OT: Health Care in Mexico vs. U.S. (related to “Father is visiting and hospitalized…”)

[eyePod]

My young daughter almost died in Mexico. We own a house in the interior, down in the heartland. Her condition deteriorated so fast she ended up having surgery there. And no, they did not demand payment or insurance in advance. This was in the highest end private clinic in town. They did however, demand payment in full before discharge. And I agree with all the previous comments about the great bedside manner and care. And the cost (cash) was about what my deductible would have been in the states.

[UCGal]

During college I was broke (I was a student!) – but needed birth control pills. They weren’t covered my my student insurance and cost $30/month. I used to make an annual trip and get a years supply for myself.

Exact same pills – same manufacturers/pharmaceutical companies. Same packaging. The only difference is the instructions (that no one reads) were in Spanish.

A friend was skeptical – but I showed her a monthly pack I had from a US pharmacy – (which cost $30 back then) and a pack of the same prescription from a Tijuana pharmacy (which cost $5). They were IDENTICAL. She came with me on the next annual pilgrimage for inexpensive birth control. $300 savings a year is HUGE for a college student.

I guess, in hindsight, I was trafficking drugs across the border. Yikes.

[UCGal]

During college I was broke (I was a student!) – but needed birth control pills. They weren’t covered my my student insurance and cost $30/month. I used to make an annual trip and get a years supply for myself.

Exact same pills – same manufacturers/pharmaceutical companies. Same packaging. The only difference is the instructions (that no one reads) were in Spanish.

A friend was skeptical – but I showed her a monthly pack I had from a US pharmacy – (which cost $30 back then) and a pack of the same prescription from a Tijuana pharmacy (which cost $5). They were IDENTICAL. She came with me on the next annual pilgrimage for inexpensive birth control. $300 savings a year is HUGE for a college student.

I guess, in hindsight, I was trafficking drugs across the border. Yikes.

[UCGal]

During college I was broke (I was a student!) – but needed birth control pills. They weren’t covered my my student insurance and cost $30/month. I used to make an annual trip and get a years supply for myself.

Exact same pills – same manufacturers/pharmaceutical companies. Same packaging. The only difference is the instructions (that no one reads) were in Spanish.

A friend was skeptical – but I showed her a monthly pack I had from a US pharmacy – (which cost $30 back then) and a pack of the same prescription from a Tijuana pharmacy (which cost $5). They were IDENTICAL. She came with me on the next annual pilgrimage for inexpensive birth control. $300 savings a year is HUGE for a college student.

I guess, in hindsight, I was trafficking drugs across the border. Yikes.

[UCGal]

During college I was broke (I was a student!) – but needed birth control pills. They weren’t covered my my student insurance and cost $30/month. I used to make an annual trip and get a years supply for myself.

Exact same pills – same manufacturers/pharmaceutical companies. Same packaging. The only difference is the instructions (that no one reads) were in Spanish.

A friend was skeptical – but I showed her a monthly pack I had from a US pharmacy – (which cost $30 back then) and a pack of the same prescription from a Tijuana pharmacy (which cost $5). They were IDENTICAL. She came with me on the next annual pilgrimage for inexpensive birth control. $300 savings a year is HUGE for a college student.

I guess, in hindsight, I was trafficking drugs across the border. Yikes.

[UCGal]

During college I was broke (I was a student!) – but needed birth control pills. They weren’t covered my my student insurance and cost $30/month. I used to make an annual trip and get a years supply for myself.

Exact same pills – same manufacturers/pharmaceutical companies. Same packaging. The only difference is the instructions (that no one reads) were in Spanish.

A friend was skeptical – but I showed her a monthly pack I had from a US pharmacy – (which cost $30 back then) and a pack of the same prescription from a Tijuana pharmacy (which cost $5). They were IDENTICAL. She came with me on the next annual pilgrimage for inexpensive birth control. $300 savings a year is HUGE for a college student.

I guess, in hindsight, I was trafficking drugs across the border. Yikes.

[davelj]

[quote=Eugene][quote=davelj]
That’s a good point and certainly accounts for perhaps a couple of percentage points in the differential, but… not the whole 10 percentage points. No, clearly we have multiple US-specific problems with our delivery system.[/quote]

More than a couple of points. Most of the medical expenses accumulate during the last few years of life. Probably enough to account for the gap between Mexico and Europe.

