OT: McCain

[Veritas]

Character does count. It is what did Kerry in:

“But Ross Perot, who paid her medical bills all those years ago, now believes that both Carol McCain and the American people have been taken in by a man who is unusually slick and cruel – even by the standards of modern politics.‘McCain is the classic opportunist. He’s always reaching for attention and glory,’ he said.‘After he came home, Carol walked with a limp. So he threw her over for a poster girl with big money from Arizona. And the rest is history.’”

I have always thought McCain should change his party and come out of the political closet. He acts like a democrat.

[Shadowfax]

To answer all those out there who keep asking what experience Obama has, I say, “let’s look at all the [questionable] experience McCain has.”

He was born outside the US in Panama (which technically is a bar to his becoming president under the constitution). BTW, Obama WAS born in the US–in Hawaii. McCain was born into a long line of navy officers–so I guess this makes him some sort of a military “affirmative action” candidate? And his class ranking at Annapolis was appalling.

How’s this for privilege:

After he became a POW: “Although McCain was badly wounded, his captors refused to treat his injuries, instead beating and interrogating him to get information. Only when the North Vietnamese discovered that his father was a top admiral did they give him medical care.”

He touts his military service and likes to say “I know how to fight wars.” Um, Johnny, you were a prisoner of war for almost 6 years. They beat the crap out of him, tortured him, left him for dead, but he thinks waterboarding isn’t torture. Gotta love the voice of experience.

[don’t get me wrong, I feel for the guy’s suffering. But he of all senators should be the first to speak out against our torture practices in Abu Ghraib and Gitmo and the rights of those prisoners. The torture itself is bad enough, but what it has done to America’s moral reputation is even worse.]

He was loyal to his fellow prisoners and refused early release but, several years later, couldn’t manage to be loyal to his crippled wife. He requested a divorce in February, it was finalized in April and he married the trophy wife in May. Ok, being tortured does something to a guy….

He left the navy when it became apparent there was little upward mobility left for him there and turned to politics. Despite his wealthy wife’s income, he received a disability pension from the military.

He served as a state politician in Arizona. With the assistance of local political endorsements, his Washington connections, as well as money that his wife lent to his campaign, McCain won a highly contested primary election. Gee, some connections helped him win the election…

Then a US senator. He was investigated for selling political influence as a member of the “Keating Five” and later cleared except for the exercise of poor judgment. [Public memory is so short–the was the Rezko of the 80s]. So years later, perhaps from real remorse, or maybe just to cover things up, he introduces some campaing finance reform legislation. (Sort of like drug traffikers like to put DARE and “Back the Badge” stickers on their drug running cars.) Now, he is back to taking the same campaign money as everyone else. He lost the presidential nomination to GW in 2000.

Running again this time around, he nearly lost before he started as his campaign ran out of money early on.

Both BO and JM have something going on about their fathers: JM wrote Faith of My Fathers and BO wrote Dreams from My Father.

Enjoy–I for one am doing my part to “even out” the postings re the candidates.

[Shadowfax]

To answer all those out there who keep asking what experience Obama has, I say, “let’s look at all the [questionable] experience McCain has.”

He was born outside the US in Panama (which technically is a bar to his becoming president under the constitution). BTW, Obama WAS born in the US–in Hawaii. McCain was born into a long line of navy officers–so I guess this makes him some sort of a military “affirmative action” candidate? And his class ranking at Annapolis was appalling.

How’s this for privilege:

After he became a POW: “Although McCain was badly wounded, his captors refused to treat his injuries, instead beating and interrogating him to get information. Only when the North Vietnamese discovered that his father was a top admiral did they give him medical care.”

He touts his military service and likes to say “I know how to fight wars.” Um, Johnny, you were a prisoner of war for almost 6 years. They beat the crap out of him, tortured him, left him for dead, but he thinks waterboarding isn’t torture. Gotta love the voice of experience.

[don’t get me wrong, I feel for the guy’s suffering. But he of all senators should be the first to speak out against our torture practices in Abu Ghraib and Gitmo and the rights of those prisoners. The torture itself is bad enough, but what it has done to America’s moral reputation is even worse.]

He was loyal to his fellow prisoners and refused early release but, several years later, couldn’t manage to be loyal to his crippled wife. He requested a divorce in February, it was finalized in April and he married the trophy wife in May. Ok, being tortured does something to a guy….

He left the navy when it became apparent there was little upward mobility left for him there and turned to politics. Despite his wealthy wife’s income, he received a disability pension from the military.

