OT: Dalai Lama

[FlyerInHi]

[quote=ocrenter]

When did you become part of their on-line 50 cent army?[/quote]

I’m not defending China. But, as Harvey mentioned, there is moral equivalence with what we do. Think we’re that innocent? A lot of the stuff we do is not for human rights but as tools to destabilize and contain adversaries.

What we do in the name of national security is worse than China’s rule over Tibet. For example, Afghanistan, Iraq right now.

I’ve been around the world enough to know that people want economic prosperity. China is doing a great job at economic development.

BTW, a lot of support for America around the world is because we’re rich and people hope for trickle down. When we’re relatively less rich, support will decrease. Simple economics.

BTW, unlike Tibet, foreigners can travel independently in Xinjiang. Go visit, it’s very prosperous compared to neighboring central Asian countries.

When you talk about taking a vote in California… the reason people would want to remain part of the USA is because we’re rich. If Mexico were 10 times richer, people would vote to join Mexico. And if the USA becomes deplorable country, there will be CalExit so we can join Mexico, Canada, China and Pacific countries in a free trade agreement. We would accept college graduates from China and block high school dropout from Kansas who will be the new illegals.

[scaredyclassic]

im just sad the peaceful buddhists in tibet got tortured and squashed.

[ocrenter]

[quote=FlyerInHi]

I’m not defending China. But, as Harvey mentioned, there is moral equivalence with what we do. Think we’re that innocent? A lot of the stuff we do is not for human rights but as tools to destabilize and contain adversaries. [/quote]

That is exactly what Trump says. Glad you are in agreement with Trump.

No one is looking at the US as an altruistic angelic figure out to rid the world of injustice. But ultimately there is still free discussion in regard to US policy.

China on the other hand is doing everything within a black box, and all criticism are silenced. In addition, there’s a broad based national strategy to cook up nationalistic sentiment, such as the multiple WWII movies and TV shows generated every few months to fire up anti-Japanese nationalism.

The point here is whatever fault US has, China can be so much worse.

[quote=FlyerInHi]

I’ve been around the world enough to know that people want economic prosperity. China is doing a great job at economic development. [/quote]

So you saw economic prosperity for Uyghurs AND Han Chinese? Or you just saw the fancy new buildings used by the Han Chinese?

Again, given a vote, do you really think the Uyghurs will vote to stay under China’s rule? Again, if they are truly volunteering to stay as a member of the large family of ethnic groups under the leadership of CCP, why bother suppressing speech and lock away dissent? This is quite different compared to Californians wishing to stay as part of the union.

I know your answer, just give China another 200 years so the Uyghurs would be no more.

[scaredyclassic]

think about how much of a DICK those turdly chinese exchange students nust be to protest the freaking dalai lama, one of the most chill bros of our era.

what a bunch of TOOLS. hope they never ever get laid on the USA.

[spdrun]

Nah, I hope they get laid … by meth-addled Trump supporters who also have an antibiotic-resistant strain of VD.

[scaredyclassic]

ok then, i pray they get Cs and bring ignominy and shame upon their entire family.

dalai lama ruins our joy!!!

Op-Ed: Why I Won’t Accept the Dalai Lama As A Commencement Speaker

[ocrenter]

[quote=scaredyclassic]ok then, i pray they get Cs and bring ignominy and shame upon their entire family.

dalai lama ruins our joy!!!

http://ucsdguardian.org/2017/02/07/op-ed-why-i-wont-accept-the-dalai-lama-as-a-commencement-speaker/%5B/quote%5D

“the Dalai Lama spent his whole life trying to separate Tibet from the mainland of China, regardless of how much privilege and freedom the government offered the people of Tibet. His conflict with our government caused property loss, deaths of innocent people and panic among the general public”

Spoken like the Chinese fanboys represented here by Brian and Harvey.

What is up with these Tibetans. You give them all these privileges and freedom, and all they do is self immolation by the hundreds.

Well, as Brian said it best, give China 200 more years and there would not be any problematic Tibetans left to cause panic and property loss.

[scaredyclassic]

the peaceful buddhists generally get fucked. ugh. fucking bastards.

[FlyerInHi]

ocrenter, I’m no China fanboy. In fact, I think we need to counter China in trade, commerce, diplomacy, education, etc.. For example we should have ratified TPP to give pacific countries an alternative to trade with China. I’m just trying to be objective.

Unless we are ready to go all to way for Tibet to achieve independence, let’s not use them to sow chaos. That just causes suffering all around.

I’m well aware of Xinjiang. I actually have a Uighur friend who is a trade representative for China (went to Beijing University, then studied in USA, all on government scholarship). Uighurs who are educated do very well in China. They look Western but are Chinese citizens so they can actually gain professional status fairly easily — accountants, architects, lawyers, middle managers, etc..

