- This topic has 30 replies, 7 voices, and was last updated 17 years, 1 month ago by
cantab.
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October 13, 2007 at 7:45 PM #88813October 13, 2007 at 7:45 PM #88820
HLS
ParticipantMichael,
We aren’t all the same, sorry
I am in the industry and will not disagree with part of what you say.
In ANY commission based industry, any product, commissions breed fraud.There were plenty of morons doing loans that screwed people beyond even your wildest dreams. The borrowers were taken, hook line and sinker. There are fewer still doing that today, but they are still out there. Often it was from a relative, friend or neighbor. I am not going to defend them in any way. Some people are losing their houses today because of the loans that they are in.
To me, providing a mortgage is a service. YOU may know what you want or at least think that you know what you want. Many that stand to make money from a borrower may know less than they do, but they know where their commission comes from.
I give people the best rates that I can and tell people what my service is going to cost them. I don’t care if they want an ARM, interest only, 30 YR or 40 Yr fixed, none of it changes my fee or what I net.
Most people are overwhelmed and stressed out throughout the process. I can solve that. Even if it costs them a few thousand dollars to get straight honest advice about a $500,000 transaction, it is worth it to them. It may not even cost that.
Retail banks have wholesale rates and retail rates. When you walk in a branch, you get retail.
If you are dealing with a scummy loan person, they will add fees to a wholesale rate that can make their prices beyond stupid. When you are deling with someone who is fair, you may easily get a better deal from the broker side.Most people have no clue what they are facing when they are looking for a loan. I will guess that 8 of 10 will try to screw them in some way, either by rate, fees, term etc.
Most succeed.Most borrowers with tough situations were simply turned down by banks, just like the old days. They wanted a loan.
Many major lenders didn’t do subprime loans on the retail side.Having someone who tells you the truth and keeps you out of a prepay when you don’t need to be in one is worth a small fortune. Some people are trusting the largest financial decision of their life to an hourly employee that works for the bank, not for the client, or a young kid in a boiler room with a crappy credit score who has never signed loan docs in their lives and may never.
Personally, I spend more time explaining things than I should. I want people to understand what their options are, so they can decide what is right for them,and it could save them tens of thousands of dollars over the life of their loan, or avoid a pitfall.
I have seen people pay $10,000 or more in prepayment penalties that they should have never been in.YES, I charge for what I do, it’s more than fair in the industry. If someone wants to go at it alone, that’s their choice. I can’t guarantee anyone that I can get them the cheapest rate on earth, but nobody can honestly say that.
I look out for those that work with me.If they care, they will learn something from me too.
I’ve had dozens of rentals and signed more loan docs than most and can give people some help that most others can’t.If you just want to shop rates and think that you have beat the system, maybe you have and maybe you haven’t.
Maybe you are sharper than the average borrower.I’m not even going to ask what you do for a living and how you justify what you get paid for what you do.
I wouldn’t expect to ever get a call from someone with your attitude, and that’s OK with me.I don’t know why I wasted my time writing this, I’m sure that you don’t believe I’m any different.
October 13, 2007 at 8:04 PM #88817cantab
ParticipantWhen I refinanced recently, by far the best deal was from Pt Loma Credit Union. See here:
http://www.plcu.com/rates_db/interest_rates.aspI have just closed with them, with no hiccups. Highly recommended.
When I last bought a house, I went with the broker suggested by my agent. He was a past president of the Calif. mtg brokers association’s ethics committee. He turned out to be so unethical I seriously considered suing him.
The best Internet deal is here:
http://www.ingdirect.com/google/index.html
You can get a firm loan commitment for free from ING in just a day or two. Use it as a basis for evaluating other offers.HLS is very well-informed and has been very helpful to me by email. Recommended!
October 13, 2007 at 8:04 PM #88824ParticipantWhen I refinanced recently, by far the best deal was from Pt Loma Credit Union. See here:
http://www.plcu.com/rates_db/interest_rates.aspI have just closed with them, with no hiccups. Highly recommended.
When I last bought a house, I went with the broker suggested by my agent. He was a past president of the Calif. mtg brokers association’s ethics committee. He turned out to be so unethical I seriously considered suing him.
The best Internet deal is here:
http://www.ingdirect.com/google/index.html
You can get a firm loan commitment for free from ING in just a day or two. Use it as a basis for evaluating other offers.HLS is very well-informed and has been very helpful to me by email. Recommended!
October 13, 2007 at 8:12 PM #88821michael
ParticipantHLS,
Not a waste of time. I appreciate the sincerity of your post.
As I was reading your post I feel that you do indeed add serious value to your clients. I personally wouldn’t have a need for your services, but I can respect and value your integrity and character – which is your true value added.
My comments were painted with to broad a paint brush based on what i’ve seen in your industry and I apologize for my tone.
October 13, 2007 at 8:12 PM #88827ParticipantHLS,
Not a waste of time. I appreciate the sincerity of your post.
As I was reading your post I feel that you do indeed add serious value to your clients. I personally wouldn’t have a need for your services, but I can respect and value your integrity and character – which is your true value added.
My comments were painted with to broad a paint brush based on what i’ve seen in your industry and I apologize for my tone.
October 13, 2007 at 8:45 PM #88823ParticipantPCLU 30 YR rates aren’t anything special.
They are fair market rates.
These rates are those extended to our most creditworthy applicants. (???)If that was BY FAR THE BEST DEAL, how much better was it than what you had been quoted ??
Someone try to rip you off ?Rates change every day. Loans still need to be underwritten.
There are fees that need to be covered. You still have to qualify.Their full no cost/no points rate was 6.75% on Friday.