He served as a state politician in Arizona. With the assistance of local political endorsements, his Washington connections, as well as money that his wife lent to his campaign, McCain won a highly contested primary election. Gee, some connections helped him win the election…

Then a US senator. He was investigated for selling political influence as a member of the “Keating Five” and later cleared except for the exercise of poor judgment. [Public memory is so short–the was the Rezko of the 80s]. So years later, perhaps from real remorse, or maybe just to cover things up, he introduces some campaing finance reform legislation. (Sort of like drug traffikers like to put DARE and “Back the Badge” stickers on their drug running cars.) Now, he is back to taking the same campaign money as everyone else. He lost the presidential nomination to GW in 2000.

Running again this time around, he nearly lost before he started as his campaign ran out of money early on.

Both BO and JM have something going on about their fathers: JM wrote Faith of My Fathers and BO wrote Dreams from My Father.

Enjoy–I for one am doing my part to “even out” the postings re the candidates.

[Shadowfax]

To answer all those out there who keep asking what experience Obama has, I say, “let’s look at all the [questionable] experience McCain has.”

He was born outside the US in Panama (which technically is a bar to his becoming president under the constitution). BTW, Obama WAS born in the US–in Hawaii. McCain was born into a long line of navy officers–so I guess this makes him some sort of a military “affirmative action” candidate? And his class ranking at Annapolis was appalling.

How’s this for privilege:

After he became a POW: “Although McCain was badly wounded, his captors refused to treat his injuries, instead beating and interrogating him to get information. Only when the North Vietnamese discovered that his father was a top admiral did they give him medical care.”

He touts his military service and likes to say “I know how to fight wars.” Um, Johnny, you were a prisoner of war for almost 6 years. They beat the crap out of him, tortured him, left him for dead, but he thinks waterboarding isn’t torture. Gotta love the voice of experience.

[don’t get me wrong, I feel for the guy’s suffering. But he of all senators should be the first to speak out against our torture practices in Abu Ghraib and Gitmo and the rights of those prisoners. The torture itself is bad enough, but what it has done to America’s moral reputation is even worse.]

He was loyal to his fellow prisoners and refused early release but, several years later, couldn’t manage to be loyal to his crippled wife. He requested a divorce in February, it was finalized in April and he married the trophy wife in May. Ok, being tortured does something to a guy….

He left the navy when it became apparent there was little upward mobility left for him there and turned to politics. Despite his wealthy wife’s income, he received a disability pension from the military.

He served as a state politician in Arizona. With the assistance of local political endorsements, his Washington connections, as well as money that his wife lent to his campaign, McCain won a highly contested primary election. Gee, some connections helped him win the election…

Then a US senator. He was investigated for selling political influence as a member of the “Keating Five” and later cleared except for the exercise of poor judgment. [Public memory is so short–the was the Rezko of the 80s]. So years later, perhaps from real remorse, or maybe just to cover things up, he introduces some campaing finance reform legislation. (Sort of like drug traffikers like to put DARE and “Back the Badge” stickers on their drug running cars.) Now, he is back to taking the same campaign money as everyone else. He lost the presidential nomination to GW in 2000.

Running again this time around, he nearly lost before he started as his campaign ran out of money early on.

Both BO and JM have something going on about their fathers: JM wrote Faith of My Fathers and BO wrote Dreams from My Father.

Enjoy–I for one am doing my part to “even out” the postings re the candidates.

[Shadowfax]

To answer all those out there who keep asking what experience Obama has, I say, “let’s look at all the [questionable] experience McCain has.”

He was born outside the US in Panama (which technically is a bar to his becoming president under the constitution). BTW, Obama WAS born in the US–in Hawaii. McCain was born into a long line of navy officers–so I guess this makes him some sort of a military “affirmative action” candidate? And his class ranking at Annapolis was appalling.

How’s this for privilege:

After he became a POW: “Although McCain was badly wounded, his captors refused to treat his injuries, instead beating and interrogating him to get information. Only when the North Vietnamese discovered that his father was a top admiral did they give him medical care.”

He touts his military service and likes to say “I know how to fight wars.” Um, Johnny, you were a prisoner of war for almost 6 years. They beat the crap out of him, tortured him, left him for dead, but he thinks waterboarding isn’t torture. Gotta love the voice of experience.

