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Escoguy.
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June 30, 2021 at 1:09 PM #23096June 30, 2021 at 1:12 PM #822347
scaredyclassic
ParticipantCHAPTER 1.
The words of the Teacher, son of David, king in Jerusalem: 2 “Meaningless! Meaningless!” says the Teacher. “Utterly meaningless! Everything is meaningless.” 3 What do people gain from all their labors at which they toil under the sun? 4 Generations come and generations go, but the earth remains forever. 5 The sun rises and the sun sets, and hurries back to where it rises. 6 The wind blows to the south and turns to the north; round and round it goes, ever returning on its course. 7 All streams flow into the sea, yet the sea is never full. To the place the streams come from, there they return again. 8 All things are wearisome, more than one can say. The eye never has enough of seeing, nor the ear its fill of hearing. 9 What has been will be again, what has been done will be done again; there is nothing new under the sun. 10 Is there anything of which one can say, “Look! This is something new”? It was here already, long ago; it was here before our time. 11 No one remembers the former generations, and even those yet to come will not be remembered by those who follow them. 13 I applied my mind to study and to explore by wisdom all that is done under the heavens. What a heavy burden God has laid on mankind! 14 I have seen all the things that are done under the sun; all of them are meaningless, a chasing after the wind. 15 What is crooked cannot be straightened; what is lacking cannot be counted. 16 I said to myself, “Look, I have increased in wisdom more than anyone who has ruled over Jerusalem before me; I have experienced much of wisdom and knowledge.” 17 Then I applied myself to the understanding of wisdom, and also of madness and folly, but I learned that this, too, is a chasing after the wind. 18 For with much wisdom comes much sorrow; the more knowledge, the more grief.
Ecclesiastes 1:1-11, 13-18 NIVJune 30, 2021 at 1:14 PM #822348ParticipantIt gets worse…
The Bible, sure can sneak up on a guy…
June 30, 2021 at 1:21 PM #822349ParticipantCHAPTER 2
1 I said to myself, “Come now, I will test you with pleasure to find out what is good.” But that also proved to be meaningless. 2 “Laughter,” I said, “is madness. And what does pleasure accomplish?” 3 I tried cheering myself with wine, and embracing folly—my mind still guiding me with wisdom. I wanted to see what was good for people to do under the heavens during the few days of their lives. 4 I undertook great projects: I built houses for myself and planted vineyards. 5 I made gardens and parks and planted all kinds of fruit trees in them. 6 I made reservoirs to water groves of flourishing trees. 7 I bought male and female slaves and had other slaves who were born in my house. I also owned more herds and flocks than anyone in Jerusalem before me. 8 I amassed silver and gold for myself, and the treasure of kings and provinces. I acquired male and female singers, and a harem as well—the delights of a man’s heart. 9 I became greater by far than anyone in Jerusalem before me. In all this my wisdom stayed with me. 10 I denied myself nothing my eyes desired; I refused my heart no pleasure. My heart took delight in all my labor, and this was the reward for all my toil. 11 Yet when I surveyed all that my hands had done and what I had toiled to achieve, everything was meaningless, a chasing after the wind; nothing was gained under the sun. 12 Then I turned my thoughts to consider wisdom, and also madness and folly. What more can the king’s successor do than what has already been done? 13 I saw that wisdom is better than folly, just as light is better than darkness. 14 The wise have eyes in their heads, while the fool walks in the darkness; but I came to realize that the same fate overtakes them both. 15 Then I said to myself, “The fate of the fool will overtake me also. What then do I gain by being wise?” I said to myself, “This too is meaningless.” 16 For the wise, like the fool, will not be long remembered; the days have already come when both have been forgotten. Like the fool, the wise too must die! 17 So I hated life, because the work that is done under the sun was grievous to me. All of it is meaningless, a chasing after the wind. 18 I hated all the things I had toiled for under the sun, because I must leave them to the one who comes after me. 19 And who knows whether that person will be wise or foolish? Yet they will have control over all the fruit of my toil into which I have poured my effort and skill under the sun. This too is meaningless. 20 So my heart began to despair over all my toilsome labor under the sun. 21 For a person may labor with wisdom, knowledge and skill, and then they must leave all they own to another who has not toiled for it. This too is meaningless and a great misfortune. 22 What do people get for all the toil and anxious striving with which they labor under the sun? 23 All their days their work is grief and pain; even at night their minds do not rest. This too is meaningless. 24 A person can do nothing better than to eat and drink and find satisfaction in their own toil. This too, I see, is from the hand of God, 26 To the person who pleases him, God gives wisdom, knowledge and happiness, but to the sinner he gives the task of gathering and storing up wealth to hand it over to the one who pleases God. This too is meaningless, a chasing after the wind.