On a $400K loan, That rate would pay a commission to cover all costs, which is $1000-$1500 more than is needed, so that rate isn’t so great.The true par rate was 6.125-6.25 for a full doc loan with a score above 660. (Don’t know what their minimum score criteria is)
If you got the advice and service that you needed, then you should be happy. Some people need help and advice on how to structure the submission so it gets approved.
I doubt that the CU employee can accomplish that, if needed.October 13, 2007 at 8:45 PM #88829ParticipantPCLU 30 YR rates aren’t anything special.
They are fair market rates.
These rates are those extended to our most creditworthy applicants. (???)If that was BY FAR THE BEST DEAL, how much better was it than what you had been quoted ??
Someone try to rip you off ?Rates change every day. Loans still need to be underwritten.
There are fees that need to be covered. You still have to qualify.Their full no cost/no points rate was 6.75% on Friday.
On a $400K loan, That rate would pay a commission to cover all costs, which is $1000-$1500 more than is needed, so that rate isn’t so great.The true par rate was 6.125-6.25 for a full doc loan with a score above 660. (Don’t know what their minimum score criteria is)
If you got the advice and service that you needed, then you should be happy. Some people need help and advice on how to structure the submission so it gets approved.
I doubt that the CU employee can accomplish that, if needed.October 13, 2007 at 9:05 PM #88830ParticipantMichael,
There’s no offense. You aren’t wrong. Rants are therapy for me. I swim with some real scum. I wear a wet suit so they don’t rub off on me.We are all just friends here that haven’t met face to face.
I don’t care if people shop. I can’t promise the lowest price. From what I see though, many people did get screwed on their loans. I can tell from their last closing statement showing the commission that was paid to the broker and the fees that were charged. I don’t need to know what the rates were that day.
Even intelligent, high wage earners got taken. The severity of the neg am loan has yet to rear its ugly head for many. It was pushed by many because it pays the highest commissions in the industry. Horrible product.
Some people pride themselves in thinking that they got the best deal on a car, plumber, computer, suit, loan etc. Does one ever really know ?
Plenty of businesses aren’t cheap, and people know it, and still shop there for quality, service, etc.Is gambling on the internet with the largest financial transaction of one’s life risky ?
Making sure people understand their options and loan is my priority. I’ve heard horror stories of some online loan shopping experiences.I try to explain that you don’t shop for rates, you shop for people to educate you and help you through the process.
October 13, 2007 at 9:05 PM #88835ParticipantMichael,
There’s no offense. You aren’t wrong. Rants are therapy for me. I swim with some real scum. I wear a wet suit so they don’t rub off on me.We are all just friends here that haven’t met face to face.
I don’t care if people shop. I can’t promise the lowest price. From what I see though, many people did get screwed on their loans. I can tell from their last closing statement showing the commission that was paid to the broker and the fees that were charged. I don’t need to know what the rates were that day.
Even intelligent, high wage earners got taken. The severity of the neg am loan has yet to rear its ugly head for many. It was pushed by many because it pays the highest commissions in the industry. Horrible product.
Some people pride themselves in thinking that they got the best deal on a car, plumber, computer, suit, loan etc. Does one ever really know ?
Plenty of businesses aren’t cheap, and people know it, and still shop there for quality, service, etc.Is gambling on the internet with the largest financial transaction of one’s life risky ?
Making sure people understand their options and loan is my priority. I’ve heard horror stories of some online loan shopping experiences.I try to explain that you don’t shop for rates, you shop for people to educate you and help you through the process.
October 13, 2007 at 9:17 PM #88833Wrangler
Participanthi HLS, what’s your email? We’re looking for a full documentation loan for a purchase price about $750K. We can pay down 20%, but not sure if it would make much difference for the rate if we pay only 10% or 5%. Our credit scores are above 780. The mortgage before tax deduction will be less than 1/3 our gross monthly income for 10% downpayment. We’re mainly looking at 30 fixed, 15 fixed, 5/1 ARM.
Thanks a lot
October 13, 2007 at 9:17 PM #88839Participanthi HLS, what’s your email? We’re looking for a full documentation loan for a purchase price about $750K. We can pay down 20%, but not sure if it would make much difference for the rate if we pay only 10% or 5%. Our credit scores are above 780. The mortgage before tax deduction will be less than 1/3 our gross monthly income for 10% downpayment. We’re mainly looking at 30 fixed, 15 fixed, 5/1 ARM.
Thanks a lot
October 13, 2007 at 9:24 PM #88842ParticipantPlease post here if you send me an email.
I don’t check that box unless I need to.
It’s not my regular which I will respond from.Happy to help if I can.
October 13, 2007 at 9:24 PM #88848ParticipantPlease post here if you send me an email.
I don’t check that box unless I need to.
It’s not my regular which I will respond from.Happy to help if I can.
October 13, 2007 at 10:25 PM #88863ParticipantHLS, I am sure you are right about the 30 yr fixed at PLCU.
The loan I got is their 1 yr ARM jumbo at 4.25% initial rate. What is special about this is that the maximum it can adjust is 1% per year. Next year it will be 5.25%, then 6.25% etc. worst-case.
Their 3yr starts 1% higher, the 5yr 1.5% higher. Doing the math, the 3yr cannot be better than the 1yr and it takes many years for the 5yr to be potentially better.
Given excellent credit, stable job, and LTV under 50%, I am not worried about being able to refinance again when desirable.
The Pt Loma loan has no prepay penalty, no points, no origination fee. Total closing were $900 title insurance, $425 escrow fee, and about $400 miscellaneous fees. Nothing else. (Their no-closing-cost option is a bad deal since their closing costs are so low.)
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