[don’t get me wrong, I feel for the guy’s suffering. But he of all senators should be the first to speak out against our torture practices in Abu Ghraib and Gitmo and the rights of those prisoners. The torture itself is bad enough, but what it has done to America’s moral reputation is even worse.]

He was loyal to his fellow prisoners and refused early release but, several years later, couldn’t manage to be loyal to his crippled wife. He requested a divorce in February, it was finalized in April and he married the trophy wife in May. Ok, being tortured does something to a guy….

He left the navy when it became apparent there was little upward mobility left for him there and turned to politics. Despite his wealthy wife’s income, he received a disability pension from the military.

He served as a state politician in Arizona. With the assistance of local political endorsements, his Washington connections, as well as money that his wife lent to his campaign, McCain won a highly contested primary election. Gee, some connections helped him win the election…

Then a US senator. He was investigated for selling political influence as a member of the “Keating Five” and later cleared except for the exercise of poor judgment. [Public memory is so short–the was the Rezko of the 80s]. So years later, perhaps from real remorse, or maybe just to cover things up, he introduces some campaing finance reform legislation. (Sort of like drug traffikers like to put DARE and “Back the Badge” stickers on their drug running cars.) Now, he is back to taking the same campaign money as everyone else. He lost the presidential nomination to GW in 2000.

Running again this time around, he nearly lost before he started as his campaign ran out of money early on.

Both BO and JM have something going on about their fathers: JM wrote Faith of My Fathers and BO wrote Dreams from My Father.

Enjoy–I for one am doing my part to “even out” the postings re the candidates.

[Shadowfax]

To answer all those out there who keep asking what experience Obama has, I say, “let’s look at all the [questionable] experience McCain has.”

He was born outside the US in Panama (which technically is a bar to his becoming president under the constitution). BTW, Obama WAS born in the US–in Hawaii. McCain was born into a long line of navy officers–so I guess this makes him some sort of a military “affirmative action” candidate? And his class ranking at Annapolis was appalling.

How’s this for privilege:

After he became a POW: “Although McCain was badly wounded, his captors refused to treat his injuries, instead beating and interrogating him to get information. Only when the North Vietnamese discovered that his father was a top admiral did they give him medical care.”

He touts his military service and likes to say “I know how to fight wars.” Um, Johnny, you were a prisoner of war for almost 6 years. They beat the crap out of him, tortured him, left him for dead, but he thinks waterboarding isn’t torture. Gotta love the voice of experience.

[don’t get me wrong, I feel for the guy’s suffering. But he of all senators should be the first to speak out against our torture practices in Abu Ghraib and Gitmo and the rights of those prisoners. The torture itself is bad enough, but what it has done to America’s moral reputation is even worse.]

He was loyal to his fellow prisoners and refused early release but, several years later, couldn’t manage to be loyal to his crippled wife. He requested a divorce in February, it was finalized in April and he married the trophy wife in May. Ok, being tortured does something to a guy….

He left the navy when it became apparent there was little upward mobility left for him there and turned to politics. Despite his wealthy wife’s income, he received a disability pension from the military.

He served as a state politician in Arizona. With the assistance of local political endorsements, his Washington connections, as well as money that his wife lent to his campaign, McCain won a highly contested primary election. Gee, some connections helped him win the election…

Then a US senator. He was investigated for selling political influence as a member of the “Keating Five” and later cleared except for the exercise of poor judgment. [Public memory is so short–the was the Rezko of the 80s]. So years later, perhaps from real remorse, or maybe just to cover things up, he introduces some campaing finance reform legislation. (Sort of like drug traffikers like to put DARE and “Back the Badge” stickers on their drug running cars.) Now, he is back to taking the same campaign money as everyone else. He lost the presidential nomination to GW in 2000.

Running again this time around, he nearly lost before he started as his campaign ran out of money early on.

Both BO and JM have something going on about their fathers: JM wrote Faith of My Fathers and BO wrote Dreams from My Father.

Enjoy–I for one am doing my part to “even out” the postings re the candidates.

[Casca]

Yes Gandolf/Shadowfax, but why lie to do it?

McCain isn’t my favorite Republican. I can find plenty wrong with him. One of those things is his declaration that waterboarding IS torture. So there’s lie # one.