We do have multiple US-specific problems, but solving them will not reduce real cost of treatment by more than 20-40%.
[/quote]

Your Mexico-Europe gap rationale is a reasonable possibility (I’m not an expert). However, as it appears that US health care spending will be over 17% of GDP this year (http://www.kff.org/insurance/upload/7692_02.pdf), while the average in Europe is around 10% (with higher life expectancies), it’s clear that our system is broken. If we operated an identical system, then by definition we’d see a reduction in real spending of roughly 40%. That seems like real money to me. I’m generally in favor of free market solutions to economic problems – I have libertarian leanings – but… our health care system appears to be a textbook case of market failure.

The following post does a good job of covering this (in my view, anyway):

http://www.anonymousliberal.com/2009/07/market-failure.html

The punchline:

“The bottom line is that, when it comes to health care, all the market is really capable of doing is providing reasonably affordable care to the young and healthy, people for whom the risk profile is essentially random and therefore the economic model more closely resembles that of other major types of insurance (car, home, life). But a system that only covers the young and the healthy is, by definition, a failure. That’s why every other industrialized country has long since adopted some sort of government insurance system. Expecting the market to provide affordable health care to all is like expecting the market to provide everyone with an affordable personal chef. It’s never gonna happen.”

[davelj]

[quote=Eugene][quote=davelj]
That’s a good point and certainly accounts for perhaps a couple of percentage points in the differential, but… not the whole 10 percentage points. No, clearly we have multiple US-specific problems with our delivery system.[/quote]

More than a couple of points. Most of the medical expenses accumulate during the last few years of life. Probably enough to account for the gap between Mexico and Europe.

We do have multiple US-specific problems, but solving them will not reduce real cost of treatment by more than 20-40%.
[/quote]

Your Mexico-Europe gap rationale is a reasonable possibility (I’m not an expert). However, as it appears that US health care spending will be over 17% of GDP this year (http://www.kff.org/insurance/upload/7692_02.pdf), while the average in Europe is around 10% (with higher life expectancies), it’s clear that our system is broken. If we operated an identical system, then by definition we’d see a reduction in real spending of roughly 40%. That seems like real money to me. I’m generally in favor of free market solutions to economic problems – I have libertarian leanings – but… our health care system appears to be a textbook case of market failure.

The following post does a good job of covering this (in my view, anyway):

http://www.anonymousliberal.com/2009/07/market-failure.html

The punchline:

“The bottom line is that, when it comes to health care, all the market is really capable of doing is providing reasonably affordable care to the young and healthy, people for whom the risk profile is essentially random and therefore the economic model more closely resembles that of other major types of insurance (car, home, life). But a system that only covers the young and the healthy is, by definition, a failure. That’s why every other industrialized country has long since adopted some sort of government insurance system. Expecting the market to provide affordable health care to all is like expecting the market to provide everyone with an affordable personal chef. It’s never gonna happen.”

[davelj]

[quote=Eugene][quote=davelj]
That’s a good point and certainly accounts for perhaps a couple of percentage points in the differential, but… not the whole 10 percentage points. No, clearly we have multiple US-specific problems with our delivery system.[/quote]

More than a couple of points. Most of the medical expenses accumulate during the last few years of life. Probably enough to account for the gap between Mexico and Europe.

We do have multiple US-specific problems, but solving them will not reduce real cost of treatment by more than 20-40%.
[/quote]

Your Mexico-Europe gap rationale is a reasonable possibility (I’m not an expert). However, as it appears that US health care spending will be over 17% of GDP this year (http://www.kff.org/insurance/upload/7692_02.pdf), while the average in Europe is around 10% (with higher life expectancies), it’s clear that our system is broken. If we operated an identical system, then by definition we’d see a reduction in real spending of roughly 40%. That seems like real money to me. I’m generally in favor of free market solutions to economic problems – I have libertarian leanings – but… our health care system appears to be a textbook case of market failure.

The following post does a good job of covering this (in my view, anyway):

http://www.anonymousliberal.com/2009/07/market-failure.html

The punchline:

“The bottom line is that, when it comes to health care, all the market is really capable of doing is providing reasonably affordable care to the young and healthy, people for whom the risk profile is essentially random and therefore the economic model more closely resembles that of other major types of insurance (car, home, life). But a system that only covers the young and the healthy is, by definition, a failure. That’s why every other industrialized country has long since adopted some sort of government insurance system. Expecting the market to provide affordable health care to all is like expecting the market to provide everyone with an affordable personal chef. It’s never gonna happen.”

[davelj]

[quote=Eugene][quote=davelj]
That’s a good point and certainly accounts for perhaps a couple of percentage points in the differential, but… not the whole 10 percentage points. No, clearly we have multiple US-specific problems with our delivery system.[/quote]

More than a couple of points. Most of the medical expenses accumulate during the last few years of life. Probably enough to account for the gap between Mexico and Europe.

