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October 12, 2011 at 11:53 AM #730533October 12, 2011 at 12:45 PM #730536
jstoesz
ParticipantIt would be wise to give Egypt a few more years before using them as an example of an effective protest. That country will likely yet turn into a blood bath.
A quote from a Roosevelt admirer, maybe it will chasten you.
“A second danger to President Roosevelt’s valiant and heroic experiments seems to arise from the disposition to hunt down rich men as if they were noxious beasts. It is a very attractive sport, and once it gets started quite a lot of people everywhere are found ready to join in the chase. Moreover, the quarry is at once swift and crafty, and therefore elusive. The pursuit is long and exciting, and everyone’s blood is infected with its ardour. The question arises whether the general well-being of the masses of the community will be advanced by an excessive indulgence in this amusement. The millionaire or multi-millionaire is a highly economic animal. He sucks up with sponge-like efficiency money from all quarters. In this process, far from depriving ordinary people of their earnings, he launches enterprise and carries it through, raises values, and he expands that credit without which on a vast scale no fuller economic life can be opened to the millions. To hunt wealth is not to capture commonwealth.”
Winston ChurchillOctober 12, 2011 at 2:35 PM #730539briansd1
Guest[quote=jstoesz]It would be wise to give Egypt a few more years before using them as an example of an effective protest. That country will likely yet turn into a blood bath.
[/quote]I’m not using Egypt as an example of an effective protest.
But if we, in the West, are supporting the Arab Spring protesters, we should accept similar protests in our own country.
It’s all about human rights and citizens’ rights to express their grievances directly to their governments.
October 12, 2011 at 2:38 PM #730540
CoronitaParticipant[quote=briansd1][quote=flu]I’m trying to figure out why people like this 60 year person feels that “he’s (paulson) the type of person we’re against”… Just because he’s rich and has means to make money, their against him? Why? I guess people are just pissed at anyone that is “rich”…It’s people like this that behave in robin hood that just want a redistribution of wealth…. French revolution anyone?[/quote]
If that’s your understanding of the French Revolution, then I’m not surprised at your view of the current protests.
The protesters are ordinary citizens, not a political party. Isn’t protesting for change and reforms good enough?
BTW, what were the protesters in Tiennamen Square or Tahrir Square asking?[/quote]
It’s good if they understand the purpose and if the protest is directed at something concrete. Most of the folks that are protesting probably don’t know what they are really “against”. except that have some feeling of being “oppressed” by anyone who makes more then them.
Please don’t bring up Tiennamen unless you really know what that was about, which I doubt you do, except reading about it textbooks and seeing it covered on CNN. If you find Tiennamen so appalling, you’d be boycotting any goods produced there and boycotting cosmetics made there…But as many americans do these days, one often says one thing with conviction, and yet one’s action is completely contrarian…Last time I checked, it’s not like China is a democratic state yet….
October 12, 2011 at 3:46 PM #730541Participant[quote=briansd1]
It’s all about human rights and citizens’ rights to express their grievances directly to their governments.[/quote]
I am confused, have these protests been shut down? The various cities seem fairly accommodating to me.
There have been some arrests, but that was for illegal activity/breaking park rules. Some parks/cities have made exceptions for the protesters, and that discretion seems pretty lenient. People are not being arrested for shouting and holding up signs. I would be hauled off if I started building a encampment in the middle of Balboa.Are you already claiming victim hood?
October 12, 2011 at 4:08 PM #730542Guest[quote=jstoesz]
Are you already claiming victim hood?[/quote]
No, I’m simply dismayed that the protesters are being condemned in some quarters of the establishment. Eric Cantor and Herman Cain come to mind.
October 12, 2011 at 4:29 PM #730544CoronitaParticipant[quote=briansd1][quote=jstoesz]
Are you already claiming victim hood?[/quote]
No, I’m simply dismayed that the protesters are being condemned in some quarters of the establishment. Eric Cantor and Herman Cain come to mind.[/quote]
But isn’t that’s what’s great about this country? Some quarters or people of the establishment CAN condemn the protesters if they want, even if it doesn’t jive with your own belief system…..
October 12, 2011 at 4:43 PM #730545ParticipantClassic Brian, thanks for the chuckle.
October 12, 2011 at 7:26 PM #730549
svelteParticipant[quote=sdduuuude]I think it will die on the vine as well – simply because there is nothing to actually do. I support their right to protest and I don’t hate their list of demands, but I just don’t think it will accomplish anything tangible.
[/quote]Agree with that. Plus when the cold weather hits, the protesters will be outta there!!!
October 12, 2011 at 8:49 PM #730551blake
Participant[quote=jstoesz]
I am confused, have these protests been shut down? The various cities seem fairly accommodating to me.
[/quote]http://www.10news.com/news/29456764/detail.html
[quote]
…
The cost to have a police presence is mounting. Each day, 10News learned the police department pays more than $10,000 to have officers watch the protestors. The dollar figure is already more than $49,000, and that doesn’t include overtime for the 22 officers who were called back for Friday night’s march through downtown.