Ecclesiastes 2:1-24, 26 NIVJune 30, 2021 at 2:39 PM #822351
barnaby33ParticipantSlow day at the asylum?
JoshJune 30, 2021 at 2:54 PM #822355ParticipantAmerican novelist Thomas Wolfe wrote: “[O]f all I have ever seen or learned, that book seems to me the noblest, the wisest, and the most powerful expression of man’s life upon this earth—and also the highest flower of poetry, eloquence, and truth. I am not given to dogmatic judgments in the matter of literary creation, but if I had to make one I could say that Ecclesiastes is the greatest single piece of writing I have ever known, and the wisdom expressed in it the most lasting and profound.
June 30, 2021 at 3:04 PM #822357barnaby33ParticipantDude never read any of HST’s good stuff. I mean it puts the bible to shame:
I have a theory about the truth, it is never told between the hours of 9 and 5.
If there is in fact, a heaven and a hell, all we know for sure is that hell will be a viciously overcrowded version of Phoenix — a clean well lighted place full of sunshine and bromides and fast cars where almost everybody seems vaguely happy, except those who know in their hearts what is missing…
There are times, however, and this is one of them, when even being right feels wrong. What do you say, for instance, about a generation that has been taught that rain is poison and sex is death? If making love might be fatal and if a cool spring breeze on any summer afternoon can turn a crystal blue lake into a puddle of black poison right in front of your eyes, there is not much left except TV and relentless masturbation. It’s a strange world. Some people get rich and others eat shit and die.
Josh
June 30, 2021 at 3:04 PM #822358barnaby33ParticipantDude never read any of HST’s good stuff. I mean it puts the bible to shame:
I have a theory about the truth, it is never told between the hours of 9 and 5.
If there is in fact, a heaven and a hell, all we know for sure is that hell will be a viciously overcrowded version of Phoenix — a clean well lighted place full of sunshine and bromides and fast cars where almost everybody seems vaguely happy, except those who know in their hearts what is missing…
There are times, however, and this is one of them, when even being right feels wrong. What do you say, for instance, about a generation that has been taught that rain is poison and sex is death? If making love might be fatal and if a cool spring breeze on any summer afternoon can turn a crystal blue lake into a puddle of black poison right in front of your eyes, there is not much left except TV and relentless masturbation. It’s a strange world. Some people get rich and others eat shit and die.
Josh
June 30, 2021 at 3:21 PM #822360Participant[quote=barnaby33]Dude never read any of HST’s good stuff. I mean it puts the bible to shame:
I have a theory about the truth, it is never told between the hours of 9 and 5.
If there is in fact, a heaven and a hell, all we know for sure is that hell will be a viciously overcrowded version of Phoenix — a clean well lighted place full of sunshine and bromides and fast cars where almost everybody seems vaguely happy, except those who know in their hearts what is missing…
There are times, however, and this is one of them, when even being right feels wrong. What do you say, for instance, about a generation that has been taught that rain is poison and sex is death? If making love might be fatal and if a cool spring breeze on any summer afternoon can turn a crystal blue lake into a puddle of black poison right in front of your eyes, there is not much left except TV and relentless masturbation. It’s a strange world. Some people get rich and others eat shit and die.
Josh[/quote]
I believe that sentiment is expressed in Ecclesiastes.
I thought I was a book of job guy, but I think I’m an Ecclesiastes guy.
7 Go, eat your food with gladness, and drink your wine with a joyful heart, for God has already approved what you do. 8 Always be clothed in white, and always anoint your head with oil. 9 Enjoy life with your wife, whom you love, all the days of this meaningless life that God has given you under the sun—all your meaningless days. For this is your lot in life and in your toilsome labor under the sun. 10 Whatever your hand finds to do, do it with all your might, for in the realm of the dead, where you are going, there is neither working nor planning nor knowledge nor wisdom.
Ecclesiastes 9:7-10June 30, 2021 at 3:23 PM #822362Participant18 I also said to myself, “As for humans, God tests them so that they may see that they are like the animals. 19 Surely the fate of human beings is like that of the animals; the same fate awaits them both: As one dies, so dies the other. All have the same breath; humans have no advantage over animals. Everything is meaningless. 21 Who knows if the human spirit rises upward and if the spirit of the animal goes down into the earth?” 22 So I saw that there is nothing better for a person than to enjoy their work, because that is their lot. For who can bring them to see what will happen after them?
Ecclesiastes 3:18-19, 21-22 NIVJune 30, 2021 at 4:02 PM #822363The-Shoveler
Participant“viciously overcrowded version of Phoenix — a clean well lighted place full of sunshine and bromides and fast cars where almost everybody seems vaguely happy, except those who know in their hearts what is missing…”
Sounds like Vegas
July 1, 2021 at 2:01 PM #822364barnaby33ParticipantSounds like lots of places.
