[Arraya]

Everybody needs to cut through the spin and propaganda and see things the way they are. Terms such as “stimulus”, “relief”, “QE” and “help”are all either deflation stopping plans or wealth transfers. Yes, often times, irresponsible borrows are in the line of fire of these two things.

The whole banking system is bankrupt. Which is why they have fraudulent accounting rules and currently indefinite short selling bans in Europe. And Buffet just stepped in to save BofA.

RE values are connected to the health of ALL the big banks. They drew a line in the sand and are doing everything they can to uphold that line. The further it drops the more bankrupt the banks are.

Not that I think these things will work – but acceptance that the whole system is dead will be instant-depression and market panics. So we have to lie to ourselves to maintain social functionality.

So as for all the moral hazards, poor incentives, etc.. They are not looking at it ideologically or with any type of principles whatsoever – they are looking at is systemically. Where “systemically” to throw money to keep it propped up. That’s it.

Which would be lowering payments, principle forgiveness and any host of other areas to shield the banks from risk, keep people paying in their overpriced homes and maintain that line in the sand.

We will continue to focus all energies on propping up asset prices and stimulating aggregate demand for the consumer economy, until we can’t anymore. How long that is is anybodies guess – it goes far beyond the current administration into geo-politics and really the structure of the whole global economy.

[Arraya]

Everybody needs to cut through the spin and propaganda and see things the way they are. Terms such as “stimulus”, “relief”, “QE” and “help”are all either deflation stopping plans or wealth transfers. Yes, often times, irresponsible borrows are in the line of fire of these two things.

The whole banking system is bankrupt. Which is why they have fraudulent accounting rules and currently indefinite short selling bans in Europe. And Buffet just stepped in to save BofA.

RE values are connected to the health of ALL the big banks. They drew a line in the sand and are doing everything they can to uphold that line. The further it drops the more bankrupt the banks are.

Not that I think these things will work – but acceptance that the whole system is dead will be instant-depression and market panics. So we have to lie to ourselves to maintain social functionality.

So as for all the moral hazards, poor incentives, etc.. They are not looking at it ideologically or with any type of principles whatsoever – they are looking at is systemically. Where “systemically” to throw money to keep it propped up. That’s it.

Which would be lowering payments, principle forgiveness and any host of other areas to shield the banks from risk, keep people paying in their overpriced homes and maintain that line in the sand.

We will continue to focus all energies on propping up asset prices and stimulating aggregate demand for the consumer economy, until we can’t anymore. How long that is is anybodies guess – it goes far beyond the current administration into geo-politics and really the structure of the whole global economy.

[Arraya]

Everybody needs to cut through the spin and propaganda and see things the way they are. Terms such as “stimulus”, “relief”, “QE” and “help”are all either deflation stopping plans or wealth transfers. Yes, often times, irresponsible borrows are in the line of fire of these two things.

The whole banking system is bankrupt. Which is why they have fraudulent accounting rules and currently indefinite short selling bans in Europe. And Buffet just stepped in to save BofA.

RE values are connected to the health of ALL the big banks. They drew a line in the sand and are doing everything they can to uphold that line. The further it drops the more bankrupt the banks are.

Not that I think these things will work – but acceptance that the whole system is dead will be instant-depression and market panics. So we have to lie to ourselves to maintain social functionality.

So as for all the moral hazards, poor incentives, etc.. They are not looking at it ideologically or with any type of principles whatsoever – they are looking at is systemically. Where “systemically” to throw money to keep it propped up. That’s it.

Which would be lowering payments, principle forgiveness and any host of other areas to shield the banks from risk, keep people paying in their overpriced homes and maintain that line in the sand.

We will continue to focus all energies on propping up asset prices and stimulating aggregate demand for the consumer economy, until we can’t anymore. How long that is is anybodies guess – it goes far beyond the current administration into geo-politics and really the structure of the whole global economy.

[Arraya]

Everybody needs to cut through the spin and propaganda and see things the way they are. Terms such as “stimulus”, “relief”, “QE” and “help”are all either deflation stopping plans or wealth transfers. Yes, often times, irresponsible borrows are in the line of fire of these two things.

The whole banking system is bankrupt. Which is why they have fraudulent accounting rules and currently indefinite short selling bans in Europe. And Buffet just stepped in to save BofA.

RE values are connected to the health of ALL the big banks. They drew a line in the sand and are doing everything they can to uphold that line. The further it drops the more bankrupt the banks are.

Not that I think these things will work – but acceptance that the whole system is dead will be instant-depression and market panics. So we have to lie to ourselves to maintain social functionality.

