Maybe you’re too rich to care, but that’s real money to me. I know it’s just a discount on the commission that I, as a buyer, am paying (see my previous post) so I don’t fool myself into thinking it’s “found money”.

Do you feel threatened by that?[/quote]

Actually, no, drboom, I don’t feel “threatened” at all. If it made your problematic deal work and was a win-win for both of you, then it appears that a full-service agent made a business decision to kick you back half their commission to get the deal done.[/quote]

No, he wanted our business and understood we wanted a limited set of services. I never even sat in his Escalade. The deal that closed wasn’t “problematic” as short sales go: it closed 90 days after our first offer.

[quote]The listing agent actually made less out of the sale than you did because he had expenses and possibly commission splits to boot! So, count yourself lucky here.[/quote]

OK, now I’m beginning to think you’ve got comprehension issues. The listing agent on the house we bought paid out the same 3% he would have paid out to anyone else. Our buyer’s agent did a post-tax fee split with us, and he showed us his payout statement from his broker to head off any questions about honesty.

[quote]
(arithmetic redacted)

The monthly payment difference is $28.35 between a $495K and $500K purchase price.
[/quote]

This is the kind of thinking that is bankrupting our government. Thackeray had some choice rants about conducting one’s life on debt service in Vanity Fair back in the 1840s (edit: fixed century). Great book, though it could have ended better.

Let’s complete your arithmetic, shall we? That piddly $28.35/mo. adds up to $10,206.00 over 360 payments.

My wife and I could take five cruises down the coast of Mexico for that kind of money, but you suggest we’d be better off staying at home so we can pay for services we neither want nor need.

[quote]Hey, drboom?? You still haven’t indicated here whether or not your veteran agent/relative is still speaking to you and/or your wife.[/quote]

Not that it’s any of your business, but I never said she wasn’t speaking to us. Go re-read what I wrote and you’ll figure it out.

[drboom]

[quote=bearishgurl][quote=drboom]You can argue semantics all you want, but I did in fact pay 1% less than I would have if I had been a good boy and followed the rules. Maybe you’re too rich to care, but that’s real money to me. I know it’s just a discount on the commission that I, as a buyer, am paying (see my previous post) so I don’t fool myself into thinking it’s “found money”.

Do you feel threatened by that?[/quote]

Actually, no, drboom, I don’t feel “threatened” at all. If it made your problematic deal work and was a win-win for both of you, then it appears that a full-service agent made a business decision to kick you back half their commission to get the deal done.[/quote]

No, he wanted our business and understood we wanted a limited set of services. I never even sat in his Escalade. The deal that closed wasn’t “problematic” as short sales go: it closed 90 days after our first offer.

[quote]The listing agent actually made less out of the sale than you did because he had expenses and possibly commission splits to boot! So, count yourself lucky here.[/quote]

OK, now I’m beginning to think you’ve got comprehension issues. The listing agent on the house we bought paid out the same 3% he would have paid out to anyone else. Our buyer’s agent did a post-tax fee split with us, and he showed us his payout statement from his broker to head off any questions about honesty.

[quote]
(arithmetic redacted)

The monthly payment difference is $28.35 between a $495K and $500K purchase price.
[/quote]

This is the kind of thinking that is bankrupting our government. Thackeray had some choice rants about conducting one’s life on debt service in Vanity Fair back in the 1840s (edit: fixed century). Great book, though it could have ended better.

Let’s complete your arithmetic, shall we? That piddly $28.35/mo. adds up to $10,206.00 over 360 payments.

My wife and I could take five cruises down the coast of Mexico for that kind of money, but you suggest we’d be better off staying at home so we can pay for services we neither want nor need.

[quote]Hey, drboom?? You still haven’t indicated here whether or not your veteran agent/relative is still speaking to you and/or your wife.[/quote]

Not that it’s any of your business, but I never said she wasn’t speaking to us. Go re-read what I wrote and you’ll figure it out.

[drboom]

[quote=bearishgurl][quote=drboom]You can argue semantics all you want, but I did in fact pay 1% less than I would have if I had been a good boy and followed the rules. Maybe you’re too rich to care, but that’s real money to me. I know it’s just a discount on the commission that I, as a buyer, am paying (see my previous post) so I don’t fool myself into thinking it’s “found money”.

Do you feel threatened by that?[/quote]

Actually, no, drboom, I don’t feel “threatened” at all. If it made your problematic deal work and was a win-win for both of you, then it appears that a full-service agent made a business decision to kick you back half their commission to get the deal done.[/quote]

No, he wanted our business and understood we wanted a limited set of services. I never even sat in his Escalade. The deal that closed wasn’t “problematic” as short sales go: it closed 90 days after our first offer.

[quote]The listing agent actually made less out of the sale than you did because he had expenses and possibly commission splits to boot! So, count yourself lucky here.[/quote]

OK, now I’m beginning to think you’ve got comprehension issues. The listing agent on the house we bought paid out the same 3% he would have paid out to anyone else. Our buyer’s agent did a post-tax fee split with us, and he showed us his payout statement from his broker to head off any questions about honesty.

[quote]
(arithmetic redacted)

The monthly payment difference is $28.35 between a $495K and $500K purchase price.
[/quote]

This is the kind of thinking that is bankrupting our government. Thackeray had some choice rants about conducting one’s life on debt service in Vanity Fair back in the 1840s (edit: fixed century). Great book, though it could have ended better.

Let’s complete your arithmetic, shall we? That piddly $28.35/mo. adds up to $10,206.00 over 360 payments.

My wife and I could take five cruises down the coast of Mexico for that kind of money, but you suggest we’d be better off staying at home so we can pay for services we neither want nor need.

[quote]Hey, drboom?? You still haven’t indicated here whether or not your veteran agent/relative is still speaking to you and/or your wife.[/quote]

Not that it’s any of your business, but I never said she wasn’t speaking to us. Go re-read what I wrote and you’ll figure it out.

[Author]

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