We do have multiple US-specific problems, but solving them will not reduce real cost of treatment by more than 20-40%.
[/quote]

Your Mexico-Europe gap rationale is a reasonable possibility (I’m not an expert). However, as it appears that US health care spending will be over 17% of GDP this year (http://www.kff.org/insurance/upload/7692_02.pdf), while the average in Europe is around 10% (with higher life expectancies), it’s clear that our system is broken. If we operated an identical system, then by definition we’d see a reduction in real spending of roughly 40%. That seems like real money to me. I’m generally in favor of free market solutions to economic problems – I have libertarian leanings – but… our health care system appears to be a textbook case of market failure.

The following post does a good job of covering this (in my view, anyway):

http://www.anonymousliberal.com/2009/07/market-failure.html

The punchline:

“The bottom line is that, when it comes to health care, all the market is really capable of doing is providing reasonably affordable care to the young and healthy, people for whom the risk profile is essentially random and therefore the economic model more closely resembles that of other major types of insurance (car, home, life). But a system that only covers the young and the healthy is, by definition, a failure. That’s why every other industrialized country has long since adopted some sort of government insurance system. Expecting the market to provide affordable health care to all is like expecting the market to provide everyone with an affordable personal chef. It’s never gonna happen.”

[davelj]

[quote=Eugene][quote=davelj]
That’s a good point and certainly accounts for perhaps a couple of percentage points in the differential, but… not the whole 10 percentage points. No, clearly we have multiple US-specific problems with our delivery system.[/quote]

More than a couple of points. Most of the medical expenses accumulate during the last few years of life. Probably enough to account for the gap between Mexico and Europe.

We do have multiple US-specific problems, but solving them will not reduce real cost of treatment by more than 20-40%.
[/quote]

Your Mexico-Europe gap rationale is a reasonable possibility (I’m not an expert). However, as it appears that US health care spending will be over 17% of GDP this year (http://www.kff.org/insurance/upload/7692_02.pdf), while the average in Europe is around 10% (with higher life expectancies), it’s clear that our system is broken. If we operated an identical system, then by definition we’d see a reduction in real spending of roughly 40%. That seems like real money to me. I’m generally in favor of free market solutions to economic problems – I have libertarian leanings – but… our health care system appears to be a textbook case of market failure.

The following post does a good job of covering this (in my view, anyway):

http://www.anonymousliberal.com/2009/07/market-failure.html

The punchline:

“The bottom line is that, when it comes to health care, all the market is really capable of doing is providing reasonably affordable care to the young and healthy, people for whom the risk profile is essentially random and therefore the economic model more closely resembles that of other major types of insurance (car, home, life). But a system that only covers the young and the healthy is, by definition, a failure. That’s why every other industrialized country has long since adopted some sort of government insurance system. Expecting the market to provide affordable health care to all is like expecting the market to provide everyone with an affordable personal chef. It’s never gonna happen.”

[Raybyrnes]

My wife is a dentist and if you are looking for high quality care at an affordable price check out the community clinics. Family Health Centers of San Diego and San Ysidro are very affordable. They charge on a sliding scale and no one is checking what you are listing your income as. If you have children you can go to The Children’s Dental Health Center in Golden Hills. Cost for a check up is about $30. Don’t see why you would ever have to go over the border for quality care.

[Raybyrnes]

My wife is a dentist and if you are looking for high quality care at an affordable price check out the community clinics. Family Health Centers of San Diego and San Ysidro are very affordable. They charge on a sliding scale and no one is checking what you are listing your income as. If you have children you can go to The Children’s Dental Health Center in Golden Hills. Cost for a check up is about $30. Don’t see why you would ever have to go over the border for quality care.

[Raybyrnes]

My wife is a dentist and if you are looking for high quality care at an affordable price check out the community clinics. Family Health Centers of San Diego and San Ysidro are very affordable. They charge on a sliding scale and no one is checking what you are listing your income as. If you have children you can go to The Children’s Dental Health Center in Golden Hills. Cost for a check up is about $30. Don’t see why you would ever have to go over the border for quality care.

[Raybyrnes]

My wife is a dentist and if you are looking for high quality care at an affordable price check out the community clinics. Family Health Centers of San Diego and San Ysidro are very affordable. They charge on a sliding scale and no one is checking what you are listing your income as. If you have children you can go to The Children’s Dental Health Center in Golden Hills. Cost for a check up is about $30. Don’t see why you would ever have to go over the border for quality care.

[Author]

Posts