So as for all the moral hazards, poor incentives, etc.. They are not looking at it ideologically or with any type of principles whatsoever – they are looking at is systemically. Where “systemically” to throw money to keep it propped up. That’s it.

Which would be lowering payments, principle forgiveness and any host of other areas to shield the banks from risk, keep people paying in their overpriced homes and maintain that line in the sand.

We will continue to focus all energies on propping up asset prices and stimulating aggregate demand for the consumer economy, until we can’t anymore. How long that is is anybodies guess – it goes far beyond the current administration into geo-politics and really the structure of the whole global economy.

[Arraya]

[quote=briansd1]

So why not delay the pain and hope for a miracle? [/quote]

That looks to be the current plan. The iron fist of non-change has been ruling for decades and now “change” is going to vomit all over us, in an unpleasant fashion.

[Arraya]

[quote=briansd1]

So why not delay the pain and hope for a miracle? [/quote]

That looks to be the current plan. The iron fist of non-change has been ruling for decades and now “change” is going to vomit all over us, in an unpleasant fashion.

[Arraya]

[quote=briansd1]

So why not delay the pain and hope for a miracle? [/quote]

That looks to be the current plan. The iron fist of non-change has been ruling for decades and now “change” is going to vomit all over us, in an unpleasant fashion.

[Arraya]

[quote=briansd1]

So why not delay the pain and hope for a miracle? [/quote]

That looks to be the current plan. The iron fist of non-change has been ruling for decades and now “change” is going to vomit all over us, in an unpleasant fashion.

[Arraya]

[quote=briansd1]

So why not delay the pain and hope for a miracle? [/quote]

That looks to be the current plan. The iron fist of non-change has been ruling for decades and now “change” is going to vomit all over us, in an unpleasant fashion.

[Arraya]

[quote=UCGal]

Younger GOP voters like him more than senior voters. He leads the pack in the sub-30 crowd. (I guess being old doesn’t guarantee you the old-person vote.)

He’s not big in the south… So being from Texas isn’t helping him get the southern votes.[/quote]

Yeah, I meet confused kids in their 20s that think he is “anti-establishment” and hence cool.

I set them straight.

[Arraya]

[quote=UCGal]

Younger GOP voters like him more than senior voters. He leads the pack in the sub-30 crowd. (I guess being old doesn’t guarantee you the old-person vote.)

He’s not big in the south… So being from Texas isn’t helping him get the southern votes.[/quote]

Yeah, I meet confused kids in their 20s that think he is “anti-establishment” and hence cool.

I set them straight.

[Arraya]

[quote=UCGal]

Younger GOP voters like him more than senior voters. He leads the pack in the sub-30 crowd. (I guess being old doesn’t guarantee you the old-person vote.)

He’s not big in the south… So being from Texas isn’t helping him get the southern votes.[/quote]

Yeah, I meet confused kids in their 20s that think he is “anti-establishment” and hence cool.

I set them straight.

[Arraya]

[quote=UCGal]

Younger GOP voters like him more than senior voters. He leads the pack in the sub-30 crowd. (I guess being old doesn’t guarantee you the old-person vote.)

He’s not big in the south… So being from Texas isn’t helping him get the southern votes.[/quote]

Yeah, I meet confused kids in their 20s that think he is “anti-establishment” and hence cool.

I set them straight.

[Arraya]

[quote=UCGal]

Younger GOP voters like him more than senior voters. He leads the pack in the sub-30 crowd. (I guess being old doesn’t guarantee you the old-person vote.)

He’s not big in the south… So being from Texas isn’t helping him get the southern votes.[/quote]

Yeah, I meet confused kids in their 20s that think he is “anti-establishment” and hence cool.

I set them straight.

[Arraya]

[quote=aldante]
Adults look at results objectively. RP was correct[/quote]

A lot of people were correct in calling an economic dislocation. However, correct narratives are far and few between. RP will never be able to do that and hence misdiagnose everything to suit his ideology. He constantly and dramatically understates the role of the private industry. Why?

[quote=aldante]
(in 2002)on the uncontrolled wars, the housing bust, gold’s value, lack of confidence in the government, and the dollar losing value, he was correct about the US losing its manufacturing base and the erosion of our civil liberties.[/quote]

Losing mfg base? That was a policy for decades. Not really a hard call on that one. Actually all those things are not hard to understand including losing civil liberties, this shows the elite know major economic problems are coming – they are seriously paranoid. RP gets no prize for stating the obvious. Though, it is in short supply in the establishment because being honest is not politically feasible. Politicians can’t get up and say our policies, set forth by our masters, are going to lowers your standard of living dramatically. That is not the way our system works. We’ve been systemically lied to for decades.