In decades past, the hinterland of China was not developed, so there were separatist movements. But now, as wealth spreads westward, the people are actually happy with their lot in the PRC. If given a vote, I’m confident Uighurs would stay in the PRC because they can see their own prosperity compared to their cousins in Central Asia. But, as with Brexit, you never know with a plebiscite, and China will never risk it.

Don’t believe all the propaganda you hear in the Western press. They parrot the voices of dissidents who don’t represent the people. (compare to Iraq where the US brought back Ahmed Chalabi and Iraqi exiles who the people didn’t even know or recognize).

Even Russian towns near China are now dying with envy at the prosperity they see across the border. What a change from decades past when Russia was richer!

Same goes for Tibet. People there now live much better than across the border in India. With tourism and highspeed rail, Llasa real estate probably increased 5 fold in a decade, a great benefit to local property owners.

We may romanticize Buddhism and monks in robes living serene lives, but the people in Tibet want electric appliances, cars, central heating, and consumer products just like Americans. China is providing that.

BTW, I’m a big fan of Buddhism. Find happiness within! So in that regards, scaredy is right. The Dalai Lama is one of the most chill bros of our era.

[scaredyclassic]

the people of tibet are not the same post conquering. would those original buddhist folk want a consumer society imposed on them.

all is change, though, and suffering.

and desire

[ocrenter]

[quote=scaredyclassic]the peaceful buddhists generally get fucked. ugh. fucking bastards.[/quote]

Paraphrasing the UCSD Chinese graduates: The Tibetans are given the privilege and freedom of getting fucked. Instead of being grateful, they cry and scream instead, creating panic amongst the general public.

[FlyerInHi]

[quote=ocrenter]
Paraphrasing the UCSD Chinese graduates: The Tibetans are given the privilege and freedom of getting fucked. Instead of being grateful, they cry and scream instead, creating panic amongst the general public.[/quote]

Isn’t that the same argument Whites use against Blacks in USA. We give them affirmative action, all kinds of benefits… and instead of being grateful, they choose to be criminals causing chaos in society. Ok, not all Whites, but you get the general idea.

Minorities are oppressed in many ways in all societies.

BTW, a lot of Han Chinese feel that the government is showering benefits and development money in Tibet while ignoring other areas in need. Financially, Tibet is getting way more than it contributes in output.

[FlyerInHi]

[quote=scaredyclassic]the people of tibet are not the same post conquering. would those original buddhist folk want a consumer society imposed on them.

all is change, though, and suffering.

and desire[/quote]

For sure.

There is no answer to that however. It’s the eternal pursuit happiness. Buddhist philosophy is very helpful. Control desires and fnd happiness within.

Right now, the objective measures of wellbeing are money/GDP, and material possessions, objective measures we developed in the west.

Own a car? Check
Have air conditioning? Check
Went to university? Check
Have savings? Check
Modern sewer system? Check
Electricity to all households? Check
Refrigerator for all? Check

[ocrenter]

[quote=FlyerInHi]

Isn’t that the same argument Whites use against Blacks in USA. We give them affirmative action, all kinds of benefits… and instead of being grateful, they choose to be criminals causing chaos in society. Ok, not all Whites, but you get the general idea.

Minorities are oppressed in many ways in all societies.

BTW, a lot of Han Chinese feel that the government is showering benefits and development money in Tibet while ignoring other areas in need. Financially, Tibet is getting way more than it contributes in output.[/quote]

So based on that parallel, expat US students would be protesting a commencement speech by MLK if he is alive and barred by the US government?

Minorities are oppressed, especially in a colonial relationship with the ruling government. Uighurs and Tibetans are colonized people whose language and customs are systematically erased through slow and gradual assimilation.

Glad you have Uighur friends that benefited from Chinese rule. Such is the strategy of the colonizers throughout history. I do have to give it to you, you really do fight a valiant fight for colonialism and oppression of minorities.

[ocrenter]

[quote=FlyerInHi][quote=scaredyclassic]the people of tibet are not the same post conquering. would those original buddhist folk want a consumer society imposed on them.

all is change, though, and suffering.

and desire[/quote]

For sure.

There is no answer to that however. It’s the eternal pursuit happiness. Buddhist philosophy is very helpful. Control desires and fnd happiness within.

Right now, the objective measures of wellbeing are money/GDP, and material possessions, objective measures we developed in the west.

Own a car? Check
Have air conditioning? Check
Went to university? Check
Have savings? Check
Modern sewer system? Check
Electricity to all households? Check
Refrigerator for all? Check[/quote]

Cars, AC, electricity, and refrigerator are fleeing, would you like to exchange your language and culture and identity for a washer and dryer?

[Author]

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