…
[/quote]October 12, 2011 at 10:11 PM #730554Guest[quote=svelte][quote=sdduuuude]I think it will die on the vine as well – simply because there is nothing to actually do. I support their right to protest and I don’t hate their list of demands, but I just don’t think it will accomplish anything tangible.
[/quote]Agree with that. Plus when the cold weather hits, the protesters will be outta there!!![/quote]
I agree that when the weather gets cold, the protesters will thin out.
But if the Occupy movement awakens American civic conscience and gets people who don’t normally vote to the polls, then that would be a great achievement in democracy building.
I hope that the Occupy movement grows in California and in warm weather states.
The weather in NYC this coming weekend is expected to be nice and sunny. I will be over there with some friends. I wonder if Rich will allow me to carry a Piggington billboard to represent the landed poor of San Diego. 😉
October 13, 2011 at 12:08 AM #730556CA renter
Participant[quote=sdduuuude][quote=jpinpb]pri_dk – my brother is involved in the auto industry and claims union as the problem. Couple of questions that maybe you can give me some feedback/answers. How many factory auto workers are living in mansions and fly in private jets?
Should labor be brought to the low levels of third world countries, working conditions and pay, so that the head guys at corporations can continue to enjoy their rich lifestyle?
When companies are making record profits off the backs of workers in third world countries, tax breaks by our government that the rich paid politicians to pass and the loss of jobs here, do you really still hold on to the unions being the cause of these problems?
Should our labor (pay and conditions) be as cheap as third world countries so we can keep jobs and companies can make record profits?[/quote]
Unions serving government seem to be the problem, not so much unions serving corporations. As far as I’m concerned, the unions and corporations can battle it out in their own way. Both are private enterprises, really.
Unions serving government, however, seem vey crooked to me. The unions gain a monopoly on providing services, they block individuals from working in their area, then trade votes for higher wages. It is true thug behavior and needs to stop. Unions serving government are really an unregulated monopoly. Not sure how anyone can love that.
Because fat-cat corporate officials supply the funds for corporate union workers, I can understand how you might side with the union there. However every-day taxpayers bear the brunt of paying public union wages. In a sense, the union is the private corportion here, milking the public coffers and taxpayers.[/quote]
Do you think private corporations aren’t guilty of gaining a monopoly on services, blocking individuals (or other buisinesses/entities) from working in their area, and trading votes (or campaign contributions) for higher pay (contracts, etc.)?
October 13, 2011 at 12:12 AM #730557Participant[quote=jstoesz]It would be wise to give Egypt a few more years before using them as an example of an effective protest. That country will likely yet turn into a blood bath.
A quote from a Roosevelt admirer, maybe it will chasten you.
“A second danger to President Roosevelt’s valiant and heroic experiments seems to arise from the disposition to hunt down rich men as if they were noxious beasts. It is a very attractive sport, and once it gets started quite a lot of people everywhere are found ready to join in the chase. Moreover, the quarry is at once swift and crafty, and therefore elusive. The pursuit is long and exciting, and everyone’s blood is infected with its ardour. The question arises whether the general well-being of the masses of the community will be advanced by an excessive indulgence in this amusement. The millionaire or multi-millionaire is a highly economic animal. He sucks up with sponge-like efficiency money from all quarters. In this process, far from depriving ordinary people of their earnings, he launches enterprise and carries it through, raises values, and he expands that credit without which on a vast scale no fuller economic life can be opened to the millions. To hunt wealth is not to capture commonwealth.”
Winston Churchill[/quote]Hogwash. Most of the richest people today do nothing to increase domestic production or create jobs. Quite the opposite — they’ve lobbied for policies that make it easier and cheaper for them to off-shore jobs to Third World nations.
The way most of the “traders” are getting rich today is by speculating. They buy and sell existing assets that they don’t personally need and have no use for, and they bet on the price movements of those assets. This is zero-sum, totally unproductive, and takes money from the *real* productive economy.
October 13, 2011 at 1:07 AM #730561all
Participant[quote=briansd1][quote=jstoesz]It would be wise to give Egypt a few more years before using them as an example of an effective protest. That country will likely yet turn into a blood bath.
[/quote]I’m not using Egypt as an example of an effective protest.
But if we, in the West, are supporting the Arab Spring protesters, we should accept similar protests in our own country.
It’s all about human rights and citizens’ rights to express their grievances directly to their governments.[/quote]
Reminds me of Hillary Clinton who condemned Tunisian and Egyptian governments for attempting to block Facebook and Twitter while leaning hard (and with success) on MasterCard, Amazon and PayPal to block Wikileaks.
October 13, 2011 at 6:44 AM #730564Anonymous
Guest[quote=CA renter]Hogwash. Most of the richest people today do nothing to increase domestic production or create jobs.[/quote]
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_members_of_the_Forbes_400_(2010)
Funny, I found the facts that demonstrate how wrong you are on Google, using a Dell computer running a Microsoft OS.
Now I’m off to Wal Mart, where I can buy tonight’s dinner for my family for under $10…
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