[quote=aldante]Furthermore, I would like to address your point about unmitigated Capitalism. Read Bastiat (the Law). Our government exists to ensure our liberties. From outside enemies as well as internal enemies.[/quote]

Yeah, I understand the foundational thesis about the modern government and economics.

You want to start with Thomas Hobbes re-writing of natural law, Locke’s “Treatise of governments”

Then go to Bernard Mandeville who laid the political foundation for Libertarianism when he suggested that a society based on “rational interests” (like a bee hive) would suppress irrational passions. Mandeville’s ideal society was one where the unwitting cooperation of individuals, each working for his or her own interest, would result in the greatest benefit to society at large.

The French writer Baron de Montesquieu , further developed Libertarian politics with a division of political powers in government. The division of power would, in effect, neutralize government and prevent citizens from gaining power over each other; conversely, citizens could easily make power powerless by changing parties. This is what Montesquieu called “liberty.” Today, we call Montesquieu’s philosophy “Social Darwinism” — a term which is most closely associated with the writings of Herbert Spencer. Spencer coined the phrase “survival of the fittest” — a term that describes Montesquieu’s state of “liberty” perfectly.

The French physician François Quesnay was the leader of a sect of Enlightenment thinkers known as the Physiocrats (or économistes) who founded Libertarian economics. The term “Physiocracy” means rule of nature and was coined in 1767 by Pierre Samuel du Pont de Nemours to describe the doctrine of the first modern school of economics. Quesnay transformed economics into its modern role as the science of money. In so doing he disengaged economic process from its role as servant of the sociopolitical order, and established its claim to be the direct manifestation of the natural order. In other words, he argued that the economic process itself embodied natural law and should thus dictate the sociopolitical order.

Quesnay had arrived at his theories of a free market and economic individualism by studying the emergence of a national market in England. But he always understood that in eighteenth century France the unfettered pursuit of individual interest might not result in the natural order he sought to establish. Quesnay knew that men could fail to behave “economically.”

Quesnay believed that his introduction of arithmetic precision into economics provided a scientific rule that should dictate appropriate political arrangements — and even the obedience of sovereigns. He was never willing, however, to trust the spontaneous development of the proper sociopolitical order. Nature required the assistance of an absolute authority capable of forcing natural order upon recalcitrant humans.

Montesquieu’s philosophy of Social Darwinism (survival of the economically fittest), Libertarian politics, and Libertarian economics were imported to America by Pierre Samuel DuPont, Thomas Jefferson, Benjamin Franklin, and James Madison thereby establishing America as the first Libertarian state.

But, modern science has moved on. These are all invalid theories and not inline with human biological and behavioral or planetary reality. They are built on false assumptions and have inherent blindness that need to be rectified. No politician can do that. Though, we do have a lot invested in this reality and it will take some time for it to cause enough pain to push for a transition. All our institutions are invalid, flawed and outdated.

RP is kind of an artifact. His beliefs are quaint and he does seem to be sincere, but time has moved on. Now, the dominant minority knows this and uses it to their advantage. People should recognize the corruption of the system but not fall victim to romanticizing the past like RP does – one that was not that good under close analysis. I mean, come on, he wants to go back to the Robber Barren days. Seriously. This is his version of an ideal society? The general population fought very hard to get away from that exploitation.

.[quote=aldante] They are participating in croney capitalism. Oligarchy. The wealthy hiring the government class to build the rules in their favor.[/quote]

The elite have no use for a “free market”. This is the inevitable evolution of capitalism and has always been this way to some extent, it’s just much more obvious now. It could not end any other way. Whether things ever worked or just gave the illusion of working is another story. Economists are sophists and make false correlations to fit their world view. I don’t hold it against them, they mostly believe there own BS. Which is really just politics with math. But a valid science, it is not.

[quote=aldante]
I think if you want to stop believing in fairy tales you should start by figuring out who has had the correct answers. Paul Krugman? Austin Goolsby? Chrisina Romer? Uncle Ben? Big Al? Any of the other Candidates? or Ron Paul?[/quote]

No, these people are defenders of the flawed status-quo. I don’t look to establishment types for guidance. They will do what ever it takes to perpetuate their validity.

I will say, most probably are doing the best they can within the contexts of what is acceptable, while others use there influence to game this system and even a smaller portion that know things are going to get worse for the majority and are positioning themselves for personal gain from the publics lack of understanding.

[Author]

Posts