“No person except a natural born citizen, or a citizen of the United States, at the time of the adoption of this Constitution, shall be eligible to the office of President.” If both parents are citizens in good standing of the United States, their offspring are natural born citizens of the US, even if born on the moon. This is actually BO’s problem. His daddy was a Kenyan with a British passport, and his mother was a minor so could not transfer citizenship. Even if he was born in Hawaii, over which there is some doubt, he does not have a claim to be a “natural born citizen”. He may be British. He may be Kenyan, but he is not a natural born US citizen. Lie # two.

He receives a military pension, for his years of service as a military officer. A portion of that income is disability for his injuries received in the service of his country. This has nothing to do with what his future earnings may be, or what his wife may earn. Lie # three.

“He served as a state politician in Arizona.” McCain never held office at the state level in AZ. Lie # four.

One could go on, but why bother with someone prepared to lie at every turn?

[Casca]

Yes Gandolf/Shadowfax, but why lie to do it?

McCain isn’t my favorite Republican. I can find plenty wrong with him. One of those things is his declaration that waterboarding IS torture. So there’s lie # one.

“No person except a natural born citizen, or a citizen of the United States, at the time of the adoption of this Constitution, shall be eligible to the office of President.” If both parents are citizens in good standing of the United States, their offspring are natural born citizens of the US, even if born on the moon. This is actually BO’s problem. His daddy was a Kenyan with a British passport, and his mother was a minor so could not transfer citizenship. Even if he was born in Hawaii, over which there is some doubt, he does not have a claim to be a “natural born citizen”. He may be British. He may be Kenyan, but he is not a natural born US citizen. Lie # two.

He receives a military pension, for his years of service as a military officer. A portion of that income is disability for his injuries received in the service of his country. This has nothing to do with what his future earnings may be, or what his wife may earn. Lie # three.

“He served as a state politician in Arizona.” McCain never held office at the state level in AZ. Lie # four.

One could go on, but why bother with someone prepared to lie at every turn?

[Casca]

Yes Gandolf/Shadowfax, but why lie to do it?

McCain isn’t my favorite Republican. I can find plenty wrong with him. One of those things is his declaration that waterboarding IS torture. So there’s lie # one.

“No person except a natural born citizen, or a citizen of the United States, at the time of the adoption of this Constitution, shall be eligible to the office of President.” If both parents are citizens in good standing of the United States, their offspring are natural born citizens of the US, even if born on the moon. This is actually BO’s problem. His daddy was a Kenyan with a British passport, and his mother was a minor so could not transfer citizenship. Even if he was born in Hawaii, over which there is some doubt, he does not have a claim to be a “natural born citizen”. He may be British. He may be Kenyan, but he is not a natural born US citizen. Lie # two.

He receives a military pension, for his years of service as a military officer. A portion of that income is disability for his injuries received in the service of his country. This has nothing to do with what his future earnings may be, or what his wife may earn. Lie # three.

“He served as a state politician in Arizona.” McCain never held office at the state level in AZ. Lie # four.

One could go on, but why bother with someone prepared to lie at every turn?

[Casca]

Yes Gandolf/Shadowfax, but why lie to do it?

McCain isn’t my favorite Republican. I can find plenty wrong with him. One of those things is his declaration that waterboarding IS torture. So there’s lie # one.

“No person except a natural born citizen, or a citizen of the United States, at the time of the adoption of this Constitution, shall be eligible to the office of President.” If both parents are citizens in good standing of the United States, their offspring are natural born citizens of the US, even if born on the moon. This is actually BO’s problem. His daddy was a Kenyan with a British passport, and his mother was a minor so could not transfer citizenship. Even if he was born in Hawaii, over which there is some doubt, he does not have a claim to be a “natural born citizen”. He may be British. He may be Kenyan, but he is not a natural born US citizen. Lie # two.

He receives a military pension, for his years of service as a military officer. A portion of that income is disability for his injuries received in the service of his country. This has nothing to do with what his future earnings may be, or what his wife may earn. Lie # three.

“He served as a state politician in Arizona.” McCain never held office at the state level in AZ. Lie # four.

One could go on, but why bother with someone prepared to lie at every turn?

[Casca]

Yes Gandolf/Shadowfax, but why lie to do it?

McCain isn’t my favorite Republican. I can find plenty wrong with him. One of those things is his declaration that waterboarding IS torture. So there’s lie # one.

“No person except a natural born citizen, or a citizen of the United States, at the time of the adoption of this Constitution, shall be eligible to the office of President.” If both parents are citizens in good standing of the United States, their offspring are natural born citizens of the US, even if born on the moon. This is actually BO’s problem. His daddy was a Kenyan with a British passport, and his mother was a minor so could not transfer citizenship. Even if he was born in Hawaii, over which there is some doubt, he does not have a claim to be a “natural born citizen”. He may be British. He may be Kenyan, but he is not a natural born US citizen. Lie # two.