July 3, 2021 at 8:10 PM #822383Escoguy
Participant[quote=scaredyclassic]18 I also said to myself, “As for humans, God tests them so that they may see that they are like the animals. 19 Surely the fate of human beings is like that of the animals; the same fate awaits them both: As one dies, so dies the other. All have the same breath; humans have no advantage over animals. Everything is meaningless. 21 Who knows if the human spirit rises upward and if the spirit of the animal goes down into the earth?” 22 So I saw that there is nothing better for a person than to enjoy their work, because that is their lot. For who can bring them to see what will happen after them?
Ecclesiastes 3:18-19, 21-22 NIVhttps://bible.com/bible/111/ecc.3.18-22.NIV%5B/quote%5D
My father was a Baptist minister in Texas in the 1980s.
When I learned of Ecclesiastes, the word used instead of meaningless was vanity (all is vanity).
A friend of his who grew up in the former USSR, came to me shortly after my mother died when I was 17. He said, “what you father teaches is true and useful”.Needless to say, my life took some odd turns from 1986 to today and I lived in the former GDR (Berlin) for 5 years and 5 former USSR republics for 15 years.
It was a range of projects:
German Ministry of Privatization (energy industry)/liquidation department
World Bank in Moldova
Soros Foundation in Moldova (even met George personally once)/USAID
Built a factory in Ukraine with a German company, did the same in Kyrgyzstan when we traded with Mongolia/Afghanistan (pre 9/11).
Helped launch the first Nasdaq listed company from RussiaLived in SoCal a few years
Round 2 of former USSR: non-proliferation of bioweapons/bio-threat programs in Russia/Azerbaijan
Topped off with a stint in oil field servicesNow back in San Diego, mostly have been working in Oncology as an administrator, now in Orthopedics.
The point of all this: our lives can have an impact, things like the breakup of the USSR and German unification are not daily occurrences, but neither is a cure for cancer/mRNA vaccines.
If our lives are focused too much on our own desires and pleasures, then the phrase of vanity/meaninglessness is relevant.
But good life purpose can be found even if one is well off by finding a path to serve others and make a positive contribution.
July 3, 2021 at 10:07 PM #822384Participant[quote=Escoguy][quote=scaredyclassic]18 I also said to myself, “As for humans, God tests them so that they may see that they are like the animals. 19 Surely the fate of human beings is like that of the animals; the same fate awaits them both: As one dies, so dies the other. All have the same breath; humans have no advantage over animals. Everything is meaningless. 21 Who knows if the human spirit rises upward and if the spirit of the animal goes down into the earth?” 22 So I saw that there is nothing better for a person than to enjoy their work, because that is their lot. For who can bring them to see what will happen after them?
Ecclesiastes 3:18-19, 21-22 NIVhttps://bible.com/bible/111/ecc.3.18-22.NIV%5B/quote%5D
My father was a Baptist minister in Texas in the 1980s.
When I learned of Ecclesiastes, the word used instead of meaningless was vanity (all is vanity).
A friend of his who grew up in the former USSR, came to me shortly after my mother died when I was 17. He said, “what you father teaches is true and useful”.Needless to say, my life took some odd turns from 1986 to today and I lived in the former GDR (Berlin) for 5 years and 5 former USSR republics for 15 years.
It was a range of projects:
German Ministry of Privatization (energy industry)/liquidation department
World Bank in Moldova
Soros Foundation in Moldova (even met George personally once)/USAID
Built a factory in Ukraine with a German company, did the same in Kyrgyzstan when we traded with Mongolia/Afghanistan (pre 9/11).
Helped launch the first Nasdaq listed company from RussiaLived in SoCal a few years
Round 2 of former USSR: non-proliferation of bioweapons/bio-threat programs in Russia/Azerbaijan
Topped off with a stint in oil field servicesNow back in San Diego, mostly have been working in Oncology as an administrator, now in Orthopedics.
The point of all this: our lives can have an impact, things like the breakup of the USSR and German unification are not daily occurrences, but neither is a cure for cancer/mRNA vaccines.
If our lives are focused too much on our own desires and pleasures, then the phrase of vanity/meaninglessness is relevant.
But good life purpose can be found even if one is well off by finding a path to serve others and make a positive contribution.[/quote]
We are all here on earth to help others; what on earth the others are here for I don’t know.
W. H. Auden
July 4, 2021 at 1:53 AM #822385
svelteParticipantdamn if I could have dinner with scaredy and escoguy I feel as if I would gain life changing insights.
I’m not joking.
I love the way those minds think. I love thinking outside the box.
There is so much more to life than the commonly accepted status quo.
And thanks to the incoming generations. The changes they are bringing are exciting yet a bit scary. To change is difficult. Not to change is fatal.
Happy 4th to you and yours.
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