He receives a military pension, for his years of service as a military officer. A portion of that income is disability for his injuries received in the service of his country. This has nothing to do with what his future earnings may be, or what his wife may earn. Lie # three.

“He served as a state politician in Arizona.” McCain never held office at the state level in AZ. Lie # four.

One could go on, but why bother with someone prepared to lie at every turn?

[Shadowfax]

Nice! You finally have added some substance to the discussion!! Bravo!

Everything I wrote in my post I got from internet sources–some from McCain’s campaign website, a lot from Wikipedia, some from other alleged biographies. So they may have had inaccuracies, which is different from lying. The best part about chronicaling history is that people see things–and even record things–differently. I did not take the effort to double-check or cross-check every “fact” I read elsewhere. I knew someone here would do that for me.

Thanks for finally adding something to the debate.

I will take a look at what you have offered and see if I can find any material to refute it or something that casts a different interpretation and…I’ll be back to report on what I find.

For the record, I don’t dislike the guy. And I really feel for him and what he went through. But I certainly think that, after the last 8 years, the party really could have come up with someone better.

I really want to address your issues re patriotism (from another thread) but honestly can’t come to terms with how separationist your worldview is. Will need some thought to try to see the entire country as us (military) against them (civilians). I thought we were fighting terrorist, not our own neighbors…?

[Shadowfax]

Nice! You finally have added some substance to the discussion!! Bravo!

Everything I wrote in my post I got from internet sources–some from McCain’s campaign website, a lot from Wikipedia, some from other alleged biographies. So they may have had inaccuracies, which is different from lying. The best part about chronicaling history is that people see things–and even record things–differently. I did not take the effort to double-check or cross-check every “fact” I read elsewhere. I knew someone here would do that for me.

Thanks for finally adding something to the debate.

I will take a look at what you have offered and see if I can find any material to refute it or something that casts a different interpretation and…I’ll be back to report on what I find.

For the record, I don’t dislike the guy. And I really feel for him and what he went through. But I certainly think that, after the last 8 years, the party really could have come up with someone better.

I really want to address your issues re patriotism (from another thread) but honestly can’t come to terms with how separationist your worldview is. Will need some thought to try to see the entire country as us (military) against them (civilians). I thought we were fighting terrorist, not our own neighbors…?

[Shadowfax]

Nice! You finally have added some substance to the discussion!! Bravo!

Everything I wrote in my post I got from internet sources–some from McCain’s campaign website, a lot from Wikipedia, some from other alleged biographies. So they may have had inaccuracies, which is different from lying. The best part about chronicaling history is that people see things–and even record things–differently. I did not take the effort to double-check or cross-check every “fact” I read elsewhere. I knew someone here would do that for me.

Thanks for finally adding something to the debate.

I will take a look at what you have offered and see if I can find any material to refute it or something that casts a different interpretation and…I’ll be back to report on what I find.

For the record, I don’t dislike the guy. And I really feel for him and what he went through. But I certainly think that, after the last 8 years, the party really could have come up with someone better.

I really want to address your issues re patriotism (from another thread) but honestly can’t come to terms with how separationist your worldview is. Will need some thought to try to see the entire country as us (military) against them (civilians). I thought we were fighting terrorist, not our own neighbors…?

[Shadowfax]

Nice! You finally have added some substance to the discussion!! Bravo!

Everything I wrote in my post I got from internet sources–some from McCain’s campaign website, a lot from Wikipedia, some from other alleged biographies. So they may have had inaccuracies, which is different from lying. The best part about chronicaling history is that people see things–and even record things–differently. I did not take the effort to double-check or cross-check every “fact” I read elsewhere. I knew someone here would do that for me.

Thanks for finally adding something to the debate.

I will take a look at what you have offered and see if I can find any material to refute it or something that casts a different interpretation and…I’ll be back to report on what I find.

For the record, I don’t dislike the guy. And I really feel for him and what he went through. But I certainly think that, after the last 8 years, the party really could have come up with someone better.

I really want to address your issues re patriotism (from another thread) but honestly can’t come to terms with how separationist your worldview is. Will need some thought to try to see the entire country as us (military) against them (civilians). I thought we were fighting terrorist, not our own neighbors…?

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